posted
One thing that should be foremost in our discussions and analysis, but has been lacking on all the boards, is insights into how the Bluelinx/GP distribution agreement around which much of this companies prospects are built, resulted in Bluelinx/GP being awarded a huge writ of garnishment of our companies income.
With all the people who have talked directly to JT and BH, has anyone ever brought this up? How did our company come to owe them such a huge sum in such a short period of time? How is this being paid off? How much has already been paid? Does Bluelink just get to keep the income from the rebar supports(that is, get the rebar supports for free or at cost until all is paid up), or can they get proceeds from stock sales? I'm not a lawyer or expert on garnishments, so any lawyers out there know the answer?
Could there be restrictions into their getting on the OTCBB, or complications in getting the audit out based on this garnishment? Is this why the company has to sell shares in the open market instead of finding a VC for funding? Would any funding have to go to bluelinx first? That would certainly make a VC financing complicated at the least.
For a company this small, anything over $1 million is a big deal, yet there has been very little explanation that I've seen.
Sound analysis is giving reasons for a certain belief. It does not include invective about "doom and gloom," or heaping scorn about others' trading. That's just throwing insults around.
I think there are many more reasons to be skeptical than not, since the simple fact is that PLNI hasn't kept a single substantive promise since May of 2005. But arguments on the flip side would include Chopper's recent field report from Promold, for example.
I think we're all better off if we focus on facts about Plasticon.
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You really think you focus on facts about Plasticon? You continually slam this company...Stockhunter more so than you...Your more like his guy Friday...
Your analysis isn't "sound"...it's "bias"...Your depressed state of mind and lack of ability to trade this stock effectively is the issue...that's the reason for the bias...thus the multiple posts over and over about the same issues that we all know...
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Bear, there you go again. You're just insulting people. No new DD.
Stock has made numerous calls, so have I, most of which have been reported here (sometimes when I call and get nothing new from Rodeny, I don't bother saying so here.)
I think the garnishment issue is a good one to bring up. If someone else doesn't do so by the next time I call in, I'll do so. I also keep forgetting to ask about the current auditor--don't think I'll get much on it, but keep meaning to give it a try.
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Stockhunter.... I can't believe you actually posted that Crap. Do you not do any DD on your own but rather take the easy way out and post that fictional Garbage from another board? I challaged the Bashers to actually post the photo copies of this particular slander a few weeks ago and as EXPECTED.... NOTHING to validate this Trash! Your so called solid analysis is based on pure innuendo and conjecture and nothing more! You Know nothing more than anyone else. I like you because your a pretty darn smart guy.... but your showing me different with posts like that!
The Garnishments are Phoney! Check the Nevada State Corporation Commission. International Plastics Group was DISOLVED in 2001. So was Laser Engineering and Florida Curbing. The wording on the so called proof is wrong! it shows Wicklund and International Plastics as the Debtor and GP and BlueLinsx as the Garnishee. So who owes whom the money? Next time the Bashers should check their wording before they post this Slanderous False Garbage. Or better yet post the actual State website that this information can be seen by all!
garnishee Function: transitive verb Inflected Form(s): -eed; -ee·ing Date: 1846 1 : to serve with a garnishment 2 : to take (as a debtor's wages) by legal authority
Main Entry: [1]gar·nish·ee Pronunciation: "gär-n&-'shE Function: noun Date: 1627 : a person who is served with a legal process of garnishment
debt·or Pronunciation: 'de-t&r Function: noun Date: 13th century 1 : one guilty of neglect or violation of duty 2 : one who owes a debt
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Really... Are you trading this stock at all or just holding long and posting negative posts...You call it DD...When you do talk to someone you post that your getting the run around...
That's not insulting you...It's getting to the reason for your negative outlook...Other investors need to know your agenda as well as the information/opinion you post...
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quote:Originally posted by Bearclaw: Why don't you call? You keep bringing it up...Why not get your answer and move on?
As you know, I have contacted the company, BAC, pinksheets, the MMs, numerous state regulators, the SEC and others regarding this company. The only wall I've run up against is from the company. BAC gave me false information and neither the company or BAC will respond to anything written. Rodney still has not gotten back to me with direct contact info for JT or BH. Nor has he come back with responses to any of the questions he said he would ask on my behalf.
Talking to the receptionist just isn't enough. Since there have been many on this board who claim to have a relationship and direct contact with JT and BH I was asking if they had any insights on these questions. It seems reasonable that someone would have asked about the bluelinx relationship and even a non-repsonse would be information.
Anyone who thinks this bluelinx garnishment is an old issue or that we all know about it simply hasn't been reading this board. I don't know how this evolved or how it can/will be resolved. If this is an old issue that everyone is aware of, then I missed it and would appreciate a repost, or a PM pointing to the info if it seems redundant to post.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust.
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Stock Jockey... Maybe VFIN forgot to include that information in the envelope with his paycheck.. Maybe ask on the Worms website where he's being quoted...
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You mention Laser Engineering and Florida Curbing in your post, neither of which are included in the post from the link I provided. Could you post (or PM me) with the document or link you have which includes these so we are all looking at the same documents.
The thread on SI where I read this did not come from a "basher", but from Jeff Mitchell. He is one of the most legally knowledgable and respected members on the SI boards. Even rrm praised his knowledge and professionalism today. If the doc he posted was forged, it would be highly out of character. Plus none of the subsequent posts on that thread questioned its authenticity. Very strange silence from a group usually trigger happy to question anything that could be viewed as negative.
You are correct that I did not obtain the legal copy myself. We all need to work together to best utilize our time resources. Your response helps us start to get to the bottom of this issue. I will dig further to check out the document, but again, the source has a very reliable history to this point IMO.
Wicklund(now Plasticon) is listed as the judgement debtor and the writ was granted "for" bluelinx and GP. But bluelinks and GP are listed as "garnishee", so I can see the apparent confusion. Like I said, I'm not a lawyer and will investigate further to see if your concerns are correct. Why would a lawyer not notice the language if it is in fact not kosher verbiage?
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust.
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quote:Originally posted by state780: Again with they psychoanalysis.
I have such a depressed state of mind I'm going to leave now so I can play 9 holes of golf and then have a Cuban cigar.
Life sucks!
Well State, anytime you can play 9 holes of golf in the middle of January you have something to be thankful for. Stay in the fairways and watch out for those slow playing DC lobbyists.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust.
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StockHunter, It appears Jockey was unable to respond to you. Sent me this to post. Sorry for the confusion. LOL
I added the Florida curbing and the Lasar Engineering. Along with the Ex Ceo and President of those, Dow Chemical and certain patent rights and so on are the various keys to the bankruptcy. If you really look into all those you will find a huge disaster that caused JT to be blindsided. This is why there has been so much Due Diligence done on Semco and Promold and why there are SEC holdups.
I have not seen the actual documents in question nor do I know Anyone that has seen the original docs.... But I do know there was no International Plastics in exsistance at the time and the verbage is not correct. For what it's worth I see that little piece posted by Mr. Mitchell no matter how much he sounds like a lawyer to be just a fairy tale. Just maybe he was hoodwinked into believing it was something it is NOT. Good luck in your quest.
[ January 12, 2006, 16:59: Message edited by: Chopper ]
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :)
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Chopper, thanks for the reply, but I'm a little confused by your comment that you added the Florida Curbing an Lasar Engineering. Did you guys discuss this earlier or is this from another site where you and Stock Jockey were discussing this? I just can't recall seeing any of this before.
The problem with the legal info is that it is edited. By the numbering it looks to have at least 17 parts. For the sake of argument lets say the doc was real. Could a third party (e.g. a creditor in the bankruptcy) garnish assets of a judgment debtor(Wicklund) through a garnishee (bluelinx,Georgia Pacific) since Wicklunds assets are basically coming through bluelinx/GP? It would be like having your employer being the garnishee for a bank that sues you for an unpaid debt. That would explain the language. I would want to see the rest of the doc to see if that explains all the linkage. Since JT has owned, taken over, lended between, and signed agreements between so many different entities, any legal document would be convoluted and hairy to dig through. I have seen bankruptcy docs that list many defunct(and precursor) entities in the string of debts just to cover all bases. Maybe the same practice is used in garnishments. Notice how both GP and bluelinks are listed for the same debt even though bluelinx is the current entity involved.
Guess I'll have to join SI so I can question the sources directly. Been trying to avoid all the redundancy of posting to multiple boards.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust.
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quote:Originally posted by Chopper: Anyone have an idea if we shall see a small pr tomorrow?
Friday PRs have been pretty rare, but they did put one out on Dec 30, a friday. That may have been to met the promise of something by year end though.
My opinion is they issue PRs when buying interest wanes to the point that VFIN can't sell a significant amount of stock. That appears to be happening here. Tomorrow or early next week would fit with the pattern.
Thanks for clearing up your previous post. I should have hit refresh before posting. Unless someone sees that you edited your post it looks like I don't know how to read, LOL.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust.
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Stock, Even I had a problem posting that with the cut and paste. LOL and I got the flood protection twice. Now as far as VFIN here is a post from Molson Ice1 from RB. " Anyone else get a message from the SEC thanking you for the complaint and stating that they have been looking into VFIN for quite sometime. I called once I received the e-mail. Woman (name withheld) I spoke with stated she can't give specifics just that VFIN was a priority right now."
I as others believe that VFIN has a short position. No one actually knows if Mr. Turek has diluted anymore after that first little jump in the float and with the responce received by molson from the SEC, I am inclined to believe that shorting Does indeed exsist on this stock.
I am curious why BlueLinx would have any judgement against Plasticon? Isn't Plasticon supplying product to BlueLinx? So the only instance that could cause a judgement is if there was non performance on Plasticon's part. Additionally if a vendor could not fulfill a contractual obligation to BlueLinx.... Why the heck would they renew any contract with them as PR'd rather recently? All PR's I can assure you with any mention of BlueLinx went through their legal department. Also, how in the world could you get a judgement against a company that no longer is in business for four years ie. (International Plastics)? That whole garnishment issue stinks of manipulation of the facts (or lack there of).
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :)
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Chop, You and I disagree on what VFIN is doing and who they represent, but I'm glad people are filing complaints. If the reports from those who claim Rodney is advancing this idea(and that he says JT expressed concern about VFIN) are true, then they would likely include that info to bolster their complaints.
Since BAC does a very good job of never putting anything in writing, it is difficult to make a case against their dishonest behavior to the SEC. The more people who advance an argument that JT and Rodney know to be untrue, citing them as a source, the more evidence the SEC has of questionable behavior on their part. The SEC can connect the dots.
The comment that the SEC said VFIN was a priority is really out of character for the SEC. Everyone I have dealt with has been careful not to give out such information. I've dealt with regulators on a number of occassions over the years, and yes you can get some to chat off the record, but they know they're not supposed to say such things.
As for VFIN having a short position, I believed them when they told me they were handling an order for an institutional client and not thier own account. You may argue that the client has a short position however. If that is the case, then VFIN would be failing to mark the trades properly since it only takes 0.5% of shares short(12.5 million by the company's count) to make the REG SHO list and PLNI is not on the list. VFIN sells more than 12.5 million shares after lunch every day. Since VFIN has been fined in the past for failing to properly mark short trades for customers, it would be very surprising for them to mess up here again. To turn your head the other way in order to get some institutional business is one thing, but to flagrantly violate the law for months on end for the same client is pretty extreme behavior.
Can the money they make on commissions in a .006 stock really be worth risking your franchise? For the sake of argument, lets say they charge a 1% commission to handle the order for this client. For every 100 million shares they sell at .006 VFIN would pocket $6000. The last fine they received for failing to properly mark short trades was $17,000. This one would likely be much higher and could lead to them getting shut down. It just doesn't pass the logic test for me.
The garnishment issue will have to be further verified. If its real, the non-performance possibility would be one way this could occur. That could explain the push for additional capacity. One reason they would renew the contract is because it would be the only way to get their money back. Donald Trump wasn't forced out of business when he went deep into debt. His banks became partners, in essense, in order to get their money back out of him, and it worked. The other possibility is that bluelinx is just a conduit(garnishee) for another judgement creditor. Then your comment about why would anyone renew a contract with them becomes more compelling.
As with most things Plasticon, there are more questions than answers.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust.
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posted
I've got it folks! Jim bought 50% of all these shares in his buy back program. The other 50% have been bought by HUGE Mutual Funds getting in on the ground floor. Everything is in place now for rapid production. The PR of the audit and HUGE contracts are going to send us to .50. Load the wagon.
-------------------- It's only money..We'll make more tomorrow!
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quote:Well State, anytime you can play 9 holes of golf in the middle of January you have something to be thankful for.
Absolutely (and as I think you sense, of course I was being sarcastic). January golf in Washington proves the existence of God. My swing proves the existence of demons.
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quote:Originally posted by state780: OT: January golf in Washington proves the existence of God. My swing proves the existence of demons.
Every golfer can enjoy the game with the proper attitude. For myself, I'm a value golfer. I figure I'm paying to swing the club. I hate to brag, but my cost per swing is always the lowest in my foursome. And I don't even have to practice!
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust.
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quote:Originally posted by StockHunter: The garnishment issue will have to be further verified. If its real, the non-performance possibility would be one way this could occur. That could explain the push for additional capacity. One reason they would renew the contract is because it would be the only way to get their money back. Donald Trump wasn't forced out of business when he went deep into debt. His banks became partners, in essense, in order to get their money back out of him, and it worked. The other possibility is that bluelinx is just a conduit(garnishee) for another judgement creditor. Then your comment about why would anyone renew a contract with them becomes more compelling.
If you want an answer for this, check what happened to Laser Engineering Inc.(FL) If you know how to search, you 'll find the answer.
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quote:Originally posted by tavil: If you want an answer for this, check what happened to Laser Engineering Inc.(FL) If you know how to search, you 'll find the answer.
Thanks tavil. Will do.
Here's a link to the full garnishment doc we've been discussing. Any lawyers out there willing to interpret this? Am I interpreting this properly to mean that Bluelinx has to hand over (have garnished) rebar support sales proceeds intended for Plasticon to satisfy debts the company owes to other parties?
quote:Originally posted by StockHunter: Here's a link to the full garnishment doc we've been discussing. Any lawyers out there willing to interpret this? Am I interpreting this properly to mean that Bluelinx has to hand over (have garnished) rebar support sales proceeds intended for Plasticon to satisfy debts the company owes to other parties?
This garnishment doc is a small piece of the whole puzzle for this case. Do not look at it on its own because you will arrive to wrong conclusions. To cut the story short though(for those too lazy to search), as a PLNI stockholder, I would not worry about this case at all.
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tavil, all due respect, but Yoda-like statements ("seek, and the answer find will you") are not a big help. If you have an explanation, by all means as a PLNI stockholder I'm interested in hearing it explained. Kinda defeats the purpose of sharing DD if every poster has to start from scratch, especially on complex issues.
posted
With all due respect... Posting DD on this board is the equivelant to running through a guantlet...It use to be a place where folks could share DD as well as "opinion" and "speculation" The 2 latter ones are no longer welcome without getting a disertation on the rules of posting here! Unless you have a notorized statement from the Pope your at risk here! Folks wonder why they don't have the insider scoop and why groups of investors are choosing to communicate via Private e-mails and phone calls...Take what your offered and incorporate it in what you have then ...Buy, Sell or Hold...
Tavil...thanks for your input and feel free to share only what you choose...If you have anything else you'd care to share please feel free to PM me...thanks again...
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Honest, Bear, no offense meant. I think it's a fair point--instead of sending a bunch of posters scrambling to figure out what Tavil has in mind, he could, you know, tell us. Maybe it's just me, but I'm a busy guy and don't have time for riddles.
posted
State... I use to post things here that I got from sources. I didn't go into detail sometimes. My reasons were always well intended...When I did that I got picked apart so I quit...I now communicate with folks in other ways...There are many investors who refuse to post here and on other blogs for this reason...so...If all someone has is the blogs to get information they are driving in the dark with no lights...Stock Jockey only posted his information because he was surprised people were still discussing it at all...he was a little irritated as was I.
I'm not sure why Tavil didn't lay it out for you...The use of a PM may work for you communicating with him...I told him to PM me if he had anything to share...He may have shared all he's willing to at this point...He did say he would not worry about this case at all...I had concluded that also...along with other folks...
We're all busy...but...the DD on this site only occasionally has information that is useful for my trading purposes...That information is found elsewhere...
If the disecting of posts and PLNI and Turek would stop then maybe folks might post more here...never know...I'll see if Tavil is willing to PM me...You might want to try also...who knows...otherwise I'll take what he offered as another confirmation for me from a seperate source that the garnishment is a non issue...
posted
claw, IMHO you're being worked, ol' Son................
PLNI will lay it all out for us shortly. So why you bother responding to bashers and blowhards who are clearly trying to "..BAIT you.." into a TOSable post is beyond me.
If '760' is such a "..whizbang stock guru, pseudoVIP, & 'very busy guy'..", what the Sam Hail is he doing whining-&-moaning on a freebie stock board, over a $0.006 stock he owns none of, and could clearly care less about. He comes across like another "..legend in his own mind.." to me..!!!
posted
Stockhunter, Your first mistake is trusting the worm's partial flow of docs! Your second Second is not getting all the legal documents yourself and revieving them and the circumstances that surounded Laser Engineering, Florida curbing and the X President and CEO of the companys and the other principle parties that were involved in those 2 corporations prior to JT's acquisition bid.
While your at it, why not check Rudolph T. Poselli Jr. and Gary Ball's background relating to Florida curbing and some other corporations that they have been involved in and their subsequent business dealings. Rather interesting story unfolds with a little work. I really don't expect you to do so though as your only source appears to be your buddy the worm. Of which your are quoted heavily on his web site btw. Hmmmmm
I have known about everything you post that is negative for Months. I really don't appreciate your sly way of slandering the company, with your lack of posting all the truth that is out there. But I guess you enjoy bashing your own investment. You did say you were a fractional stockholder ay?
I don't post a lot here anymore as the DD quality environment has deteriorated greatly. I have done an extensive back ground check on MR. T and all the companies that he has either done business dealings with, current and past. I have even visited some of the companies myself as an investor and even shared the ProMold visit with all the board members here. Have you done any of this hands on Due Diligence??? I do know several others posting here have... Investors like Stock Jockey, Bearclaw and a few others. In my research I established a comfort level that JT will be successful and this company will move to the OTC BB and beyond rather rapidly after a few issues are taken care of, which should be very shortly.
I am not going to debate you, state or anyone else on the board with the wasteful bantering. But I will recomend that you guys get off your lazy cans and do some real field work rather than posting your innuendo, half truths, seemingly innocent questions and your so called analysis of the market makers like you were a Wall Street Insider or posing as an honest investor. Have a good weekend folks and GLTA!
Ohhh and Gooooo Panthers!
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :)
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posted
geez, no good deed goes unpunished. I saluted Chopper before for sharing his field report, and I get a slightly different salute in return.
Stock, who has done a ton of substantive DD, needs no defense from me. I just wish we could spend more time evaluating (potentially competing) facts and less insulting each other.
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