posted
what are the assumptions that will happen tomorrow for this stock. from the sound of the board, it looks like PAIV is not finished yet! could we see .03 again as it did couple months ago?
Posts: 1088 | From: Dallas, Texas | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by stocks1984: what are the assumptions that will happen tomorrow for this stock. from the sound of the board, it looks like PAIV is not finished yet! could we see .03 again as it did couple months ago?
This is just my opinion here, so take it for whatever you like.
1 of 2 things will happen tomorrow. The stock will be halted due to the enormous level of this screw up and in an effort to stop any further damage from occuring....OR the price will see multiple pennies as word has gotten out and been confirmed that those who shorted, be it intentional or unintentional, HAVE to buy back the shares. You could see this thing go well beyond what it will EVER be worth simply because they know someone has to buy the shares no matter what.
I don't know which will occur but financially I am hoping for the latter while I am not going to be upset with the first. I can get rich on another stock another dya, I don't want to see too many people bankrupt over a brokerages mistake.
-------------------- Lemmy = God Posts: 21 | From: Las Vegas | Registered: May 2006
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posted
How would halting the stock help? People who bought the stock would be out 100% of their investment, people who short sold it would make 100% profit, and the brokers would be even.
quote:Originally posted by TimLV: So here's a question for the board. Given the way this stock has spiraled out of control, it seems to me the only safe way to save both company and investor from incurring massive damage is to halt trading. However, the company does have the option to just screw the investor, which is far from unheard of. Do you think that they will halt the stock tomorrow or will it just be a payday for some and bankruptcy for others?
Posts: 5508 | From: Southeastern PA | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
This is Only my Opinion but be very very careful.
I can't see how this can't be halted.
It's immpossible for all the shares to be covered. There are only Apprx 56M shares available for sale. If only 1M additional shares were put on the market and are now circulating it's impossible to cover them. You can't cover with what isn't there. It's going to hit the fan tommorrow with the failure to delivers. Tommorrow is the third day. The day of reckoning. This is truly a mess. At some point the merry-go-round has to stop.
Posts: 3255 | From: Los Angeles California | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
If anyonw wants a free lesson in candlestick charting wait until Friday and look at a candlestick chart for this stock. If a gap takes place you will be able to recognize the pattern for future purchases and sales. I predict that we are going to see an upside tasuki gap by Thursday, which may be to late to get the best selling price. I think that this dilema will have played itself out by the EOW and the upward gaps will be filled. Watch your back.
-------------------- If ignorance is bliss, why aren't more people happy? Posts: 2647 | From: MN | Registered: Feb 2006
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quote:Originally posted by PCola77: How would halting the stock help? People who bought the stock would be out 100% of their investment, people who short sold it would make 100% profit, and the brokers would be even.
quote:Originally posted by TimLV: So here's a question for the board. Given the way this stock has spiraled out of control, it seems to me the only safe way to save both company and investor from incurring massive damage is to halt trading. However, the company does have the option to just screw the investor, which is far from unheard of. Do you think that they will halt the stock tomorrow or will it just be a payday for some and bankruptcy for others?
The brokers would be even, which is in their best interest. I doubt it will happen as well, I think the company will pressure them not to because that will ruin any future chance at moving to a bigger board but I just want to consider all possiblities. Quite frankly, my guess is that this opens over a penny and keeps on running. People have a product that other people are required to buy. They certainly aren't going to sell it cheap.
That's just my train of thought though.
-------------------- Lemmy = God Posts: 21 | From: Las Vegas | Registered: May 2006
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posted
The solution to this is that AMTD will have to buy back the unrestrcited shares and the volume will slowly decrease until it hits the actual level it was supposed to be. That being said, this can be a very nice week for some and my condolences to others if this comes to pass.
-------------------- Lemmy = God Posts: 21 | From: Las Vegas | Registered: May 2006
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posted
The problem is that in essence a huge number of shares that technically don't exist were sold. If 100 Million additional shares were sold how can 56 Million shares cover 156 million shares unless it's a shill game that keeps going round and round and never stops. Some type of intervention is going to happen by whom and when is the only question.
Posts: 3255 | From: Los Angeles California | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
That's the thing, the shares DO exist, they are just restricted. As such, someone (investors or brokers)will have to cover the positions that were shorted. This will continue until the gap between restrcited and unrestricted closes. It is going to be an interesting week!
-------------------- Lemmy = God Posts: 21 | From: Las Vegas | Registered: May 2006
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quote:Originally posted by TimLV: That's the thing, the shares DO exist, they are just restricted. As such, someone (investors or brokers)will have to cover the positions that were shorted. This will continue until the gap between restrcited and unrestricted closes. It is going to be an interesting week!
Restricted shares are non tradable shares. The only way this can be covered is if the company issues enough additional share on the open market to cover the deficit. You can't turn 56 million shares into 156 million or more. There are only a few options. Issue more shares from the A/S, unrestrict the restricted shares or do a forward split. At this point the only solution is to make more shares tradable. REMEMBER AT THIS POINT IN TIME THERE ARE ONLY 56 MILLION TRADABLE SHARES.
Posts: 3255 | From: Los Angeles California | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Unfortunately for the share holders of restricted shares, who sold their shares, will have to replace those shares that are available on the open market. TD/A and any others have probably started that today and when their accounts are reconciled then things will get back to normal. Then to make sure that all shares are accounted for, do a forward split on the trading shares of 2/1 and that will reconcile the rest. Just my opinion. TMAN...
-------------------- In the end, trust only yourself when trading stocks. Posts: 2048 | From: Texas | Registered: Feb 2006
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posted
Here's a few points I find interesting. Call me a stuck stick, but I can't pass go on this.
1. jphc shares were never collected and cancelled. So how did PAIV get accurate shareholder/share count for their filing? Seems to me that either paperwork wasn't filed, or not implemented properly.
2. trading continued on jphc up until May 19. I can't speak for dates after that, because I stopped tracking it. It must be a common occurence, because this situation/remedy appears in pinksheets basic FAQs.
3. PAIV intended a lot of things, but there are still missing links in their filings to accomplish their goal. Based on declared actions (otcbb events), all jphc and apoa shares were treated as a company name change and symbol change, carrying no restriction. BECAUSE THE OLD JPHC SHARES should not have existed at that point. And I won't bring up the missing APOA divvy count in the last filing (which, hey, I should have received on my jphc shares, too).
Now for my commentary... if that's the best Macro/PAIV can do, then they should be halted. Every day is further injury. They needed jphc for the shareholder count and APOA for the otcbb listing. If Ameritrade deals with them at the expense of their own customers, for the sake of giving PAIV cover, then Ameritrade deserves to be what... halted? Call the SEC, file complaints, I'm sure plenty of shareholders have already done that.
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: How would halting the stock help? People who bought the stock would be out 100% of their investment, people who short sold it would make 100% profit, and the brokers would be even.
PCola, a halt would give everyone a chance to straighten this mess out. Trading on PAIV is complicating a resolution exponentially.
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: Basically if a stock "gaps" big in one way or the other means it closes at a price one day then opens at a price much different form that. Meaning thre was a gap in which no sales took place. Like APO closed at .01 on Thursday and opened like 85% down at .0015. Filling the gap is when the price corrects itself to the point where it ended the previous day.
I haven't really thought too much about it, but it's not obvious to me why it happens as often as it does. Some peole say it has to do with the prices that MMs bought and sold, but it just doesn't seem like that's a good enough explanation.
Posts: 159 | From: San Diego, CA, USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Logic says this won't be suspended: Ameritrade froze trading today in accounts that had nothing to do with shares in question released Friday. Later that freeze was lifted... That tells me the deal has been cut. I'm hearing now Mytrade has told its clients it will cover it clients' short position, but *only* for the first transaction...in other words, you're a Mytrader and sold JPHC/PAIV on Friday, they'll cover all your short *if* you liquidated...but if you sold a portion, then another, then another...they'll cover only the first transaction.
In the GVRP suspension, the company was *screaming* and begging for suspension...supposedly, these guys are using whatever power/influence they have to avoid suspension.
(btw, a persnickety point: a "halt" is brief interruption (part of a day) that originates with NASD/NASDAQ the serious interruption is the 10-day suspension that originates with the SEC.)
posted
Just treat this as a stock that has been severely naked shorted.
quote:Originally posted by wallymac: The problem is that in essence a huge number of shares that technically don't exist were sold. If 100 Million additional shares were sold how can 56 Million shares cover 156 million shares unless it's a shill game that keeps going round and round and never stops. Some type of intervention is going to happen by whom and when is the only question.
Posts: 159 | From: San Diego, CA, USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by BuyTex: In the GVRP suspension, the company was *screaming* and begging for suspension...supposedly, these guys are using whatever power/influence they have to avoid suspension.
(btw, a persnickety point: a "halt" is brief interruption (part of a day) that originates with NASD/NASDAQ the serious interruption is the 10-day suspension that originates with the SEC.)
Yes, I'm wondering why PAIV isn't doing the same thing. It's not the end of the world for uplisting... unless there's more to the story.
And, thanks for that correction - suspension. Yes, we need that. In the meantime... DAYTRADERS! Go get 'em!
posted
TT, for whatever reason, the company line is they fear a suspension will jeopardize their 15c-211 filing, which must come from a market maker. Most suspensions result in either permanent limbo (GVRP), extended periods of no trading (BCIT) or trading on greys (SSTY)...not in the biz plan, obviously, for a company whose announced goal is either AMEX or NASDAQ.
Their plans need a refresh button or a real-time feed, if this is the best they can do.
Don't get me wrong, I still have my shares. And will until they take 'em away. But they are debt free (? didn't check lately) because Hawkins took their debt in exchange for 30% interest. Oh, I say no more on this. Hope they get there, but I doubt it.
posted
sry to ask now, but does anyone now what the 20 day avg of APOA ended up being? was it .01? I had JPHC, so just wondering. Scottrade hasnt updated account yet. If so, then the split price avg would make a JPHC share at the time worth .0025. Now I just hope PAIV can maintain a penny for 2 yrs.
Posts: 379 | From: Peoria, AZ. | Registered: Apr 2006
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posted
BuyTex, not directing my comments at you. Your input and advice are always a welcome sight.
I'm so dam mad about how shareholders get treated. Every dam time. I hope whatever deals they have worked out will remember the peeps that make all their grand plans possible.
posted
The final ratio was .4623 shares of PAIV for each share of JPHC. If I'm dong the math right that would have put the average of APOA at .0108 or so.
quote:Originally posted by Chad: sry to ask now, but does anyone now what the 20 day avg of APOA ended up being? was it .01? I had JPHC, so just wondering. Scottrade hasnt updated account yet. If so, then the split price avg would make a JPHC share at the time worth .0025. Now I just hope PAIV can maintain a penny for 2 yrs.
Posts: 5508 | From: Southeastern PA | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
I dont know about the rest of you but I am definitley holding my shares and I know of about 20 million shares so far that are being held by other investors. I called Glenn this morning, He is a 3rd party investor relation for paiv. He said that the float on the stock is 28.9 million shares. Which means if you all hold, this stock will go up tremendously because the stock will have to be condensed down from these 100's of millions of shares to 28.9 million!! I am sure the market makers new this and have been buying up these shares left and right to make a HUGE profit.
I know my stock group has
GLTA
-------------------- "The greatest risk is to take no risk at all" Posts: 54 | Registered: Apr 2006
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posted
I would not be at all surprised to see .10 today. Fact is, if what Stockeyes said is true, then everyone has to fight to get a lot of shares down to a small number of shares by comparison. MM's and those who didn't short sell aren't going to let them go cheaply. Today will be a bloodbath for some and retirment for others. GLTA.
-------------------- Lemmy = God Posts: 21 | From: Las Vegas | Registered: May 2006
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posted
those that have JPHC shares in their ameritrade accounts showing, those shares will be automatically converted back into PAIV shares correct? Does anyone know when that is?
Yesterday they converted PAIV shares back into JPHC shares until they clear up this mess, that's why I'm asking
Posts: 1091 | From: Brugge, Belgium / Dallas TX USA | Registered: May 2006
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posted
this is bull****, i had to back the shares .0059 that i shorted on friday. Right now i have no paiv shares showing in my account and my account is negative balance ... just ****ed up brokers dont want to take an blame as to what hppnd. any help guys?
Posts: 4071 | Registered: Dec 2005
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... just ****ed up brokers dont want to take an blame as to what hppnd. any help guys?
