posted
Heres some questions you might want to ask. Was it done in one night or pilfered? If done on a single occasion what kind of vehicle would they need to haul? 3000 pounds? even spread out and carried in bundles would take some time for two, three guys. 4 guys and the job almost isnt worth it BUT.... to a youngster it might be.
-------------------- "Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication"
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posted
Even better check the closest places they could have pawned it off. Maybe even bring some pics along. Might not matter... im sure the buyer knows hes not getting scraps.
-------------------- "Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication"
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quote:Originally posted by The Bigfoot: What's your overnight security like Up?
90% chance it is internal but that they completely cleaned you out suggests outside job.
Internal is almost always a little at a time.
Ashamed to admit it but the overnight security is non-existent. We have 3 people working a second shift until about 11:00 p.m. but after that there's nothing. No security cameras, no guards, no nothing. There are ways that daytime employees could have gained entrance to the building in the middle of the night too. An example, if one of our delivery trucks comes back early from a shorter than normal route, he's got an overhead door opener in his truck that is supposed to be placed in a lock box but half the time they forget to do it. It would be a simple matter for one of the daytime employees to pocket it, come back at say 2:00 a.m. and clean us out. It's a risk but a fairly minor one.
Another possibility is one of the drivers loading their trucks in the morning. No one is watching them that closely and they could have thrown a bit of it on their trucks here and there as they are loading and then head to a scrap yard while out making deliveries. There's numerous possibilities and I've got a couple of suspects in mind, now it's just a matter of setting them up for a major fall.
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posted
Copper thievery very bad all over...we've had nut jobs opening the base-plate on highway lighting fixtures, then pulling the copper. Crazy...so many ways that go wrong, but they do it.
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
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posted
Possibly simple. As long as you've not publicly thrown a fit over this, you can simply make the same mistake again... only this time.. bigger... and with cameras. The trick is to act as though you are not worried about the issue... you'll simply write it off. Pointless to call the cops.. bla bla. Swing down to best buy or radio shack and grab a couple cameras. This time if you have copper laying about.. make sure you leave it wide open. If the guy got ten grand worth there is no way he'll be able to pass up another free shot.
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quote:Originally posted by Relentless.: Possibly simple. As long as you've not publicly thrown a fit over this, you can simply make the same mistake again... only this time.. bigger... and with cameras. The trick is to act as though you are not worried about the issue... you'll simply write it off. Pointless to call the cops.. bla bla. Swing down to best buy or radio shack and grab a couple cameras. This time if you have copper laying about.. make sure you leave it wide open. If the guy got ten grand worth there is no way he'll be able to pass up another free shot.
That's exactly the plan right now. No police contact, I'm acting like I don't even know about it. Oh and Glassman, clean out your mailbox!
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quote:Originally posted by Upside: Sign of the times? As some of you know I own a steel service center, small company selling raw material to tool & die shops, machine shops, etc. Sold some 1" diameter, 12' long copper bar stock to a customer Tuesday morning. We showed 15 of them in stock.
About an hour after the order went out into the plant for processing, the guy pulling the stock comes into my office saying he can't find a single length of it out there. Funny, we show 15 and he can't find even 1? Now there's only one place this stock could be located but I decide to go look for myself thinking that someone screwed up and mis-racked it or something. Not only could I not find a single length of it myself but I couldn't find a single piece of any sized copper out there at all. Nothing!
Went back into the office and ran a quick tally of our copper and we were supposed to have close to 3000 pounds of it out there in various sizes, shapes and lentghs. After doing a complete physical inventory, we found one piece of copper pipe that was 7/8" o.d about 6" long in a scrap bin that weighed less than a pound.
So now I've got to figure out who the thief is and how I'm going to catch him. I don't have a single person working here whom I don't trust though. Up until this week I felt I could have left 100's of dollars in cash laying on my desk and no one would touch it. Not anymore.
Jeez UP....
The A/C unit at a rental was ripped off several months back and I thought that sucked....just the coil
Actually what pisses me off is that there are people out there buying this material when they have to know it was stolen.
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posted
They just passed a law down here.. or it's about to pass.. That requires all scrap metal yards to keep names, numbers, and I think thumb prints of everyone who sells them junk metal. Stealing then selling scrap copper is huge business everywhere. In fact down here after the storm most looters we taking copper out of houses... easy acsess what with most of the siding washed away from the exterior walls on many houses near the beach and back bay.
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quote:Originally posted by Relentless.: They just passed a law down here.. or it's about to pass.. That requires all scrap metal yards to keep names, numbers, and I think thumb prints of everyone who sells them junk metal. Stealing then selling scrap copper is huge business everywhere. In fact down here after the storm most looters we taking copper out of houses... easy acsess what with most of the siding washed away from the exterior walls on many houses near the beach and back bay.
agree with this, and preceding post.
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
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quote:Originally posted by Relentless.: They just passed a law down here.. or it's about to pass.. That requires all scrap metal yards to keep names, numbers, and I think thumb prints of everyone who sells them junk metal. Stealing then selling scrap copper is huge business everywhere. In fact down here after the storm most looters we taking copper out of houses... easy acsess what with most of the siding washed away from the exterior walls on many houses near the beach and back bay.
They did the same thing here. Anything that comes into a scrapyard that's not aluminum cans or something that obviously came from a guys garage is supposed to be videotaped, the person i.d'ed and so on. But, one of the local televison channels set up a sting where they had a reporter walk in with finished, machined, aluminum parts and a hidden camera. The azzholes at the scrapyard walked this guy through how to sell these parts to them and bypass all the new laws. They basically directed him out to a guy in the yard who paid him cash, no taping of the transaction, no paperwork, no nothing. They're just as unscrupulous as ever. Just made it a little more difficult is all.
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quote:Originally posted by Relentless.: Possibly simple. As long as you've not publicly thrown a fit over this, you can simply make the same mistake again... only this time.. bigger... and with cameras. The trick is to act as though you are not worried about the issue... you'll simply write it off. Pointless to call the cops.. bla bla. Swing down to best buy or radio shack and grab a couple cameras. This time if you have copper laying about.. make sure you leave it wide open. If the guy got ten grand worth there is no way he'll be able to pass up another free shot.
That's exactly the plan right now. No police contact, I'm acting like I don't even know about it. Oh and Glassman, clean out your mailbox!
done, relentless' idea is good i agree. might catch a different one tho... (sorry to be such a skeptic)
might look around the parking lot and see if anybody got any new tires or antyhing else outa the ordinary...
as for Rimasco's idea? i REALLY like it the best, but as friend, i have to say it's terrible, you could lose everything, they frown on booby traps outside of wartime
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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Set up a hidden camera in an office to catch the third shift manager sleeping...yea, that'll cause problems. (Especially if they are union)
Set up a camera to watch your stock and just don't advertise it to anyone...not many will murmur about it.
Do yourself a favor and get digital recording equipment, not VHS. You will save yourself a lot of time(though it will cost more.) Also remember to get at least one close up in a choke point for a face shot. If it should go to court (hopefully not) you will need a face or license plate as proof you have fired/fingered the right person.
-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues.
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posted
This happened here at work the other day (night). We had several employees who were on the road so their vehicles were parked in our gravel parking lot. Some person (or people) came in when no one was here and cut the catalitic converters out of 4 cars with a sawzall or something. There was another car that was very low to the ground and the thief(s) started to dig a hole under the car but they either got spooked or gave up trying to dig the gravel. What a wonderful world.
-------------------- If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy?
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If only Munchie would have taken me up on my job offer this probably never would have happened. Being the crackerjack that he is I'm sure he'd have immediately spotted our security flaw and handled it in a matter of a few days. Darn you Munch! Where are you in my time of need?
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get your self some copper barstock, have a machinist cut it, drill it out, thread it, so you can insert some RF inventory tags, put it back together and then turn it to hide the seem....
hide RF sensors at the doors...
i dunno if copper shields the RF tho? wouldn't be cheap, but you'd know for sure.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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i have a close relative that's fire marshal and he says they are investigating so many suspicious house fires they can't keep up. people are burning their own houses down.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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posted
Only problem with that is there's no copper left right now, the Grinch has stolen Christmas and left nothing but a copper crumb behind. I'm not going to re-stock it until we've got some measures in place. I'm working on a plan with some tempting looking aluminum pieces right now. We've got a little bit of brass out there too, I'm going to have to keep close tabs on that as well.
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quote:Originally posted by glassman: recession signs?
i have a close relative that's fire marshal and he says they are investigating so many suspicious house fires they can't keep up. people are burning their own houses down.
not difficult to fathom...
get a dog cornered, etc.
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
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posted
quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by glassman: recession signs?
i have a close relative that's fire marshal and he says they are investigating so many suspicious house fires they can't keep up. people are burning their own houses down. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
quote Tex:
"not difficult to fathom...
get a dog cornered, etc."
_________________________________________________
Lets look at the positive side for those that let their houses go back to the bank......................
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I'll tell you what I can't fathom. I can't fathom my pessimism continuing. I can't fathom humanity succumbing to the "cabal". I cannot see any economic hiccup as anything but finite. I do see the idiots in charge as idiots. I see them underestimate those I call morons. I see them relish their bird's eye view and fear no down draft. But there is.......... Hmmmn There is a morality at this basement level they will never comprehend. There is a unity at this level that transcends any time tested propaganda. We do NOT detest each other's next breath. We do not fight our roommates out of hate. We do not argue with the desire to later dissect every inflection. There is an underestimation made that our words towards each other are literal.
You all know this to be true. Think of how many morons have stumbled across one of our many arguments and commented how we were a group of hate mongers. Not once taking time to do a back check and realize we were in fact making fun of each other or ourselves.
There is still real anger in the black/ African-American/ negro/ Whatever the hell the correct term of the month is.. I don't care. There is real anger. This is a given and will not relinquish it's hold until the "cabal" makes the fatal mistake of taking it for granted. They will exploit it until they are too late to realize it does not exist as anything but a political gimmick. They will hype it and hype it but the reality is no one really cares anymore. They are creating for their benefit an us versus them mentality that will be their downfall. Simply stated there are more of us than them and those cops they are now brainwashing will not forever be able to carry out orders...
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Really one has to look at history. How many governments have lasted in a hundred thousand years? ***** and moan as we will, we all know it is government that will fail.. Not us. we have chaos on our side. Chaos trumps organized freedom everytime.
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I do see the idiots in charge as idiots. I see them underestimate those I call morons.
yes, and America was originally founded as a way to escape that nonesense. Early on? Europeans of of all strata of society sent their smarter younger kids here to get them away from their families so they would not kill their elder siblings to inherit the family wealth. It wasn't until much later that this idea of "adopting" "huddled masses" and po'folk to put to slave labor and wages was adopted for purely economic reasons. It surely wasn't some gesture of pity, (even from the so-called liberals).
There is a rather severe "economic cuttoff line" that begins at people born at the end of the baby boom...
it's about 1957-9... NUMBER OF JOBS HELD, LABOR MARKET ACTIVITY, AND EARNINGS GROWTH AMONG THE YOUNGEST BABY BOOMERS: RESULTS FROM A LONGITUDINAL SURVEY
The average person born in the later years of the baby boom held 10.5 jobs from age 18 to age 40, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics of the U.S. Department of Labor. Nearly three-fifths of these jobs were held from ages 18 to 25. --Individuals born from 1957 to 1964 held an average of 10.5 jobs from ages 18 to 40. These baby boomers held an average of 3.8 jobs while ages 18 to 21. The average fell to 3.0 jobs while ages 22 to 25 and to 2.0 jobs from ages 36 to 40. Jobs that span more than one age group were counted once in each age group, so the overall average number of jobs held from age 18 to age 40 is less than the sum of the number of jobs across the individual age groups.
--Although job duration tends to be longer the older a worker is when starting the job, these baby boomers continued to have large numbers of short-duration jobs even as they approached middle age. Among jobs started by workers when they were ages 36 to 40, 36 percent ended in less than a year and 72 percent ended in fewer than 5 years. http://www.bls.gov/news.release/nlsoy.nr0.htm
the opportunities didn't dry up, but the "expansion" of the "baby boomers" system stopped and the people that had found their way rather easily into "high places" due to rapid expansion had established themselves political ties. they "locked in" and refused to continue to promote their juniors. instead they decided to create a disposable work force. they were/are very hard to displace from their positions of control and their abilities to perform are not the criteria that "gave" them their opportunity or the ability to hold the positions they got into. The opportunities were primarily driven by population demographics.
we have not been living in a meritocracy for a long time now. and some of the stuff they've been teaching kids in schools lately like extreme self esteem regardless of ability will not promote the reformation of meritocracy any time soon...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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posted
quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: quote: --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Quote Relentless:
What would you have government do about it? Keep in mind the grubby mitted nature.
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It appears people are already doing something about it indicated by Glassman's post.
posted
It appears people are already doing something about it indicated by Glassman's post.
What a sad mess!
it's all been part of the consolidation of costs approach to economics. bring two co's together and decrease competition WHILE you cut employment costs.
say you are 30, born in '60. you have just gotten yourself married, two kids (one more coming) and you bought a custom home you have car payments health insurance you both work so you have day-care.
one of your employers co's is doing so well that it gets bought out by a bigger co. you are a junior employee on verge of becoming senior but you are too young to be considered senior no matter how good you are.
you are back on the job market. the second job is not enough to keep everything and you HAVE to keep health insurance which is more expensive at the job kept because it wasn't the better co.
so? you switch over to the more expensive health insurance, have the baby and you EVENTUALLY get another job that's just as good (in 1990 anyway, today that's not even the norm)
BUT? you just ate up 60% of your savings.. you're young. you'll get i back...
and you're on your 4th job at 31.
then your wife's co (that sells 2500$ PC's) has to cut back because PC's just became 1200$ at circuit city and realises there's no future in computer sales at all anymore...
she decides to go back and get her masters. so you dip back into the savings, refi the house take some student loans.. etc...
getting the picture now?
and Greenspan said we need more education but REAL education now costs about the sam as the average home, so you have two mortgages to pay off
we're all still working, it's just that somehow most people in the US are in debt today and this is how it happened...
there is such a thing as the hard-working poor, esp. in the South, and those numbers are growing so fast i personally cannot beleive that the US is not on the verge of tremendous social upheaval....
where i live today? there's no "recession" cuz the "recession" after the civil war has never really ended.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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just to be clear? that isn't exactly my story, but it includes elements of mine and other people that i have grown up/associated with over the years.
it's also an attempt to explain why my postings tend to lean toward Obama even tho i am in NOWAY convinced he would be the best president. it's just that the Clintons and the Bush's totally represent the economic system that created this situation we find ourselves in right now. both of them beleive they are somehow entitled to whatever they want.
there is a major disconnect of the entitlement philsophy when you look at people in the US born in 1950 and 1960... they have completely different philisophic approaches. and i don't think the "youngsters" are complaining either, they just don't see the world the same way...
that's why Obama was able to "ambush" Hillary with the younger vote, and he did. she never saw him coming, because she already beleived the nomination was hers.
as for McCain? IMO he does not represent the same values of entitlement. i could be wrong tho.
this latest "elitism" charge against Obama is laughable. even tho he is the beneficiary of afirmative action? and he is. he took advantage the education offered to him and did not "squander" it as so many have (affirmative action recipients or not). will he be a good president if elected? i have no idea. but i believe he understands the average American much better than the Clintons or the Bushes.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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