quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: That just lets you know how he approaches his arguments. It's pretty clear.
Enlighten us Ole Black/white spot Wiseone... you still haven't answered your purpose as to this thread ... since you said it's not a racial thread (though u use "mexican" in your thread title etc.) and such... you seem to avoid the question... what is your purpose for this thread?
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: That just lets you know how he approaches his arguments. It's pretty clear.
Enlighten us Ole Black/white spot Wiseone... you still haven't answered your purpose as to this thread ... since you said it's not a racial thread (though u use "mexican" in your thread title etc.) and such... you seem to avoid the question... what is your purpose for this thread?
So, if I say "Mexican" then i'm racist? Typical race card being pulled here. The point of the thread was to raise awareness.
Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: Not sure what white america has to do with the point.
We'll when I say white america it is a generalization because Mooman's view of what is American and what isn't is obvious by his posts... anything "hispanic or mexican" is not considered American by him so it goes to say that must mean that anything non- ethnic (white) is what he would only want to see... therefor my conclusion since the Mooman won't answer is he does not want Walmart to open hispanic themed or any ethnic themed supermarkets on this side of the border because it's not "American/white". I could be wrong but he's not answering is he?
quote:Technically speaking white america might be a minority now.
Not now but in the future it will or might be... it's predicted that Hispanics will number 100 million or so by 2050... that means legal ones before the Mooman speaks out of his cowpie azz... as for other ethnic groups by that year... i am not sure... though i read that Islam will be large in this country by then... because of low birthrates in non muslims in this country and around the world though I am not sure if that study was accurate or biased...
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: So, if I say "Mexican" then i'm racist? Typical race card being pulled here. The point of the thread was to raise awareness.
Ummm awareness of what exactly Mooman? Please enlighten us... now remember your thread title is about Walmart opening hispanic (not Mexican) supermercardos (means supermarket in case you don't know)... as well as the article you posted... so awareness about what???
Btw in the article you posted Walmart is catering to HISPANIC and not MEXICANS in general... no mention of the word Mexican in the article except to say that Walmart had success in Mexico with supermarkets... so if you are not racist ole wise one.. why put the word Mexican in the thread title and awareness about what???
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: So, if I say "Mexican" then i'm racist? Typical race card being pulled here. The point of the thread was to raise awareness.
Ummm awareness of what exactly Mooman? Please enlighten us... now remember your thread title is about Walmart opening hispanic (not Mexican) supermercardos (means supermarket in case you don't know)... as well as the article you posted... so awareness about what???
Btw in the article you posted Walmart is catering to HISPANIC and not MEXICANS in general... no mention of the word Mexican in the article except to say that Walmart had success in Mexico with supermarkets... so if you are not racist ole wise one.. why put the word Mexican in the thread title and awareness about what???
How much explaining do you need anyway? The country is changing, things like this are part of it. You can run with it however you like.
Its like when I brought the news about certain places in southern Texas accepting PESOS as payable currency...im sure you see nothing wrong with that either.
Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged |
"Btw in the article you posted Walmart is catering to HISPANIC and not MEXICANS in general... no mention of the word Mexican in the article except to say that Walmart had success in Mexico with supermarkets... so if you are not racist ole wise one.. why put the word Mexican in the thread title and awareness about what???"
_________________________________________________
I could have done the same thing without even thinking about it.
It's seems like the only times i think about friends that i have/had over the years in a ethnic way is when i see or hear of discussions like this.
Then i try and think back if we had any problems that were ethnic in origin.
Not unless arguing about which friend was going to be on each team, and who buys the beer. (when we got older)
We always used our first names when addressing each other, don't think we thought about race, at least i did not when i was younger.
Maybe i was just naive, i am sure i was, that's the nice part about being young sometimes.
Not sure we cared who came from where, there seemed to be so many other things to worry about and have fun with.
Don't get me wrong there were things going on in families of friends, but we stuck together and supported each other as friends should.
Maybe i was lucky not much out of the ordinary in my family.
We either liked each other or we did not, rather simple, not saying that is always the case, because i have seen the other side at times in the service and later.
But again to me the title Mexican /Hispanic would refer to the same thing.
I grew up in Ca. and have always loved Mexican food for as far back as i can remember, it just does not like me much anymore.
A lot of states in the 60's and 70's you could not find a mexican restaurant or mexican food of any type other than chile peppers, you had to make it yourself which happened plenty.
posted
Capitalism's most successful child: big business. Why arent liberals attacking big business wal mart, or big business GE? GE is getting more money in stiumulus and "green" projects than Halliburton got out of Iraq. GE and Obama are so far up eachothers rears im surprised not more people are catching on. Only reason is because GE is not "big bad oil" so they sweeten their image with green projects. They are so green that they import green products from the biggest carbon footprint on earth...CHINA....oh so does walmart! What a surprise.
Always has been a double standard.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged |
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
It's a general quote that can be interpreted to any aspect of life not just politics... but yes I do find the man's life interesting... I don't agree with his methods but I do agree with some of his thoughts... bet you know nothing about him other then what you have been brainwashed to think about him....
Stop mooing
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: How much explaining do you need anyway? The country is changing, things like this are part of it. You can run with it however you like.
still avoiding it i see... and changing? Hate to burst your bubble bud, but hispanic (or ethnic) supermarkets have been around for decades... nothing new... Walmart is just capitalizing on it... this is why they are a big business... they think ahead and not behind like you do...
i have to laugh at your backwards thinking... making it sound like hispanic influences in this country is a bad thing... I wonder if you think the same thing of italians for example with Pizza being very popular in this country as well as Little Italy's and Italian grocers and such... bet you don't because by now Italians are considered "white" unlike in the past around the late 19th and early 20th century...
quote:Its like when I brought the news about certain places in southern Texas accepting PESOS as payable currency...im sure you see nothing wrong with that either.
Wow, your ignorance shows through. And other then Iraq I am guessing you haven't done much traveling.
I'll use Costa Rica for example to educate your little mind. Their local currency is called the Colon. But they do accept Dollars at most businesses down there especially big businesses... this holds true in most if not all latin american countries with the dollar as well as other countries around the world...
So would you like to rethink your statement?
Stop Mooing...
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Mach you are trying to evolve my words more and more. The more I hit at something the more you try to twist it and throw it back at me. You just make the argument more ugly.
As far as Costa Rica? Of course they accept dollars. Are you trying to compare Costa Rica accepting Dollars to my eateries accepting Pesos in Texas? LMAO
ANYWHERE takes dollars like you said. It is a whole different ballgame when people start taking pesos as accepted currency here. So you think its ok to take yen and euro at a mall in Dallas? You must be one of those one world currency fans the way you compare all this.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: Mach you are trying to evolve my words more and more. The more I hit at something the more you try to twist it and throw it back at me. You just make the argument more ugly.
As far as Costa Rica? Of course they accept dollars. Are you trying to compare Costa Rica accepting Dollars to my eateries accepting Pesos in Texas? LMAO
ANYWHERE takes dollars like you said. It is a whole different ballgame when people start taking pesos as accepted currency here. So you think its ok to take yen and euro at a mall in Dallas? You must be one of those one world currency fans the way you compare all this.
That is the point. You don't hit on anything at all or rarely. You really should work for Fox News lol
You asked me if we should accept euros, pesos, yen etc. in Malls , your eateries etc. and the answer is : depends. Depends on the exchange rate of whether the dollar is weak or strong versus the currency being used. But Americans are not every educated on currency exchange so that is asking too much of them. While people in other countries are very educated on the major currency exchange rates. Says something about us doesn't it? Also I don't know about your mall but the local one here which is the largest mall in NY has a currency exchange business inside of it.
Btw the accepting of dollars in Costa Rica at least is done as a courtesy more so then anything else. That is what you get in CR. Alot of courtesy , kindness and customer service towards foreigners unlike here.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
"Actually no were not. Do not know where you got that from. Spaniards on the other hand are."
_________________________________________________
"Many Americans who are treated as part of minority groups are included in the census category "white." This is true for many Hispanic Americans, 47.9% of whom identified racially as white.
In 2005, Whites made up 76% of the American population.
White Americans (non-Hispanic Whites together with White Hispanics) are projected to remain the majority, though with their percentage decreasing to 73% of the total population by 2050."
Posts: 3875 | From: ca. | Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged |
"Many Americans who are treated as part of minority groups are included in the census category "white." This is true for many Hispanic Americans, 47.9% of whom identified racially as white.
In 2005, Whites made up 76% of the American population.
White Americans (non-Hispanic Whites together with White Hispanics) are projected to remain the majority, though with their percentage decreasing to 73% of the total population by 2050."
Oh yes we all know the census is accurate
Tell that to the KKK/White supremacist groups, white cops who target hispanics, Americans in general if they were polled and most important ask the Hispanics such as myself if we consider ourselves white or do we think America treats as white...
I don't think any board member, with the exception of you, thinks of Hispanics as "white"... Minorities are called minorities for a reason and it's not because they are "white"...
anyways as for the population:
The projected Hispanic population of the United States for July 1, 2050 is 102.6 million people, or 24.4% of the nation’s total projected population on that date.[35]
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
Tell that to the KKK/White supremacist groups, white cops who target hispanics, Americans in general if they were polled and most important ask the Hispanics such as myself if we consider ourselves white or do we think America treats as white...
I don't think any board member, with the exception of you, thinks of Hispanics as "white"... Minorities are called minorities for a reason and it's not because they are "white"...
_________________________________________________
Maybe not all hispanics are like you, i sure know that statement to be true.
What are you talking about this time, Board Member?
I did not know our government was supporting the KKK in a direct way, not sure what they have to do with it?
Have you ever been involved with the census?
Have you ever filled out the Questionaire?
Where do you think the answers came from, who do you think they ask?
One thing has become very obvious, you do not like the word Mexican.
So why don't you like the word?
You have made it real clear that after all this talk that you have a personnal dislike to being refered as being of Mexican decent, why?
Posts: 3875 | From: ca. | Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged |
I say pick one.....I don't even give a **** which one you choose. If you're legal.....welcome to America!
If you're not.....go home.
-------------------- "The greatest argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter." (WC) Posts: 386 | From: Georgia | Registered: May 2009
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: Maybe not all hispanics are like you, i sure know that statement to be true.
I think it is safe to say that I have grown up with more hispanics all my life then let's say you or the rest of the forum members? So it is also safe to say that I have heard enough opinions from them about whether they are white or not or considered white by white people (irish, polish, WASP's etc.) or not...
quote:What are you talking about this time, Board Member?
Board member = Forum member... get with the program you knew what I meant..
quote:I did not know our government was supporting the KKK in a direct way, not sure what they have to do with it?
Tell me, if we (hispanics) are white then why are we targeted for violent hate/racial crimes by White supremacists, bigots etc.? If you do not think they do I could give you links to hate crimes across the U.S. targeted at hispanics.
quote:Have you ever been involved with the census?
Have you ever filled out the Questionaire?
Where do you think the answers came from, who do you think they ask?
For lack of choices hispanics will choose "white" on a questionairre if need be but if you ask them personally the majority if not all would say they aren't... The Gov't does not speak for me about my own race... sorry...
quote:One thing has become very obvious, you do not like the word Mexican.
So why don't you like the word?
You have made it real clear that after all this talk that you have a personnal dislike to being refered as being of Mexican decent, why?
If you think I do not like Mexicans you are sadly mistaken. I am quite fond of Mexicans, especially of the female persuasion. I am in lust with Salma Hayek (she's half Mexican though) and Thalia among others.
But I am not Mexican and contrary to belief not all hispanics are Mexican. I don't call a Mexican a Costa Rican any more so as they would refer to me as Mexican. Sort of like calling a Japanese person Korean or vice versa. They are both "Asian" but they are not one another. Hope you understand now.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
"Board member = Forum member... get with the program you knew what I meant..
Tell me, if we (hispanics) are white then why are we targeted for violent hate/racial crimes by White supremacists, bigots etc.? If you do not think they do I could give you links to hate crimes across the U.S. targeted at hispanics.
For lack of choices hispanics will choose "white" on a questionairre if need be but if you ask them personally the majority if not all would say they aren't... The Gov't does not speak for me about my own race... sorry...
If you think I do not like Mexicans you are sadly mistaken. I am quite fond of Mexicans, especially of the female persuasion. I am in lust with Salma Hayek (she's half Mexican though) and Thalia among others.
But I am not Mexican and contrary to belief not all hispanics are Mexican. I don't call a Mexican a Costa Rican any more so as they would refer to me as Mexican. Sort of like calling a Japanese person Korean or vice versa. They are both "Asian" but they are not one another. Hope you understand now."
_________________________________________________
Your just talking in circles trying to stay away from the point where this all started and went.
You think everyone is targeting you for many reasons it appears, by what you say.
Can't help you there, lots of bitterness it appears, tough way to go through life, especially as young as you are.
Hopefully some where down the line that changes, but unfortunately it usually doesn't get better with age.
Posts: 3875 | From: ca. | Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: Your just talking in circles trying to stay away from the point where this all started and went.
You think everyone is targeting you for many reasons it appears, by what you say.
Can't help you there, lots of bitterness it appears, tough way to go through life, especially as young as you are.
Hopefully some where down the line that changes, but unfortunately it usually doesn't get better with age.
Where did i speak in circles that you speak of? I answered your posts/questions pretty straight forward.
As for my supposed bitterness and such I guess you would have to live life as a minority who gets blamed more times then not for society's ills at the end of the 20th Century and early 21st Century. Until then I guess you can't criticize someone's bitterness without empathy that you cannot experience.
Mooman has never given a straight answer as to the purpose of this thread though we know what it is. You as well as I know he hasn't.
As for the whole Mexican word. Go tell a Puerto Rican he is Mexican or vice/versa (or any hispanic/latin). Let me know what answer they gave you. I suggest you exercise your right to carry/own a gun when you do tell them what they are.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
"As for the whole Mexican word. Go tell a Puerto Rican he is Mexican or vice/versa (or any hispanic/latin). Let me know what answer they gave you. I suggest you exercise your right to carry/own a gun when you do tell them what they are."
_________________________________________________
Again your reading what you want things to say.
What does a Hispanic/Mexican Walmart that i think will specialize in Mexican food have anything to do with above statement?
Let alone how it has anything to do with the census and gov. and how many of the Hispanics/Mexicans consider themselves white as far as the census and their personal preferance.
I had made this statement to you:
"Actually Machiavelli the Hispanics/Mexicans are considered white also."
And this was your answer:
"Actually no were not. Do not know where you got that from. Spaniards on the other hand are."
Then i told you where i got it.
Have you every completed a census report, i believe it is required by law, but i will have to look again.
I actually worked doing the 2000 census, interesting and rather fun, would not mine doing it again.
Now to answer your above statement, not that it has anything to do with what we were talking about.
I have worked with many Mexicans/Hispanics etc. over the years.
The last one i worked with hated the Mexicans that came over the border illegally.
I never asked him why, sometimes your better off leaving well enough alone.
What i heard while driving with him told me i would hear and ear full if i asked him.
He never wanted to be refered to them in any way.
There were many others i worked with that the subject never came up one way or the other, most of us had enough garbage going on with work, like most everyone else.
Then there was another person back in the 70's that could not understand why so many of his people(Mexicans) that worked at the company would not bother to learn the English languge.
Yet as he stated, wanted to get ahead and they cound not understand why they did not.
He would explain to them, but they just ignored him, while he moved up the pay scale.
They all lived within the same community so it was not necessary to learm english and they made no attempt to teach their kids or send them where they could/would have to.
This particular indivual sent his kids to school where they had to learn english.
He liked to be refered to as Mexican, but really was never offended if called something else.
Last but not least, was 2 friends of mine that i was overseas with, they were Puerto Rican.
I heard them called Black sometimes and Mexican other times.
They were never offended, yet made it clear they were Puerto Rican and very proud of it.
I always felt those guys got the shaft when they got drafted, just like Guam did.
Posts: 3875 | From: ca. | Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged |
What does a Hispanic/Mexican Walmart that i think will specialize in Mexican food have anything to do with above statement?
Actually no one said that the Walmart supermercardos were going to specialize in Mexican food. The article says "hispanic" supermercardos not "mexican". Hispanic food varies alot and contrary to belief is not all mexican. Mooman put "mexican walmarts" in the title so automatically you assume mexican food. Mooman misnamed the thread and i pointed that out which you seemed to have not caught on or ignored completely. As for the rest of the convo and what it has to do with the thread title.Nothing nor did i say it had anything to do with it. You were the one who progressed the conversation to that direction when you said hispanics are white. So I went with the flow.
quote:I had made this statement to you:
"Actually Machiavelli the Hispanics/Mexicans are considered white also."
And this was your answer:
"Actually no were not. Do not know where you got that from. Spaniards on the other hand are."
Then i told you where i got it.
And i told you for the lack of better choices hispanics are classified into that catergory but if you asked them directly are you white? The majority will say no. And the majority of americans (non hispanics) would say no also that hispanics are not. We may have white ancestry (spaniards etc.) but that does not make us white since our blood is now mixed with either native americans (Central and South America) and/or negro blood (dominicans for example as well as Cubans)
quote:Have you every completed a census report, i believe it is required by law, but i will have to look again.
I recall i did one time long ago and like i said for a lack of more or better choices I most likely checked off "white".
quote:I have worked with many Mexicans/Hispanics etc. over the years.
The last one i worked with hated the Mexicans that came over the border illegally.
I never asked him why, sometimes your better off leaving well enough alone.
What i heard while driving with him told me i would hear and ear full if i asked him.
He never wanted to be refered to them in any way.
Your friend is the exception and not the rule. Most hispanics for the most part empathize and/or sympathize with the illegals. Why do you think the immigration issue is such a hot issue among hispanics?
quote:Then there was another person back in the 70's that could not understand why so many of his people(Mexicans) that worked at the company would not bother to learn the English languge.
Yet as he stated, wanted to get ahead and they cound not understand why they did not.
Because for the most part we keep to ourselves and do not speak nor need to speak english to each other. I don't mean me but the older generation or 1st generation hispanics for the most part.
quote:They all lived within the same community so it was not necessary to learm english and they made no attempt to teach their kids or send them where they could/would have to.
Those are exceptions and not rules. Here ,in NY at least, all hispanics send their kids to english speaking schools. ALL.If anything my own parents didn't teach me spanish correctly so my spanish tends to be childish at times while I did go to english speaking schools and my english is fluent. That is the reality of american born hispanics right now in NY at least. Can't say for rest of country.
quote:He liked to be refered to as Mexican, but really was never offended if called something else.
Last but not least, was 2 friends of mine that i was overseas with, they were Puerto Rican.
I heard them called Black sometimes and Mexican other times.
They were never offended, yet made it clear they were Puerto Rican and very proud of it.
Exceptions because every hispanic i have ever known here and in Nicaragua/Costa Rica always takes offense to being called something they are not. Some are very vocal about it and others quiet about it but all get offended for the most part because we are also very prejudiced against each other. Sad but true but we are. We'll be friendly to each other face to face for the most part but behind closed doors or behind each other's backs we say sh*t about each other.
quote:I always felt those guys got the shaft when they got drafted, just like Guam did.
Personally I think they should have the right to vote about their own fate. To stay as U.S. territory or sucede since they are not states.
Anyways IWISH i know you are trying to show you know the experiences of hispanics but unless you are one and grew up as one you will never know. That goes for all races/ethnicities. I cannot say i know what blacks go through by saying i am friends with one or because i read it in the newspaper unless I am one. And I don't pretend to know because i know that i am not one.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
"Exceptions because every hispanic i have ever known here and in Nicaragua/Costa Rica always takes offense to being called something they are not. Some are very vocal about it and others quiet about it but all get offended for the most part because we are also very prejudiced against each other. Sad but true but we are. We'll be friendly to each other face to face for the most part but behind closed doors or behind each other's backs we say sh*t about each other"
_________________________________________________
As far as your friends and what you and they talk about behind close doors is your problem.
I would know nothing about that, we did talk trash about our friends or others behind their backs.
Again, why does stating that Walmart is opening up a Mexican Store have to do with being a racist?
Maybe it's not completly true that it is just Mexican food store, but my lack of being completely true in this statement, could be from my not caring what they open, i think they suck.
You make statements throughout your post using the word most, you do have statistics to confirm your statements, not just friends or friends of friends, like with the Chinese.
"The 39,000-square-foot Supermercado de Walmart at 8921 W. Thomas Road in Phoenix is a former Walmart Neighborhood Market that has been remodeled and stocked with goods to appeal to Hispanic consumers.
That includes a mix of Spanish and U.S. products. Yoplait yogurt sits next to LaLa dairy products from Mexico. There is an expanded produce section, traditional Latin bakery, a baby section and expanded party aisle with piñatas and other accessories for celebrations.
Hispanics buy significantly more fresh produce, dairy and meat products than non-Hispanics, they have larger families with more children."
Quotes Iwish:
"Another factor in in figuring how much each family spends on food would depend on the family size.
"Does not mean they spend more on food than non hispanics. (Per Person)"
Like i said before i could care less what Walmart does, i would stay clear no matter what they carry.
As far as how Hispanics/Mexicans etc. choose to classify themselves, as far as a race in the census, had nothing to do with someone forcing a choice on them.
If they did not want to be considered white then they had a choice in the Questionaire.
Even though you think the majority would chose otherwise.
As far as your quote to me:
"You were the one who progressed the conversation to that direction when you said hispanics are white. So I went with the flow."
You did not go with the flow, you started the flow where you wanted it to go.
This other statement shows that, when you addressed CashCowMoo:
"i have to laugh at your backwards thinking... making it sound like hispanic influences in this country is a bad thing... I wonder if you think the same thing of italians for example with Pizza being very popular in this country as well as Little Italy's and Italian grocers and such... bet you don't because by now Italians are considered "white" unlike in the past around the late 19th and early 20th century...
Posts: 3875 | From: ca. | Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
wow, Mach what was that you were telling me about two against one?
the way i see it?
you have a serious problem, you've called me out for being racist on several occasions too.
fact?
we are all racist to some degree or another, and you expressed the most racism in this thread. identifying who is your freind and who is your foe is an evolutionarily induced trait. skin tone would be the first and most recognisable trait before you ever meet a person. it's in our DNA
Mexicans are not a race.
Hispnics are NOT a race.
It denotes the language you were raised to speak.
now, here's where it gets really stupid.
we speak English here. our Constitution is written in English.
i happen to like ketchup and salsa both, but i still speakadaAngalis. so when i go to a store? i like to be able to read what's in my food.
i still buy food at Asian markets that i cannot read the label on but i have to ask for help
at the very least 75%% of my personal ethnic background was NON_ENGLISH speaking yet i speak English, my kids speak English, so i am not being racist a by expecting everybody else to learn it too. my people learned it.
racism? nope, it's about whether we'll speak English or not.
The U.S. Office of Management and Budget currently defines "Hispanic or Latino" as "a person of Mexican, Puerto Rican, Cuban, South or Central American, or other Spanish culture or origin, regardless of race".
and that my paranoid buddy has nothing to do with race.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: As far as your friends and what you and they talk about behind close doors is your problem.
I would know nothing about that, we did talk trash about our friends or others behind their backs.
We'll I didn't mean gossips, rumors, this guy is an azzhole or that guy is an azzhole etc.
What I meant is such things as "Salvadorians are nothing but criminals" or "Salvadorians are mostly indian blood and not true hispanics"... things like that.. those are direct quotes from people i know about one type of hispanic... they say the same kinds of things about other types...
quote:Again, why does stating that Walmart is opening up a Mexican Store have to do with being a racist?
Again you are confused. I didn't say Walmart is racist nor you. Just Mooman for starting this thread. He wanted to make us "aware" that Walmart is starting them. And I said aware about what? He still hasn't given a satisfactory answer to that.
quote:Quotes Iwish:
"Another factor in in figuring how much each family spends on food would depend on the family size.
"Does not mean they spend more on food than non hispanics. (Per Person)"
Again IWISH, poverty and/or family size may factor into it but more then anything culture does. Everything in hispanic life centers around food. My parents are not rich nor is our family large (I don't live with them but it's just me and them. 3 people. I do go over for dinner sometimes) but they spend on average of $200 to $300 per grocery trip. That is just one example. I could give dozens from families and friends that are similar. Not all hispanic families are large. I guess you would have to spend time and i mean real time not at work and not once in a blue moon with a hispanic family to see it for yourself. I can say it all i want to you but you still won't believe me and will go by stats and such.
quote:Like i said before i could care less what Walmart does, i would stay clear no matter what they carry.
I stay clear of them as well except in times like now with the crisis and cutting back of hours at my job. I don't like Walmart for what they do to local small businesses. But I have to do what I have to do to save money and pay the bills for now.
quote:As far as how Hispanics/Mexicans etc. choose to classify themselves, as far as a race in the census, had nothing to do with someone forcing a choice on them.
If they did not want to be considered white then they had a choice in the Questionaire.
Even though you think the majority would chose otherwise.
I don't think ,I know. If I haven't met a person in 3 countries that is hispanic who identifies themselves as white in my 37 years nor have I met a white person who considers hispanics as white in my 37 years except in some piece of paper from the Gov't then tell me how I am wrong? That is not stats but personal experience. How do the stats explain my personal experiences?
quote:As far as your quote to me:
"You were the one who progressed the conversation to that direction when you said hispanics are white. So I went with the flow."
You did not go with the flow, you started the flow where you wanted it to go.
This other statement shows that, when you addressed CashCowMoo:
"i have to laugh at your backwards thinking... making it sound like hispanic influences in this country is a bad thing... I wonder if you think the same thing of italians for example with Pizza being very popular in this country as well as Little Italy's and Italian grocers and such... bet you don't because by now Italians are considered "white" unlike in the past around the late 19th and early 20th century...
That is not the census I meant but society's view in general of what people are considered.
This is an example that is not about race but shows what I mean about the Gov't's classifications. Poker is a game of skill but is not considered to be so by the Gov't so therefor it is illegal on the internet. Now ask any serious poker player if the game is skill and the answer will always be yes. Now whose right? The majority of poker players or the Gov't? Now whose right about hispanics? The majority of hispanics who see hispanic/latin as a race or the Gov't who does not recognize hispanic/latins as a race? I personally do not classify myself as white, asian or black. The 3 so called only races on this earth. And I know plenty of hispanics that feel the same way as well as whites who think the same.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by glassman: wow, Mach what was that you were telling me about two against one?
the way i see it?
you have a serious problem, you've called me out for being racist on several occasions too.
Yes the way you see it: opinion. And if you read my comments you would see i called no one a racist in this thread except Mooman. Afterall why does he keep making threads about hispanics/mexicans? Again why this thread? To make us "aware" he says. Aware about what? That he sees Hispanic supermarkets as threat to his view of the American way of life perhaps? Don't know because he won't answer truthfully or at all about this thread.
quote:fact?
we are all racist to some degree or another, and you expressed the most racism in this thread. identifying who is your freind and who is your foe is an evolutionarily induced trait. skin tone would be the first and most recognisable trait before you ever meet a person. it's in our DNA
Care to show how i am the most racist on this board? Do i keep making threads about a race or ethnicity over and over and call or imply them as a threat?
Skin tone? yes that to me defines if you are white or not. Hispanics for the most part ceased to be white long ago when bloods mixed with natives and blacks. He'll hispanics denotes to me a totally different race and not because of language. Spaniards were the true white people in Latin America til time and blood mixing changed all that.
Let me ask you something Glass and forget Gov't or other definitions of race, ethnicity , white etc. I am quite tan in color. If you put me next to someone, let's say irish who most are pretty much pale white. Do you consider me white compared to that irish person?
quote:Mexicans are not a race.
Hispnics are NOT a race.
Yes, Mexicans are not a race. I never said they were. As for hispanics, who says so? The Gov't? lol We can all agree Asians are a race and in that race there are Koreans, chinese, Japanese, Thai's etc. Now tell me why can't hispanics be considered a race who have different ones like Mexicans, Costa Ricans, Cubans, Colombians etc. Sounds the same don't it? Asians and Hispanics a race while the Japanese, Mexicans etc. are the different ones within that "race".
quote:It denotes the language you were raised to speak.
Then I suppose I am full blooded spaniard. Let's ask the spaniards if I am shall we?
quote:now, here's where it gets really stupid.
we speak English here. our Constitution is written in English.
Yah, this is really stupid because it has nothing to do with the conversation. Language.
quote: so when i go to a store? i like to be able to read what's in my food.
Learn the language then. Asian, spanish etc. if you go to those ethnic communities and their supermarkets. Perhaps if americans learned a 2nd language like most of the rest of the world does we wouldn't be considered the most uncultured Western nation. People learn english to accomodate Americans in Latin America as well as in Europe etc. Americans for the most part are arrogant when it comes to language don't you think?
But since you brought up language which has nothing to do with the topic I'll quote Wiki on it:
" In all, a full 90% of all Hispanic and Latino Americans speak English, and at least 78% of all Hispanic and Latino Americans speak Spanish.[79] Spanish is the oldest European language in the United States, spoken uninterruptedly for four and a half centuries, since the foundation of St. Augustine.[13][14][15][16]"
"The usual pattern is monolingual Spanish use among new migrants or older foreign–born Hispanics, complete bilingualism among long–settled immigrants and the children of immigrants, and the sole use of English, or both English and either Spanglish or colloquial Spanish by the third generation and beyond.
quote:at the very least 75%% of my personal ethnic background was NON_ENGLISH speaking yet i speak English, my kids speak English, so i am not being racist a by expecting everybody else to learn it too. my people learned it.
I am sure your peoples' 1st generation didn't learn it or barely spoke it. Later generations of "your people" are the ones who spoke it well. One thing us english speakers think is that english is a easy language to learn. English has so many "exceptions" to language rules it's not even funny. We think asian languages are difficult compared to our own language but in reality other languages are much easier to learn especially spanish. When you read spanish it is spoken as it is written with no exceptions to language rules.
quote:racism? nope, it's about whether we'll speak English or not.
I already established this has nothing to do with language. Mooman's motive i mean but his own prejudices.
quote:The U.S. Office of Management and Budget currently defines "Hispanic or Latino" as "a person of Mexican, Puerto Rican, Cuban, South or Central American, or other Spanish culture or origin, regardless of race".
and that my paranoid buddy has nothing to do with race.
Ah yes and we should take the Gov't's definition of things over the actual people they are talking about own opinions. As for me being paranoid, i guess were two peas in a pod my equally paranoid buddy.
Btw I don't hate anyone because of their race or ethnicity. If i hate someone it's because of their personality. I am an equal opportunity hater.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
"Again IWISH, poverty and/or family size may factor into it but more then anything culture does. Everything in hispanic life centers around food. My parents are not rich nor is our family large (I don't live with them but it's just me and them. 3 people. I do go over for dinner sometimes) but they spend on average of $200 to $300 per grocery trip. That is just one example. I could give dozens from families and friends that are similar. Not all hispanic families are large. I guess you would have to spend time and i mean real time not at work and not once in a blue moon with a hispanic family to see it for yourself. I can say it all i want to you but you still won't believe me and will go by stats and such."
_________________________________________________
I am only going to address this above statement, kinda tired with talking about Walmart, were just going in circles.
You did not read my earlier posts or you forgot them.
I have grown up with and been around Hispanics/Mexican etc. families most of my life.
I just got done coaching a team that 85% of the players were hispanic. I had no relatives or friends of mine kids on the team.
As far as how large or how small a particular family is depends on the family. The fact is they were refering to the average size in general, compared to other American familes, i assume.
As far as what they eat and how it is prepared, seems to depend how a particular family likes their food, not any different than any other families.
They had plenty of food at the end of the season party for this baseball team and me, each prepared their dishes a little different.
Posts: 3875 | From: ca. | Registered: Jul 2005
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: I have grown up with and been around Hispanics/Mexican etc. families most of my life.
I've known PR's most of my life but know nothing of their culture as they do not know anything about CR culture. I just know CR culture and hispanic culture in general. The commonalities you can say. But anyways if hispanic families on average were equal and not greater to the average American family they would still buy more food then the american family due to culture. imo and from being hispanic all my life in a small family. Smaller then the american average.
Do admire you for embracing and not staying away from hispanics/mexicans like the rest of society though. Wish it was like that but sadly it's not. Were scapegoats instead.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Care to show how i am the most racist on this board
you do this over and over again. i didnt say that and you know it.
I am sure your peoples' 1st generation didn't learn it or barely spoke it
that's what i said. one ancestral line took several hundred generations to learn it since they were Cherokee
it really is about language.
when i lived in SoCali i knew several Mexican Americans who plainly stated that they and their people fully intended to take California back by laoding the votes. When i asked them did they mean taking it to Spanish speaking or taking it to be another Mexican State? they said both. i asked why they'd want to givbe up the great deal they get by being part of the US and they did not have an answer. It was simply about some sort of ancestral pride thing.
the only reason i point this out to you is that, as Iwish also pointed out to you, seem pretty angry and that's not a real good way to live.
Cash seems angry about Obam getting elected,
i was angry not about Bush getting elected but getting re-elected in '04...
i'm over it now, and better for it.
all women are/have been economically oppressed. being angry doesn't make them more successful, being GOOD does it.
there's a lot of oppression out htere, but the fact is? even white men oppress each other for odd reasons... wrong school, wrong club within the school, too much hair, too little hair etc. etc. etc.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by glassman: Care to show how i am the most racist on this board
you do this over and over again. i didnt say that and you know it.
But you said I express the most racism on this board so wouldn't that in a way make me the most racist in your eyes? As for me bringing up the the ills of societies racism. Do I not have a reason to? Afterall you see it all the time... just look around... people seem to think that if they ignore that it exists it will go away but it won't and you know it...
quote:that's what i said. one ancestral line took several hundred generations to learn it since they were Cherokee
it really is about language.
So if it took several hundred generations in your own family why does the public expect 1st generation immigrants to learn it fluently? A language that is very difficult because of it's grammar and pronunciation rules with a million exceptions to such rules? Why can't people just accept that 1st generation immigrants probably will not learn it fluently but suceeding generations will so therefor it all cancels out. Remember wiki says 90% of hispanics speak soley english and/or both spanish and english. That % will only increase but as always Americans are impatient.
quote: It was simply about some sort of ancestral pride thing.
Yah, it's the pride thing and you can't blame them. You would feel the same probably if you were Mexican. Afterall don't you feel the Europeans took away the Cherokee's land?
quote:the only reason i point this out to you is that, as Iwish also pointed out to you, seem pretty angry and that's not a real good way to live.
Can you blame me? When all I hear is hispanics caused this and hispanics caused that and all hispanics are illegal etc.. etc.. how would you feel? Being mad about elections is one thing but race and such is a totally different thing.
I know I'm a good person but that doesn't mean i can't be angry about certain injustices imo.
-------------------- Let the world change you... And you can change the world.
Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna Posts: 4669 | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
When you read spanish it is spoken as it is written with no exceptions to language rules. ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
