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Author Topic: CIEN Ciena will be $35+ in 4 months $18.23
lostone
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they prolly bought puts n sold calls n shorted the stock

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lostone

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invester
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" J.P. Morgan said Ciena might encounter some difficulty integrating its recent purchase of Nortel assets that more than doubled the size the company. " Huh? The nortel unit scored the $1 billion contract with AT&T. LoL. What an idiot.
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lostone
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i really hope that max pain theory kicks in tomorrow, cuz i'm soooo screwed..

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lostone

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invester
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Another network equipment buy. ADCT last week now MOT. I just can't believe how cheap CIEN is. There going to get taken out.


3rd UPDATE: Nokia Siemens Buys Motorola Gear Business For $1.2 Billion
Monday 07/19/2010 11:43 AM ET - Dow Jones News

Related Companies
Symbol Last %Chg
ALU 2.67 -0.19%
CHL 49.68 0.96%
CIEN 12.52 -2.19%
ERIC 11.69 1.91%
MOT 7.90 5.33%

As of 2:23 PM ET 7/19/10
(Adds further executive and analyst comments, background throughout.)

By Gustav Sandstrom and Roger Cheng
Of DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

Telecom equipment vendor Nokia Siemens Networks said Monday it has agreed to pay $1.2 billion for the majority of U.S.-based Motorola Inc.'s (MOT) network equipment business in order to gain a stronger foothold in the important North American and Japanese markets.
In a joint statement, the companies said they expect the all-cash deal to close by the end of 2010.
Nokia Siemens is making the acquisition primarily to boost its position in markets like the U.S. and Japan and gain access to new customers, but the deal will also provide economies of scale and synergies in areas such as mobile broadband, Chief Executive Rajeev Suri told Dow Jones Newswires Monday.
Nokia Siemens, a joint venture between Finland's Nokia Corp. (NOK) and Germany's Siemens AG (SI) said it expects the transaction to strengthen its business relationships with a number of telecom operators including China Mobile Ltd. (CHL), Sprint Nextel Corp. (S) and Vodafone Group PLC (VOD). The stronger relationships are necessary as it finds itself squeezed by market leader L.M. Ericsson Telephone Co. (ERIC) and rising upstart Huawei Technologies Co. (HWI.YY).
"This deal is about customers," Suri said. "I expect to gain an incumbent position with many new customers."
As a result of the deal, Nokia Siemens expects to become the largest foreign wireless gear vendor in Japan, the third-largest in the U.S., and to strengthen its number two position in the global infrastructure segment.
The Motorola acquisition would provide much-needed economies of scale for Nokia Siemens, said analyst Sylvain Fabre at research firm Gartner, adding that the telecom gear industry has long been ripe for consolidation.
He said, however, that the integration will be a distraction for the company, which itself has been through an extensive integration process since its creation around three years ago.
Still, Suri said the Motorola takeover should be uncomplicated in comparison. "I don't think this is anywhere close to the integration we have been through," he told Dow Jones Newswires.
Approximately 7,500 employees are expected to transfer to Nokia Siemens Networks from Motorola's wireless network infrastructure business when the transaction closes, the companies said. Suri said he doesn't expect any layoffs.
Siemens and Nokia will support the deal by transferring a shareholder loan of EUR250 million each into preferred equity, it said, but added that the acquisition will be fully funded by Nokia Siemens.
Motorola's decision to break up the company through the sale of its network equipment business was demanded by activist investor Carl Icahn and aims to increase the company's market value. The company hopes it will force analysts to assess the cellphone and cable set-top boxes businesses separately from the remainder of the company, which makes public-safety equipment and hand-held scanners.
"I think this is fantastic news," Motorola Co-CEO Greg Brown told Dow Jones Newswires. "It's unlocking value for the separation and enabling a pure-play worldwide leading enterprise business."
Motorola is expected to split itself into two companies in the first quarter, with Brown now taking over the enterprise mobility and public safety units, and co-CEO Sanjay Jha running the mobile devices and television set-top box businesses. Brown said the Nokia Siemens deal doesn't affect the timing of the split, and declined to say which business would get the $1.2 billion.
Still, analysts believe the deal represents the right direction for Motorola.
"Bottom line, Motorola is taking more steps to separate their businesses and get fair market value--a positive," said Ittai Kidron, an analyst at Oppenheimer & Co.
Motorola shares rose 1.3% to $7.60.
Nokia Siemens has made no secret of its ambitions to enter the U.S. market. Last year, it bid for two units of bankrupt Nortel Networks Corp., only to lose the bulk of the wireless-equipment business to Ericsson and Nortel's metro ethernet unit to U.S.-based Ciena Corp. (CIEN).
Under the deal announced Monday, Nokia Siemens will take over most of Motorola's network equipment assets such as its GSM and CDMA business, while Motorola will retain control of the less widespread iDEN technology and a number of other assets such as network infrastructure related patents.
The acquisition will boost Nokia Siemens' position in the U.S. market and give it access to a network of new customers who may later choose the vendor for fourth-generation network upgrade deals, said Redeye analyst Greger Johansson.
Meanwhile, analyst Pierre Ferragu at Bernstein said the valuation of Motorola's assets looks fair, at 0.3 to 0.5 times sales. The deal should be positive for Nokia Siemens as the wider network equipment industry consolidates, he added.
-By Gustav Sandstrom, Dow Jones Newswires; +46-8-5451-3099; gustav.sandstrom@dowjones.com
(Roger Cheng in New York and Archibald Preuschat in Duesseldorf contributed to this story.)

(END) Dow Jones Newswires
07-19-10 1143ET
Copyright (c) 2010 Dow Jones & Company, Inc.

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AJGrano
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I'm thinking about buying a few August calls around that $12-13 strike price tomorrow since we should have a decline in the market due to the the IBM report. I hope this goes down another 3-5% tomorrow so I can pick some of those up
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AJGrano
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I'm thinking about buying a few August calls around that $12-13 strike price tomorrow since we should have a decline in the market due to the the IBM report. I hope this goes down another 3-5% tomorrow so I can pick some of those up
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invester
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Transtelco Expands Regional Optical Network with Ciena
32 minutes ago - Businesswire

Related Companies
Symbol Last %Chg
CIEN 12.33 -1.60%

As of 9:32 AM ET 7/20/10
Ciena(R) Corporation (NASDAQ:CIEN), the network specialist, and Transtelco, a regional operator serving businesses and carriers along the U.S.-Mexico border, today announced the implementation of a 400-kilometer high-capacity network span using Ciena's WDM transport technology. The new link is the longest span in Transtelco's network, adding route diversity, redundancy and bandwidth availability. Transtelco has also deployed additional platforms from Ciena's packet-optical transport portfolio to aggregate traffic onto the point-to-point link and increase connectivity to the operator's metro rings.

Transtelco operates one of the most reliable networks on the U.S.-Mexico border with more than 2,500 miles of fiber optic cable. Serving one of the most active border regions in the world, Transtelco provides metro and long-haul transport, dedicated IP access, co-location and voice termination services as a wholesale carrier and directly to end-user customers, ranging from small and medium businesses to enterprises. With Ciena's technology in place, Transtelco can combine its different data center connectivity and transport services as-needed over the existing infrastructure, giving the operator increased flexibility to meet the needs of customers requiring additional capacity and network service points.

"Ciena helped us make the longest hop in our network to date, so not only can we now reach more businesses and destinations, but we also can provide better service to our customers through added capacity and route diversity," said Manuel Marin, vice president of engineering and development at Transtelco. "To keep pace with customer demand, we're in the middle of a major network expansion across the south-western border region, and we hope to build on our success working with Ciena's engineering team to power new segments of our network."

"With our strong customer base and diverse product portfolio, Ciena is helping operators throughout the U.S. quickly expand their network footprint to capitalize on new business opportunities," said Alvio Barrios, vice president and general manager, U.S. market and Latin America at Ciena. "Our project with Transtelco is a great example of our continued success, and as capacity demands and networks evolve throughout the region, we're squarely focused on providing the converged optical and Ethernet infrastructure required to help networks scale and grow."

Transtelco deployed Ciena's CoreStream(R) Agility Optical Transport System and CN 4200(R) FlexSelect(R) Advanced Service Platform for the network expansion. Both platforms are part of Ciena's broader packet-optical transport portfolio, which includes solutions that address any transport network requirement or application and offer a variety of service and interface options.

About Transtelco

Located in the heart of the largest border region in the world, Transtelco's geographic focus includes the entire southern United States - Mexico Border. Transtelco delivers world class telecommunication services including: Transport, Direct Internet Access, Voice and Collocation Solutions for Carrier and Enterprise customers over a Next-Generation DWDM platform. Our philosophy of "simplified communications" allows our clients to focus on their core business while we solve their telecommunications issues. For more information, visit us at http://www.transtelco.com.

About Ciena

Ciena specializes in practical network transition. We offer leading network infrastructure solutions, intelligent software and a comprehensive services practice to help our customers use their networks to fundamentally change the way they compete. With a global presence, Ciena leverages its heritage of practical innovation to deliver maximum performance and economic value in communications networks worldwide. We routinely post recent news, financial results and other important announcements and information about Ciena on our website. For more information, visit www.ciena.com.

Note to Investors

Forward Looking Statements: This press release contains certain forward-looking statements based on current expectations, forecasts and assumptions that involve risks and uncertainties. These statements are based on information available to the Company as of the date hereof; and Ciena's actual results could differ materially from those stated or implied, due to risks and uncertainties associated with its business, which include the risk factors disclosed in its Report on Form 10-Q, which Ciena filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission on June 10, 2010. Forward-looking statements include statements regarding Ciena's expectations, beliefs, intentions or strategies regarding the future and can be identified by forward-looking words such as "anticipate," "believe," "could," "estimate," "expect," "intend," "may," "should," "will," and "would" or similar words. Ciena assumes no obligation to update the information included in this press release, whether as a result of new information, future events or otherwise.

SOURCE: Ciena Corporation

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invester
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Wow, this is big news for NOK. Should be huge for CIEN as if the other players want to compete, they will need to buy CIEN.


UPDATE: Nokia Siemens Gets $7 Billion U.S. Network Deal
4 minutes ago - Dow Jones News

Related Companies
Symbol Last %Chg
CIEN 12.32 -1.68%
ERIC 11.46 -2.22%
MOT 7.80 -1.52%
NOK 8.97 1.72%
NRTLQ 0.029 -3.33%

As of 9:30 AM ET 7/20/10

(Rewrites, adds detail, background, analysts' comments.)

By Gustav Sandstrom
Of DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

Nokia Siemens Networks Tuesday won a $7 billion-contract to deploy and maintain a new U.S. mobile broadband network in one of the largest deals in the industry's history, cementing its presence in the North American market after Monday it agreed to buy the majority of Motorola Inc.'s (MOT) network equipment business in the country.
Newly-formed telecom venture LightSquared, which is backed by New York-based private hedge fund Harbinger Capital Partners, said that under the 8-year contract Nokia Siemens will roll out a fourth-generation network with around 40,000 base stations that will cover 92% of the U.S. population by 2015.
The deal is subject to final approval by the boards of Nokia Siemens and LightSquared.
"Nokia Siemens Networks is proud to have been selected for the largest-ever outsourced deployment of a wireless network in the United States," said NSN Chief Executive Rajeev Suri.
LightSquared, which will be headed by Chief Executive Sanjiv Ahuja, will integrate wireless broadband and satellite and provide coverage for customers such as communication service providers, cable operators and content providers, the telecom venture said.
However, equites research firm Macquarie said Tuesday it might be "a mistake" to invest billions of dollars in a new wireless network in the already highly competitive U.S. market.
"We do believe in the need for additional capacity over time, but believe it would be better used as part of an existing network than for another competitor," it said in a broker note.
Still, the significant contract scope and order value should make the agreement "a very good start" for Nokia Siemens in the U.S., said Pohjola Bank analyst Hann Rauhala, where the increasing popularity of smartphones and laptops is sharply boosting data traffic.
The LightSquared deal adds further momentum to Nokia Siemens' push into the U.S. market after the company Monday said it had agreed to pay $1.2 billion for the majority of Motorola's network equipment business in the country.
NSN, a joint venture between Finland's Nokia Corp. (NOK) and Germany's Siemens AG (SI), has made no secret of its ambitions to enter the U.S. Last year, it bid for two units of bankrupt Nortel Networks Corp., only to lose the bulk of the wireless-equipment business to Sweden-based market leader Telefon AB L.M. Ericsson (ERIC) and Nortel's metro ethernet unit to U.S.-based Ciena Corp. (CIEN).
At 1324 GMT, shares in Nokia Siemens' parent company Nokia were up 3.5% at EUR7, outperforming a 0.2% drop in the wider market in Helsinki.
-By Gustav Sandstrom, Dow Jones Newswires; +46-8-5451-3099; gustav.sandstrom@dowjones.com

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AJGrano
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bought (8) $ .39 calls for that $13 strike price for august. Think I might have got in a little too early but this thing has been beaten down too much and I think it can make it back to the 14-15 range in that time if this market picks up. I don't think the market is going to go down too much more today either (crosses fingers).
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invester
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This is huge. There is something brewing. CIEN will be bought.


LightSquared's Upstart Network Takes Form, But Faces Hurdles
Tuesday 07/20/2010 1:45 PM ET - Dow Jones News

Related Companies
Symbol Last %Chg
CIEN 12.61 0.64%
CLWR 6.48 -0.77%
ERIC 11.71 -0.09%
MOT 8.00 1.01%
NOK 9.01 2.15%

As of 4:01 PM ET 7/20/10
By Roger Cheng
Of DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

NEW YORK -(Dow Jones)- Hedge fund manager Philip Falcone's ambition to create an upstart high-speed wireless network is slowly taking form.
The newly formed venture--backed by Harbinger Capital Partners--has a name in LightSquared, a veteran management team, additional financing and a vendor in Nokia Siemens Network. It plans to sell wireless service on a wholesale basis to retailers, cable companies and other telecom providers. By creating an alternative network to the established players, it could potentially shake up the market. But the significant technical, financial, regulatory and competitive hurdles could threaten to overwhelm the company before it gets off the ground.
"In a market that we believe is overly competitive already, putting billions of capital into building another wireless network seems like a mistake," said Macquarie Securities analyst Philip Cusick.
LightSquared, however, believes its pure wholesale business model and the growing need for data services will allow it to grow in spite of the competition.
"The data demand will exceed the supply by a massive margin," Chief Executive Sanjiv Ahuja told Dow Jones Newswires. "It's the absolute opportune time for it."
The company said Tuesday it awarded a $7 billion, eight-year contract to Nokia Siemens to help deploy its network, which is unique--as well as risky and expensive--because it will marry an army of 40,000 ground radios with two satellites to create a nationwide network, which runs on a fourth-generation technology called Long-Term Evolution. The company plans to cover 92% of the U.S. population with its LTE network by 2015, and plans to begin commercial service by mid-2011.
LightSquared also said it had secured $1.75 billion in additional financing, but will need further funds to complete its buildout.
"We believe that, if successful, this is only the first of many financings the company will need," Cusick said.
Ahuja declined to disclose the investors. Some suspect Nokia Siemens may have provided vendor financing, but Susan Spradley, head of Nokia Siemens's North American operations, declined to comment on the specifics of the deal.
Spradley, however, expressed confidence in LightSquared's leadership team.
"They know what they need to do to raise the financing," she told Dow Jones Newswires. "We will help them anyway we can to make sure the networks get built."
The deal is subject to final approval by the boards of Nokia Siemens and LightSquared.
Pressure is mounting on Harbinger to show more progress with its spectrum assets. The four-year-old plan is underpinned by Harbinger's controlling stake in satellite-telecom company SkyTerra Communications Inc., which estimated in a recent earnings presentation that it would need to come up with about $211 million for the third quarter to cover costs related to the development of the network. Expenses include insurance for a satellite launch and development of wireless base stations.
In addition, the Federal Communications Commission set benchmark requirements for access to wireless spectrum when it approved Harbinger's acquisition of SkyTerra and its licenses in March. According to one condition, Harbinger must build out its network to provide coverage to at least 100 million people in the U.S. by the end of 2012, 145 million people by the end of 2013, and 260 million people by the end of 2015.
Frank Boulben, chief marketing officer of LightSquared, told Dow Jones Newswires he believes the company will move faster than the government-set benchmark.
LightSquared still has a long way to go before it becomes a credible threat to the established carriers, analysts say. Verizon Wireless, which is a joint venture between Verizon Communications Inc. (VZ) and Vodafone Group PLC (VOD), plans to launch its own LTE network later this year. AT&T Inc. (T) is expected to follow.
Clearwire Corp. (CLWR), which is majority owned by Sprint Nextel Corp. (S), is in the middle of rolling out its own 4G network, which runs on a rival standard called WiMax. The company is already employing the wholesale model to the cable companies, as well as with retailers such as Best Buy Co. (BBY).
Boulben said the company has an advantage over Clearwire because it doesn't have a retail arm, so there isn't any indirect competition.
"There's no conflict of interest," he said. "We're only successful if our customers are successful."
LightSquared is talking to more than 30 potential customers, including cellular and wireline operators, cable companies and retailers, Boulben said.
The lack of any customers may be a concern for investors looking to provide additional financing to the business, according to Credit Suisse analyst Jonathan Chaplin.

-By Roger Cheng, Dow Jones Newswires; 212-416-2153; roger.cheng@dowjones.com

(END) Dow Jones Newswires
07-20-10 1345ET
Copyright (c) 2010 Dow Jones & Company, Inc.

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invester
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quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
bought (8) $ .39 calls for that $13 strike price for august. Think I might have got in a little too early but this thing has been beaten down too much and I think it can make it back to the 14-15 range in that time if this market picks up. I don't think the market is going to go down too much more today either (crosses fingers).

.51 now. Nice move.
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AJGrano
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quote:
Originally posted by invester:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
bought (8) $ .39 calls for that $13 strike price for august. Think I might have got in a little too early but this thing has been beaten down too much and I think it can make it back to the 14-15 range in that time if this market picks up. I don't think the market is going to go down too much more today either (crosses fingers).

.51 now. Nice move.
We'll see....I mean if I don't even hit my strike price their worthless anyway and the way the stock has been moving It might not happen
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invester
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Put a limit for half sale at .80
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AJGrano
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quote:
Originally posted by invester:
Put a limit for half sale at .80

how can I put in a limit sale for half if it doesn't even hit my strike price?
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invester
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It doesn't need to hit your strike to sell. Puts and Calls have what’s called intrinsic value "time value". As you get closer to strike, your option goes up in value. I don't even remember the last time I held an option to completion. Put a sell in for half of it at .8 and if you hit it, your playing with the houses money.
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AJGrano
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oh ok I see what you're saying. Honestly I thought your strike price HAD to hit in order for you to sell it back. Yeah that is a good plan, I wish I had more money in my account because I probably would've bought some more at these levels. I'm just not liking how this stock is moving right now though..doesn't seem to want to make its way up, but it'll tank in a heartbeat. Atleast I have plenty of time now
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Happy Valley
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quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
oh ok I see what you're saying. Honestly I thought your strike price HAD to hit in order for you to sell it back. Yeah that is a good plan, I wish I had more money in my account because I probably would've bought some more at these levels. I'm just not liking how this stock is moving right now though..doesn't seem to want to make its way up, but it'll tank in a heartbeat. Atleast I have plenty of time now

You are playing with fire if you get into the habit of averaging down with short term options in high beta stocks like CIEN...Can't treat the short term options the same way you would the commons or even the leaps...JMO
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AJGrano
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quote:
Originally posted by Happy Valley:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
oh ok I see what you're saying. Honestly I thought your strike price HAD to hit in order for you to sell it back. Yeah that is a good plan, I wish I had more money in my account because I probably would've bought some more at these levels. I'm just not liking how this stock is moving right now though..doesn't seem to want to make its way up, but it'll tank in a heartbeat. Atleast I have plenty of time now

You are playing with fire if you get into the habit of averaging down with short term options in high beta stocks like CIEN...Can't treat the short term options the same way you would the commons or even the leaps...JMO
I can see your reasoning for that, but a small investment in this can go a long way...short term or not. I mean those 8 calls I placed only cost me $325 compared to $9,840 if I were to buy the stock. I mean a lot of people say you shouldn't even touch options on stocks under $50 anyway but I feel this is a high reward/low risk play.
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invester
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quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
quote:
Originally posted by Happy Valley:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
oh ok I see what you're saying. Honestly I thought your strike price HAD to hit in order for you to sell it back. Yeah that is a good plan, I wish I had more money in my account because I probably would've bought some more at these levels. I'm just not liking how this stock is moving right now though..doesn't seem to want to make its way up, but it'll tank in a heartbeat. Atleast I have plenty of time now

You are playing with fire if you get into the habit of averaging down with short term options in high beta stocks like CIEN...Can't treat the short term options the same way you would the commons or even the leaps...JMO
I can see your reasoning for that, but a small investment in this can go a long way...short term or not. I mean those 8 calls I placed only cost me $325 compared to $9,840 if I were to buy the stock. I mean a lot of people say you shouldn't even touch options on stocks under $50 anyway but I feel this is a high reward/low risk play.
No, I agree with you. I've only added to my positions.
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metal1
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quote:
Originally posted by invester:
It doesn't need to hit your strike to sell. Puts and Calls have what’s called intrinsic value "time value". As you get closer to strike, your option goes up in value. I don't even remember the last time I held an option to completion. Put a sell in for half of it at .8 and if you hit it, your playing with the houses money.

Just to clarify, 'instinsic value' and 'time value' are different. Instrinsic value is the 'in the money value', (in this case zero) anything left over is 'time value'
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metal1
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quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
quote:
Originally posted by Happy Valley:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
oh ok I see what you're saying. Honestly I thought your strike price HAD to hit in order for you to sell it back. Yeah that is a good plan, I wish I had more money in my account because I probably would've bought some more at these levels. I'm just not liking how this stock is moving right now though..doesn't seem to want to make its way up, but it'll tank in a heartbeat. Atleast I have plenty of time now

You are playing with fire if you get into the habit of averaging down with short term options in high beta stocks like CIEN...Can't treat the short term options the same way you would the commons or even the leaps...JMO
I can see your reasoning for that, but a small investment in this can go a long way...short term or not. I mean those 8 calls I placed only cost me $325 compared to $9,840 if I were to buy the stock. I mean a lot of people say you shouldn't even touch options on stocks under $50 anyway but I feel this is a high reward/low risk play.
Options are interesting in the fact that the precentage gains and losses are usally greater. Even though you only invested 325, if it expires worthless and you don't sell any before expiration, like Invester said to put a sell order in, you end up with a 100% loss. if you buy the stock and it goes nowhere, you just lose commission or maybe break even. If you buy the option and it goes nowhere, the option becomes worthless at expiriation.
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quote:
Originally posted by metal1:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
quote:
Originally posted by Happy Valley:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
oh ok I see what you're saying. Honestly I thought your strike price HAD to hit in order for you to sell it back. Yeah that is a good plan, I wish I had more money in my account because I probably would've bought some more at these levels. I'm just not liking how this stock is moving right now though..doesn't seem to want to make its way up, but it'll tank in a heartbeat. Atleast I have plenty of time now

You are playing with fire if you get into the habit of averaging down with short term options in high beta stocks like CIEN...Can't treat the short term options the same way you would the commons or even the leaps...JMO
I can see your reasoning for that, but a small investment in this can go a long way...short term or not. I mean those 8 calls I placed only cost me $325 compared to $9,840 if I were to buy the stock. I mean a lot of people say you shouldn't even touch options on stocks under $50 anyway but I feel this is a high reward/low risk play.
Options are interesting in the fact that the precentage gains and losses are usally greater. Even though you only invested 325, if it expires worthless and you don't sell any before expiration, like Invester said to put a sell order in, you end up with a 100% loss. if you buy the stock and it goes nowhere, you just lose commission or maybe break even. If you buy the option and it goes nowhere, the option becomes worthless at expiriation.
Yeah I understand the difference between intrinsic value and time value, I just thought for some reason that your option was not good unless the stock hit the strike price. I appreciate you guys pointing this out to me, I can't believe I didn't know that...that definitely helps me out a lot. Cien looking nice today...wondering if I should sell my position with this nice little run up and try to get back on another dip or not. I guess how I'll just see how the nasdaq starts to trade around 3pm.
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quote:
Originally posted by metal1:
quote:
Originally posted by invester:
It doesn't need to hit your strike to sell. Puts and Calls have what’s called intrinsic value "time value". As you get closer to strike, your option goes up in value. I don't even remember the last time I held an option to completion. Put a sell in for half of it at .8 and if you hit it, your playing with the houses money.

Just to clarify, 'instinsic value' and 'time value' are different. Instrinsic value is the 'in the money value', (in this case zero) anything left over is 'time value'
I meant intrinsic value, and time value, not intrinsic value, "time value.
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quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
quote:
Originally posted by metal1:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
quote:
Originally posted by Happy Valley:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
oh ok I see what you're saying. Honestly I thought your strike price HAD to hit in order for you to sell it back. Yeah that is a good plan, I wish I had more money in my account because I probably would've bought some more at these levels. I'm just not liking how this stock is moving right now though..doesn't seem to want to make its way up, but it'll tank in a heartbeat. Atleast I have plenty of time now

You are playing with fire if you get into the habit of averaging down with short term options in high beta stocks like CIEN...Can't treat the short term options the same way you would the commons or even the leaps...JMO
I can see your reasoning for that, but a small investment in this can go a long way...short term or not. I mean those 8 calls I placed only cost me $325 compared to $9,840 if I were to buy the stock. I mean a lot of people say you shouldn't even touch options on stocks under $50 anyway but I feel this is a high reward/low risk play.
Options are interesting in the fact that the precentage gains and losses are usally greater. Even though you only invested 325, if it expires worthless and you don't sell any before expiration, like Invester said to put a sell order in, you end up with a 100% loss. if you buy the stock and it goes nowhere, you just lose commission or maybe break even. If you buy the option and it goes nowhere, the option becomes worthless at expiriation.
Yeah I understand the difference between intrinsic value and time value, I just thought for some reason that your option was not good unless the stock hit the strike price. I appreciate you guys pointing this out to me, I can't believe I didn't know that...that definitely helps me out a lot. Cien looking nice today...wondering if I should sell my position with this nice little run up and try to get back on another dip or not. I guess how I'll just see how the nasdaq starts to trade around 3pm.
Congrats AJ...Glad your calls worked out for ya... [Smile]
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quote:
Originally posted by invester:
quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
bought (8) $ .39 calls for that $13 strike price for august. Think I might have got in a little too early but this thing has been beaten down too much and I think it can make it back to the 14-15 range in that time if this market picks up. I don't think the market is going to go down too much more today either (crosses fingers).

.51 now. Nice move.
.71 now. Nice call. My dollar cost average on my Leaps has now brought me up 60%
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Ended up selling 5 of my 8 calls at .71. Made about $35 ontop of my initial investment and have 3 calls to play with. Wish I had more money in my account when I purchased these though!
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.85 now. Should have put that limit in at .81 [Smile]
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.90 now
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I would take your gains and go out to Oct. or Jan 2011 $20 $25 respectively. Huge point of clarity today with the EU. I see us getting to my call of S&P 1350 and Dow 13050
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This will hit $20 within a month.
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Earnings Aug. 30th
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quote:
Originally posted by invester:
I would take your gains and go out to Oct. or Jan 2011 $20 $25 respectively. Huge point of clarity today with the EU. I see us getting to my call of S&P 1350 and Dow 13050

I looked into that and the commissions were insane something like $300 for $800 worth of options
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quote:
Originally posted by AJGrano:
quote:
Originally posted by invester:
I would take your gains and go out to Oct. or Jan 2011 $20 $25 respectively. Huge point of clarity today with the EU. I see us getting to my call of S&P 1350 and Dow 13050

I looked into that and the commissions were insane something like $300 for $800 worth of options
What do you pay per contract?
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$13 calls now $1.10
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$14.13. This will hit $20 shortly. After earnings, $30
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