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andrew
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Every cop is not a bad cop. There is bad in everything such as Lawyers, Doctors, Nurses, Pilots and every other profession you can think of. Don't stereo type all policeman.

What has the Commander in Chief said about police?

There are many here who are very flamboyant, over the top, exaggerate and are frankly ridiculous in their brain washing.

I am an independant...so dont throw me in the Republicans. Everyone who does not see things the way others see them, are not all crazy right wingers.

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glassman
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you are correct Andrew, there's bad in everything,, the problem is that it's so hard to find the good in politics... [Big Grin]


the general atmosphere is the problem IMO...
people in general are begging to give up their rights for one reason or another...

you could say the terrorists are winning, simply because their goal is not to kill everybody, it's to destroy our way of life, FREEDOM... and people have been rushing to give it up..

if you look really hard at how they live in the mid-east? you'll see they have no clue what freedom is...

--------------------
Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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True, not all cops are bad.

But so very many are. Moreover, given the power and trust we place in the hands of each and every cop, any single one that is bad is an assault on our way of life that is more heinous than hundreds of thousands of terrorist. No matter how many good cops there are, their existence a thousand times over can never justify a single bad cop.

"What has the Commander in Chief said about police?"

He has said that no matter how underpaid they are he won't sign a bill to help them pay the cost of getting decent health care for their kids.

"There are many here who are very flamboyant, over the top, exaggerate and are frankly ridiculous in their brain washing."

Yes. Talk to the mirror.

You are not an independent, by whatever stretch of imagination.

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thinkmoney
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every generation has its faults but with HOw things are- instead of growth in th human evolution we see descend- we see worse - we see more of evil or negativity - I am sorry but when I was in high school guns were not even heard off now its a common thread ....a fear for all schools...

no - each generation has had its hurts but our culture has been going downhill vs growth - i blame it on the secular progressives - 10% dictates the law of the land ex..no god in schools - no god? we are children of god so if we sell our souls we let the devil in devil is evil, hatred, etc...

As a nation, we need to grow vs self destruct...
Who we are at our innermost being should be glorified ...if we deny god, we let evil in......

but, what i despise is the 5 -10% dictate to usa the secular progressive of our cultur..i will say we are fighting back...

do u think our public schools will survive?

i doubt it...I as a parent cry that i have to send my child to a school without morals or god and guns or go private...the public schools are failing and nothing will save them except honor , and god back...

I as a parent refuse to send my kids to a schools wuth guns, out of control morals, sex, drugs, alcohol....but that is the values of our public schools..tight jeans to glorify sex, drugs, sex, no god, guns, fould language...i refuse so i have to work so hard to pay fer the public and sne my kids prrivate...we call this freedom? freedom to show a culturee of self destruct to our kids????

we have so many problems in this land yet so many opportunities...public schools will change , a matter of time before we wake up...

and we as a culture need to pursue growth vs self destruction..we need to grow vs die....

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bdgee
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Well, I blame it on self righteous and egocentric christain right-wingers that are so determined to dictate to the rest of the world and make their religious beliefs become law that they have made this society one of hate and divisiveness.

Instead of declaring everyone else wrong and announcing you are godly and right, why can't you do something productive? Try to remember that an essential and fundamental character of Christianity is suppposed to be that the law of the land must be followed and another is that government makes law, not religion.

It is not destructive, as you say, to think rather than demand that others obey the particular herd instinct of your choice. That does cause people to not appreciate your wish to dictate.

Only those that are too ignorant (generally by choice) to actually study the development of the Constitution believe that there was ever meant to be any influence by any religion in the United States, particularly christianity (remember, those that came here to escape the religious intolerance of Europe were escaping christian intolerance, not intollerance of any other religion).

Religion dependent government is a direct path to dictatorship. (Lets remember that Adolph and Benito were devout christians.)

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T e x
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
never read Shockwave Rider, i'll have to pick it up...

The Sheep Look Up is on my desk right now tho...

i had a signed copy of Sheep Look Up, but i lost it...

haven't been back over it in years and years, but at the time was quite the prescient read... some critics posit this title as the origin of "cyber-punk." The main character hacks the system--and changes ID--via touch-tone phones. A one-off re Toffler, derivative re Orwell.

--------------------
Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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vg
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Glass,
How have you been doing Sensei???

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andrew
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"He has said that no matter how underpaid they are he won't sign a bill to help them pay the cost of getting decent health care for their kids"

Hell..I am underpaid. Why don't he sign a Bill so the government can pay for me to get decent health care for my kids.

The Government already provides health care to the poor...It is called Medicaid.

Once again a way for the left to ease socialized medicine into the system.

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bdgee
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"I am underpaid. Why don't he sign a Bill so the government can pay for me to get decent health care for my kids."

Great idea, andy!

Why is it that throughout the world, except for the United States, every non third world country has free medical treatment? I'll tell you why. Because selfish jerks use the health of the public as a political football in a game of scare tactics in order to milk money from the pockets of the people.

Strange isn't it, that our republican arch right-wing has loudly predicted the failure of the government with every case of a nation accepting the responsibility for the healt of the people and installing free medical treatment. Then, decades and decades later, we see that that free medical treatment has caused none of them to fail, time and time again! Wouldn't it be a bit rational if you irresponsible jerks would get off the lies and scare tactics and admit to the truth?

Wouldn't it be refreshing if those populating the republican arch right-wing could learn to think for themselves on some question instead of rushing to gather into a heard and stampeding in whatever direction the Judas bull takes them? (It'll never happen, but it sure would be a wonderful and positive thing for this country.)

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by vg:
Glass,
How have you been doing Sensei???

dodged a few of the slings and arrows of outrageous fortune, caught a few too...

scars add character [Wink]

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by andrew:
"He has said that no matter how underpaid they are he won't sign a bill to help them pay the cost of getting decent health care for their kids"

Hell..I am underpaid. Why don't he sign a Bill so the government can pay for me to get decent health care for my kids.

The Government already provides health care to the poor...It is called Medicaid.

Once again a way for the left to ease socialized medicine into the system.

in a few years andrew? i PREDICT that companies like GM ,Ford, WalMart and others will demand the govt take health care costs off their hands, and it will be big business that gets healthcare socialised (or whatever you wanna call it) medicine pushed thru....
Coventry fined $264K

Coventry Health Care Inc. and Humana Inc., two of the largest providers of U.S.-subsidized health plans, were fined by Medicare for improperly marketing the policies to the elderly and disabled. Coventry, based in Bethesda, received a civil penalty of $264,000, while Louisville, Ky.- based Humana will pay $75,000, according to Medicare officials. State health regulators and patients have told congressional committees that elderly people who arenít competent, canít read or donít speak fluent English have been pressured into joining the plans, known as Medicare Advantage.

http://www.mddailyrecord.com/article.cfm?id=2779&type=UTTM

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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Yeah, but don'tcha know they paid that fine grinning since they made more than $264M profit out of those poor old folks.
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bdgee
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Each dime the government spends educating the and tending to the health of the population yields dollars in taxes into the treasury due to increases in production of the workforce.

Why can't the right-wingers learn to understand that if their kid doesn't have to sit next to a poor kid with whooping cough or measles in her third grade class, then little Janie has a much better chance of never getting that disease and, thereby, not only living to adulthood, but also being fertile and having healthy offspring of her own?

IT ISN'T JUST THE HEALTH OF THE POOR KID WE PROTECT WHEN WE MIND HIS HEALTH!

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by bdgee:
Yeah, but don'tcha know they paid that fine grinning since they made more than $264M profit out of those poor old folks.

most definitely bdg...

and that seems to be the atmosphere the current admin has been fostering from day one...

what i want to know is who is gonna actually take a different approach to proper regulation..

they have the same attitude with illegals, stock market enforcement, consumer products, EPA, and FDA

unfortunately? i don't have any reason to think Hillary has a different plan either

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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andrew
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Every program that the government has their greasy hands in and are overseeing is not very successful. What makes you think they can run health care? Like I said Medicaid takes care of the poor. I do not want the government to dictate anything do with me or my families medical decisions. They government will start to dictate every single procedure that is done in the hospital. And how do you think this socialized medicine will be payed for? I for one already pay enough taxes.

It will never work...It does not work well in any other country that has it. Come on man..wake up and stop trying to brain wash everyone with that crap you spew from the democrat talking points.

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glassman
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Every program that the government has their greasy hands in and are overseeing is not very successful.

not true...

there's alot of programs that run very well.. i know some of them very well..

NIH, USDA, USMC, USN, USAF, the army is OK, but not as good as the Marines [Razz]

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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glassman
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i am not saying i am for socialized medicine andrew, i'm saying that IMO, it's inevitable because of gloablisation..


if we want to keep real jobs in the US, and i'm not talking about fast food servants, we'll have little choice..

it's inevitable because we are not competing against one single nation that doesn't have it..

except China. and who knows what they have...

as globalisation progresses, the companies in other countries are developing CUSTOMERS in their own countries (which is part of the long-term plan) as those new consumers become more economically powerful? they will actually drive the cost of goods that we import up (see oil and china and india) that will give US consumers even less "pricing power"...

sure we'll be able to send more goods overseas, but the difference we gain from our exports won't matter in the foreseeable future..

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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"Every program that the government has their greasy hands in and are overseeing is not very successful. "

I mean, like Iraq for example, to name just one.

Oh yeah, and NOAA is horribly wasteful. Who gives a rat's a about climate change?

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glassman
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the Iraq failures fall directly on Bush's shoulders..

it's pretty obvious now that Rummy and Wolfowitz shoulda been replaced much earlier, and ignoring Shinseki was a massive failure in judgement.

there are alot of civil and military servants that do great jobs in spite of the politicians

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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Over all, absent the interference or influence of politicians and political organizations (that includes special interest groups like MADD, Minuteman, and B'nai B'rith, as well as the Boy Scouts of America) on publicity campaigns to shape the opinions of the public to their selfish desires, the various programs administered by our governments (local, state, and federal) are quite effective and provide much value to the society and that is because of the dedicated efforts of the people working in and overseeing those programs. (Being too tight to properly oversee those programs, i.e., the republican fiscal approach, is a greater evil than the programs.)

Government does not exists in spite of society. As pointed out by Thomas Jefferson, throughout history, whenever there has been no government, there has been nothing at all positive in human society.

Before you buy into this notion of "small influence" by and "small" government, you better get a solid and rigid definition of both small and government

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TruthLiesWithin
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I would hate to have seen what they would have done if she spilled milk.
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bdgee
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quote:
Originally posted by TruthLiesWithin:
I would hate to have seen what they would have done if she spilled milk.

I must admit, I have no idea what you are saying.
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bdgee
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"It will never work...It does not work well in any other country that has it. Come on man..wake up and stop trying to brain wash everyone with that crap you spew from the democrat talking points."

Where, pray tell, did you ever come by that absurd ort of misinformation and negation of fact?

The whole non-backward world, except for the U.S. has been practicing socialized medicine of one form or another for decades and all have been very successful medically and have drastically lowered the economic expense for their respective nations.

It isn't a democratic talking point: it is truth and an accepted reality in the whole world. Check out those facts with Sweden or Canada or Germany or England or France or ..... rather than listening to and devouring Fat Rush's lies.

The brainwashing seems to have been what happened to you.

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Relentless.
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What we have now is socialized medicine... but not for everyone.
If one were to actually think about it..
One could easily see that HMO's are the same damned thing as socialized health care.. only on a smaller basis and governed by no one.
I'm not saying one is better than the other... in this post...
Merely saying
Same damned thing.

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bdgee
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quote:
Originally posted by Relentless.:
What we have now is socialized medicine... but not for everyone.
If one were to actually think about it..
One could easily see that HMO's are the same damned thing as socialized health care.. only on a smaller basis and governed by no one.
I'm not saying one is better than the other... in this post...
Merely saying
Same damned thing.

I see your point, provided it is viewed from only a specific viewpoint. Otherwise, the comparison fizzles.
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T e x
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health-care reimbursement is JACKED UP...

mostly in favor of the provider... less so for the patient

--------------------
Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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bdgee
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Tex,

I think it is more so jacked up for the medical "supplier" (like drug companies and clinics and hospitals and such) than it is the provider, though I absolutely agree that the guys you go see for prescriptions and the ones dealing in those are getting more of a share of this Country's outlay for medical service than is appropriate.

Years back I worked for a time in Sears in the hardware deparment. A lady came in looking for a "device" to hold her mothers wheel chair in a van so her mother could manage to leave the house. She had pictures in a brochure of what she wanted. There was also a price for it at over 70 dollars each. She needed three. I had seen such a device just a week before and sent her there, where she bought three boomers at the truck stop for under $5 each. They differed from those in the brochure in that they were painted orange rather than being chrome plated and having been given a strange name I had never heard of before. She showed up the next week to thank me for sending her to a truck stop. It certainly does not cost $70 plus to chrome plate a boomer. (Now-a-days, I would send her to Harbor Freight to buy locking safety straps at about $2 each).

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The Bigfoot
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My wife is going on a new medical plan that is kind of nice. We take a higher deductible to cut the cost of the plan and in return the company puts $100 a month in a Health Savings Account that she can use to pay her bills. The bad thing is the insurance company doesn't cover anything until the deductible is met but once you factor in the free HSA money the max out of pocket is just as good as other plans and if she has a normal year of medical expenses her portion will be close to 0.

I got to say, I am a fan of national health care coverage, but I think a non-profit has a better chance at getting it done (right) than the Gov. (especially if they can get government help in controlling pricing for drugs and such.)

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No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues.

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glassman
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IMO? these TV ads for medicine are stupid.


for starters? your doctor already knows what they are.. why are they going straight to the consumer?

because they are "coaching" people on what to ask their doctor for?


overall? the drug industry is spending 100 million plus $ per year on lobbying...

n 2003 alone, the industry spent nearly $116 million lobbying the government. That was the year that Congress passed, and President George W. Bush signed, the Medicare Modernization Act of 2003, which created a taxpayer-funded prescription drug benefit for senior citizens.
Critics charge that the prescription drug benefit will transfer wealth from taxpayers, who provide the funding for Medicare, to pharmaceutical firms. According to a study done in October 2003 by Boston University professors Alan Sager and Deborah Socolar, 61 percent of Medicare money spent on prescription drugs will become profit for drug companies. Drug-makers will receive $139 billion in increased profits over eight years, the study predicts. The Medicare prescription drug benefit starts in 2006.


http://www.publicintegrity.org/rx/report.aspx?aid=723

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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It doesn't take but maybe a tenth to half a percent of the viewing public that does not realize those adds are inappropriate for the drug companies to make a fortune with them.
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glassman
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in addition to that? the FDA has been "revoking" the "approval" of some old time tested "generics" forcing consumers to buy newly developed drugs that are sometimes 100's of times as expensive, and since they are not generic force even the consumer with good insurance to make a much higher co-paymeny...

and the insurance co's are just passing on the cost instead of fighting these practices.

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Relentless.
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I can't see any of that improving with nationalized health care...
If anything it would be worse.
Remember NASA's $600 hammer?

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bdgee
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Where was it I recently saw that insurance companies own 72% of all real estate? Where do you suppose they got the money to buy it?
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Machiavelli
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in your mind most likely... but i am curious to read such a fact if you can find it... because i doubt it very much insurance companies own almost 3/4's of real estate in this country... but i do wonder what the percentages of real estate owned in the U.S. is... anyone have those figures? ...

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Let the world change you... And you can change the world.

Ernesto "Che" Guevara de la Serna

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Relentless.
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Whatever it is, I'm sure banks are quickly over taking insurance companies... what with all the foreclosures.
Seems as though privately owned land is starting to dwindle.

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