posted
hey everyone,,, does anyone know where i can find investors?? i have a few idea's i have been working on but need the money to patent the idea's and get them out on the market,, of course all of this takes money,,, so right now i am looking for a partner with a light smile but heavy wallet. anyone know where i can find investors?? and without having to pay $50 to join a website where there may or may not be investors... or if anyone here wants to chat send me a private message,, i wont tell you what idea's i have, but we can discuss some other things about it,,,,
thnx
-------------------- Sometimes its easier to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission. Posts: 234 | From: pa USA | Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:Originally posted by reidler88: hey everyone,,, does anyone know where i can find investors?? i have a few idea's i have been working on but need the money to patent the idea's and get them out on the market,, of course all of this takes money,,, so right now i am looking for a partner with a light smile but heavy wallet. anyone know where i can find investors?? and without having to pay $50 to join a website where there may or may not be investors... or if anyone here wants to chat send me a private message,, i wont tell you what idea's i have, but we can discuss some other things about it,,,,
thnx
I think you need to come up with an actual Prospectus of your plan and ideas(do not give away details) in a general format for the end product. IMO, that is the first step, then if it is a truly great idea, product, etc, you could then shop it around to small VC's. Really depends on the idea/product and your background as far as investor's believeing that you can make it a reality. JIMO.
PS: maybe others here will have some more ideas for you as far as investors.
-------------------- It is impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious. Posts: 3311 | From: St. Louis | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
yeah i know what your saying,, but i dont wanna give away details over the net,, but a plan of how it works and how i could sell it is a good idea,,, actually i work for walmart and i know the eastern regional manager on a level where he knows i have idea's i have given him idea's to stop theft in walmarts and some idea's on how to sell products,,,,, so i am sure when i have my invention to the part where i can sell it to a mass i would use that to get it sold in walmarts,,, and once u get it in walmart your pretty much set,,, haha,,,, i am a dreamer just lookin for my chance,, thats all i ask for,,, a chance,,,
-------------------- Sometimes its easier to beg for forgiveness than ask for permission. Posts: 234 | From: pa USA | Registered: Nov 2004
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quote:Originally posted by reidler88: yeah i know what your saying,, but i dont wanna give away details over the net,, but a plan of how it works and how i could sell it is a good idea,,, actually i work for walmart and i know the eastern regional manager on a level where he knows i have idea's i have given him idea's to stop theft in walmarts and some idea's on how to sell products,,,,, so i am sure when i have my invention to the part where i can sell it to a mass i would use that to get it sold in walmarts,,, and once u get it in walmart your pretty much set,,, haha,,,, i am a dreamer just lookin for my chance,, thats all i ask for,,, a chance,,,
I agree. Do not give out exact details or designs. I highlighted a portion of my post to you. "I think you need to come up with an actual Prospectus of your plan and ideas(do not give away details) in a general format for the end product."
But you will have to have some concrete gameplan for your invention/product for potential investors to look at to make a determination on whether to invest or not. Hence the prospectus....or even a mock up of the product. Investors will wanna see something tangible...not just ideas floating in the air. It does sound like you might be on the right track with this. Good luck!
-------------------- It is impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious. Posts: 3311 | From: St. Louis | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Reidler, when you become successful with your product, and you want to put some of that wealth into creating more wealth let me know if you are interested in Petroleum.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
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posted
Find an angel investor (Venture Capitalist) in your area. They will scalp you for a high percentage but since you don't have the wallet to do it yourself you don't have a bargaining position. If you are serious about this venture then you are gonna have to live with that. Your local SBA should have some names and ideas for you.
Good Luck.
-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues. Posts: 5178 | From: Up North | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
Not trying to rain on your parade but I can give you a couple tips because getting a patent and getting in Walmart, as well as manufacturing your idea are pretty steep walls. First the patent, if what your thinking is a totally new concept or radicaly new product unlike anything else on the market then a patent attorney should only be about $5,000.00 to $7000.00 to get it done. If your idea contains concepts already patented then be prepared to re-apply numerous times at the same costs. I stopped the process after three rejections at $5k an app. The only one that made money off that was the attorney. As far as manufacturing costs if your idea needs that you need to shop around for pricing. The internet is great for that just find a specialty web site that has the manufacturers you are looking for, electronis, clothing, plastics etc, etc,. You can list a basic idea without giving to many details when they contact you have them sign a non-disclosure agreement before you give them the entire detailed product for a quote. Most people here will jump down my throat after this statement but you need to know before you startr anything your target price. If this isn;'t a high ticket retail item then you have to go overseas to get it made. You won't be able to afford made in USA after you take out the cost to produce unless of coarse yuo are ordering 100,s of thousands in quantities. Still at that you can still save over 100% manufacturing elsewhere. You can have the greatest idea in the world but if you can't afford the cost to manufacture it won't go anywhere. You simply can't up your retail price because the market may not be able to move it. Walmart.... simply knowing one manager may help but if I remember you need to get at least three managers to agree they want your product. Then you have to get through a buyer, then you have to abide by what they want for a discount which will be more than any other retailer. On the other side if Walmart has your product other smaller retailers may not want to sell it because they simply don't have the discount walmart has and won't want to carry a product you can by cheaper elsewhere. Last but not least one of the more important is a sales team. You'll have a difficult time unless your great at sales and have an endless amount of time on your hands to market this. Sales reps work on 15% commision and sell the product wholesale at usually a 50% discount, books are more 55% to 60% discount. You'll never get around the discounts. Retail stores aim for 50% profit on any item the sell. some retailers or products may be different but from my experience 50% is standard. So all that said for example if your idea is for a product that sells for $10.00 you'll look something like this. Cost to manufacture -$1-2 dollars wholesale discount -50% sales commmision -15%
Out of that $2.75 profit you still need to subtract advertising, shipping materials, shipping costs if they aren't passed on to the retailer, and any storage costs. You should know all this and have a written plan before you seek any investor. Good luck and don't get discouraged. This is just my experience and knowledge in my small part of the world.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:Originally posted by jgrecoconstr: Not trying to rain on your parade but I can give you a couple tips because getting a patent and getting in Walmart, as well as manufacturing your idea are pretty steep walls. First the patent, if what your thinking is a totally new concept or radicaly new product unlike anything else on the market then a patent attorney should only be about $5,000.00 to $7000.00 to get it done. If your idea contains concepts already patented then be prepared to re-apply numerous times at the same costs. I stopped the process after three rejections at $5k an app. The only one that made money off that was the attorney. As far as manufacturing costs if your idea needs that you need to shop around for pricing. The internet is great for that just find a specialty web site that has the manufacturers you are looking for, electronis, clothing, plastics etc, etc,. You can list a basic idea without giving to many details when they contact you have them sign a non-disclosure agreement before you give them the entire detailed product for a quote. Most people here will jump down my throat after this statement but you need to know before you startr anything your target price. If this isn;'t a high ticket retail item then you have to go overseas to get it made. You won't be able to afford made in USA after you take out the cost to produce unless of coarse yuo are ordering 100,s of thousands in quantities. Still at that you can still save over 100% manufacturing elsewhere. You can have the greatest idea in the world but if you can't afford the cost to manufacture it won't go anywhere. You simply can't up your retail price because the market may not be able to move it. Walmart.... simply knowing one manager may help but if I remember you need to get at least three managers to agree they want your product. Then you have to get through a buyer, then you have to abide by what they want for a discount which will be more than any other retailer. On the other side if Walmart has your product other smaller retailers may not want to sell it because they simply don't have the discount walmart has and won't want to carry a product you can by cheaper elsewhere. Last but not least one of the more important is a sales team. You'll have a difficult time unless your great at sales and have an endless amount of time on your hands to market this. Sales reps work on 15% commision and sell the product wholesale at usually a 50% discount, books are more 55% to 60% discount. You'll never get around the discounts. Retail stores aim for 50% profit on any item the sell. some retailers or products may be different but from my experience 50% is standard. So all that said for example if your idea is for a product that sells for $10.00 you'll look something like this. Cost to manufacture -$1-2 dollars wholesale discount -50% sales commmision -15%
Out of that $2.75 profit you still need to subtract advertising, shipping materials, shipping costs if they aren't passed on to the retailer, and any storage costs. You should know all this and have a written plan before you seek any investor. Good luck and don't get discouraged. This is just my experience and knowledge in my small part of the world.
of course Billy Mays is dead now, but they'll find somebody to replace him... they always do
May he rest in peace. I have to say that his shouting grated on me. I would either mute the TV or change channels whenever his commericials aired.
The guy that does the Sham Wow and Slap Chop is funny. May end up being the next BIG Pitchman.
Posts: 3255 | From: Los Angeles California | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Not trying to burst a bubble or anything but a lot of people have great ideas. In order to attract investors you need to go beyond the idea and develop it to a point where you can show that the idea is not only feasible but profitable.
Investors in general are only interested in Return on Investment. Which of course means that you need to do most of the grunt work prior ro them coming in. I know it's a catch 22 because you don't want anyone to know what the idea is prior to getting a patent yet you lack the funds to get one.
The onlt true alternative is to save your money until you can afford to get it off the ground and then pitch it to investors. Buck******* mentioed the Shark Tank, I think it's pretty close to what you will face in attempting to attract investors. The one constant on that show is that the businesses they decide to invest in are businesses that are already generating sales and they want a good chunk of the business for their money.
Posts: 3255 | From: Los Angeles California | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Shark Tank ? is that the show that was based in England and had like 5 people that would bid on the investment. That was a good show, haven't seen it in awhile.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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quote:Originally posted by jgrecoconstr: Shark Tank ? is that the show that was based in England and had like 5 people that would bid on the investment. That was a good show, haven't seen it in awhile.
The American Version of it debuted a few weeks ago. I believe ot's on Sunday's on ABC. I never saw the brittish version but have enjoyed the few episodes of the American Version that I've seen.
Posts: 3255 | From: Los Angeles California | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Here is a perfect example of overseas competition and kind of an example of an investors or partners cut with an I-phone app. Current developer/partner I have gets 35% of the total earnings. Cost to me nothing to develop, my cut 35% and Apples cut 30%. If you just say the app is $8.00 and there are 500 dloads a month then that developer/partner will gross around $16,800 per year. I would gross the same. If I dump the developer/partner and go it alone and hire a programmer to just make the app then the cost for a US programmer would be between $4,000 to $6,000.00. If I hire a programmer from India the cost to develop would be $2,000 to $2,500.00. It will take between 60 to 70 hours to code the material for an i-phone app. So you can see where the cheapest place to make the same identical thing is and also see where if you don't invest any of your own money an investor makes a killing, almost 8 times what the actual cost would be going overseas and 4 times what the cost would be to have it made in the US using the lower end of the quotes.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
I don't think you did the math in there. Do you think 30 to 40 dollars an hour is a good wage? Especially in this econonmy!!! I personally have had to cut my own wages from 45 per hour to 30 to 35 per hour just to stay busy the past year and I'm not that busy if I'm sitting here. I was pointing out the difference in where your money can go for the same product. And here's the kicker, when you come up with a product that's all your own and you have to invest all your own money in, you let me know where your bottom line is going to go. 9 times out of ten I bet you aren't going to pay twice the amount. This is a world economy were in not an individual US economy. What gets spent in one country goes on to the next. Not that I need to tell you where I'm going but it's a developer in Canada for $4,500 he had the best presentation and personality.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
This is a world economy were in not an individual US economy.
then the US is going to be a third world country in less than a decade.
merchandising is a necessary part of the economy, but the simple truth is that the only time money is actually created or manufactured (as opposed to made) is when real production happens. providing service to real producers is the only way an economy can sustain itself.
this idea that you can just print money to keep a service economy (merchandising) going is flawed at its root premise.
once we drop to the level that China or India rises to? then and only then can we begin to be producers again.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
Glass, what I was meaning is that yes there is a seperate economy here but at the same time it is all tied together with so many others. The biggest being China. Take Walmart for example the majority of their products are made in China and sold at discount prices. The majority of people shop at Walmart whether they admit it or not they eventually shop there. In turn that creates jobs here all be it low paying but every job can't pay 50k a year. That money spent on Chinese manufactured products turns into tax dollars that get cycled through the sherrifs, road crews, welfare, local goverment, schools.... which all pay the higher wages,etc etc.... That's how I meant it was all tied together.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
i understand that, but there's something missing here.
walmart is the PERFECT example too.
walmart cuts tax deals before they ever even buy the land. they demand specific right of ways to connect to the roads. most towns have been so eager to get Walmart that they give them all kinds of freebies.
the profits they make DO NOT return to the community, they are removed from the community and sent to the home office to be distributed to the shareholders or used to build yet another store.
the taxes collected would STILL be collected if walmart was selling American made goods or if walmart was replaced by the large number of small businesses it put out of business.
they do not, NET , create jobs in th ecommunities they "serve" (LOL) at all, they REPLACE higher paying jobs with lower paying jobs.
China is communist. they do not hold elections outside of closed rooms where the party membership meets and somehow decides who will be the next leader of whatever office they have to fill.
Wall ST? MSNBC? all day every day you hear them call China Capitalists. they are lying. Chinas central govt controls their whole economy. yet the "business community" continues to convince themselves that it doesn't matter, because they are profitable, so it must be alright.
our recent market "malfunction" has only proven to the Chinese govt that they "need" to retain stricter control over their economy rather than less.
beleive it or not? IMO we should devalue the dollar even further to stop allowing Chinese good to be so cheap.
we only keep it high for one reason and that is maintain a relatively low cost of oil.
China was hit very hard when oil went to 140.
there are always any number of solutions to an economic problem. deciding which are best is never an easy job, because in economics someone always wins and someone always loses.
the system we have going right now does allow for a few to win very big, however, they have to make their money by putting people to work, and then finding customers for that work. before long? they will run out of customers here in the US. i'm not guessing about this, if we stay on this path it is inevitable, a couple years ago? i knew we were in for eventual market problems, i honestly didn't understand how bad and how soon they would hit, so i have revised my estimation of how long we can continue to keep this "service(? ugh) economy" alive.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
You know when I was reading your response I was trying to think of what stores closed here when Walmart came and I only came up with one I can think of. It was an Ames next to it and they were in trouble before they came. If I remember Walmart even redid the facade of their store and made some improvements inside yet they still went under even though they were benifitting from the traffic Walmart bought. When I think of business, I think they all have their niche. Take home depot and lowes two miles apart here and yet the three private lumber yards still survive. A different niche, a different quality product and a different level of service. I just read today Kodak kodachrome film that there is only one place left in the world where that can be developed and that will close shortly or cease to develop that particular film. You have to see the future, and make your niche and change accordingly. We force or have forced on all of us these high costs, with regulations, taxes, insurance costs. It's endless. My last example........ they are taxing people out of smoking, in turn losing tax dollars and at some point it will affect the production jobs to make cigs. Once they kill that industry and force everyone into quitting where do you think that revenue will come from?
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
so, are you trying to tell me that all the chinese made goods in walmart store did not replace US jobs?
as for the stores that you cannot think of going out of business? they most certainly lost market share, it is impossible for them not to have.
Surplus to requirements
Jan 15th 2009 | HONG KONG From The Economist print edition Why is China’s trade surplus growing when its exports have collapsed?
THIS week revised figures revealed that China overtook Germany in 2007 to become the world’s third-biggest economy. At the start of last year China also looked set to become the world’s biggest exporter, but a slump in exports in the final months of the year meant they remained smaller than Germany’s. China’s exports tumbled by 13% (in dollar terms) in the fourth quarter, leaving them 3% lower in December than a year earlier. Despite this, China’s trade surplus rose to a record $457 billion at an annual rate in the fourth quarter—50% bigger than in the same period of 2007. What is going on?
n the first half of 2008 China’s trade surplus did indeed shrink (see chart). But since then, although exports slumped, imports fell by much more—down by 21% in the 12 months to December. The slide in both exports and imports was exacerbated by the global credit freeze, which has made it harder for companies around the world to get letters of credit to guarantee payment. Imports were also dragged down by cheaper oil and commodity prices, and by weaker imports of materials and components used to make exports (over 50% of total imports).
But a more worrying reason why China bought less from the rest of the world is that its domestic demand has weakened.
posted
No not at all, I'm sure they replaced US jobs but this was coming from along time ago when unions outlived their purpose and got greedy. It's snowballed from there. Am I anti union? to a degree yes. They add way to much costs to manufacturing and construction with some of their ridiculous demands. I have been in a union so I know the stupid things the demand pay for. If it was just about doing your job for a decent wage, safety and benefits that are in line with the general public I would be 100% pro union but it's not and that's why were where we are today.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
when unions outlived their purpose and got greedy.
wrong. it has absolutely nothing to do with the unions asking for better anything. it all about who has INVESTED their venture capital where
it's when business people got greedy and decided that HIGHER (read easier) profits/returns were more important than their countries way of life.
once again, i repeat that we are LOSING the economic war with the COMMUNISTS. they are selling US the rope to hang ourselves, and we are doing it for profit. this is not some opinion i am offering you, it's what is happening, and it's happening faster every year.
Chinese trade balance, in millions USD per month, nsa (blue), and twelve month trailing average (red). NBER defined recession dates shaded gray. Source: Chinese trade statistics from IMF, IFS, ADB; and NBER, and author's calculations.
what this leads to and very soon now, is that we will have "exchanged" all of our real property for "cargo", and that is something we did to a very small degree with Japan, but then the Japanese backed off and "lost" a decade...
China? they are not even close to utilising half of their available manpower to provide labor to the world. they have only applied about one third of their labor force to date.
the reason that jobs are going there have nothing to do with Labor Unions,(i am a sole proprietor with no employees BTW) the reason the Investors on Wall St. have Invested in China is because the people there are literally working for less than i pay for my cable bill.
A recent study shows that the average monthly income of 70% of business workers in Mainland China is between 800 yuan (US $97) to 2,500 yuan (US $302), with the senior management staff earning three to 15 times the salary of the average enterprise worker. The report also shows that more than 70 percent of the Chinese enterprise workers are satisfied with their salaries, and the most unsatisfied are the employees of state-run enterprises.
now, these are the BUSINESS workers. if you go into the countryside? their pay is less than 300$ per year.
simply put? teh yuan-dollar exchange rate is all out of whack... that's how the Chinese govt has LURED all the investors. the investors will most likely lose every penny they have put in China before it's all done tho, and it will serve them right.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
A recent study shows that the average monthly income of 70% of business workers in Mainland China is between 800 yuan (US $97) to 2,500 yuan (US $302),
800 to 2500 US dollars per month would be 9600/yr to 30,000/year...
guess what? The median income per household member (including all working and non-working members above the age of 14) was $26,036 in 2006.
and right there is why all the jobs are going to China
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
We may never agree. I do agree some companies went for pure profit but I also believe other were pushed against the wall by unions. How can you run a business Glass if you forgot to call Little Johnny first for overtime and Johnny files a grievance for a free days pay and you have to give it to him. Or the union worker who is more than capable of carrying 50 lbs of material but the union set the limit at 10lbs so now he has to make 5 trips and slow production down. There is a lot more to it than that but bottom ine is they cut into profit. Why would anyone run a company to lose their profits to unreasonable rules. There was a paper company here Finch Pryun I believe it was the largest privatley held company in the paper industry. The union went on strike 2 years in a row if I remember always wanting more. Great paying jobs but the union wanted more for health coverage, everybody wanted a job there they paid so well. The company replaced almost every single person there and offered some workers to come back at a different rate. They greeded themselves out of a job for more health coverage. I'm self employed also, by choice I wouldn't have it any other way so you should have the same attitude I do when you see people complaining health coverage and double time and shift differential..... work on your own and see how much people hand you and you'll stop complaining. Can I fix the world? certainly not.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
the US worker is the most productive worker in the world, period.
you can blame the Unions all you want, i'm not a defender of them, they have their place in society, but they are not the reason that venture capital has GIVEN the Chinese Govt so much money to work with.
make no mistake, China is one big Union dude, that's what communism is and they will do whatever they want when the time is right for them.
U.S. Workers World's Most Productive United Nations Report Says Longer Hours Worked, More Achieved Per Hour
The U.S., according to the report, also beats all 27 nations in the European Union, Japan and Switzerland in the amount of wealth created per hour of work - a second key measure of productivity.
China is not even in the same league with the 27 mentioned.
China and other East Asian countries are catching up quickest with Western countries. Productivity in the region has doubled in the past decade and is accelerating faster than anywhere else, the report said.
But they still have a long way to go: workers in East Asia are still only about a fifth as productive as laborers in industrialized countries.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
jgrecoconstr...it really is not that difficult to understand...
Go back 20 years when we had "good paying" manufacturing jobs in this country...things were good and the economy was strong
Now fast forward 20 years when we manufacture very little in this country and buy damn near everything from China via Walmart...things are not so good..in fact YOUR wages have been reduced and will continue to go lower until people WAKE UP...
When you buy products from other countries or hire them to save yourself a buck, that money leaves our economy and DOESN'T come back...It's not rocket science man...it's just plain common sense...
Oh...and to blame this whole thing on the unions is about as lame as an excuse as you could come up with...it proves to me that you are one of many in this country that hear a few soundbites on one of our illustrious cable news channels, and believes it as gospel...you are NOT a thinker, but merely a "follower".
As long as people in this country believe what you have been led to believe...our quality of life will continue to decline...in fact I'll bet 2 to 1 that you will be making less than $20.00 per hour in the very near future...
-------------------- ***********************
It's all in the timing... Posts: 4303 | From: DSA | Registered: Dec 2003
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quote:Originally posted by glassman: This is a world economy were in not an individual US economy.
then the US is going to be a third world country in less than a decade.
That is exactly what is going to happen Glass, and it never ceases to amaze me how many people in this country STILL don't see it...They have lost their jobs, their homes, and have seen their wages reduced by as much as 50%, and they STILL don't get it...
jgrecoconstr is a perfect example...his wages have already been cut by 25% to 30% and it is getting harder and harder for him to find work...yet the best reason he can come up with is "it's the unions fault"
WAKE UP PEOPLE...the so-called "GLOBAL ECONOMY" is WHY our standard of living is in decline, and it will continue to decline if WE don't start looking out for US...
-------------------- ***********************
It's all in the timing... Posts: 4303 | From: DSA | Registered: Dec 2003
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posted
BS are you involved or have ever been involved with any business of your own,producing a product? Like I said in a previous post, you can have the best idea in the world and if you can't afford to produce it for a affordable resale price it's useless. US industry and labor has priced themselves out of making affordable products. If you were to pay twice as much for your clothes as you do now I'm sure you would be b---hing about it. So your telling me you would be happy to run to the store and pay double so you can keep someone employed here. You wouldn't do it,and I'm sure your not boycotting foriegn made goods. I don't believe I blamed a union at all for my lack of work, this current situation is in my opinion all wall street greed and crooked politicians. If you have no experience in production and you don't have made in America on everything you own don't try to preach to me.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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I'm calm Tex, I came into this thread to give some insight into the original question. Like I said above people would jump down my throat.Glass and I had a basic discussion of viewpoints. It wasn't until sometime later that someone else thought the need to make it more of a personal matter.
Posts: 492 | From: new york | Registered: Jul 2005
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