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Author Topic: Bush on $4 gas: 'I hadn't heard that'
Relentless.
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I must have missed something?
Weren't permanent bases always on the schedule?

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Relentless.:
I must have missed something?
Weren't permanent bases always on the schedule?

not openly, i think most of US assumed they were,

but the admin has always denied it to the Iraqi's...

still does in fact...
U.S. Not Seeking Permanent Iraq Bases, Ambassador Says

By DAVID STOUT
Published: June 5, 2008
WASHINGTON — The United States ambassador to Iraq on Thursday dismissed any suggestion that the Bush administration is maneuvering to set up permanent military bases in Iraq.

“I’m very comfortable saying to you, to the Iraqis, to anyone who asks, that, no indeed, we are not seeking permanent bases, either explicitly or implicitly,” Ambassador Ryan C. Crocker said at a State Department news briefing.
Mr. Crocker commented at length, and sometimes disdainfully, on a London newspaper report of “a secret plan” whereby the United States would keep 50 permanent military bases in Iraq, keep control of Iraqi airspace and insist on legal immunity for American soldiers and contractors.


http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/05/world/middleeast/05cnd-crocker.html?ref=world


my understanding is that Congress (GOP controlled at that) passed RESOLUTIONS condemning the idea, but they were not binding as law...

i beleive al-Maliki is in Iran this weekend seeing if they want to help in kicking US out now:

Iraqi PM in Tehran for talks with Iranian leaders

By ALI AKBAR DAREINI – 5 hours ago

TEHRAN, Iran (AP) — Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki was in Tehran Saturday for talks that are expected to focus on a proposed U.S.-Iraq security agreement that Iran fears will keep the American military in neighboring Iraq for years.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j5leYnvOpPqrVCiXxC65pROPNYBAD915DQ400

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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Propertymanager
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quote:
i thought you called yourself a Christian, is this the kindof stuff you are really praying for?
I almost never pray about money or anything having to do with money. If you'll re-read my post, you'll see that I didn't say anything about praying.

quote:
and it is coming, and you can thank the "conservatives" that have been running the country for the last 30 years for that.
What conservatives? Bill Clinton? George Bush? Who?

quote:
the coming social unrest is likely to include slogans like "eat the rich" and "crucify your landlord first"...
"Crucify your landlord first"? That's not a very good slogan, it doesn't even rhyme. Besides, they can't get rid of the landlords. Most low income tenants couldn't possibly manage their own house even if it was given to them - ESPECIALLY IF IT WAS GIVEN TO THEM. All you have to do is look at the Habitat for Humanity houses a few years after the owners get them. UGH!

Besides, low income people today don't have the initiative to revolt. As long as they get their government handout and the beer and cigarettes don't run out - they're perfectly happy to be enslaved by the policies of the left!

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Relentless.
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If your dream/prayer of $10 a gallon gas comes true, then you will see the very unrest you don't now think is possible.
It won't just be the poor people who rent your shacks who take to the streets...
It will be middle class folks that grab the pitchforks.
Ten dollar a gallon gas means that it's more expensive to work than to sit at home and collect unemployment or welfare checks.
It means a spiraling economy where no one has money to rent your roach infested shacks..
It means they will just squat there..
It means there will be so many of them that the cops won't be able to do a damned thing about it.
This means you will soon be without a dime.

Maybe it does affect you...
Funny notion isn't it?
The economy as it works means we are all connected.
I'm certain you are about to learn all about it.

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Stupid
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Ten bucks a gallon...Whew,makes me think twice before I buy a truck and go back to work.

--------------------
DDDDD

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bond006
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PM I am wondering why any sane person would wish what you are wishing. It might happen but why hope it does.

I see every day what happens to humans when the worst comes out in them some never heal.

And to have this mess come out when I am so close to retirement is ironic to say the least

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Propertymanager
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quote:
It means a spiraling economy where no one has money to rent your roach infested shacks..
Isn't that funny that you assume that I rent shacks and that they are roach infested. The truth is that neither is true. Of course, truth doesn't matter much to the left.

However, you seem very concerned about the price of gas. So, why aren't you advocating doing some things that will actually lower the price of gas, like drilling in ANWR and off the continental shelf?

You can't have it both ways - whining about gas prices but not be willing to do anything to correct the problem!

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T e x
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So, why aren't you advocating doing some things that will actually lower the price of gas,. . .

correct the market...

PAY Ah 10 SHUN!

--------------------
Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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Relentless.
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
quote:
It means a spiraling economy where no one has money to rent your roach infested shacks..
Isn't that funny that you assume that I rent shacks and that they are roach infested. The truth is that neither is true. Of course, truth doesn't matter much to the left.

However, you seem very concerned about the price of gas. So, why aren't you advocating doing some things that will actually lower the price of gas, like drilling in ANWR and off the continental shelf?

You can't have it both ways - whining about gas prices but not be willing to do anything to correct the problem!

The bit where you assume I'm a lefty at all is just.. well.. adorable.
Drill in ANWR.. drill with bits made entirely of baby harp seal teeth for all I care.
Use caribou fat for the bit's lubrication and I'm on board.
You seem incapable of proving you are anything but inept.
And I know you rent roach infested shacks because of your general attitude coupled with your seemingly unavoidable desire to be wrong.

Jeeze.. where is Bdgee.. If I'm going to argue with someone who's perpetually wrong I at least want a mild challenge.

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Relentless.
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And another thing, the price of oil has not a damn thing to do with ANWR.
ANWR has the ability in five years to drop the price of oil by fifty cents.
You want to drop the price of oil?
Tell ya what:
STOP BOMBING EVERY COUNTRY WITH OIL!
Revolutionary idea?
The price of oil is largely if not WHOLLY due to speculatory investing.
Speculation that supply will be interrupted because of what????
WAR.
God Damned shocking huh?

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
quote:
i thought you called yourself a Christian, is this the kindof stuff you are really praying for?
I almost never pray about money or anything having to do with money. If you'll re-read my post, you'll see that I didn't say anything about praying.

quote:
and it is coming, and you can thank the "conservatives" that have been running the country for the last 30 years for that.
What conservatives? Bill Clinton? George Bush? Who?

quote:
the coming social unrest is likely to include slogans like "eat the rich" and "crucify your landlord first"...
"Crucify your landlord first"? That's not a very good slogan, it doesn't even rhyme. Besides, they can't get rid of the landlords. Most low income tenants couldn't possibly manage their own house even if it was given to them - ESPECIALLY IF IT WAS GIVEN TO THEM. All you have to do is look at the Habitat for Humanity houses a few years after the owners get them. UGH!

Besides, low income people today don't have the initiative to revolt. As long as they get their government handout and the beer and cigarettes don't run out - they're perfectly happy to be enslaved by the policies of the left!

PM, that's just wrong. here's your exact post:

I hope that gas prices continue to rise. I'm looking forward to seeing what price gas will

now, i might not be one of those people that runs around praising the lord and trying to witness everybody, but i happen to believe that hope is a very religious thing...

i understand you are unable to comprehend that since you've posted enough to here to make clear that you have some decidedly sociopathic tendencies.

you said it plain as day, you see? as far as i'm concerned God is everywhere and that's a prayer...

you can't go round all week being a jerk and go into Church on Sunday and "be good" and expect that's enough. and as Relentless pointed out to you? as a landlord? you'll find you aren't needed at all. especially at the end of the month when it's time to decide between food and rent....

if you think the cops are gonna come help? think again, cuz they won't be any better off than your tennants.. we don't pay em that much... maybe if you give 'em a bonus outa your own pocket? you'll get extra help..

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SeekingFreedom
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correct the market...

PAY Ah 10 SHUN!


I've heard many on this board lay the blame for oil at the feet of speculative investing and I'm not saying that it doesn't belong there (at least part of it). But, what do we do about it? I mean in a capitalistic society (which most of the world is headed that way economically speaking), how do you tell people they can only invest in what 'The Man' says you can?

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Relentless.
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Nah, that's not what I'm saying at all.. pretty sure no one else is either.
The speculation is that when we attack.. then invade.. then occupy these "Oil Rich" nations there is a break in the supply.
My solution is to stop invading these countries.
Why are we about to invade Iran?
Because their leader said some bad things?
Actually read the words he's spoken and you will see clearly that he has yet to threaten anyone.
And what's more?
If threatening another nation is grounds for war then this nation should be blown away.
We're the ones actually bombing nations without cause.
We still haven't found any reason for the war in Iraq and it should trouble you, me and every human on this planet that five years later and we are trying to make excuses that Saddam was a bad guy?
Sure every reason Bushy stated was either coincidentally wrong or blatant lies.
No one is saying the speculative investors are bad guys who need to be regulated.
I'm saying this nation's government is wrong and needs to be hobbled before there is nothing left of the land it governs with brute force and lies.
We need to stop making threats towards Saudi Arabia, Iran, Venezuela, and every other nation that even murmurs opposition to this nation's march towards global conquest.

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IWISHIHAD
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[bold]This is killing business except oil related.[/bold]

Quote Propertymanager:

"It's very good for the rental business. More people are renting as the cost of living increases. People also want to live in the city where the drive to work is much shorter."

_________________________________________________

I guess i did generalize on my statement.

But i was looking at the majority of people that would be affected as opposed to the very few that will gain from others losses.

Sure the low rent landlords will gain the most compared to regular landloards.

We will need more people to handle all the new welfare and unemployment claims. I am sure that more liquor, cigarettes and drugs will be sold and stolen. Pharmaceutics will gain also and of course more laws and law enforcement will be needed. But the percentage that gain from those that have lost will be very small and it boils down to we are in deep...... if something does not change.

Like i said these oil prices are just killing business. The business that still survives that relies on oil not only have to worry about their business but they have to worry about the businesses they are selling to because of all the bankruptcies.

These bankrupt companies are taking down others that sold to them and it's real hard to allow for a lot of bankrupcies in the cost of doing business without becoming bankrupt yourself.

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Propertymanager
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quote:
And another thing, the price of oil has not a damn thing to do with ANWR.
ANWR has the ability in five years to drop the price of oil by fifty cents.

You're contradicting yourself. If ANWR would drop the price 50 cents and drilling off the continental shelf would drop it more, etc, etc, etc. soon we would be talking about real money.
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Relentless.
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
quote:
And another thing, the price of oil has not a damn thing to do with ANWR.
ANWR has the ability in five years to drop the price of oil by fifty cents.

You're contradicting yourself. If ANWR would drop the price 50 cents and drilling off the continental shelf would drop it more, etc, etc, etc. soon we would be talking about real money.
Fifty cents against $140 is nothing.
You contradicted the evolution of our species with your comments.

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by SeekingFreedom:
correct the market...

PAY Ah 10 SHUN!


I've heard many on this board lay the blame for oil at the feet of speculative investing and I'm not saying that it doesn't belong there (at least part of it). But, what do we do about it? I mean in a capitalistic society (which most of the world is headed that way economically speaking), how do you tell people they can only invest in what 'The Man' says you can?

you're right SF you can't put the genie back in the bottle.

for years? our economy grew and our WHOLE nation prospered with strict controls on public utilities.

the public utility owners didn't like being "regulated" and the "hippies" [Roll Eyes] didn't like the monopoly that was granted to the utilities...

now? we've done away with those controls because the big corps said that competition would offer better deals to the consumers...

well? in telephony that's working... but only because of wireless/cellular... it's not working in the other areas because the largest corps consolidated into even larger corps..

there is no real competition in oil. the only competition is to "buy" a futures contract thru the index market and hold it till you have to replace it with another one. there's no shorting in that market, it's all long...

the "funny" thing about it is that it's pension funds, University trusts, and other little people investment groups buying in heavy that are doing it...

the US is in a world achit right now. Obama ? McCain? they aren't gonna be able to fix this with policies.

the only fix is oil pricing itself right off the shelf.

PM's suggestion that we drill everywhere is very shallow because even if he's correct? those wells dry up fast, that's the real reason the oil co's don't bother. it's not the environmental whackos. it's pure bottom line issues that stop 'em.

MONEY RULES in this country, period. anybody who says different forgot to get off the bus

 -


if you ever get a chance to look at old movies shot on location around the city of LA? you'll see oil rigs everywhere.... they dried up fast... most do...
and the big find in Brazil? it's under 10,000 feet of water, and the oil is expected to be about 500 degrees F. that'll be expensive to get too...

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Highwaychild
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http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/25045979
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Highwaychild
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Happy 4th. It's going to be so patriotic.
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glassman
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yeah, from the article at the beginning:


When taking the question about the $4 milestone, Bush told the reporter, "That's interesting. I hadn't heard that."
If you're out there wondering... what your life is going to be like, and you're looking at $4 a gallon, that's uncertain," Bush responded to a question posed at a White House news conference. "And when you couple that with the idea that... taxes may be going up in a couple years, that's double uncertainty."


sheesh...
life's the same except more people are worried...

and it only took three months

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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glassman
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here's an article i missed this past winter:

Oil prices rise as Venezuela cuts supplies

Feb 12, 2008

LONDON (AFP) — World oil prices headed upwards on Wednesday as traders assessed a move by Venezuela's state oil company PDVSA to cut supplies to US oil giant ExxonMobil.

On Wednesday, New York's main contract, light sweet crude for delivery in March, gained 19 cents to 92.97 dollars a barrel.

In a statement, the Venezuelan oil concern cited "judicial-economic aggression" by ExxonMobil as the reason for its action, which it described as an act of "reciprocity."

The move by Venezuela comes after ExxonMobil, the world's biggest energy company, secured international court orders freezing up to 12 billion dollars in PDVSA assets.

The court orders were issued as part of an international arbitration sought by ExxonMobil to gain compensation for the leftist Venezuelan government's nationalization of key oil fields in the Orinoco basin.

Crude prices had surged higher on Monday after weekend threats by Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez to cut US oil deliveries.


http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5jzw5x9suPo8BSh77mESYZzUY-FVw

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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T e x
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where to place this?

http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/06/09/technology/09petaflops.php

--------------------
Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by SeekingFreedom:
correct the market...

PAY Ah 10 SHUN!


I've heard many on this board lay the blame for oil at the feet of speculative investing and I'm not saying that it doesn't belong there (at least part of it). But, what do we do about it? I mean in a capitalistic society (which most of the world is headed that way economically speaking), how do you tell people they can only invest in what 'The Man' says you can?

i wonder what would happen to the overall commodities trading market if they did away with margin/leverage on long positions? or raised it to some "outrageous figure" like 50%?

the shorts would destroy the prices IMO...

--------------------
Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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Relentless.
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All those margin calls would kill the price.. then add the ensuing shorts to it?
Yup we'd be back down to $2.00 a gallon by winter.

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glassman
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it seems too simple man...

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Relentless.
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precisely why it will never happen
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glassman
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even the Saudi's are saying that the price of oil is ridiculaous and they are the ones that make the most money/profit on it...

In a statement following the weekly meeting of the Saudi Cabinet, Mr Madani said the current price of oil was unjustified and pledged action to prevent further "unwarranted and unnatural" price hikes.

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/natural_resource s/article4099716.ece

But many oil producers, including the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries and some of the world's largest fully publicly traded oil firms, say supply is enough and blame speculation for rising prices.

OPEC officials have lined up to say the exporter group does not need to pump more and Jeroen van der Veer, head of Royal Dutch Shell Plc, has blamed market "psychology," not shortages, for record prices.


http://uk.reuters.com/article/oilRpt/idUKL0930489320080609?pageNumber=3&virtualB randChannel=0

i heard AGAIN today that OPEC says oil should be at $70/barrel now.. not 130...

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Relentless.:
precisely why it will never happen

don't count on any Presidential candidate besides a Ron Paul to say it tho...

it could happen politically, but only if there were some really bad "social unrest" like we had in '68.... and even that would have to be more widespread than it was in '68

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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Relentless.
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yup, agree 100%.
It will take ELE to make it happen.

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