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Author Topic: Unpaid Credit Cards Bedevil Americans!!
osubucks30
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Link:
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/071223/credit_card_crunch.html

Are we going to have a recession or not?

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glassman
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it's not looking good is it?

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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Hannibull
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what's the use of having a credit card anyway, so you can buy that $1000 vacation for which you don't have the money? You know, it's too easy to buy something with a credit card, the money is available to you so the temptation to buy something is more present than ever before. People spend money without standing still and thinking that at some point they will have to pay that money back. Then something happens (you lose your job or whatever, income is gone) and they run out of money and can no longer pay back their credit cards, and end up with huge debit interests of over 15%. They were no longer able to pay the credit card in the first place and now they have to pay back not only the debt but the intrest as well...

This is why I'm radically against credit cards, not only is it unethical of the banks to give people access to money that they KNOW they can't pay back, but it can severely burden people's lives. When you get a loan at the bank at least the bank knows where the money goes to and the loan is adjusted for its intended use. If it's a house you have the house as collateral and you pay it off in 15-25 years, etc, but with a credit card you have 1 month to pay off the debt yet the choice and freedom to buy whatever you want is up to you...

I have a friend who can't afford his last years of college anymore because he has multiple credit cards to pay off, I think that's very sad...

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glassman
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well? i spend several grand a month on any of several cards, and i pay them off every month. they keep raising our limits till they have gotten to ridiculous amounts. heck i spend a almost a grand a month at the grocery store with 'em...
if i had an opportunity come up to improve my business and needed to spend some money right on the spot? i can..

that's what i use 'em for... but we always pay them off. i'm not really sure, but i think my Sears card is 24%... that's criminal, but i never have to pay it...

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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T e x
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no debt...

regardless of whether "you" or "i" can handle it? no debt, period.

That's the goal. No debt.

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Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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T e x
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quote:
Originally posted by Hannibull:
what's the use of having a credit card anyway, so you can buy that $1000 vacation for which you don't have the money? You know, it's too easy to buy something with a credit card, the money is available to you so the temptation to buy something is more present than ever before. People spend money without standing still and thinking that at some point they will have to pay that money back. Then something happens (you lose your job or whatever, income is gone) and they run out of money and can no longer pay back their credit cards, and end up with huge debit interests of over 15%. They were no longer able to pay the credit card in the first place and now they have to pay back not only the debt but the intrest as well...

This is why I'm radically against credit cards, not only is it unethical of the banks to give people access to money that they KNOW they can't pay back, but it can severely burden people's lives. When you get a loan at the bank at least the bank knows where the money goes to and the loan is adjusted for its intended use. If it's a house you have the house as collateral and you pay it off in 15-25 years, etc, but with a credit card you have 1 month to pay off the debt yet the choice and freedom to buy whatever you want is up to you...

I have a friend who can't afford his last years of college anymore because he has multiple credit cards to pay off, I think that's very sad...

good post...

just say "NO!" to credit in general

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Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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Propertymanager
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no debt...regardless of whether "you" or "i" can handle it? no debt, period. That's the goal. No debt.

Don't think so small. It takes money to make money and having debt for income producing assets is a good thing!

The difference is what the debt is for. If the debt is for consumer nonsense - it's bad. If the debt is for income producing assets - it's good!

Mike

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bdgee
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"It takes money to make money" is an oft heard saying that is false and terribly misleading, used often to intend to convey the idea that the route to wealth is through debt. (Consider the cases of Bill Gates and Ross Perot, one a college misfit that never graduated and the other a simple salesman of office software. Those vast fortunes certainly didn't come about via using money to make money.)

It is NOT true that it takes money to make money.

What is true is that, except in extreme cases like maybe inheritance from a lost uncle or a chance win of the lottery, that is, via normal routines, it takes either work or capital or very special (often very very lucky) insight to make substantial amounts of money.

Debt IS NOT work or capital and certainly doesn't amount to insight. One may, through judicious selection or blind stupid luck, use money obtained through debt to obtain capital, then with that capital and work, gain sufficient more capital to repay the debt and make a profit. Otherwise, debt is simply a foolishness that leads to generational poverty.

To be rich is not to hold vast sums of money. It is a certain degree of financial security, which one may have attained without ever accumulating excesses of money and capital. It is a condition that some are born to, others achieve, but no one reaches simply by assuming debt. Moreover, many that never reach that state fail to do so because they mistakenly thought debt was acceptable.

Even with all that, contrary to hype, financial security isn't the epitome of human achievement or desire. Ask anyone that has lost a child and a fortune which he or she would have back first!

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Propertymanager
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Most of what you said is simply - nonsense. Almost all businesses have debt. That debt enables them to buy the equipment and assets that allow them to operate.

The same is true of the vast majority of people starting businesses. Unless they are born rich, it will take debt to start and operate a business. Without the money (from the debt), they simply could not be successful.

It is absolutely true that a lot of hard work is also required and so is a thorough understanding of the business. However, yes, it does take money to make money.

To be rich is not to hold vast sums of money.

That's true, to be rich is to "hold wealth or great possessions". Having a big pile of cash would not be a wise use of resources.

Mike

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Propertymanager
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Most of what you said is simply - nonsense. Almost all businesses have debt. That debt enables them to buy the equipment and assets that allow them to operate.

The same is true of the vast majority of people starting businesses. Unless they are born rich, it will take debt to start and operate a business. Without the money (from the debt), they simply could not be successful.

It is absolutely true that a lot of hard work is also required and so is a thorough understanding of the business. However, yes, it does take money to make money.

To be rich is not to hold vast sums of money.

That's true, to be rich is to "hold wealth or great possessions". Having a big pile of cash would not be a wise use of resources.

Mike

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bdgee
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All of what I said is beyond the simple minded hatred you display for those not worshiping at the alter of the haves and the free market, so I am not surprised you can't understand.

You are hopelessly addicted to a supposed philosophy that declares the richest that ever lived to be the poor, eliminating from consideration the truly rich, such as an Einstein or a Thoreau. Are you also of the misconception that those sorts failed?

You are playing the part of an intellectual fool, loudly proclaiming at you own reflection in the mirror that you find it handsome, then smiling when you see it telling that same egotistical blather to you. You don't have a clue.

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Propertymanager
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bdgee,

So, since you're not right, you post more nonsense. Why not argue on the facts instead of more tired socialist propaganda?

Mike

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glassman
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The same is true of the vast majority of people starting businesses. Unless they are born rich, it will take debt to start and operate a business. Without the money (from the debt), they simply could not be successful.


LOL... not true. i know many people that have debt-free small businesses...

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Propertymanager
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I'm not talking a hobby business. I'm talking a real business. A business that pays the bills and makes money.

I'm not saying (and didn't say) that NO ONE has a business without debt, but the vast majority of small businesses do have debt.

Mike

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glassman
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secured or unsecured debt?

i'm not talking about hobby businesses either.

i know many people in the automotive service biz that pay for their racing HOBBY (even at the dirt track level) and still pay the bills and have nice houses. hell, i did that for years.

heck i even know peasants with one tow truck that make 100K a year after taxes.


are you forgetting that this is a stock board, and SEC flings are not hard that hard to read if you take the time to learn how? it's all right there, study it and learn.

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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Credit cards are an abomination of the finance community designed to circumvent usury statutes and quietly squeeze money out of the poor.

Want to back up the lenders? Then I'll quote the bible and point out that Jesus dammed the lenders. (Yep, I am ashamed of sinking to such depths, but not so ashamed as I would be leaving an opening for some fool to forget he has declared as a Christian and to follow the examples of Jesus. Usury is sinful)

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Propertymanager
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bdgee,

So are you saying the poor are so stupid that they don't know what they are doing when they buy things with their credit cards? Are they victims? It's a good thing they have the wacko left to be their nursemaid.

Mike

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glassman
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yeah but when "the poor" do stupid stuff on mortgages it causes the whole house of cards to shudder...

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
bdgee,

So are you saying the poor are so stupid that they don't know what they are doing when they buy things with their credit cards? Are they victims? It's a good thing they have the wacko left to be their nursemaid.

Mike

What an arrogant and ignorant do-do you are.

You don't know enough to recognize either the left or the right. It isn't innocent either.

Of course they are victims. They are allowed no other option.

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bdgee
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House of credit cards. I like that.
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Propertymanager
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What an arrogant and ignorant do-do you are.

More 3rd grade insults? You're the one who is calling the poor stupid and think they're all victims!!!

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bdgee
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No, I don't call them stupid. It is just that you are so bigoted and hateful you can't read straight and willfully misrepresent what is said.

Or do you really believe that BS you post? Perhaps that is a sign that you are stupid rather than the poor?

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