posted
The absense of SEC filings is because they file in Wyoming. I talked to several people there today, but the person with the goods is out until tomorrow. I'm trying to find out the details of the 100 million preferred shares(among other questions). They are filed with the WY SOS Corporations division, but not the details. Those should be available from the Securities division. If I find out anything tomorrow I'll post it here.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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Will... I'm no one's bulldog...Is this your quote below? This was the beginning of our exchanhge started by you. Who's the one too arrogant to apoligize...This know it all better than anyone attitude by you is what started it...
You jumped in on postings between state and I...I was giving him another look at possibilities based on data interpreted in the charting...Then you decided to set me straight... My input was nonsense...That began our little square dance...
You want to come after me then do it...but...not through someone else...Choppers a good guy...He works hard finding DD and supports PLNI...He's a respected member of As...
I won't even address the "shut his piehole" comment...Looking at your posts the past week there's a chance your a slick paid basher...the symptoms are there..You don't own a share but assure people of the gloom and doom of dilution and Reverse Split...Wonder why that is..????
"I must have missed that proof ??? Or if someone says it, that makes proof or fact? Accuumulation and short selling, nonsense. Almost 400M vol=8
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
A Wyoming company does not have to file with SEC?
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by will: A Wyoming company does not have to file with SEC?
There are some instances where small companies, not on an exchange, only have to meet state security standards for certain things. This link elaborates on it:
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
Thanks for the one good answer StockHunter. All very good questions and answers in a sea of mystery. I can only hope that we have been handed a huge short position that will be called on very soon with an explanation from Mr. Turek.
And No the Green Baron is Not the total proof, However the statement that Turek has not released the shares in question is just more concrete to stabilize the foundation or another piece of evidence to seal the Tomb with. And you are right about one thing... It was one heck of a sell off. I bought more. GLTA
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :) Posts: 1161 | From: NC | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
Well, looking at that, I would say they don't meet those exemptions. They have $10M in molds, and surely more than 300 shareholders.
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Chopper, I will give you The Green Barons statement regarding Turek has not released any shares. I think there was a qualifier in his statement though, that he assured him that the O/S was not over 2B. Was it not 1.8B a short time ago? Could that not be one share shy of 200M diffirence? Would you have to divide the total volume of last 6 / 7, (Apprx 400M), days by 2, because of a buy and a sell being reported? Would that account for 200M shares and leave The Green Baron deniability because of the wording of his report?
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by will: Well, looking at that, I would say they don't meet those exemptions. They have $10M in molds, and surely more than 300 shareholders.
From the SEC web site: ----------------------- If a company registers its securities under the Securities Act, the company must then file periodic reports with the SEC under the Securities Exchange Act of 1934. The obligation to file reports continues at least through the end of the fiscal year in which the registration statement became effective. After that, the company is required to continue reporting unless its satisfies the following "thresholds," in which case the company’s filing obligations are suspended if the company has fewer than:
300 shareholders of the class of securities offered; or 500 shareholders of the class of securities offered and less than $10 million in total assets for each of its last three fiscal years.
Even if a company doesn’t have to register its securities for an offering, it still may have to file reports with the SEC if the company lists its securities on an exchange or the Nasdaq Stock Market or has 500 or more shareholders and $10 million or more in assets. ---------------------
I agree they do not look like they currently qualify as exempt. Looks like they qualified last year and stopped filing then. I'm waiting a call back from the SEC and will bring this up with them.
There may be some lead time after they no longer qualify before they have to file w/the SEC. If not, it should be very easy to prove the don't qualify by these criteria since they send out PRs bragging about the value of their molds.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
excellent analysis of the trading volume compared to the alleged float, stock.
Posts: 610 | From: DC Metro area | Registered: Jun 2005
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Will, I will post the release just for you again. And it does say that Mr. Turek stated that the O/S was less than 2 Billion.
From the Green Baron Urgent Need to Clear Up a False Rumor
It appears there are rumors circulating that may be causing the major drop in PLNI shares over the past four days. The Company has stated to us that the total issued and outstanding for Plasticon has never surpassed two billion shares. Apparently, Plasticon increased its authorized share count recently to five billion shares, but Jim Turek and Bill Howe have assured us it has not issued any of these new shares to date and may never do so. The rumors may stem from some people assuming the Company had already issued all those shares into the market.
In conversations with CEO Jim Turek and Bill Howe last night, The Green Baron Report was told that the total outstanding shares are still fewer than two billion shares. In fact, Jim Turek stated it is the intention of the Company to still reduce the number of shares outstanding and that Plasticon has a very interesting and creative reason for the increase in its authorized count that shareholders will likely applaud. Please contact Plasticon International directly for more details.
About Plasticon International, Inc.
Plasticon International (www.plasticonintl.com) designs, produces, and distributes high-quality concrete accessories, transportation signage, plastic lumber, and office supplies which are all produced from recycled and recyclable plastics. Plasticon is a leader, an innovator of cutting edge design, engineering, and production of industrial and commercial products. Plasticon is a green Company, environmentally friendly, using recycled plastics to produce its line of products.
GLTA
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :) Posts: 1161 | From: NC | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
The key to the SEC filing might be the "if":
"If a company registers its securities under the Securities Act,..."
Since they used to file when they were Wicklund, I assumed they were at one time registered under the Securities Act. I do not know this for a fact, perhaps they filed voluntarily or the name change also changed thier filing status. I keep on adding quesions to my list...
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
"Since the stock broke below .01 we have traded the entire stated float in just 9 trading sessions. There has been very little if any intra-day swing tradable moves. For Matt and GB to be correct that the float is still 500 million it requires that many shares were bought, sold lower, bought lower, sold lower, etc... by the same people or that almost every holder flipped their shares during the past 9 days.
This action is not consistent with the massive flipping required to turn over so much of the float in tight trading action. If one assumes a significant chunk of the float is held by longer term non-flippers, the math(of a 500M float) gets even more difficult to correlate with the action."
Now that is logical. Much easier to draw the conclusion that would support diltion as apposed to a chart interpretation. Much clearer and believable explantion.
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Chopper, that is what I said, that TGB said the O/S was under 2B. It was 1.8B according the IR guy, and as of the last buy back PR. So that leaves a possible 199,999,999 that could have went back to the market.
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
"The key to the SEC filing might be the "if":
"If a company registers its securities under the Securities Act,..."
I would think they would have to register inorder to trade on the pinks even. I only found 4 SEC Filings for Wicklund, I saw no 15g.
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Chopper: Will, I will post the release just for you again. And it does say that Mr. Turek stated that the O/S was less than 2 Billion....
GLTA
Well, then it must be 1.999 billion or threabouts, because Mapple told me on the phone it was 2 billion.
But then again, he told me the a/s has been at 5 billion for months.
So you can see why I laughed when the Green Baron report said to contact Plasticon for details.
Posts: 610 | From: DC Metro area | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
Much better answer Will. Thank you, I will take that into consideration. I still believe in the CONSIDERABLE amount of mirror trades (20-30% daily done as swing plays by MM's), the huge selloff due to panic and naked shorting though. All things you did not mention.
quote:Originally posted by will: "Since the stock broke below .01 we have traded the entire stated float in just 9 trading sessions. There has been very little if any intra-day swing tradable moves. For Matt and GB to be correct that the float is still 500 million it requires that many shares were bought, sold lower, bought lower, sold lower, etc... by the same people or that almost every holder flipped their shares during the past 9 days.
This action is not consistent with the massive flipping required to turn over so much of the float in tight trading action. If one assumes a significant chunk of the float is held by longer term non-flippers, the math(of a 500M float) gets even more difficult to correlate with the action."
Now that is logical. Much easier to draw the conclusion that would support diltion as apposed to a chart interpretation. Much clearer and believable explantion.
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :) Posts: 1161 | From: NC | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
If this stock is being "shorted" what does that do to your math? Or have you disregarded "Naked Shorting" all together...If you include it then how much volume could be attributed to it? 50 million...100 million...200 million..more????
You really do make a case for dilution with only examples you chose...You just leave out the rest? Very convienient....
Sincerely, The Bulldog
quote:Originally posted by will: "Since the stock broke below .01 we have traded the entire stated float in just 9 trading sessions. There has been very little if any intra-day swing tradable moves. For Matt and GB to be correct that the float is still 500 million it requires that many shares were bought, sold lower, bought lower, sold lower, etc... by the same people or that almost every holder flipped their shares during the past 9 days.
This action is not consistent with the massive flipping required to turn over so much of the float in tight trading action. If one assumes a significant chunk of the float is held by longer term non-flippers, the math(of a 500M float) gets even more difficult to correlate with the action."
Now that is logical. Much easier to draw the conclusion that would support diltion as apposed to a chart interpretation. Much clearer and believable explantion.
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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"Since the stock broke below .01 we have traded the entire stated float in just 9 trading sessions. There has been very little if any intra-day swing tradable moves. For Matt and GB to be correct that the float is still 500 million it requires that many shares were bought, sold lower, bought lower, sold lower, etc... by the same people or that almost every holder flipped their shares during the past 9 days.
This action is not consistent with the massive flipping required to turn over so much of the float in tight trading action. If one assumes a significant chunk of the float is held by longer term non-flippers, the math(of a 500M float) gets even more difficult to correlate with the action."
Chopper, Mr. Claw, can you refute, debunk, disprove what stock has contributed. Does his analysis work in the favor of dilution as opposed to accuumilation and sharting? Does his arguement meet the standard of "preponderance of evidence" ? Is that not more believable, logical, possible, than a peron's intepretation of a chart? Does that coupled with the ambiguity of the 199,999,999 shares that might be in the float support dilution over accuumulation and shorting?
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
I see you answered already Mr. Claw. Then my next question would be, is PLNI on the SHO list? Please don't tell me that there is an O/S of 2B and a float of 500M, so it can be shorted 1.5B before it makes the SHO list. That arguement isn't valid. I saw that when the guy posted it, and it just isn't the way that works.
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
I assume you mean, NO, you do not accpet that dilution is more acceptable than accuumulation and shorting as an explantion of the unusually high volme of the last 6 / 7 trading days.
quote:Originally posted by Bearclaw: No
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Willy... Not my argument. The new SEC official over fraud...she stated that "Naked Shorting is not provable and it's just normal trading"...that's pretty close to her quote....
So if you take her interpretation then there is no problem...It doesn't exist...but...
If you watched the L2's over the last 3 weeks or so with WDCO and then VFIN.... the trading activity was as good an example of naked shorting and price manipulation as I've seen...That is what got me looking in this direction...Then hours and days of phone calls and monitoring the trading convinced me of it...
Now...Stockhunter and I agreed to disagree about a week or so ago...He owns shares (sorry Stock I thought you said you sold) but you do not... So why even share any of what I've found with you? You have zero invested in this company except the claim of dilution and reverse split...so what's that about?
If your not paid to be here then why? I don't buy the I may be interested in buying some shares...You want real then start getting real...
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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"So why even share any of what I've found with you? You have zero invested in this company except the claim of dilution and reverse split...so what's that about? If your not paid to be here then why? I don't buy the I may be interested in buying some shares...You want real then start getting real... "
I would like you to share only those things that can be proven or are factual. Monitoring and talking to people on the phone is hearsay, and interpretation at best.
I never said PLNI would R/S. I implied that many companies dilute / R/S / dilute again. In a later post I even said two good things about PLNI...one of those was it does not have a history of R/S'ng. Talk about gleening information to support your arguement, that would be you. Taking the whole R/S comment out of context.
I am not paid to be here. I have followed PLNI since it was traded under its old symbol, (which I cannot recall right now), before its name change. When it hit its 52 week low I mentioned it to friend here, (he posted and verified that yesterday). I had a moratorium on buying pennies, because I was losing money, and missed the opportunity to buy at its low. That I regret. It would make me happy if there is another buying opportunity I could take advantage of and make some money from PLNI.
Now you have brought the arguement full circle for a weak position:
From: Q Prove you're right A Prove I'm not right Q Prove you're Right A Do your own DD Q Prove you're right A You're a paid basher
Do you understand how silly that sounds to a reasonable person?
Look you win, It's accummuulation and shorting.
I think people will read these last few pages and the reasonable ones will see where the preponderance of evidence takes them. What stock offered is mcuh more factual than what you have offered. The canned weak arguement responses, opinions, personal attacks, and the clincher, an accusation that I am a paid basher.
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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The post below is you...I knew I read your RS and gloom and doom a few days ago.
You started this little dance disrespecting me and then then wanted an apology for me going back at you....Bulldog you called me and a few other things...Now that sure get's me thinking of a truce...
I buy your moritorium on pennies...Ok that works...My position on share buyback and shorting is not weak... it gives as much as you give for your dilution not to mention the reverse split you deny/misinterpreted saying...so...in that case we're both weak...
Your right people will read these posts and find you day after day warning all of dilution...Maybe they'll find it refreshing that there may be other explainations...find a way through the smoke screen of dilution...
No one wins in these instances...so it's a draw.. maybe you'll not try to disrespect me again and think you have a free ticket...no free rides here Will...
The RS comment you deny really making...out of context is below...People who read this will probably think you were talking about another stock...just happened to be on the PLNI thread...Your a wordsmith...I'll give you that...bright guy...I'll give you that too...
So when I called you a paid basher it came from your accumulated posts...an example is...
"I assume you have a substantial amount invested in this stock. Fortunately I do not own any. I am simply trying to make you aware the ways these companies screw you. No skin off my nose, you''ll see dilution and a R/S, and your 100,000's of thousands share become 100's of shares with a PPS that will drop faster than rock." --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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Sorry Willy... I forgot to reference the date of November 1st for the previous post concerning the Reverse Split comment you said was misunderstood...
Of course the one you made the day before ...below...was more vague but the reference is clear to me..."sneakier than the obvious"..Yah...you fit the profile of an experienced basher...
I asked you to get real...I don't think that will happen...you'll wordsmith around and around...
These are your statements and people can read and conclude for themselves...If you want to possibly purchase shares as you have stated you may want to in the future ... then it may require regular shock treatments to turn your opinions around...
Regular DD and sharing that in this case won't change the color of this cameleon...
will Member posted October 31, 2005 11:44 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- "well, my friend, you can declare what good work would be, or you can do it"
So, it would seem I don't have any "good work" to do. It would be right or appropriate for someone who had an investment in PLNI to do "good work" to find out what is going on with the unusually high volume, and the status and deatil of the preferred.
I wasn't being a wise ass intitally, evidentally you took it that way. There are a lot ways these companies can dilute and then R/S you out of your money. Converting preferred shares into millions of common shares is one way. Increasing the O/S is obvious, but they're a lot smeakier than the obvious. Just trying to be helpful. Hope it plays out well for you. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Posts: 4664 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004 | IP: Logged |
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
This is the first day in how many that we closed up??? Not sure how many but it has been a while. Maybe the fall is over now...blue skies ahead. Just wish I could have bought a few more.
-------------------- It's only money..We'll make more tomorrow! Posts: 788 | From: Tx. | Registered: Jun 2005
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DQ, you're absolutely right. I'd love even to inch up a little Friday, but Fridays often aren't good for pinks--to many unknowns to sleep on, and the fact is we're still totally in the dark.
Posts: 610 | From: DC Metro area | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
If there is manipulative naked shorting going on [though I doubt it]I'd be more inclined to think VFIN was doing it than WDCO. WDCO faded more aggressively in the face of buys than VFIN and they participated on the bid when it looked like the stock was about to tank. VFIN is a mack truck. They fade a little on the opening buys but drive it down after that. I've been chalking that up to a tight timetable to raise a given amount of money, but I can be wrong.
Keep in mind the MMs are only going to take on a stock for manipulation if they don't think the company can fight back. If their DD indicates the company has to dump shares to raise funds then there's not much risk to force it down. The faster and further they get it down, the more shares the company has to dump. Its a self fullfilling strategy. That's why Bears characterization of the SEC fraud officials dismissal of the pratice is so disturbing. Manipulative naked shorting is about as anti-capitalistic and fraudulent a strategy as I can imagine.
So, if VFIN is naked shorting we need to ask why they are so confident there will be plenty of shares for sale at lower prices for them to cover. They read the same PRs we do and probably have better and quicker access to securities filings. I find little comfort in the possibility these are not long sales.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
I think tomorrow could be the tell all. I've been analyzing the chart, the money flow and accumulation distribution was looking rough but with a nice improvement today. I think tomorrow could be a good gauge on the direction it's headed. Ever since May really, vol. has been thru the roof in the black then, but with the red now, more shares traded now than usual since the new o/s brought to light. A new base level, and pps basicly right in the middle of what it's done in the those last 6 months.
Posts: 2634 | From: The highway | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
I don't think the usual Friday curse of the pinks should apply tomorrow. We've pretty much washed out the weak holders - mostly those of us who have come to doubt the magic dates they throw at us. The new money coming in doesn't know the history. They will be anxious to get on board for the big developments the company promised for the next 2 weeks.
It will go down if VFIN forces it down. If VFIN steps back, I would expect a significant spike upward tomorrow. All IMHO.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by StockHunter: I don't think the usual Friday curse of the pinks should apply tomorrow. We've pretty much washed out the weak holders - mostly those of us who have come to doubt the magic dates they throw at us. The new money coming in doesn't know the history. They will be anxious to get on board for the big developments the company promised for the next 2 weeks.
It will go down if VFIN forces it down. If VFIN steps back, I would expect a significant spike upward tomorrow. All IMHO.
Yes, I've really come to dislike VFIN.
Posts: 610 | From: DC Metro area | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
Going hunting tomorrow. Won't be around again til Monday. Good luck all. Next week should see some action with the Promold closing. Hope they will release news of some contracts to go along with it. LUV that PLNI!
For Christmas I want Jim to announce that Home Depot and Lowes are now carrying Plasticons rebar supports. Now that would be a real Christmas.
-------------------- It's only money..We'll make more tomorrow! Posts: 788 | From: Tx. | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
I care state...It really comes in handy when flushing out which information is real and from who...You may give me info that doesn't pan out but if the intent was OK that's fine. Especially in Pennyland...
When I present another valid point of view and someone goes after me it makes me wonder why...I found out what I needed to. It took a while and you may have got sick of the BS...but...that's what it took...
I have a lot invested in PLNI and don't want what happened tonight from someone who doesn't have a nickle invested...I'm not sure why you decided to jump in but that's OK too...
We'll know by the time we cut the Turkey in 3 weeks what happened. I expect the PPS will go north very soon and folks will settle down. I expect a lot of movement before Thanksgiving. I also expect the float to get real tight. IMO
There are several possible reasons for the current trading activity...The most popular discussed has been dilution and a impending R/S...The gloom and doom theory that happens so often in pennies..We've all experienced it... I presented another reason to consider that didn't conclude in disaster...that simple...
quote:Originally posted by state780: bear. Nobody cares.
DQ, you're absolutely right. I'd love even to inch up a little Friday, but Fridays often aren't good for pinks--to many unknowns to sleep on, and the fact is we're still totally in the dark.
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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Even Bigger yet. How about Depot amd Lowes carrying Semco's concrete and asphalt coating products as well! Makes me wanna sing Jingle bells. Good Luck hunting DQ.
quote:Originally posted by DQ.: Going hunting tomorrow. Won't be around again til Monday. Good luck all. Next week should see some action with the Promold closing. Hope they will release news of some contracts to go along with it. LUV that PLNI!
For Christmas I want Jim to announce that Home Depot and Lowes are now carrying Plasticons rebar supports. Now that would be a real Christmas.
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :) Posts: 1161 | From: NC | Registered: Mar 2005
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