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Author Topic: Option Pic's lounge ~
Chart walker
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quote:
Originally posted by SherriT:
I checked EOD, and I was up $50 on a $900 investment in one hour, and I didn't have any fear about it...

DEFINATELY on to something....

[Big Grin]

WTG SherriT!! [Smile]
Rock on!
No doubt you're a little more ahead today with the present drop! Remember gaps fill but EOD shows what's going on. they'll bouce around but market is weak right now...

Status on our experiment:

Our FIRST Put
.QQQRQ QQQQ JUN 43 Put
20 for $1.31 cost us $2,620.00
selling now for 2.09 $4,180.00

Profit of $1,560.00


Our second Put
.UQQRS QQQQ JUN 45 Put
10 for $1.30 $1,300.00
selling now for 3.41 $3,410.00

Profit of $2,110.00 -approaching 200% [Big Grin]

--------------------
The "BIG PICTURE" http://www.businessjive.com/nss/darkside.html

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Chart walker
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REPO... -word had it you were banned! lol ~
Welcome back!

Your questions are very deep, give me a week to work through some models and back testing, -as well as "what if's." I'll get back to you... [Smile]
Interesting. Do you think it can out perform what we are doing with these straight CALLS and PUTS at "extremes?"

That's my biggest question, -the bottom line [Smile]

--------------------
The "BIG PICTURE" http://www.businessjive.com/nss/darkside.html

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SherriT
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Unfortunately Choicetrade has been having system problems this morning, so not able to take advantage of my new found info...read some more this weekend [Big Grin]

Can hardly wait to dump some pennies and buy more options! LOL!

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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Chart walker
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quote:
Originally posted by SherriT:
OK Chart, these are kinda options and kinda chart questions...I was looking at the weekly charts you posted previously for the cubes, and decided I would pull up the charts of some of the others you mentioned...GOOG, MSFT, SPY, etc. and see if I could pick the buy points and what you would attempt to buy...correct me if you would...

http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=MSFT&p=W&b=5&g=0&id=p03316799780
===========================================
Looks like everytime the Stochastic breaks below that 20 mark of it's indicator you should radar for a CALL, right on SherriT [Smile]
================================================
.
.
.

MSFT you could have bought a 22 or 23 call once you had that long white candlestick in July 06 - then, in Jan, a put at 31 or 30 would have been the thing once those red candles confirmed the downtrend...that Stochastic is a no-brainer, isn't it?
=================
Looking at that MSFT chart makes you wonder how much you could have made! Nice rides up and down.
======================================


http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=GOOG&p=W&b=5&g=0&id=p03316799780
======================================
You're "reading them" [Smile] RSI Stochastic is a good indicator too ~
http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=GOOG&p=W&b=5&g=0&id=p43299777695
======================================

GOOG looks like it is at the bottom, or nearly at the bottom of the Stochastic and the Accum/Dist is turned down...the candles I don't like as much because it isn't a clear up or down to me...by the indicators, I would say call, but I would likely stay away from GOOG because of the wide strike price variation at the levels GOOG trades at...

.
.
.

http://stockcharts.com/h-sc/ui?s=SPY&p=W&b=5&g=0&id=p03316799780

SPY - man, this one looks like an extreme top, so I might even consider a put on this next week for September (or whatever the next period is after June) just out of the money. All indicators pointing down, or turning that way at least...

OK, that was enough questions...how close was I?

=====================================
http://stockcharts.com/charts/gallery.html?SPY
Yep! Right on SherriT, that's what I saw a week or two back, (posted it somewhere...) notice that the indicator (PPO) on the Weekly chart in the gallery page was negative for some time...

The "signs" that where there for the big turn down were the red volume bars in the daily and the lower volume over all.. Volume is the fuel that feeds the fire [Smile]
-And NOTHING that runs that long and hard stays up forever!

I think you're doing great!
looks like you have found yourself a side income stream [Smile]

Love these "Big Boy" stocks because the BS isn't there like with the pennies... And when you know what the indicators are "telling you" combined with playing the extreme tops or bottoms and buying 6 month contracts you almost can't not make money at this...

Remember, mistakes that you make are WORTH GOLD!!

--That is where your learning comes from, when you go back and find out what you missed as far as "signs."

Cause then you are even better then before!

Peace out peeps!! [Smile]

Chart ~

--------------------
The "BIG PICTURE" http://www.businessjive.com/nss/darkside.html

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SherriT
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Bought another today... [Big Grin]

5 QQQ June 42 Put for under 1.50...I figured if the trend was heading that way, I can probably stand to make 20% or so on it since the 43 is doing nicely, and the out-of-the-money current status made it cheap

AMD looks ripe for a call...below its 52 week low and all indicators are bottomed out. Might be able to wait another day or two for a bigger bottom, but....

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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milliam
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I pulled the trigger on some QQQQ June 40 puts. Got them at open this morning and paid a premium. I still expect them to do fine though.
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SherriT
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Man, it's like someone turned a light on....I see more buying ops than I have funds! LOL

This is just way too darn much fun! [Big Grin]

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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SherriT
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I figured I would add my stats on the day since I am the only one here right now [Wink] :

5 QQQQ June 43 Put
Cost 1.80 ($900), Current 2.06 ($1030)

5 QQQQ June 42 Put
Cost 1.50 ($750), Current 1.63 ($815)

Not bad for purchases since 1:00pm last Friday!

THANK YOU CHART!

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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JLo
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Today's action: No Action

DOW March 45 Call Short didnt reached my sell limit. DOW Chemical has suitors including Indian firm (unlikely). Even humors will pump it up. Feb 26 gap up $3. Decided to let it go even tho in all likelyhood its all hot air. DOW board will fight take over (look at GM). Basically waiting for smoke to clear.

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SherriT
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This morning I bought:

15 DYNUU Sep 7.50 Put
Cost .50 ($750)

And now, I bought:

8 AMDJU Oct 16 Call
Cost 1.36 ($1088)

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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SherriT
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Got a few more QQQQ puts with the jog upward today...hope that was a good decision.

Anyone else here???

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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JLo
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Today:

Found different target.

* Short YHOO Apr 25 put * open for 0.15

* Buy to close NVDA March 35 Calls * 0.05
collected 0.25 for it, held since Feb 26
profit 0.20 or 80%

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SherriT
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JLo, do you short everything Option wise? Seems like you are doing very well....if you don't mind my asking, what quantities of the contracts are you able to purchase? Realistically, many people can afford to buy large numbers of shares of penny stocks but getting out with profit during a run can be difficult. I just wondered if you stick to small $ amounts like 1K or if you successfully trade a single purchase with more than that?

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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JLo
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Lately I've more shorts than longs. It made up for the last couple months when I had been flat. Contract size, its what ur comfortable with and what your margin account allows. Usually I have 5-6 positions in my account, when I take one off, I put one back on same day or in a couple of days. Total# of contracts can add up. Like everyone else, I am always ready to improve like learning more to help make better decision like more charting and that dividend idea is intriguing.
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SherriT
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OK. I was thinking about Chart's example of dividing into 5 parts, and eventually, if you doubled each time and reinvested that amount, you would be in the hundreds of thousands. I wondered how difficult it is/would be if you wanted to sell 250 contracts or so...I just have no experience with amounts that high, not so much that I would be uncomfortable doing it...

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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Jenna
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Hey guys,

Just wanted to let you know I am studing up on options so I can join you in trading them....It's going to take me a while to understand it though....

Good Luck to all & I'm watching! [Big Grin]

-Jenna

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

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thesource
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I'm on here lurking as well . I've dabbled in options a few years ago but never really made a serious effort .

--------------------
----- Game Over -----

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Jenna
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Well study up boy then you can join the party right after me..... [Big Grin]

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

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SherriT
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10 said she is going to read up on them this weekend. I can hardly wait until it get closer to expiration on mine to see just how well they do.

Also? (man, I have started typing like 10 too LOL) I think the best day trade or short swing ones are going to be the options with about 1 month to expiration. Any thoughts any of you who have done this before?

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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thesource
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quote:
Originally posted by Jenna:
Well study up boy then you can join the party right after me..... [Big Grin]

I actually moved my Roth over to E-trade and plan to only invest in big boards and options with it . No POS penny stocks for that account .

On a side note , I've finally made back some of my losses in penny stocks from last year . Up about $1400.00 in the last two weeks but still have a ways to go [Frown] .

--------------------
----- Game Over -----

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Jenna
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Hey guys,

I have to apply to trade options, with Scottrade, even though I already have an account with them....I have to apply to add that kind of trading to my account....

Anybody out there trading options using Scottrade or should I use someone else?

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

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JLo
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Its too risky to write 250 contracts on single company or index. Thats 25,000 shares you are shorting. Assuming the underlying is $30, that means your at risk is 3/4 million$. Incidently the margin to do that is 25% or $187,500.

In another thread "Index vs Company Option", I take the opinion that an index option position is nowhere to hide when it trends against you.

Basic but true at least for me: diversify.

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milliam
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Jenna, I think all trading accounts have to sign up for the option trading. They'll make you sign a bunch of stuff that says "options are risky and not for everyone". Its amazing how often you'll see that. I use TDA for mine and its just fine as far as I can tell. I'm sure some of the more options oriented companies (optionsexpress, etc.) would be better, but for now any of the onlines should do for you.
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milliam
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Sherri, you are correct that the near term contracts will be the best to swing or day trade. They will move very fast, but that goes both ways...up or down. If you can get the direction correct, there's big money to be made with them.

Also, you've got me a little worried with your statement "I can hardly wait until it get closer to expiration on mine to see just how well they do"...I just want to make sure you understand the workings here. Unless the stock continues in the direction you want, your options will be losing money. If the stock stagnates, you'll still be losing money based on the time value alone. Sorry if you know this, I just don't want to see you get surprised.

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Chart walker
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http://www.schaeffersresearch.com/
Sign up for the free news letter, -worth it.
""Ton"" of info there too.


QUICK notes! [Smile]
I like an index fund because it's already diversified, -single stock's can tank on one bad PR/news, and even "over" selloff. Where an index fund is more "averaged" and I've seen in the history of the charts that they tend to be less whip-saw and more predictable. There are a ton of ETF's out there as they are growing in popularity. ~ Major market moves are more predictable IMO (watch the FED and interest rates for example, etc.) -they move together (see below chart links).

examples:
DIA
IWM
QQQQ
SPY
OIH
VDE
IYE
IXC

Also, when really building up an account, I would have trouble flopping alot of money on Options (talking about my plan of splitting the account into 5, --as posted in detail earlier...) -but the "CONCEPT" of the POWER of doing that can be be seen.

Also, ETF's like the Cube's (QQQQ) are heavily traded (liquid!). The only thing I know of that is more liquid is the FOREX market... -which btw is why I've been trying to brush up on that animal, poking around the FOREX thread! [Big Grin]

Again, there are a million ways to skin a cat, these are just my thoughts and my reasonings...

Everyone has idea's and opinions and allow us to see many angles,... "Priceless!"

This board is taking off, some good solid plays and ideas coming out here!

Also, start to notice how all the gears of the clock/market work... Compare these charts and see what can only be seen as a miracle as they ALL trade in basically the same pattern! Look at their charts!

http://stockcharts.com/charts/gallery.html?qqqq

http://stockcharts.com/charts/gallery.html?%24comp

http://stockcharts.com/charts/gallery.html?iwm

http://stockcharts.com/charts/gallery.html?spy

"Understanding" is called for here.
They do move in a connection with each other, in pattern, understanding them is power. Always ask yourself questions...

-Is there a "leading/lagging" index?
-HOW do they move together?
-Is there an "order" of movement... etc...

Gotta run board!
GLTY All!

Chart ~ [Smile]

--------------------
The "BIG PICTURE" http://www.businessjive.com/nss/darkside.html

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Chart walker
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quote:
Originally posted by milliam:
Sherri, you are correct that the near term contracts will be the best to swing or day trade. They will move very fast, but that goes both ways...up or down. If you can get the direction correct, there's big money to be made with them.

Also, you've got me a little worried with your statement "I can hardly wait until it get closer to expiration on mine to see just how well they do"...I just want to make sure you understand the workings here. Unless the stock continues in the direction you want, your options will be losing money. If the stock stagnates, you'll still be losing money based on the time value alone. Sorry if you know this, I just don't want to see you get surprised.

FWIW, -as stated earlier.
I sell with one month to go as a rule of thumb on the 6 month contracts. This is the safest way I have thought up to date with options ~

Look up "Intrinsic value" and how it decays value for a deeper understanding, or simply sell with one month to go. [Big Grin]

--------------------
The "BIG PICTURE" http://www.businessjive.com/nss/darkside.html

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SherriT
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quote:
Originally posted by Chart walker:
quote:
Originally posted by milliam:
Sherri, you are correct that the near term contracts will be the best to swing or day trade. They will move very fast, but that goes both ways...up or down. If you can get the direction correct, there's big money to be made with them.

Also, you've got me a little worried with your statement "I can hardly wait until it get closer to expiration on mine to see just how well they do"...I just want to make sure you understand the workings here. Unless the stock continues in the direction you want, your options will be losing money. If the stock stagnates, you'll still be losing money based on the time value alone. Sorry if you know this, I just don't want to see you get surprised.

FWIW, -as stated earlier.
I sell with one month to go as a rule of thumb on the 6 month contracts. This is the safest way I have thought up to date with options ~

Look up "Intrinsic value" and how it decays value for a deeper understanding, or simply sell with one month to go. [Big Grin]

Thanks Milliam and Chart....nice to have friends with warnings! LOL

In my statement about seeing the money, I am going to get too heavy into options until I have done a couple of plays and made a decent (10%) profit. I doubt that I will let it go long enough to lose too much money (if any), nor would I buy into anything that I really wasn't pretty darn sure of the direction. Pennies don't seem to follow the rules of the charts, but the big boards do (other than the occasionally jog here and there).

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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SherriT
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Note: I couldn't edit my last post, but all of my current options are in June or Oct....that might explain part of my earlier comments

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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Jenna
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Sherri- are you really in them or are you doing virtual trades?

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

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SherriT
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I am really in some for June and Oct now....I did a few virtual trades last night as well, but here I am speaking only of real ones....

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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Jenna
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These are the choices we get when we go to buy an option:

Buy to open
Buy to close
Sell to open
Sell to close


Guys would I be right to use these:

Buy to open

&

Sell to close

********************************

I do not want to write, I just want to buy the option & sell it (hopefully for a profit) before it expires....

Can anybody help, which buy & sell orders should I use?

TIA

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

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SherriT
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Buy to open and Sell to close are the two you will use for simply Calls and Puts...

--------------------
Study before you buy, Sell before you think about it....

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Jenna
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Thanks Sher- that's what I thought- just wanted to make sure.....

Currently I bought "virtual" options on OptionsXpress for now until I feel comfy....

Thanks for all your help guys & gals.... [Wink]

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

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Jenna
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quote:
Originally posted by Chart walker:
Ok, now I'm going to let you in a a HUGE trick!

Learned the darn thing by accident! [Smile]

Everyone and their mother knows a PUT makes money when a stock is going DOWN, and a CALL when price goes up...

But here's how to make a freaking TON of money with next to NO money! CHEAP!!!!

When you want to buy a CALL buy a PUT INSTEAD and sell it short!!! Or when you would buy a PUT, buy a CALL instead and short it!! WAY OUT of the money, the further the better! -the further the CHEAPER!!

--If you "sell to open" you are shorting it...
Meaning it will make money when it does the opposite of what it is... Hence, I shorted CALL will make money when it FALLS in price! [Smile]
-or a PUT will make money when the price goes up!

Why does this make TONS of money?....
SUPER CHEAP CONTRACTS!!!!!!

While the "crowd" is buying PUTS you are buying CALLS and "selling to open" because you can buy them for CENTS!!

Here are two examples that I'm in right now... The first is NEAR the money the second was the WAY out of the money as far as I could go! [Smile]

.QQQFV QQQQ JUN 48 Call --current price $44.41
-10 for $0.59 (my cost $590.00) [10 contracts]
they are selling for 0.5 or ($500.00)
Profit of $90.00 Almost 20%!

NOW look at this ONE!!

.QQQFZ QQQQ JUN 52 Call
-20 for $0.05 or (my cost $100.00)
[That's 20 contracts!]
0.04 = ($80.00)
Profit of $20.00 -or 20%!!

ONLY $100.00 bought "20" CALLS that "sold to open" -that's what the "-" in front of the contract number means...
In otherwords, I could buy CALLS WAAAAAAY out of the money CHEAP!!! In fact buy the ones that are the FAREST out that you can!!! And SHORT them and make money!

What a trick huh?!! [Smile]

Clearly you can see that even a little bit of money can make you a TON with this "trick!"


---now the catch...
"The Rich" (the powers that be) KNOW this too...

They have set up "requirements" now which must be met in order to short a Option contract, otherwise EVERYONE would do it!
1) you must have at least $10,000.00 in your account, some are more then others... ($50,000.00 for an Index Option).

2) you must have Margin

3) level 5 trading account status...

For those who really what to get on the fast track, there is your blue print and directions! But for this thread I'll keep to the basic straight CALLS and PUTS from now on but wanted to make mention of this powerful Trick...

I'm only too Happy to share this TRICK/info with you all. Should someone pop a Million Buck$ with this please let me know of your Bessing!! Hard times have fallen on my family and the health thereof, so I am not able to do anything mysely yet... --but I feel this knowledge should be shared... [Smile]

Actually, I may not get to use this info for a long time as I'm contemplating going to seminary school to become a Pastor [Smile]

GL Board!!
Chart ~

Hey Chart!!

Wanted to let you know I tried to do it this way but it would only let me do a few, the others it wouldn't take the order due to not enough in the account.....(I am only doing vitual trades right now).....what do you suggest someone does if that doesn't work....

I put the orders in the regular way too- just to see what the difference would be...

for example I have:


.GTSE GT Jul 25 PUT (8)
cost .95 ($760)

So I was going to also do you "trick" to see how they compare....I was trying to do...

Since I had a PUT - I was going to short a Call - the farthest one out of the money which I found to be a 35 call so I tried this...

.GTTG GT Jul 35 CALL (1)
cost .95

...but it said I can't do it because I need 10,000 in my account, even though I am doing it virually right now & could add virtual dollars, I do not want to do that because I really won't have that much anyway........is there another way to do it?...or doing it the first way- would that be the best for now?

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

Posts: 3944 | From: Rochester, NY | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Jenna
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Another question....for anyone....

I virtually bought this the other day:

.QQQRL QQQQ Jun 38 PUT (25)
cost .33 (825)

Wondering if I may have went to far out.....

I think the Q's may get down to $38 by June....did I do this correct? & if so did I go out to far even though I think that's were it's headed?....

Is it better to stay close to the current price then place your Call or Put....

--------------------
..just remember....Family is EVERYTHING!!

Posts: 3944 | From: Rochester, NY | Registered: Sep 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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