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Part of the problem of the wars since WWll is that the word "WIN" has taken on a different meaning. Maybe before we enter a war we need to know exactly what the president considers "WINNING," if we the people think can be achieved then we go to war. Now if the president does not pull the troops out when we have "Won" by the definition then he is impeached immediately. It seems like its always easier to get us in wars than to get us out.
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The one good part about having a "Draft" is that it probably gives the high ranking military officers nightmares at night, just thinking of having to deal with "Draftees again. Most Draftees come in with a completely different military attitude than other soldiers and it drives the brass nuts. Its not that they are bad soldiers, but they are in the military for a different reason and it usually shows. We gave um hell.
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"Maybe before we enter a war we need to know exactly what the president considers "WINNING".
I disagree. We need to have a president that cares what "WE THINK" is winning.
John Nance Garner told us what the Vice Presidency is worth and the damned invasion of Iraq and anything that might come of it ain't even worth a tenth a Vice President. No, make it a hundreth!
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More carp to stoke the fire(s)....why?? Can you smell it yet? The clash is burning heavy....the muslims want to go backwards.....the world wants to move forward.....the Palestinians were jubilent after 9/11...(it's even more evident with their elections of Hamas leaders)...who's gunna' win???? A so called, "religious war" is eminent....but it won't be based on religion.... http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060206/ap_on_re_mi_ea/prophet_drawings Protesters Torch Danish Mission in Beirut
By JOSEPH PANOSSIAN, Associated Press Writer 52 minutes ago
BEIRUT, Lebanon - Muslim rage over caricatures of the prophet Muhammad grew increasingly violent Sunday as thousands of rampaging protesters undaunted by tear gas and water cannons torched the Danish mission and ransacked a Christian neighborhood. At least one person reportedly died and about 200 were detained, officials said. ADVERTISEMENT
Muslim clerics denounced the violence, with some wading into the mobs trying to stop them. Copenhagen ordered Danes to leave the country or stay indoors in the second day of attacks on its diplomatic outposts in the Middle East.
In Beirut, a day after violent protests in neighboring Syria, the crowd broke through a cordon of troops and police that had encircled the embassy. Security forces fired tear gas and loosed their weapons into the air to stop the onslaught.
The protesters, armed with stones and sticks, damaged police and fire vehicles and threw stones at a Maronite Catholic church in the wealthy Ashrafieh area a Christian neighborhood where the Danish Embassy is located.
Flames and smoke billowed from the 10-story building, which also houses the Austrian Embassy and the residence of Slovakia's consul. Protesters waved green and black Islamic flags from broken windows and tossed papers and filing cabinets outside.
Witnesses said one protester, apparently overcome by smoke, jumped from a window and was rushed to the hospital. Security officials said he died.
Thirty people were injured, half of them members of the security forces, officials said, making it the most violent in a string of demonstrations across the Muslim world. All the injuries were from beatings and stones.
Prime Minister Fuad Saniora said before meeting with top Islamic leaders that about 200 people were detained, and police said they included 76 Syrians, 35 Palestinians and 38 Lebanese.
The first apparent victim of the political fallout from the violence was Interior Minister Hassan Sabei, who submitted his resignation. It was not immediately clear if the resignation was accepted.
Sabei said authorities had tried to prevent the protest from turning violent.
"Things got out of hand when elements that had infiltrated into the ranks of the demonstrators broke through security shields," he said. "The one remaining option was an order to shoot, but I was not prepared to order the troops to shoot Lebanese citizens."
Sabei, like other Lebanese politicians and Grand Mufti Mohammed Rashid Kabbani, spiritual leader of Lebanon's Sunni Muslims, suggested Islamic radicals had fanned the anger.
Kabbani said outsiders among the protesters were trying to "distort the image of Islam."
The United States accused the Syrian government of backing the protests in Lebanon and Syria.
U.N. Secretary-General Kofi Annan said in a statement that the resentment over the caricatures "cannot justify violence, least of all when directed at people who have no responsibility for, or control over, the publications in question."
The Danish Foreign Ministry urged Danes to leave Lebanon. The violence Saturday in Damascus prompted a similar warning.
"The government has no intention to insult Muslims," Danish Foreign Minister Per Stig Moeller said on public radio in Copenhagen. "We are trying to explain to everyone that enough is enough."
The Syrian state-run daily newspaper Al-Thawra said Denmark was to blame because its government had not apologized for the September publication of the caricatures in Jyllands-Posten.
The drawings including one depicting the prophet wearing a turban shaped as a bomb with a burning fuse have since been republished in several European and New Zealand newspapers as a statement on behalf of a free press.
In Malaysia, an editor at a small newspaper on remote Borneo Island resigned for reprinting the caricatures and, in a statement Monday, the newspaper apologized and expressed "profound regret over the unauthorized publication." The Sunday Tribune was the only newspaper in mainly Muslim Malaysia to reprint any of the caricatures, and a government official warned that the newspaper may lose its license if it fails to give a satisfactory explanation.
Islamic law is interpreted to forbid any depictions of the Prophet Muhammad for fear they could lead to idolatry.
Denmark's Prime Minister Anders Fogh Rasmussen has said he disapproves of the caricatures, but insisted he cannot apologize on behalf of his country's independent press.
Thousands also took to the streets elsewhere in the Muslim world and parts of Europe, including some 3,000 Afghans who burned a Danish flag and demanding that the editors at Jyllands-Posten be prosecuted for blasphemy.
Afghan President Hamid Karzai urged forgiveness.
"God instructs us to forgive. Therefore, we as much as we condemn it strongly must stay above this dispute and not bring ourselves ... to equating ourselves to those who have published the cartoons," he said on CNN's "Late Edition."
Stepping up the pressure, the Islamic Army in Iraq, a key group in the insurgency fighting U.S.-led and Iraqi forces, posted a second Internet statement Sunday calling for violence against citizens of countries where the caricatures have been published.
A Lebanese security official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not allowed to speak to the press, said Danish diplomats had evacuated the mission in Beirut two days earlier, anticipating the protests.
The protesters, who came in buses from all over Lebanon, waved flags and banners.
"There is no god but God and Muhammad is the messenger of God!" they shouted as they pushed against riot police.
Many Muslim clerics were among them.
"Regretfully, the march did more harm to the prophet than it did good," said Sunni Sheik Ibrahim Ibrahim, who was in the crowd. He said he and others tried to stop the mob, but "we got stones and insults."
European leaders also urged calm and respect both for religion and freedom of the press.
"The violence now, particularly the burning of Danish missions abroad, is absolutely outrageous and totally unjustified, and what we want to see is this matter being calmed down," British Foreign Secretary Jack Straw said in London, adding that the media must exercise its free speech privilege responsibly.
Lebanon's most senior Shiite Muslim cleric, Grand Ayatollah Muhammad Hussein Fadlallah, issued an edict banning violence, saying it "harms Islam and Prophet Muhammad the same as the others (the publishers of the cartoons) did."
But Iran's Foreign Ministry announced Tehran had recalled its ambassador to Denmark, joining Syria, Saudi Arabia and Libya in pulling diplomatic representatives.
Iraqi Transport Minister Salam al-Maliki also said his country would cancel its contracts with Danish firms and reject reconstruction money from Copenhagen.
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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Yea, the world is very peaceful.....an artist depicts and presents a painting of the "christian entity" in cow carp....no riots, just outrage.....but this is how radical murderers, in large numbers BTW, react to artistic insults to THEIR religion..... http://tinyurl.com/bgfq3
Cartoons Spark Burning of Embassies
Syrians, Angry at Drawings of Prophet Muhammad, Target Danes and Norwegians
By Karl Vick Washington Post Foreign Service Sunday, February 5, 2006; Page A15
ISTANBUL, Feb. 4 -- Outrage among Muslims around the world over cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad again erupted into violence on Saturday, as crowds in Damascus, Syria, set afire the embassies of two countries where newspapers published the images forbidden by Islam.
The embassies of Denmark and Norway were badly damaged by demonstrators shouting "God is Great!" as police fired tear gas and water cannons, news reports said. In the Palestinian territories, protesters burned tires and threw rocks at offices of the European Union, and a leader of the Islamic Resistance Movement, or Hamas, was quoted as calling for the death of those responsible for the caricatures.
Syrians in Damascus burn a Danish flag in continuing protests against European newspapers for publishing cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad. Muslim protests spread to Pakistan and the West Bank. Syrians in Damascus burn a Danish flag in continuing protests against European newspapers for publishing cartoons depicting the prophet Muhammad. Muslim protests spread to Pakistan and the West Bank. (By Khaled Al-hariri -- Reuters) Photos /world Cartoons Ignite Fury Anger grows in the Middle East after European publications reprint cartoons that Muslims worldwide call disrespectful to the prophet Mohammed. Who's Blogging? Read what bloggers are saying about this article.
* Rick Sincere News and Thoughts * Rick Sincere News and Thoughts * Spot-On: Josh Trevino
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Meanwhile, the Roman Catholic Church added its voice to Western governments condemning publication of the images. "The right to freedom of thought and expression . . . cannot entail the right to offend the religious sentiment of believers," the Vatican said in a statement.
The controversy showed no signs of abating as newspapers reprinted the cartoons, triggering fresh protests. In the West, each new incident fueled curiosity about the provocative images in question -- a series of 12 cartoons that a Danish newspaper commissioned in September to directly challenge Islam's ban on depicting the prophet. The cartoons not only pictured Muhammad, who Muslims believe carried the word of God from a mountaintop 1,500 years ago; several also lampooned him, with one artist rendering his turban as a bomb.
After Muslims began protesting this past week, newspapers in Germany, France and Norway reprinted the cartoons, calling the issue a matter of free expression. But the Bush administration and other Western governments declared that publication served no purpose except offending the world's 1.1 billion Muslims, many of whom already feel aggrieved. Global surveys taken before the cartoon controversy showed that Muslims overwhelmingly believe the U.S.-led war on terror is in fact a war on Islam.
"It's interesting how our ambassadors in Europe see this issue so differently than ambassadors in Islamic countries," said a European diplomat in Turkey, where reaction to the cartoon flap has been relatively muted. "Those in Europe see it as a free speech issue," he said, while diplomats in Muslim countries are agitated.
The diplomat spoke on condition of anonymity to share confidential diplomatic traffic. The diplomat quoted a cable from his country's Cairo embassy that read: "I can't de-escalate. Freedom of speech and freedom of expression are not something I can sell here if it is in conflict with Islam."
In the United States, major newspapers, including The Washington Post, chose not to reprint the images on grounds they would give offense. In South Africa, the high court barred Sunday papers from reprinting them. CNN International reported that two newspapers in New Zealand did publish the images, but the channel blurred footage of the papers.
"We should have killed all those who offend the prophet and instead here we are, protesting peacefully," Mahmoud Zahar, a leader of Hamas in the Gaza Strip, was quoted as telling the Italian daily Il Giornale on Saturday, according to the Associated Press. Hamas won control of the Palestinian Authority parliament in elections last month.
The Reuters news agency reported the government of Iran had appointed a committee to explore bans on trade with countries where the cartoons had been published. Last year Iran quietly imposed a similar ban on at least one country, South Korea, that had voted against it at the International Atomic Energy Agency.
In Damascus, peaceful protests at the Danish and Norwegian embassies grew violent after demonstrators broke through police lines. Both buildings were empty at the time they were overrun. Denmark warned its citizens to avoid the country.
"The situation for Danes in Syria has developed negatively in the past hours," a Foreign Ministry statement said. Norway also warned its citizens away. That country previously pulled aid workers and diplomats out of the West Bank after protests.
Demonstrations were also reported in Pakistan, Britain, Iraq and Bethlehem in the West Bank. In the West Bank town of Hebron, about 50 Palestinians burned a Danish flag and demanded a boycott of Danish goods, chanting "We will redeem our prophet, Muhammad, with our blood!" they chanted, the AP reported.
There were scattered counter-demonstrations, such as one outside Copenhagen where about 50 right-wing protesters held Danish flags and shouted, "Denmark for Danes!" the AP reported. Italy's ANSA news agency reported that about 50 supporters of the right-wing Northern League offered Danish beer and biscuits to passersby in Milan.
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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Seriously, when muslim countries, (most of the middle-east, AND spread through Africa and the Phillippines), "teach" and allow their children to be educated with "religion/religious books", BEFORE educating them about the real world, (if they even get that), you have instant brain washing....very similar to the Hitler youth camps carp.....this is VERY dangerous stuff.....and is widespread.....global....a monster is in the making......how to deal with it???? Ugly.......
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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My favorite for sure "phuckhedz".....that would depict the majority of the non-realistic world....the (towel, not wrapped correctly types), that are committing murder, (terrorism is a myth, it's pronounced MURDER), are about to pizz everyone off.....and it's about time....and guess what happens next??? Not isolationaism...but let's return them to their "seemingly wanted" place of existence.....shall we???
quote:Originally posted by BuyTex: Isolationism may not be a bad idea...for awhile.
Manhattan/moonshot-style projects on alt-energy, parallel with strategic pull-backs...
let the phuckhedz revert to the stone-age, while we reward our bill-payers at home...
regroup
solidify...
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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Yea, I agree....and that's a shame.....time is of the essence with these murderers growing in numbers.....globaly...
quote:Originally posted by Gordon Bennett: I think we'll need a different president in order for any regrouping to occur.
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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The fall of every great empire in recorded history, was AFTER the acceptance of homosexualtity in it's culture.....history, is about to repeat itself.....
quote:Originally posted by BuyTex: i hear ya...
all I'm saying? Our "policy experts" ain't so expert...
we're spread too thin...
massive pullbacks--economic and military--are in order
then we strike as necessary...
think of Rome...always expanding: not a good model
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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yikes, don't know 'bout all that--suspect theres plenty of homophobic cultures that went by that wayside.
To me? human-culture-strength mirrors the most vibrant ecosystems...ie, "monocultures" are easily ravaged by disease...vibrancy resonates where zones overlap: our current foreign (lack of) policy is a monoculture
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
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and no, I'm not homophobic......I just don't agree with it, nor do I believe it is natural.....it falls in the lines of "immoral", and should NOT be allowed in a civilized society...as a matter of fact, I think it is just as bad as committing child molestation...BTW, I'm not religious....JMHO.....(bash away)
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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Monoculture? Only when intellect can exceed bodily capacity....freaky? Yea.....doable? Easily.....
quote:Originally posted by BuyTex: yikes, don't know 'bout all that--suspect theres plenty of homophobic cultures that went by that wayside.
To me? human-culture-strength mirrors the most vibrant ecosystems...ie, "monocultures" are easily ravaged by disease...vibrancy resonates where zones overlap: our current foreign (lack of) policy is a monoculture
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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quote:Originally posted by Marty: Monoculture? Only when intellect can exceed bodily capacity....freaky? Yea.....doable? Easily.....
quote:Originally posted by BuyTex: yikes, don't know 'bout all that--suspect theres plenty of homophobic cultures that went by that wayside.
To me? human-culture-strength mirrors the most vibrant ecosystems...ie, "monocultures" are easily ravaged by disease...vibrancy resonates where zones overlap: our current foreign (lack of) policy is a monoculture
lol, suspect we're talking at cross purposes...
I'm addessing foreign policy....
sounds like you're addressing "foreign-objects policy" lol, no?
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
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Policy? I thought we were talking about inter-gallactic politics.... LOL....Yea, I think we're on the same frequency, just different channels..
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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As such, you get K-Rock in your neighborhood? LOL....
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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Homosexuals aren't hurting anyone. Comparing them to child molesters is absurd.
Studies have shown that many homophobes are driven to hate speech, and even violence, by the anger and shame they are taught to feel about their own hidden homosexual desires.
Further, what happens between two consenting adults, whether you agree with it or not, is no one's business.
If/when this empire falls, it won't be because of its homosexuality. It will be the result of its leaders' arrogance and ignorance.
-------------------- "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
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Well I did invite folks to bash To bad your attempting to use an unproven theory of "Homosexuality is genetic. It's not a choice." as a response. I don't believe for one second it's genetic. It's a personal choice (my opinion of course). And the studies thing you mention below, now that's absurd....LOL....BTW, this isn't geared toward you personally, it's toward the generality of the comments below....now back to the topic itself....
quote:Originally posted by Gordon Bennett: Marty,
Homosexuality is genetic. It's not a choice.
Homosexuals aren't hurting anyone. Comparing them to child molesters is absurd.
Studies have shown that many homophobes are driven to hate speech, and even violence, by the anger and shame they are taught to feel about their own hidden homosexual desires.
Further, what happens between two consenting adults, whether you agree with it or not, is no one's business.
If/when this empire falls, it won't be because of its homosexuality. It will be the result of its leaders' arrogance and ignorance.
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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By VLADIMIR ISACHENKOV, Associated Press Writer 38 minutes ago
MOSCOW - Russia's foreign minister warned against threatening Iran over its nuclear program Monday after Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld reportedly agreed with a German interviewer that all options, including military response, remained on the table. ADVERTISEMENT
Oil prices rose after Iran ended all voluntary cooperation with the U.N. nuclear watchdog agency, saying it would start uranium enrichment and bar surprise inspections of its facilities. Traders fear the dispute could disrupt supplies from OPEC's second-largest oil producer.
Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov called for talks to continue with Tehran, which was reported to the U.N. Security Council on Saturday by the International Atomic Energy Agency.
"I think that at the current stage, it is important not to make guesses about what will happen and even more important not to make threats," Lavrov said during a visit to Athens, Greece.
Rumsfeld, in an interview with the German daily newspaper Handelsblatt, was asked if all options, including the military one, were on the table with Iran.
"That's right," Rumsfeld responded, according to Handelsblatt's print edition Monday.
Lavrov said the use of force would be possible only if the United Nations consented.
The IAEA's 35-nation board of governors voted to report Iran to the Security Council, which has the power to impose economic and political sanctions. Tehran responded by saying it would start full-scale uranium enrichment and bar surprise inspections of its facilities.
In Norway, China's foreign minister urged continued diplomatic efforts to resolve the standoff.
"A diplomatic solution serves the common interest," Li Zhaoxing said during an official visit. "We are still working on our Iranian colleagues to cherish negotiations."
However, Li warned that time was "already pressing" for efforts to resolve the dispute before it reaches the Security Council.
Li declined to stay whether China would support sanctions against Iran.
Meanwhile, Russian Deputy Foreign Minister Sergei Kislyak said Monday a proposed joint venture to enrich Iranian uranium in Russia would be possible only if Tehran resumed its moratorium on enrichment activities, Interfax reported.
Despite an earlier threat to the contrary, Iran said Sunday it was willing to discuss Moscow's proposal to shift large-scale enrichment operations to Russian territory in an effort to allay suspicions it is pursuing nuclear weapons.
Talks on the project were scheduled for Feb. 16 in Moscow. The Bush administration supports the proposal.
Uranium enriched to a low degree can be used for nuclear reactors, while highly enriched uranium is suitable for warheads. Iran insists it only wants to generate electricity, but the United States and some of its allies contend Tehran is trying to build a bomb.
The Islamic republic also left the door open for further international negotiations over its program.
Radzhab Safarov, a Moscow-based expert on Iran, said this month's talks in Moscow could produce a breakthrough because some Iranian politicians had questioned the wisdom of Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad's uncompromising course and had grown increasingly worried about growing international isolation.
"There is a strong chance that these talks will lead to a decision that would help defuse the situation," Safarov said at a news conference.
Safarov said any U.S. or Israeli military action against Iran would prompt Iran to retaliate by blocking oil deliveries through the Persian Gulf and throwing the global market into chaos.
On Monday, light, sweet crude for March delivery on the New York Mercantile Exchange rose 75 cents to $66.12 a barrel in electronic trading by afternoon in Europe. Despite relative high stocks of crude and oil products in the United States, concerns about Iran reducing exports either voluntarily or because of any sanctions imposed are supporting the market, said Sucden Commodity brokers.
France's foreign minister told Iranian officials Monday to "be careful" when considering whether to use economic sanctions to retaliate after the Security Council referral.
"The Iranians should be careful," Philippe Douste-Blazy said on France-Inter radio. "Isolating themselves would be very serious for them."
"They also need economic cooperation for their industries."
Iran reiterated its stance that it would not negotiate with the United States.
"There is no debate about relations and negotiation with the U.S. There has been no change in our policy," Gholamhossein Elham, Iran's government spokesman, said Monday.
-------------------- Marty When I was born, I was granted a visitors pass to earth. I will enjoy everyday until it has expired. You should too ;)
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You believe that homosexuality is a choice? Then it follows that heterosexuality is a choice as well.
I repeat - Homosexuals aren't hurting anyone. Comparing them to child molesters is absurd.
What happens between two consenting adults, whether you agree with it or not, is not the government's business. You can't legislate morality; it simply doesn't work.
May freedom of choice prevail!
quote:Originally posted by Marty: Well I did invite folks to bash To bad your attempting to use an unproven theory of "Homosexuality is genetic. It's not a choice." as a response. I don't believe for one second it's genetic. It's a personal choice (my opinion of course). And the studies thing you mention below, now that's absurd....LOL....BTW, this isn't geared toward you personally, it's toward the generality of the comments below....now back to the topic itself....
-------------------- "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
posted
Research by US psychologists suggests that 80 percent of men who are homophobic have secret homosexual feelings. This finding lends scientific support to the long-standing speculation that those who shout the loudest against homosexuality have something to hide.
The research results were published in the prestigious Journal of Abnormal Psychology, with the backing of the American Psychological Association.
In tests conducted by Prof. Henry E Adams of the University of Georgia, homophobic men who said they were exclusively heterosexual were shown gay sex videos. Four out of five became sexually aroused by the homoerotic imagery, as recorded by a penile circumference measuring device - a plethysmograph.
Prof. Adams says his research shows that most homophobes "demonstrate significant sexual arousal to homosexual erotic stimuli", suggesting that homophobia is a form of "latent homosexuality where persons are either unaware of or deny their homosexual urges".
-------------------- "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
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