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Author Topic: More liberal attacks on Sheriff for enforcing the law
CashCowMoo
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The Department of Justice (DOJ) has launched an investigation of the Maricopa County Sheriff's Office in Arizona following requests by congressional Democrats and allegations by liberal activists that the department has violated the civil rights of illegal aliens.

Reps. John Conyers (D-Mich.), Jerrold Nadler (D-N.Y.), Zoe Lofgren (D-Calif.), and Robert Scott (D-Va.) requested the investigation, and activists groups such as National Day Laborer Organizer Network and ACORN launched petition drives and rallies in support of the probe.


See the rest here:

http://cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=44899

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Machiavelli
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Here's a Rebuttal article and he's right.. because even though the focus is on illegal aliens or hispanics... the fact of the matter is this sheriff violates even non hispanics' rights.He's not following the law. He's making his own law:

http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/brooklyn/2009/03/11/2009-03-11_why_arizonas_ sheriff_joe_arpaio_must_go_.html

Why Arizona's Sheriff Joe Arpaio must go - and soon
Thursday, March 12th 2009, 12:37 AM

Thirty-five thousand people from all over the country signed a petition calling on the departments of Justice and Homeland Security to investigate Arizona's infamous Sheriff Joe Arpaio.

Meanwhile, Arpaio received a letter from the Justice Department Wednesday informing him of a probe into allegations of discriminatory and unconstitutional searches and seizures.

Finally, it seems that the abusive Maricopa County lawman could get what's coming to him.

The petition, initiated by America's Voice, a Washington-based group for immigration reform, was delivered to the agencies Wednesday by House Judiciary Committee Chairman John Conyers (D-Min.), Immigration Subcommittee Chairwoman Zoe Lofgren (D-Calif.), Rep. Jerrold Nadler (D-NY), other members of Congress and national immigration advocate leaders.

"Sheriff Arpaio has consistently abused his office in violation of federal law. It is time for the federal government to step in and uphold the rule of law in this country, even in Maricopa County," said Nadler.

Investigating this man - and stripping him of the power to violate with impunity the rights of Americans and immigrants - is not only urgent, it is a matter of fundamental decency.

The publicity-hungry Arpaio has five full-time media relations specialists to publicize his stunts. Yet the spin doctors can't hide the fact that his indiscriminate street sweeps of Hispanics are motivated by racism.

A blatant example of his contempt for civil rights occurred on Feb. 4. Arpaio rounded up 200 immigrant detainees and forced them to march, shackled, into a segregated "tent city" surrounded by electric fences in the Arizona desert.

To make the abuse even worse, these men were being held on pretrial detention and had not been convicted of any crime.

Not surprisingly, a whopping 2,700 lawsuits have been filed against Arpaio, including numerous allegations of civil rights violations.

Recently, Conyers, Lofgren, Nadler and Crime Subcommittee Chairman Bobby Scott (D-Va.) sent a letter to Attorney General Eric Holder and Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano demanding an investigation of Arpaio's alleged misconduct.

Arpaio received an Immigration and Customs Enforcement contract through the so-called 287(g) program, implemented under President Bush, which authorizes local lawmen to arrest immigrants without cause.

The letter calls for a review of the Arpaio's contract to insure it is not "used to justify the racial profiling of any resident of Arizona."

So abusive and abhorrent are Arpairo's actions that the situation has sparked a nationwide outcry. Last week, more than 5,000 people marched in Phoenix to protest his tactics.

Arpaio has come to symbolize everything that is wrong with immigration in this country. Yet he is a hero to the racist, irrational anti-immigration fringe.

Ironically, while Arpaio has made a career out of his "toughness" in dealing with immigrants, there are 40,000 - 40,000! - felony warrants outstanding in his jurisdiction.

In other words, as Sheriff Joe mercilessly terrorizes hard-working immigrants, real criminals are having the time of their lives.

WITH THIS in mind, the petition makes a strong request for justice.

"Sheriffs should be held accountable for fighting crime, not rewarded for spreading fear," the petition says. "We request an immediate Department of Justice investigation into Sheriff Joe Arpaio and his appalling tactics."

And so do we.

To add your name to the list of 35,000 people who have signed the petition, visit www.sheriffjoemustgo.com.

aruiz*nydailynews.com

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bdgee
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"Thirty-five thousand people from all over the country signed a petition calling on the departments of Justice and Homeland Security to investigate Arizona's infamous Sheriff Joe Arpaio."

But our ever ranting voice of the far right-wing and republican genius, cow, tells us it wasn't "Thirty-five thousand people from all over the country", just congressional democrats.

CHEESE~US Christ, lay off it, cow! We already know what your principle bigotry is.

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jordanreed
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Thirty-five thousand and one

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jordan

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bdgee
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Make that two
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raybond
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Joe is a wimp and is going to get his one day. He has had some bad dudes but most of the people he kicks around are illegals,drunks and deadbeat dads. Peacable types that want out.

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glassman
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if he's one of those sherrifs on COPS or another TV show? i strongly disaprove.


as for illegal immigrants? it is against the law for them to work. if he's picking them up at work? then he's doing his job. the employers should be prosecuted and the workers should be given a bus ride to eh border. second time they are caught here? one year in jail then the border. third? five years.

employers should be getting weekend jail and full IRS audits every year for the next five years and as far back as is legally possible, cuz you KNOW they cooked the books.

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Relentless.
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quote:
Amendment 4 - Search and Seizure. Ratified 12/15/1791. The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment 5 - Trial and Punishment, Compensation for Takings. Ratified 12/15/1791. No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

I don't see where it says only citizens of this country are afforded these rights?
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Machiavelli
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
if he's one of those sherrifs on COPS or another TV show? i strongly disaprove.


as for illegal immigrants? it is against the law for them to work. if he's picking them up at work? then he's doing his job. the employers should be prosecuted and the workers should be given a bus ride to eh border. second time they are caught here? one year in jail then the border. third? five years.

employers should be getting weekend jail and full IRS audits every year for the next five years and as far back as is legally possible, cuz you KNOW they cooked the books.

Does this sound right to you Glass?:

"A blatant example of his contempt for civil rights occurred on Feb. 4. Arpaio rounded up 200 immigrant detainees and forced them to march, shackled, into a segregated "tent city" surrounded by electric fences in the Arizona desert.

To make the abuse even worse, these men were being held on pretrial detention and had not been convicted of any crime."

& this:

"Ironically, while Arpaio has made a career out of his "toughness" in dealing with immigrants, there are 40,000 - 40,000! - felony warrants outstanding in his jurisdiction.

In other words, as Sheriff Joe mercilessly terrorizes hard-working immigrants, real criminals are having the time of their lives."

Notice nothing says they are illegal immigrants, just Immigrants he rounds up based on them being Hispanic. He too busy with his campaign versus immigrants he is neglecting Non Hispanics/immigrants who are committing felonies like murder, rape, theft, assault etc.

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glassman
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i'd have to see video to decide. it sounds bad, but marching isn't exaklly torture.

how many of the 40,000 felony warrants are for people that ha e left the jusrisditcion fro Mexico or Vegas ? that does sound like alot, i'd also have to compare it to other juridsictions of similar size.

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glassman
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To make the abuse even worse, these men were being held on pretrial detention and had not been convicted of any crime."

uh? we have this problem of illegal fleeing the jusrisdiction and not showing up for court here. there's no way they've been denied bail that would be unconstittuional... don't balme the sharrif, the judge sets bail.

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glassman
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To make the abuse even worse, these men were being held on pretrial detention and had not been convicted of any crime."

uh? we have this problem of illegals fleeing the jurisdiction and not showing up for court here. bails are being raised...

there's no way they've been denied bail that would be unconstittuional... don't blame the sherrif, the judge sets bail.

as fro searches? i dunno what he's doing... i didn't suggest he should infringe on anybodies rights.

fact is? a place of business is usually public and anybody can report "suspicious" activity. ignoring those reports is criminal.

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Propertymanager
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Dang Glassman! Bdgee is going to revoke your lifetime membership in the people's socialist movement! You've got to be a little more tolerant of the illegals if you're going to be a lefty. If you punish the employers that give the illegals jobs, where are they going to work? Mexico? And you're suggesting that the second time the illegals get caught, they go to jail? That's no way for a lefty to talk!

Better be careful or Professor Gibberish is going to call you a hate-filled, right-wing, fat Rush the doper following, goose-stepping racist!

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
Dang Glassman! Bdgee is going to revoke your lifetime membership in the people's socialist movement! You've got to be a little more tolerant of the illegals if you're going to be a lefty. If you punish the employers that give the illegals jobs, where are they going to work? Mexico? And you're suggesting that the second time the illegals get caught, they go to jail? That's no way for a lefty to talk!

Better be careful or Professor Gibberish is going to call you a hate-filled, right-wing, fat Rush the doper following, goose-stepping racist!

use the litter box please

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Propertymanager
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quote:
use the litter box please
Posting gibberish isn't going to get you back in Bdgee's good graces unless you repent for your assault on the poor helpless illegals, who are nothing more than victims of an evil right wing conspiracy in need of a little help from the gringos!
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Relentless.
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quote:
Amendment 14 - Citizenship Rights. Ratified 7/9/1868. Note History

1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.


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glassman
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so they did or didnot get bail hearings?

what rights specifically have been violated?

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Relentless.
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Sounds like they were just gathered up for no other reason than being hispanic...
That part is the no-no..

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Relentless.:
Sounds like they were just gathered up for no other reason than being hispanic...
That part is the no-no..

yeah sounds like. but is that true?

if it is? then he'll go down.

i've been accused of being racist for pointing out that it's illegal to hire illegals, and that employers are guilty too.. but i'm not.

the laws have been ignored. big business wants them ignored for cash, and the politicians want them ignore for votes...

we had at least 10 million illegals here two years ago... the "recession" took longer to show up on the books than it should have because they were all fired first...

i am not for stopping people on the street. but i am for making it very unprofitable to hire illegals... we won't need fences if we do that...

the drug war aside? we can be good neighbors, and Mexico wont lose it's most valuable people to US.

we are screwing over the honest peopl that apply and wait by ignoring the illegals already working too... the honest people that wait will wait alot longer because there is no percieved need to hire them.

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bdgee
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
i'd have to see video to decide. it sounds bad, but marching isn't exaklly torture.

how many of the 40,000 felony warrants are for people that ha e left the jusrisditcion fro Mexico or Vegas ? that does sound like alot, i'd also have to compare it to other juridsictions of similar size.

Perhaps not torture, but , if they were gathered up simply because they looked or sounded like Mexicans or someone thought they did, it does smack of kidnapping and illegal imprisonment. There is supposed to be a serious and supportable reason for shackling or locking someone up or otherwise depriving him of their freedom. And, in order for the government to do it, it must be because of a compelling need.
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glassman
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the article is very specific, it says he rounded up DETAINEES (as in they were already deatined?)


A blatant example of his contempt for civil rights occurred on Feb. 4. Arpaio rounded up 200 immigrant detainees and forced them to march, shackled, into a segregated "tent city" surrounded by electric fences in the Arizona desert.


it's definitley another example of inflamatory journalism...

rush and hannity aren't the only ones that do that..

whether the Sherrif has violated anybodies right is yet to be determined.

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T e x
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not sure where you guys are lining up on this issue, and admittedly my opinion has changed in the past few years.

But you've simply got to have control of your own boundaries...whether it's a nightclub, a church, newspaper or a union local.

On the other hand, a coast-to-coast fence/barrier/wall is ill advised, re: cost. As posted before, build that wall and give me the concession: the wall becomes a launching pad...

just a hedzup to anyone who ain't familiar with border country.

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Adventures in microcapitalism...

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Machiavelli
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quote:
Originally posted by Relentless.:
Sounds like they were just gathered up for no other reason than being hispanic...
That part is the no-no..

Exactly what i have been trying to show Glass...

None were said to be illegal only that they were immigrants or hispanic... and none were said to be arrested at job sites... just rounded up for being hispanic and suspected of being illegal without even determining if they are in fact are...

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Machiavelli
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
whether the Sherrif has violated anybodies right is yet to be determined.

the only reason he is being targeted is because he is violating peoples' rights Glass... can you not see that... if it was a simple matter of him just arresting illegals for being illegal immigrants then no one would be complaining... but this guy other then forcing already arrested inmates to march through a very hot desert is also arresting hispanics at random off the street without checking to see if they are illegal...

I'm hispanic as you already know, so that if i was on vacation in Arizona then you think it is right for him to pick me off the street for looking hispanic and detaining me without determining if in fact i am illegal?

And as for the 40,000 warrants outstanding, i doubt very much the majority of those are for violations of illegal immigration since as illegals unless they are already detained or already have a record in that area then their names would be difficult to ascertain... so it is obvious he is not focusing on violent crimes committed by non immmigrants/hispanics... i've read about this guy for long time... he stomps on the Constitution as much as Bush did and i'm quite frankly surprised you are defending him Glass and not doing your due diligence to see if in fact he is guilty of what everyone accuses him of...

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wallymac
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I don't see this as an attack. It's an investigation. If he hasn't done anything wrong then there is nothing to fear, if he has then he will be stopped from his alleged illegal activity.

I mean the "Right" investigated Clinton for close to his full 8 yrs in office and what came of it? They busted him for lying about getting a BJ, not that he got it in the White House but that he lied about. All the other investigations and nothing.

Let me use a favorite phrase of the "Right": "If you haven't done anything wrong then you have nothing to worry about." This was being said quite a bit while Bush was basically taking away the rights of US citizens.

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jordanreed
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forced marching isnt torture...well maybe not..

brings to mind the trail of tears..not exactly the same thing...but, still...they were rounded up and forced to march just cuz theyre injuns and according to the new laws the white man made, they were illegal..

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jordan

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CashCowMoo
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Since when do non us-citizens get constitutional rights? Does this mean Russians who come here get the same rights when they visit? Border jumping Mexicans who cut through or climb over fences, drop trash all over private property, and are then trafficked illegally throughout the United States do not get constitutional rights. Does that make sense to some of you liberals?

We do not need to put water coolers in the desert to provide them clean sources to quench their thirst. If they are on the ground illegally and bleeding, then sure we should help them because that is just the right thing to do.

However, giving ALL of them free health care at an expense to the American taxpayer...


Stop worrying about being politically correct because its just stupid. It is what it is. People from Mexico jumping the border instead of doing the process the right way like it was done on Ellis Island to Europeans.

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bdgee
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Get off the simple minded intentional mis-reading of the Constitution, cow.

There is nothing in the Constitution even suggesting that ONLY citizens have rights. Indeed, they are rights of "the people" not the "citizens". It is MY right to be allowed to KNOW that no one can, withing the laws of this Nation, be denied certain things, particularly those enumerated in the Bill of Rights. And there are numerous decisions of the Courts that reflect that interpretation.

"Does this mean Russians who come here get the same rights when they visit?"

YES!

"Border jumping Mexicans who cut through or climb over fences, drop trash all over private property, and are then trafficked illegally throughout the United States do not get constitutional rights. "

YES THEY DO!

Just as if it were one of our native born citizens who was "drop(ing) trash all over private property, and are ... trafficked illegally throughout the United States".

If you would bother to pay attention to the rulings of the Court, specifically in rulings on the Constitutionally required census, among "the people" to be counted are any illegal aliens living in the Country and they are to be represented by the Congressmen of the district in which they live.

Only one reason for tending the health of a person is to aid or comfort him. For instance, in tending to the health needs of a person, we prevent any diseases he might transmit to others from being carried about. In other words, that clearly you are showing is beyond the where-with-all of the simple minded, it keeps you and me and whomever else healthy.

"Stop worrying about being politically correct"

It isn't a matter of being "politically correct", it is a matter of following the directives of the Constitution, i.e., being American.

Personally, I do not understand what needs your ego finds fulfilled by thoughts of harming and harassing others, but I suspect you might become bot a happier and a less potentially dangerous person if you sought treatment.

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glassman
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the only reason he is being targeted is because he is violating peoples' rights Glass... can you not see that..

NO! i cannot see that from the article posted.

furthermore. i know for a fact the quite a few people try to lie about the situation as it pertains to the illegal immigration problem.

thousands of people die each year trying to come here. because people are willing to break the law and hire them illegally for profit.

coyotes commit dozens of crimes against humanity and most likely smuggle dope too.

people talk about the horrible drug war on the Mexican border? and blame drugs? it's Human trafficing too.

as far as i'm concerend there is almost no difference between hiring illegally and slavery.

the only real difference is that that the employers don't even take responisbilty for the health and welfare of the employess. the slave owner protected their investments.


there are many people that try to make some sort of pastoral picture out of illegal immigration. there is nothing pastoral about any of it.
it is a crime against humanity on several levels.

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bdgee
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"as far as i'm concerend there is almost no difference between hiring illegally and slavery."

Way too often they are precisely the same beast.

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Machiavelli
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:


the only real difference is that that the employers don't even take responisbilty for the health and welfare of the employess. the slave owner protected their investments.

So whipping a slave to near death and sometimes to death back in the pre Civil War days is protecting their investment and caring for their health and welfare? [Roll Eyes]

As for our good ole Sheriff you can read more about him here instead of you just going by these articles we posted. He has done some good but he has done far more bad then good:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joe_Arpaio

Alot of what he and his people have done is borderline illegal or outright illegal. Read the section on inmate deaths. Here's some highlights:

1. Family members of inmates who have died or been injured in jail custody have filed lawsuits against the sheriff’s office. Maricopa County has paid more than $43 million in settlement claims during Arpaio's tenure.

2. Officers took Agster to the Madison Street jail, placed a "spit hood" over his face and strapped him to the chair, where he had an apparent seizure and lost consciousness. He was declared brain dead three days later.

3. During his internment, evidence suggests detention officers shocked Norberg several times with a stun-gun. According to an investigation by Amnesty International, Norberg was already handcuffed and face down when officers dragged him from his cell and placed him in a restraint chair with a towel covering his face. After Norberg's corpse was discovered, detention officers accused Norberg of attacking them as they were trying to restrain him. The cause of his death, according to the Maricopa County medical examiner, was due to "positional asphyxia". Sheriff Arpaio investigated and subsequently cleared detention officers of any criminal wrongdoing.

4. Brian Crenshaw was a legally blind and mentally disabled inmate who suffered fatal injuries while being held in Maricopa Country Jail.

Crenshaw's family filed a lawsuit against Arpaio and his office, which resulted in an award of $2 million.[59] As in the Scott Norberg case, it was alleged that Arpaio's office destroyed evidence in the case. In the Crenshaw case, the attorney who represented the case before a jury alleged digital video evidence was destroyed

5. Post was placed in a restraint chair by guards and his neck was broken in the process. The event, caught on video, shows guards smiling and laughing while Post is being injured. Because of his injuries, Post has lost much of the use of his arms.[

6. During the trial, the plaintiff "presented evidence that, among other things, the Sheriff and his deputies had actual knowledge that prisoners used rebar tent stakes and tent poles as weapons and did nothing to prevent it." Furthermore, "the Sheriff admitted knowing about, and in fact intentionally designing, some conditions at Tent City that created a substantial risk of inmate violence."

Flanders suffered permanent brain damage as a result of the attack.

7. Other female inmates have had miscarriages while incarcerated in Arpaio's jail and have reported physical abuse or neglect which they believe contributed to the loss of their pregnancies.

8. On March 26, 1996, Jose Rodriquez, 39, died in a pool of his own vomit on a jail floor. His cries for help went ignored by Arpaio's jail employees. Rodriquez's dehydration, fever and twitching ultimately led to his death, even while inmates shouted for help

9. Deborah Braillard, 46, was documented as a diabetic in the jail's health records. Her cellmates say a nurse did not give Braillard insulin, and then detention officers ignored her when she went into diabetic shock. Braillard died on January 23, 2005, ultimately from lack of insulin.

10. In December 2005, Clint Yarbrough suffocated in a jail restraint chair. On April 18, 2007, the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors approved an undisclosed settlement payout to Yarbrough's family in excess of $1 million

11. A 1996 Department of Justice report specifically cautioned that inmates could use "overhanging structures" to hang themselves. Three more inmates died in the same way as Thomas Cooley while in Arpaio's custody: Kevin Holschlag, Michael Sanderson, and Juan Vasquez.[63]

12. An Icelandic court in 1997 refused to extradite Connie and Donald Hanes to Maricopa County after hearing evidence about the county jail

13. Records indicated that several of the officers and civilian posse members disrobed, fondled the breasts and genitals of the alleged prostitutes, and allowed their *****es to be touched during the operation in the hopes of convincing the women they were not law enforcement officers. The Maricopa County Attorney's Office stated that the Sheriff's office had gone too far in allowing this behavior, and sixty of the cases were thrown out

14. From 2004 through November 2007, Arpaio was the target of 2,150 lawsuits in U.S. District Court and hundreds more in Maricopa County courts[48]; 50 times as many prison-conditions lawsuits as the New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, and Houston jail systems combined

15. Arpaio is named in a class-action lawsuit, Hart v. Arpaio, brought by Phoenix attorney Debra Hill and the American Civil Liberties Union on behalf of jail inmates. The lawsuit centers on the treatment of pretrial detainees, who are legally innocent until proven guilty. The lawsuit claims that Arpaio is violating the constitutional rights of those detainees.

Again Glass, you still want to defend this piece of sh*t? He's a GOPer not that matters but he makes Bush and his cronies look like choirboys with stomping on the Constitution. He and his so called deputies (or whatever job titles they are) are more like thugs with badges and more like the Gestapo.

--------------------
Let the world change you... And you can change the world.

Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna

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Machiavelli
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quote:
Originally posted by CashCowMoo:
Since when do non us-citizens get constitutional rights? Does this mean Russians who come here get the same rights when they visit? Border jumping Mexicans who cut through or climb over fences, drop trash all over private property, and are then trafficked illegally throughout the United States do not get constitutional rights. Does that make sense to some of you liberals?

We do not need to put water coolers in the desert to provide them clean sources to quench their thirst. If they are on the ground illegally and bleeding, then sure we should help them because that is just the right thing to do.

However, giving ALL of them free health care at an expense to the American taxpayer...


Stop worrying about being politically correct because its just stupid. It is what it is. People from Mexico jumping the border instead of doing the process the right way like it was done on Ellis Island to Europeans.

Anyone who comes here has the same rights under our Constitution as we do. Let me put it in simple terms for you since you might have some cow pies stuck in your head. They have the same rights under our Constitution as we do in Russia's (or whatever country) Constitution if an American goes to their country. If we do not allow them the same rights then you will see what will happen to Americans overseas. Much like if we torture foreign prisoners (Guantanamo anyone? or CIA backed interrogations in Pakistan or other countries?) then you will see what will happen when our soldiers or just plain American citizens are detained in prisons and such in other countries whether they are innocent or guilty. Anyways giving all people the protection of the Constitution just makes plain sense and to say otherwise is stupidity. If anything we should give them the rights so as to not get cases thrown out of court if they do commit crimes. Makes sense? I think so. If we do not give all people the same rights then we are just hyprocrites and blowing smoke when we preach to the world about how great our country is and our Constitution. Perhaps you should read these Amendments again:

Fourth Amendment: guards against searches, arrests, and seizures of property without a specific warrant or a "probable cause" to believe a crime has been committed. Some rights to privacy have been inferred from this amendment and others by the Supreme Court.

Fifth Amendment: forbids trial for a major crime except after indictment by a grand jury; prohibits double jeopardy (repeated trials), except in certain very limited circumstances; forbids punishment without due process of law; and provides that an accused person may not be compelled to testify against himself (this is also known as "Taking the Fifth" or "Pleading the Fifth"). This is regarded as the "rights of the accused" amendment, otherwise known as the Miranda rights after the Supreme Court case. It also prohibits government from taking private property for public use without "just compensation," the basis of eminent domain in the United States.

Sixth Amendment: guarantees a speedy public trial for criminal offenses. It requires trial by a jury, guarantees the right to legal counsel for the accused, and guarantees that the accused may require witnesses to attend the trial and testify in the presence of the accused. It also guarantees the accused a right to know the charges against him

Eighth Amendment: forbids excessive bail or fines, and cruel and unusual punishment

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Let the world change you... And you can change the world.

Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna

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glassman
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So whipping a slave to near death and sometimes to death back in the pre Civil War days is protecting their investment and caring for their health and welfare? [Roll Eyes]


huh? i didn't say that and you know it.

fact is? slaves (per) cost more than homes did. only the very very wealthy owned slaves.

i'm not excusing it, i'm telling that IMO< hiring illegals is akin to slavery.

peopl who hire tham should be punished severly. and ostrasized.

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I just showed you cases that he abuses his powers on whites, blacks etc. not just illegals and yes even legal immigrants.. yet you choose to ignore that...

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Let the world change you... And you can change the world.

Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Machiavelli:
I just showed you cases that he abuses his powers on whites, blacks etc. not just illegals and yes even legal immigrants.. yet you choose to ignore that...

that just proves he's a typical power hungry sherriff that need to be convicted of real crime to be put out of business. the Feds are very good at doing that when they are allowed to by their bosses (the AG and the Prez)

i never defended him. i questioned the definition of torture.

going back to the original article? i still say that marching prisoners from one point to another in shackles is not torture. it can be torture. but the article described no torture.

isn't this the same guy that issues pink underwear to the inmates too? people even calim that's cruelty. i don't see it that way.

furhtermore? there's alot of poeple in those jails that he has that we want kept there.

it's obvious that two different political agendas are meeting head-on in the immigration issues Mach.

i stick to facts as much as i can to come up with a position.

facts are that people suffer everywhere.


as of a couple of years ago. the coyotes and the drug smugglers became one in the same. now the money is in the drugs cuz nobody in their right mind wants to come here when there's no jobs.

the fact that we have prisoners living in tents brings up a very interesting point about how we are running this country doesn't it?

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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