Hilarious and sad at the same time. You really got to listen to these people when asked questions. Reminds me of the people who went to Obama rallies in 2008 to interview Obama supporters.
Howard Stern contributors Sal and Richard travel to Harlem to interview Obama supporters and ask them why they are voting for Obama.
Stern and his crew ask denizens of Harlem various outrageous questions, including if they believe Obama will find and kill Osama bin Laden; if Romney is a Muslim; if Obama made the right choice by picking Paul Ryan as his running mate and if he did it because he is black.
One interviewee was under the impression that 2008 Republican nominee John McCain is also running this time.
"Just trust me, not one person knew that Osama bin Laden was dead," Stern said during the segment.
"Well, we're obviously dealing with a whole population that doesn't listen to the newscasts or read a newspaper," co-host Robin Quivers said.
Posted by raybond on :
Only a republican would make mock of a persons lack of education. All that clip told me is that we cannot afford a Romney/Ryan ln the white house with there plans for education.
A country that plans to be around for a while as a leader in the world better start thinking how they are going to raise standards for all and not making fun of other peoples ignorance.
Posted by CashCowMoo on :
"Only a republican would make mock of a persons lack of education."
Liar liar pants on fire.
"All that clip told me is that we cannot afford a Romney/Ryan ln the white house with there plans for education."
Because they were interviewing Romney voters right? Yeeahhh.
"A country that plans to be around for a while as a leader in the world better start thinking how they are going to raise standards for all and not making fun of other peoples ignorance."
Which is why you champion yourself on "tea baggers" all the time. You are a walking hypocrisy.
Posted by raybond on :
tea baggers are not human or Americans they don't count. They have education that they don,t use or apply.
Posted by CashCowMoo on :
quote:Originally posted by raybond: tea baggers are not human or Americans they don't count. They have education that they don,t use or apply.
Tea Partiers have paid a lot into the system. Your pals at occupy....not so much. Not human or Americans...what are you drinking tonight?
Posted by CashCowMoo on :
quote:Originally posted by raybond: tea baggers are not human or Americans they don't count. They have education that they don,t use or apply.
I think I will stick with Tea Partiers instead of this:
"a single employee was responsible for the forged signatures"
As opposed to a whole workforce on the other side.
Posted by glassman on :
wrong cash, not only was it not the 'whole workforce' it was ACORN who reported the forgeries as they were turned in. the law did not allow them to just scratch them off when they recognised the frauds either... they can't do that, there frauds must be reviewed by law before they can be scratched.
you just can't help swallowing the right wing tied flies can you little trout?
Posted by Pagan on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: wrong cash, not only was it not the 'whole workforce' it was ACORN who reported the forgeries as they were turned in. the law did not allow them to just scratch them off when they recognised the frauds either... they can't do that, there frauds must be reviewed by law before they can be scratched.
you just can't help swallowing the right wing tied flies can you little trout?
Did you mean "flies" or "lies"? Oh nevermind, one in the same I guess. Posted by glassman on :
you got it!
Posted by CashCowMoo on :
Hey you guys have support from another great world leader who likes Obama...Chavez!
yeah and Putin would vote for romney...
Posted by Pagan on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: yeah and Putin would vote for romney...
And Cowpoop is brain damaged! It's a friggin trifecta! Posted by CashCowMoo on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: yeah and Putin would vote for romney...
Of course, he loves a good match. Its like chess to him. Russians and chess matches...
Obama is too easy for him.
Posted by glassman on :
LOL cash... is this a competition to see who be sillier?
since when do we decide who to vote for based on what furrenners want? that was my only point to you...
Romney could have gotten elected if the GOP allowed him to be himslef. they won't. it the extreme base of your party that is self-destructing. Obama has been invading other coutnries at will based on his version of "chess" and executing our enemies with drones ans spec4's. I kinda like that version of chess. it's cheaper and it's surigcal, and no mor eof my nephews are in harms way right now, i alos think we can win this way. Afghanistan? nobody has ever ever been able to take over Afghnaistan and nobody ever will. we knew that going in. that's why it's been done the way it's been done. If Bush hadn't taken US into Iraq? we could have been done there 4 years ago with better results than we will get now.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
Sorry Glassman but i disagree there, these presidents keep getting our troops in harms way and Obama is no exception.
Bush got us into Iraq which at the time many supported, but as usual with other presidents they just never seem to get enough war.
Obama had a chance to get us out much quicker, then when he got most out he took another front... Afghanistan
Now we play with drones etc. till we take the next step which will put many young kids in harms way again.
We also never know how many special teams are in and out of these countries following up on the drones etc. until these teams do something that our government wants us to hear about, or they die.
=
Posted by glassman on :
i am not anti-war Iwishihad. The world is a messy place. Afghanistan (despite allt he 9-1 truther claims) is where 9-11 was planned form...
we are at war but not wiht an army or even a country, we are at war with a set beleifs that cannot be stamped out. i don't like it, but then a surgeon doesn't like to cut off a leg that they can't save either...
we will mostly always be involved in stuff like this, it sux, but it is what it is... i tend to be a positive thinker, but not an idealist.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
Anti war and enjoying power of controling our military and trying to control others at the risk of our young, are two different things.
The two things that many feel have gotten us into wars in the past are politics and religion, i'll throw in the third, oil.
I am not Anti war, but am anti war mongars at the risk of our young.
The middle east is all about oil and religion.
I am not going to make any excuses for this president or any other president just because it's an election year.
This board has had many dicussions over the years about different wars including Iraq and Afghanistan, seems like we hit it on the button many times, when elections were left out of it.
Of course this might be what i read into it, most here know my feelings about wasteing our young in war unless there is a real need to go to war.
When politicians have more of their kids and grandkids involved in infantry during a war, then we will know they really believe in the war.
-
Posted by glassman on :
this is why we went all-volunteer. I beleive most of us who have been here a long time are vets, i have much family active and even lifer-retired... mosto fmy best freinds have been active duty and retired military. i am against wastin lives a smuch as anybody, but we had to repsond to 9-11. the way we did it was frigged all to hell inabucket IMO...
i don't "like" drones either. they do save lives and they put th ereal burden of decison on the people paid th most to do it. instead of a 20 yr old with an itchy trigger finger and visions of ribbons? a group of pros sit in room soemwehre and make th ehard decisions..
spec ops? you have to be serious gungho to get into that frat. i applied, failed th e swim test cuz i wasn't allowed to use the basic free-style swim, it took me two minutes too long using back stroke and side stroke- i wasn't ready for that, i was not much into swimming-. the rest was actually easy after years of judo and wrestling... had i been able to live in say Fla or sanidego for a a few months to retake the test, i could have passed... than th ehard works starts.. they flunk out mor ethan half intentiiioanlly. i have no idea if i could have made it thru BUDS. but i have known alotof people who have... it's choice that you have to make and be committed to for a a very long time to become specops.... these guys ar emore committed than nay pro football player or hockey player to be "tough" and live th elife... no, you do not hrow them away, but they chose to be used and used hard.
BTW? i prolly woulda been tossed on the psych profiling anyway- i tended to interpret orders too broadly, and i don't play wih others very well Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
Drones are fine as long as they keep them away from me, i don't want to see them flying around the beach area.
We will still need our troops in many of these places if they decide to engage much, because as usual we will have to sort out the civilians and we know how that works from all the recent wars.
-
Posted by glassman on :
drones will most likely become "epidemic" i'm sorry to say.... however, you also have to realise that they have serious limitations that are not hard to use countermeasure against.
i assume the military takes great pains to protect aginst the simpler countermeasures, but when they proliferate and are dirt cheap (happening as we speak) the countermeasures will become pretty easy.... cell phone operated drones? already available tot eh conumer for 300$
as to countermeasures? a simple laser pointer can hurt most of the optics... not many people want to talk about that tho, and i'm not going to pass on the specifics... anything that "messes" with your digital camera in your phone will blind them, you can expirement but remember that you may destroy your own camera... then there's the comm systems... that's alitle mor ecomplicated, but still not beyond most peoples abiltiy with spare parts form household stuff and a little research...
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
That's the big point, anything has a counter measure, but as time goes on they get more sophisticated.
Phones, computor etc. become harder and harder to jam, except for sometimes the simple things like power outage, storms etc.
Me and my friends messed with a lot of electronics as teenagers, before the cell phone etc. era. got to the point where we were board with it.
To bad in sense, because we were in a position to get involved in the coming era of electronics, but we had no interest, almost burnt out completely.
I did use the basic parts of electronics in some of the areas i worked later in life, building and working on equiptment etc. but still have very little interest in it, not even sure i remember much anymore and don't even care
=
=
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
What's funny about these electronic devices is that the companies that build them get the best minds in the world to work on their security systems, making them almost unbreachable, then a 15 year old plays around and breaks in.
The problem is the 15 year old just sees it as a little obstacle and doesn't respect the brillant minds that said no one can breach it.
=
Posted by CashCowMoo on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: drones will most likely become "epidemic" i'm sorry to say.... however, you also have to realise that they have serious limitations that are not hard to use countermeasure against.
i assume the military takes great pains to protect aginst the simpler countermeasures, but when they proliferate and are dirt cheap (happening as we speak) the countermeasures will become pretty easy.... cell phone operated drones? already available tot eh conumer for 300$
as to countermeasures? a simple laser pointer can hurt most of the optics... not many people want to talk about that tho, and i'm not going to pass on the specifics... anything that "messes" with your digital camera in your phone will blind them, you can expirement but remember that you may destroy your own camera... then there's the comm systems... that's alitle mor ecomplicated, but still not beyond most peoples abiltiy with spare parts form household stuff and a little research...
Countermeasures will eventually lead to countermeasures to the countermeasures. These are relatively crude devices that cost $15 and can disable something that costs $250,000. That is just the cost of the equipment that fails, and not the cost of the lives lost due to the fact, or the costs to treat the disabled for life.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
I still say drones will bring us into war with our troops being involved, there just going to be the presidents way of jusifying our troops being inserted.
I do not like the idea of drones. As someone who has never served in the military and doesn't have children to worry about serving in the military, I will remain "mostly" silent about their military application. I understand that they save the lives of soldiers and pilots in combat and perhaps that outweighs some of my concerns. But something inside of me (that I can't put my finger on) views it as "dirty pool."
Perhaps it is my ignorance in matters of combat, but something in me thinks there are certain things that should be done in person out of respect for ones adversary. If roles were reversed and say, Russia, was using an impersonal technology in order to stike at targets here....it would piss us all off to no end. I realize that my logic is flawed....by my logic jets, bullets, hell even knives should have never been used because essentially if one is a tool then they all are. Still it seems like the line should be drawn somewhere. If your gonna play the game everyone involved should have some skin it. Thats just my view about drones in combat and like I said...its from someone that has only seen the Middle East on the NEWS.
Now domestically, I have a huge, huge issue with them being used. So much so, that I am perfectly willing to destroy one....even knowing that I would probably go to jail for it.
There is an oft quoted line...."those that would sacrifice liberty for security deserve neither"... I hear people reference that quote all the time and I wonder if they know what the hell it means because the same people will defend the patriot act or NDAA.
I think it may have been Glassman that posted somewhere on this board about catching wild hogs.....I don't remember what the topic was or exactly what he was using it to illustrate but government intrusion in name of our general security reminds me of that illustration.....we are fenced in on 3 sides already and we are back at the feed pile again......
Posted by glassman on :
i get your drift rounder. the problem is? we are facing people who have proven themselves willing to strap suicide bombs to their children to send among us.
it is much more honest to go at it eye to eye with swords. but then you have the issue of who has better steel... and so and so on ....
we are all just animals after all, when it comes down to surviving....
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
I don't think serving in the military makes any difference on your opinions on drones Rounder 1.
Drones used here would just be another way of taking more and more of our freedoms away.
The more secure we need to be the less freedoms we have, i would say its a choice we have to make, but in reality i think other people will make it for us and infer we made the choice.
-
Posted by rounder1 on :
Honestly, I think that we have all been duped...I don't know if it is by design or series of unfortunate events but.....I have come to believe that our economy, while terrible and terribly important, is not the greatest issue of the day. Economies will rally and crash...granted, huge swings can be almost unbearable. However, there is something intangible in the psyche of most every American ,up till very recently, that would allow us to cope, adapt, and rebound......a dogged perseverence and lust for adversity....if only for the opportunity to prove we could do it.
Our willingness to let Government shield us from challenges to an ever greater extent is/has robbing/robbed us of that most unique of American qualities. It is precisely the quality that took this country from wilderness to world power in 3-4 generations....it is the quality in us that gave pause to foreign powers whose ambitions would have brought them to our shore.
And while everyone is out looking for jobs....policy and legislation is passed and implemented....freedom is surrendered....the American spirit is forfeit.
I have seen it. "Piss and Vinegar" is almost nonexistent in todays teens....my generation is not much better, but the one that kills me is my father's generation because I am at the age where I can compare the mentality of my Granddad's generation to my father's when they were the same age....like looking at the two side by side at the same point in their lives. If you can do that and be honest, that should tell you the story. It is that generation that bothers me the most not because they are worse than any other but because it is the one in which the erosion of principle is most evident to my eyes.
Could you imagine if J Edgar Hoover had this much free rein to intrude on citizens???....He probably would have set himself up as the first King of the U.S.
And to me that is a large part of the point....whether by design or by unfortunate circumstance...we are setting ourselves up for tyrannical rule...and most people can't surrender their liberty fast enough in order to attain that phantom perception that is security.
No matter who is elected...I believe that in about 25 years or so scholars will point back to this election and determine that with Ron Paul's defeat liberty was surrendered. Not because he was the second coming Washington or Lincoln but because he saw and wanted to address the greater problem.....but the economy was bad.....go figure.
Got a little "rambly" on that one....
Posted by glassman on :
Could you imagine if J Edgar Hoover had this much free rein to intrude on citizens???
actually, he had "this much" and more. he did as he pleased, and he ruled as much as chose to. i think "they" have more "tech" to do the job than they did before, but the same tech makes it harder for them to hide too...
the Newspaper Owners were much more powerful 50 years ago than they are today, the cable news folks have tried to fill that niche, but the internet makes it all a little more open, 'democratic" and less secret...
layers keep being added to the govt to balance out the powwer garnered as each agency get more powerful..
the FBI had one of the hijackers and faile to act onit... now we have DHS to oversee them and everybody else?
this why the Feds keep growing and getting more and more out of whack becuase "they" don't FIX problems, they try to balance them out....
this started with the Civil War.."states Rights" were proven to be "not balanced"-
Posted by rounder1 on :
this started with the Civil War.."states Rights" were proven to be "not balanced"-
If you care to...expound on that...not disagreeing...just not sure that I followed what you mean. Without knowing exactly where you were going with that I am inclined to ask "why should they be balanced?" But I probably took that wrong...or I'm taking the statement as referring to something other than what you intended...
Posted by glassman on :
the civil war is where the states lost their rights to independent governance, like it or not...
seems to me that people don't want to acknowledge that...
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
I am not really sure what you mean by "Piss And Vinegar".
Can the majority of people rally without a new wave of jobs, that's the big question and the important one?
-
Posted by rounder1 on :
Okay, Glass, I follow you now and I agree. That is very true. I like to think that Lincoln was a man that did what was necessary to preserve the Union....and had he lived, would have taken steps to restore much of the states' sovreignty...but he was killed before he could address that. That, to me, is the worst part about his assissination.
HEHE....IWISH, I thought that was a more universally understood term.....I suppose its more local than I realized. Basically, it is a redneck way of saying that someone has "gumption," "backbone," "tenacity".....that sort of thing.
Most of the time it is considered a "backhand" compliment to be full of "Piss and Vinegar".... it implies that one can take care of oneself.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
I thought that might be the case but i wanted to clarify it before i made a comment.
I tend to see it a little differently, many of the young people that i am around have all those qualities and then some, sometimes to much so.
Ive done a lot of coaching over the last 30+years and have not seen a lack of any of those traits in most of our young.
Some might tend to get discouraged as they get older because of the lack of good jobs. Not being able to move in the right direction and the high cost of doing pretty much of anything is really discouraging.
As far as the older people, well if they have to many of those tendencies they would have to nap all day.
-
Posted by glassman on :
but rounder, if you "allow" the states to run things their own way? you'll end up with the same corruption closer to home.
i live in MS and quite frankly, without Federal help this place was poverty stricken, and with Federal help it's still poveryt stricken except for one difference. people don't even grow their own food anymore.
that was not the intent of the fed govt intervention here, it was the intent of the "corporate class"
there's a fairly rational "conspiracy theory" that says basically, corporate America is looking to enslave the masses by controlling every facet of the economy.
i tend to enjoy conspiracy theories as entertainment, but this one is happening even if it is not a real conpsiracy-
basically it works like this.
people in the USA tended to be fairly self-sufficient until WW2. locally i mean. you didn't have real efficient refrigeration and trucking to distribute food far and wide.
after WW2? this became more and more available.
i have raised rabbits for food and chickens for food as hobbies--- people used to always have a few rabbits a few chickens and a couple cows and pigs... even in town they did this. they raised vegetables all the time.... this pretty much illegal now ain't it? i happen to live in one single block between two towns where i can have chickens.. one block north? illegal, one block south? illegal... not on this block.. funny huh?
this all became illegal as the suprmarkets and the cereal companies became large corporate entities. it's seen as "progress"....
they measure how well our economy is doing by the "growth" which is actually just the net amount of cash flowing thru the companies...
poor people today are depndant on Govt not because the Govt wanted them to be dependant but because the corporate interests want them in the economy not outside it, and feeding themselves...
it's not "government" doing it.. that's the redd herring in all this and it's the big friggin lie...
look a Monsanto. they practivcally own the whole earhts seed productivity now... and they have not "played well' to get to that point.. in fact, i have become aware of some very ditrubing chit they've done to ge thtere and there is noone to stop them.... they will own 99% of the wolrd seed market for all the worng reasons if things keep going the way they are going...
"free marketism" is truly uncivilised. we all know that winning in the business world has almost nothing to do with market choice by consumers. we pretend that is going on, but it ain't.....
Posted by rounder1 on :
Hey Guys, I love this discussion but my internet time is very limited...Glass, I owe you a much better response to your last post and I will deliver one.
In the mean time...
I agree with much of your post. Monsanto is a prime example. I concede that many woes are the result of corperate greed. But consider this...the Government is their enforcer....their "pimp hand" if you will. To defend the Government is to defend the hand that corperations would slap you with....."thank you, sir. May I have another?"
It is my opinion that we should make that hand as week as prudently possible....and therein is lies freedom....not freedom without consequence....there is that damn "security" thing again....
As for state vs. federal....Government should be held as close to the people it governs as possible....if for no other reason than we won't have as far to travel to burn some chit to the ground....hehe. Seriously, its a great discussion that I want to continue, but I am offline till tomorrow....been fun though!
Posted by glassman on :
this is just the tip of th eiceberg too; there's even more creepiness wwhen you get itno the development side of what they are up to, the sad part is that there really isn't anyone right now that can catch up with them or touch them. they will most likely own the whole non-organic US seed market at some point int he near future
I. The Farmers Sue Monsanto
Those criticisms are unlikely to go away, particularly in the wake of a controversial decision by The U.S. District Court for the Southern District of New York, a federal court. Judge Naomi Reice Buchwald moved this week to throw out a potential class action lawsuit [1][2][3], sought by small independent farmers.
In the case the farmers, led by lead plaintiff Bryce Stephens, sought relief against Monsanto in the form a prohibition on Monsanto from bringing suit against organic farmers regarding seed contamination, given the really real possibility of cross-pollination via the wind and animals.
Mr. Stephens, who received degrees from Wichita State University (Kans.) and Washburn University (Kans.), turned away from a potentially lucrative career in law to instead run an 1,000 acre family farm that has been organic since 1994. But Mr. Stephens states that he was unable to grow organic soybeans -- a high demand crop -- for two reason both tracing to Monsanto's transgenic crops.
First, he says that his neighbors grew the transgenic strain. When other farmers in the area took their soybeans to be genetically tested, they test positive for Monsanto's patented genes -- the Monsanto crop had spread its germ into their fields. As bulk buyers who supply such mega-health food chains such as Whole Food Market, Inc. (WFM) test for transgenic genetics, this would have made his crop essentially worthless. It is estimated that between 0.5 and 2 percent of "organic" corn is really genetically modified.
II. But Were the Tables Really Turned?
However, things were killed before they even took off. The judge apparently took issue with the fact that none of the farmers had been personally threatened by Monsanto, and the fact that Monsanto only brought a small number of patent infringement suits last year.
The company successfully argued that the suit was pointless as its policy was not sue if "trace" amounts of patented seed were found on an organic farmer's land.
Wrote the judge, "[the allegations] are unsubstantiated ... given that not one single plaintiff claims to have been so threatened." She also complained that the farmers had "overstate[d] the magnitude of [Monsanto's] patent enforcement", which documents indicated entailed 13 cases last year, which she opined "is hardly significant when compared to the number of farms in the United States, approximately two million."
Of course, that ruling does overlook the fact there are only 13,000 organic farmers in the U.S., out of those 2 million [source].
Dan Ravicher, executive director of the Public Patent Foundation and lead lawyer for the plaintiffs said the ruling will allow Monsanto to continue "patent bullying" and called it "gravely disappointing."
so monsanto can sue you for trying to sell your own seed cuz their pollen drifted onto your plot? friggin outrageous huh? is that good for business?
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by rounder1: Hey Guys, I love this discussion but my internet time is very limited...Glass, I owe you a much better response to your last post and I will deliver one.
In the mean time...
I agree with much of your post. Monsanto is a prime example. I concede that many woes are the result of corperate greed. But consider this...the Government is their enforcer....their "pimp hand" if you will. To defend the Government is to defend the hand that corperations would slap you with....."thank you, sir. May I have another?"
It is my opinion that we should make that hand as week as prudently possible....and therein is lies freedom....not freedom without consequence....there is that damn "security" thing again....
As for state vs. federal....Government should be held as close to the people it governs as possible....if for no other reason than we won't have as far to travel to burn some chit to the ground....hehe. Seriously, its a great discussion that I want to continue, but I am offline till tomorrow....been fun though!
i'll go ahead and leave this up for tomorrow;
i see the govt as the last resort instead of the 'fisrt resort" as so many others do.
if 'we the people" don't actively tell the Govt what is acceptable and what is not by voting? they will continue to this slapping chit.
getting rid of govt brings back the old insurance thugs... you see that in movies? it was very real.. the Mob collected insurance payments for decades... now they cannot... the Govt did this...
the solution is to make the Govt more accountable to the people instead of vice versa....
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
![[Wall Bang]](graemlins/wallbang.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)