How dare he ask a question when he was so graciously offered the chance to ask a question... Citizens need to be tamed. This is the American way?
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-------------------- One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example. Posts: 2430 | From: CA | Registered: Jun 2005
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That's right. The American way is the way of a controlling and intimidatingly violent government. You must never assert yourself when confronted by one of your rulers. Be passive at all times. You are not special. You are lucky they are so kind as to barely tolerate your every breathe.
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-------------------- One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example. Posts: 2430 | From: CA | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
the last presidential conventions had "free speech zones" for protestors...
that implies that the rest of the country ISN'T a free speech zone.. and the Dems are just as guilty as the GOP on this one...
The constitutionality of police-imposed 'free-speech zones'
By Julie Hilden, FindLaw Columnist Special to CNN.com Wednesday, August 4, 2004 Posted: 3:25 PM EDT (1925 GMT)
(FindLaw) -- Last week, the Democratic National Convention (DNC) ended. But the First Amendment issues that were raised there did not. Indeed, they are likely to continue on indefinitely -- recurring at the upcoming Republican National Convention (RNC), and similar public events raising intense security concerns.
Protesters at the DNC were confined to a fenced-in area -- a wire enclosure topped by razor wire outside Boston's FleetCenter, where the Convention was held. They charged that their First Amendment rights were violated by this confinement.
posted
I dunno Glass, IMO there were enough witnesses there watching what was going on...
This guy could have simply done as the ACLU suggested and cooperated, and he probably would have been released with no charges...
In fact, the ACLU would have probably paid his legal fees and helped with a lawsuit against the officers involved in his false arrest.
However, he became emotional and began to physically resist the officers, which ultimately resulted in him being tased.
...Once an officer decides you are under arrest, it is no longer about whether he is right in detaining you or not. It is now his job to take you into custody, where, following due course, both your case, and his will be decided before the courts.
... Sorry Relentless, but IMO, to propose that cooperating with an officer when you are being falsely arrested is an un-american act of complacency is utter non-sense....
-------------------- One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example. Posts: 2430 | From: CA | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
hundreds of people were illegally detained in NYC during the RNC...
they were released with no charges after the convention was over...
A Raw Deal For RNC Protesters? Some Detained As Long As 66 Hours, Sparking Hunger Strike
NEW YORK, Sept. 3, 2004
(CBS/AP) A judge ordered the immediate release of nearly 500 protesters Thursday - just hours before President Bush's speech at the Republican National Convention - and then fined the city for refusing to comply with his order.
State Supreme Court Justice John Cataldo fined the city $1,000 for every protester held past a 5 p.m. deadline that he had set for their release. It was unclear how many detainees were still in custody, but Cataldo had ordered the release of 470 people.
"These people have already been the victims of a process," state Supreme Court Justice John Cataldo told the city's top lawyer. "I can no longer accept your statement that you are trying to comply."
The detainees had been in custody for anywhere from 36 to 66 hours. The decision was immediately hailed by attorneys for the demonstrators.
posted
NEW YORK (AP) AP-ES-04-15-05 1522ED - The city agreed Friday to pay $150 each to 108 demonstrators who were arrested during last summer's Republican National Convention and kept locked up even after a judge ordered their release.
In addition to the $16,200, the city will also pay legal costs and attorneys' fees of about $215,000.
The payouts will settle the demonstrators' claims that the city was in contempt of court for not complying with a judge's order to release hundreds of the protesters.
Those arrested can still sue on other grounds, including allegations of excessive force by police.
More than 1,800 people were arrested during the four-day convention. Most arrests were for minor violations, such as disorderly conduct. Some were held for days. Some claimed they were not protesters at all but were swept up anyway by police.
hmmmm... was rudy still mayor when this went down?
could be a good political wedge...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:Originally posted by NaturalResources: ... Sorry Relentless, but IMO, to propose that cooperating with an officer when you are being falsely arrested is an un-american act of complacency is utter non-sense....
NR, cooperating with an officer is one thing. Being submissive to any and all demands from an officer is quite another. This country was founded on the notion that a bully government might just maybe... possibly be a bad thing. Rushing and attacking a seemingly bright, quite articulate guy for asking a question of a guy who was onstage to answer friggen questions... seems a tad bullyish to me.
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posted
It is not our damned duty to cower before this or any other government. Police do NOT have the right to tackle and then physically torture any of us for simply voicing an opinion. There has been an incredible change in the last twenty years in how police officers deal with the public. If that change is not reversed there will be a civil war in this nation which will make Abe's war look like a picnic.
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Alachua County, Florida - The Alachua County Sheriff's Office says a Lieutenant didn't know a mother was pregnant when he tasered her stomach.
A pregnant Leslie Donaldson says she was trying to help break up a fight between neighborhood kids. That's when the sheriff's deputy showed up. He tazed one of the boys fighting then said he had to taser Donaldson.
quote:GAINESVILLE, Fla. - Video of police Tasering a persistent questioner of Sen. John Kerry became an Internet and TV sensation Tuesday, generating fierce debate about free speech and the motives of the college student involved — a known prankster who often posts practical jokes online.
University of Florida President Bernie Machen said Monday's takedown, in which the student loudly yelled, "Don't Tase me, bro!" was "regretful." He asked for a state probe of campus police actions and placed two officers on leave.
The student in the middle of it all, 21-year-old Andrew Meyer, had no comment after he was released on his recognizance on various charges following a night in jail.
But details from his online writings and videos raised the question of whether his harangue during the forum was genuine or some kind of stunt.
.....
quote:Just before Monday's scuffle started, Meyer asked a woman to tape his exchange with Kerry. One officer said the woman was "there to film him" and that Meyer asked, "Are you taping this? Do you have this? You ready?" before beginning his question.
Another officer said the 22-year-old woman said she was in line to ask a question ahead of Meyer when she was asked to tape, but she did not know him.
Meyer refused to leave the microphone after his allotted time was up, police said. He had asked Kerry about impeaching President Bush, why he didn't challenge the 2004 election results and whether he and Bush were members of the secret society Skull and Bones at Yale University.
After Meyer repeatedly and loudly refused to walk away, two officers took him by the arms. Kerry can be heard saying, "That's all right, let me answer his question."
Audience members applauded, though it was difficult to tell whether it was for the officers' action or Kerry's remark. The audience for the most part sat quietly and watched the fracas.
Meyer struggled for several seconds as up to four officers tried to remove him from the room. He screamed for help and tried to break away from officers with his arms flailing, then was forced to the ground and ordered to stop resisting.
As Kerry told the audience he will answer the student's "very important question," Meyer yelled at the officers to release him, crying out, "Don't Tase me, bro," just before he was shocked. He was led from the room, screaming, "What did I do?"
An officer, however, said in the police report that Meyer's "demeanor completely changed once the cameras were not in sight" and that he was "laughing" and "lighthearted" on the way to jail.
-------------------- One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example. Posts: 2430 | From: CA | Registered: Jun 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Relentless.: “When the government fears the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny.”
posted
It is not an issue of Freedom of Speech. The issue is of him being disruptive.
Posts: 1178 | From: Mobile, AL | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
Disruptive? He asked a question of a man who was being paid to answer questions. Soooo... we have freedom of speech but only if it is not disruptive? The incarceration of this nation's population will not be forced... it will be demanded by flag waiving goons too blind to know their rights are long gone.
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posted
hey Andrew, China and N Korea have "disruptive" people too....
is this where we are headed?
we still gave them "most favored nation" status after that incident: maybe everybody really does want this?
The Tiananmen Square massacre of June 4, 1989, and the repressive policies and violations of human rights by the Chinese government that followed it, led to the imposition by the United States of some economic and other sanctions against China and to consideration of additional sanctions, among them the withdrawal of China's most-favored-nation (MFN), or nondiscriminatory, status in trade with the United States. After having been suspended in 1951, MFN status was restored to China in 1980
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
The bit that is getting me is the fact that all the news media is missing deliberately the point. The point isn't so much that the guy got tazered or that granny got smacked... It's why were the friggen cops involved in the first place. She had a brown lawn? You're f****** kidding me. Since when was this a punishable offense? The reason they arrested her was she refused to give her name? F*** them, it is not their duty nor is it their right to demand her or my name. This IS America, a nation where we don't fear government... Well, it used to be.
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posted
It is assuredly true that now in this nation any and all government officials have far more rights than any one of the civilians... I mean citizens.
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posted
In February 2007, the U.S. Government released groundbreaking Federal guidance for non-pharmaceutical interventions for mitigating the impact of a pandemic. This community mitigation strategy is important because the best protection against pandemic influenza, a matched pandemic vaccine, is not likely to be available at the outset of a pandemic. Recent scientific modeling and historical reviews of the 1918 pandemic suggest that non-pharmaceutical interventions (such as school closures, social distancing, and cancellation of large public gatherings) could be very effective at slowing the spread of disease and mitigating the outbreak, but only if they are implemented early and maintained consistently across communities affected by a pandemic. These interventions, coupled with the use of antiviral medications, could dramatically reduce the number of people who become infected, potentially preventing illness and death in millions of Americans.
One of the most tangible benefits of planning and preparing at a Federal level has been the forging of close working relationships and unity of effort among Federal departments and agencies. It is important that we enhance connectivity and collaboration between all levels of government and all segments of society. Now is the time, before a pandemic emerges, to establish and test these relationships and partnerships.
Although the community mitigation strategy may significantly reduce illness and death, implementing this strategy will not be easy. To enhance individual and community adherence to these community mitigation measures, the Federal Government must continue to work with non-Federal stakeholders to address practical implementation considerations, including legal and feasibility concerns, at the State, local, and tribal levels and minimize any adverse consequences associated with implementation.
Preparing for a pandemic requires the leveraging of all instruments of national power, and coordinated action by all segments of government and society. Influenza viruses do not respect the distinctions of race, sex, age, profession or nationality, and are not constrained by geographic boundaries. The next pandemic is likely to come in waves, each lasting months, and pass through communities of all size across the nation and world.
from the whitehousedot gov....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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posted
There are laws concerning disorderly conduct: Definition: An act which unreasonably alarms or disturbs another and provokes as breach of the peace.
This is what he was doing. People cant just act out like that in the name of "Freedom of Speech". He could have asked his question in a way that did not cause such a disturbance. We have got to try and remain a civilized country. We have laws for a reason.
I know you will try and spin my whole statement to try and make your own point by distorting mine. If you cant understand the logic that I am trying to convey.. then I am sorry.
I believe in Freedom of Speech of course, but I really believe this guy was trying to cause a disturbance.
Posts: 1178 | From: Mobile, AL | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
What disturbance did he cause???? He asked three questions very articulately and was tackled by jack booted thugs. He didn't do the first thing that could ever be considered either disruptive or aggressive.
Posts: 2965 | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
I understand the anti-logic you are trying to spew... Do you? Freedom of speech doesn't have a nice guy only clause in it.
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