posted
Here's how retarded these people are... they are having a cartoon contest for a vile historical event they claim never even existed in the first place.
Is this making any sense to anyone?
-------------------- Do not boast about tomorrow, for you do not know what a day may bring forth -- Proverbs 27:1
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posted
So far, Ben Laden's statements about how this would progress are all true. For every dollar he and his kind spend, we are spending millions from our treasury.......and he broke the back of the USSR with exactly that scheme.
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posted
To anybody that says I think this is a laughing matter let me say for the record it certainly is not. We are dealing with fanatics who will certainly die for there beliefes and that is the hardest people to fight or understand. And I don't think that we really understand that part of the world at all. The cartoon was the straw that broke the camels back, we don't see it that way at least thats the way the president would have us believe. But there has been in the past a lot worst things done to the people of the mid east and they have swallowed it so I feel something goes much deeper than a cartoon.
I think the way to deal with these people is to do so in private and not have them loose face wich is very important to them. And then make a public statement that lets them think that they have won the day. Because if you want a confrontation you will certainly get it from the Iranian people and the Mosilum community around the world. And then they won't listen to anything we have to say and they will do something that we won't they will fight to the last man.
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posted
All I gotta say is that IF we go after Iran, then they better let me and my guys prosecute it in a manner that will allow us to win. No handcuffing ROE that give em a chance to escape. To win a war, you have to be willing to do what your enemy won't. Period. That's part of the problem in Iraq. The LN's fear the insurgents more than us. Soldiers don't want to fight if they know their neighborhoods are being destroyed. It's brutal, but that's how it works. It's how we ended WWII, it's how this one will need to be ended if it comes to it. We need to stop worrying about world opinion and end it.
-------------------- If it wasn't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all.
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posted
Soldiers should conduct the tactical aspects of war, but they are not there to dictate how they want to fight or make decisions about how a war is conducted. If he can't fight knowing that, he needs to get out, just as is the case of any employee. This is not a military dictatorship.
Any soldier that forgets that needs to be straightened out before he destroys the reason the nation maintains a military. War is too important to be left to armies......I don't have the exact quote, but it is from D. Eisenhower.
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posted
Totall agree with you bdgee, but sometimes the powers that be just put the most silly rules in effect. My guys conducted themselves as consumate professionals, and made sure they treated the Iraqis with respect and dignity. We had an awesome rapport with the villages around our FOB, hopefully the guys that replaced us over there are conducting themselves the same way.
-------------------- If it wasn't for bad luck I'd have no luck at all.
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posted
Sorry, but the powers that be (i.e, the government, not the military or anyone acting within it) have that right and the responsibility (within limits of international law and the powers granted by the Constitution) to determine what the rules are by which a war is conducted and no soldier has the right to disagree.
The rules they provide may not suit you, but it is not your place to even quesion them and describing them as "the most silly rules" is no more a proper stance for one in the military than it is for him (or her) to make statements about what political party the military (or he)wants in office.
Nations that have permitted those in the military to take such positions ot make such decisions have quite often found themselve taken over by the military or some part thereof and become strict military dictatorships.
When you swore into the military of this Nation, that oath stated you would defend the nation and the Constitution and carry out whatever lawful orders you were given. In that Constitution that you have sworn to uphold is a requirement that the military and each of its personnel will not decide whether or how war is conducted.
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posted
bdgee, i have to say i agree with Hilander...
the politicians want their cake and eat it too..
war is hell..
you go in, do the job, and stand down...
most of our casualties have been over police work... the failures in Iraq have absolutely nothing to do with the military aproach...the failures have been political....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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posted
Sorry, I can't help what your emotional needs or desires are, the Constitution must be left as the rule, not the afterthought. Getting even and showing off how manly you are are not not a rational approaches to anything.
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posted
bdgee, i think you'll find that the professional military is much more interested in seeing war conducted properly than the politicians..
take the number of troops sent into Iran for instance? remeber the General that said to do this PROPERLY, we need 300K troops...
we wouldn't be where we are now had his advice been followed...
no, i'm not sure that it was possible to put 300K troops in Iraq considering the global picture, BUT he was correct... just as in any organization? there are yes-men (politicians) in the Pentagon too, and then there are the producers... unfortuantely? there are usually too many yes men depending on the producers to make them appear competent...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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The constitution should be followed: Congress declares war, President decides which General is best at waging it; then everybody let said General do the job...
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
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posted
Bush is a liar because he says the military minds on the ground are running the operation. We all know this to be false!
If the generals were running the operation, I really believe the situation in Iraq would be quite different. I believe the U.S. troops and military leaders over there are honest, sincere, noble, and valiant men of integrity. They have displayed so many acts of kindness and love to the Iraqi people.
The Bush administration has been the ones screwing things up. Top CEO's who run massive organizations, and do it successfully all have the same philosophy -- they appoint key leaders and decision makers and give them the power and authority to act.
Micro-managers never see true success. Bush and his crew need to stop micro-managing the war and let the leaders lead. Take the cuffs and collars off of them, and let them do their job!
-------------------- Do not boast about tomorrow, for you do not know what a day may bring forth -- Proverbs 27:1
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posted
Does not matter how we start Iran is different than Iraq. IMHO even if we start off with limited air strikes it will not end there the Iranians won't let it it will blow up to something big. I have all the faith of our boys they can handle the Irainians on the battle field .IMHO I really don't know if the nation is ready for it. The only thing that will bind the nation for that is another terrible terrorist attack on our country.IMHO
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posted
Peaceful means of progress should always be the first step.
In WWII, we tried peaceful means, but as we all know, we had to drop some big, bad bombs on Japan to bring peace.
War is a means of peace, but non-war attempts should always be made first. Now, how that should be done with the Iranians, I have no idea.
The Japanese were pretty hardcore fanatical types and war was the only solution for them to bring about peace... maybe war is the only solution for the Iranians.
-------------------- Do not boast about tomorrow, for you do not know what a day may bring forth -- Proverbs 27:1
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posted
So true to some extent I believe in Pax Quratur Bellum. But it also depends on what you are after. American people should be sure what the exact motives are if they are good and right there will be no need for any justification for war. If they are foggy like the last time when there was no need to be and now the whole mess has turned into finger pointing. The result uncertain motives and to few troops on the ground
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posted
You are right. The misleading from the Whitehouse and the subsequential finger pointing and political in-fighting has really done a lot of damage to the country.
Our destruction is happening from within. Our politicians are becoming the real terrorists! I feel more threatened from the guys in blue suits in D.C. than I do from the guys in turbins in the middle east.
-------------------- Do not boast about tomorrow, for you do not know what a day may bring forth -- Proverbs 27:1
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quote:Originally posted by Team Sleep: I feel more threatened from the guys in blue suits in D.C. than I do from the guys in turbins in the middle east.
-------------------- "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
posted
big shock huh? i'm still waiting for Tennet to confirm this
Ex-CIA official criticizes use of intel ELISABETH GOODRIDGE Associated Press Posted on Fri, Feb. 10, 2006 WASHINGTON - The Bush administration deliberately misused or ignored intelligence analysis in the buildup of the 2003 invasion into Iraq, according to a former top intelligence official.
Paul R. Pillar, who served as the National Intelligence Officer for Near East and South Asia from 2000 to 2005, also accused the administration of ignoring reports that Iraq would likely endure a violent transition period.
The administration "went to war without requesting - and evidently without being influenced by - any strategic-level intelligence assessments on any aspect of Iraq," Pillar wrote in an upcoming article of Foreign Affairs. "The Bush administration deviated from the professional standard not only in using policy to drive intelligence, but also in aggressively using intelligence to win public support for its decision to go to war," Pillar wrote. "This meant selectively adducing data -- 'cherry-picking' -- rather than using the intelligence community's own analytic judgments." http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/special_packages/iraq/13841307.htm
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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Perhaps certain intelligence information was ignored or emphasized for good reason. In the spy vs. spy game, things are not always what they seem, and justification for decisions that may seem foolish or stupid to the uninformed cannot always be given.
Also, anyone who thinks Bush should rely 100% on the US intelligence apparatus or their "analytic judgments" need only be reminded of the following names.
Aldrich Ames Robert Hanssen Katrina Leung
The list goes on but I think I made my point.
-------------------- One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example.
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quote:Originally posted by Team Sleep: I feel more threatened from the guys in blue suits in D.C. than I do from the guys in turbins in the middle east.
Gee, thats funny, I've never heard of a man dressed in a "blue suit" from D.C. strapping explosives to himself and detonating it on a crowded bus or at a funeral march....
-------------------- One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example.
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quote:Originally posted by glassman: Perhaps certain intelligence information was ignored or emphasized for good reason.
more excuses NS... "good reasons" ???? reasons? yes, but good? not!
Clarke said the same thing...the Sate Dept was full of people that said the same thing...
even Bush himself has admitted "mistakes were made"
the "working culture" his people created was the mistake, they only wanted to hear one thing... "yessir right away sir"
I concede. You are right. The blame lies fully with foolish Bush and his "yes men" for not listening to the expert analysis of the CIA. After all, it isn't like our intelligence apparatus has been compromised or anything....
-------------------- One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example.
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posted
An eneeway, you can't prove nuthin cause they ain't no pichurs o Googee and that thar criminal Abramoff.
Who ya gonna beleev, that lyin kruuk that has dun kornfessed to bein a lyin kruuk or the Prezeedent of thees heer ewenighted states that ain't admitted to nuthin cause he don't have to cause he's the Prezeedent?
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posted
This country is so divided any more half of it is looking to over look the laws that are being broke and making excuses for criminal acts I think that it is time that we do divide the nation I would have to leave my beloved AZ but it would be worth it to me. The Bush people say we should, they say it on many ocassions. I am talking on talk shows and such. We would have such a better life without these unproductive ball and chains that these people are and they could learn what it is like to support themselves and all there problems. They could learn what it is like to fight the wars that they start and support from the bar that they drink at. And of course they would not have to worry about social security there life span is shorter because of there over all crummy life. They don't believe in education so they won't have that expense either. And they can have a field day at the Border with Mexico since they don't generate enough revenue to pay anybody to patrol it. They could use all volunteers that never finished high school. They won't be working to much. All in all it is something the blue states should really think of. Oh yes you can keep your hero good old George W. he comes with the whole group. Brownie Boy,scooter,condi ,and Rummy. Plus others to stupid to mention.
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there is plenty of evidence in here that the intel was cherry-picked, and even known to be faulty... all you have to do is read it with a critical non-partisan eye....( it was written by a GOP-controlled committee after all)
the primary sources were all proven unreliable by our own services before they were quoted by any number of admin officials...
Bush himself never actually said much of anything conclusive about Iraq's capabilities.. if you parse his speeches carefully? you'll find he implied alot of things..
but he did leave everyone with the impression he had said something...
that in itself is pretty damning if you think about it....
now that we are facing a real threat from Iran? he is going thru a "proper" world political process (for what that's worth). there is a reason he didn't do that before... the evidence for war never existed.... and he couldn't go to war if he had actually let the inspections continue....
Iran can honestly claim to be afraid we'll invade for no reason other than we want to now....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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quote:Originally posted by Team Sleep: I feel more threatened from the guys in blue suits in D.C. than I do from the guys in turbins in the middle east.
Gee, thats funny, I've never heard of a man dressed in a "blue suit" from D.C. strapping explosives to himself and detonating it on a crowded bus or at a funeral march....
You've never heard of anything the Party wants being wrong! you are like a wind up toy.
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quote:Originally posted by Team Sleep: I feel more threatened from the guys in blue suits in D.C. than I do from the guys in turbins in the middle east.
Gee, thats funny, I've never heard of a man dressed in a "blue suit" from D.C. strapping explosives to himself and detonating it on a crowded bus or at a funeral march....
You've never heard of anything the Party wants being wrong! you are like a wind up toy.
posted
this isn't a BUSH or GOP issue, this is a world issue...
The UN resolution presented by the European Troika, namely Britain, France and Germany and backed by the United States, passed by 27 votes in favour, including those of Russia, China and India against 3 opposition from Cuba, Venezuela and Syria and five abstentions (Algeria, Byelorussia, South Africa, Indonesia and Libya) calls on Iran to:
+++Re establish a freeze on uranium enrichment and related activities.
+++ Consider whether to stop construction of a heavy water reactor that could be the source of plutonium for weapons.
+++ Formally ratify an agreement allowing the IAEA greater inspecting authority and continue honoring the agreement before it is ratified.
+++ Give the IAEA additional power in its investigation of Iran's nuclear program, including "access to individuals" for interviews and to documentation on its black-market nuclear purchases, equipment that could be used for nuclear and non-nuclear purposes and "certain military-owned workshops" where nuclear activities might be going on. [
the difference THIS TIME?
we are not ALONE....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
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