posted
Stock... I've asked and so are other folks. Please don't assume folks aren't trying to get to the bottom of some unanswered questions. There are folks with very large positions on this company.
Pinks get away with not answering questions because they are not regulated properly, not because the questions aren't being asked.
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Bearclaw: Stock... I've asked and so are other folks. Please don't assume folks aren't trying to get to the bottom of some unanswered questions. There are folks with very large positions on this company.
Pinks get away with not answering questions because they are not regulated properly, not because the questions aren't being asked.
I appreciate your efforts and those of others. Maybe I shouldn't read these boards anymore because it may not be fully representative of the investor class(though it may just be).
I'm just saying looking at a barometer of sentiment from the people with a direct relationship with the principals, too many are making excuses for these guys. When the people who have talked directly to JT and BH tell them they will file complaints and hire lawyers if they don't get immediate answers things will change. If they continue to carry their water we will see more sell programs and lies until they drop the bomb.
As for the lack of regulation, even exchange listed companies get away with transgressions when investors don't do their part. Lots of questionable and illegal activity occured during the late 90's without being reported or punished because investors did nothing. When stocks go up, people forgive dishonest behavior. The regs have limited resources and rely on investors to report abuses. Many securities laws are written to give investors avenues for corrective action. The regulators don't automatically find trangressions or act on them.
Even pinks must follow the rules. A company can not aggressively market their stock for distribution using false statements. A good securities lawyer can take action against them. Unfortunately, these guys cost money and most pink investors lose less than the cost of the lawyer. When enough money is involved you can get a lawyer on contingency or for a class action. There is rarely enough money involved in pinks for this to happen and these companies take advantage of that knowledge.
Bottom line is every investor who feels they have been lied to needs to contact the SEC and file a complaint. If enough of us do this they will investigate and the company may give us some answers.
Once again, I'm not saying everyone is letting this happen and I do appreciate that you're taking the initiative to get to the bottom of this. I will keep encouraging more people to do as you and I are since it will take a great number of complaints to get results.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Bearclaw: I understood your point
Sorry, I'm a bit too intense today w/the holidays, this stock and now VFIN back.
VFIN just stepped down again on the close. If they show up after the first hour tomorrow(they typically fade opening strength) then it looks like we've got more distribution to go. Not sure how much this stock can absorb w/o a stream of BS PRs to bring in new blood.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
I have the same concerns...your not too intense...I understand pezzed off...A family trait...Irish Catholic...No problem Stock...
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
I just filled a complaint with the SEC today and a few of my friends who are also involved in this stock. If anyone is having a hard time finding out how to do your share then here you go. Like stock said, if everyone doesn't do anything then the sec will do nothing and we will never get answers. And i want some answers. www.sec.gov/complaint/cf942sec9570.htm
-------------------- Do your own DD Posts: 27 | From: NY | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
Good work jibber and thanks for providing the link. (why didn't I think of that?)
With a concerted effort we may get the full story before they do more damage. We owe it to ourselves to attain the opportunity to adjust our positions based on full knowledge of the facts, before they announce a restructure. That's not too much to ask in a free market in the information age.
Faced with the choice of playing the victim or being the victor, being the victor is much more satisfying.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
Rumor has it(from rrm on the RB board) that JT and BH are at Big Apple. Given that VFIN showed up today they may be planning a PR campaign to sell some more shares.
Would not be surprised to see a series of bullish sounding PRs over the next couple days if VFIN is back tomorrow.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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-------------------- Current penny stocks owned: PLNI, VWKM, AMHD. And yet none of them are moving anywhere.... Posts: 401 | From: Iowa | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by state780: The PR should be: VFIN is back.
From the movie Poltergeist:
"Theeey're Baaack"
Eddie Murphy in Trading Places(will this be next?):
"Hey, we're losing all our money and Christmas is coming. "I won't be able to buy my son the GI Joe with the Kung Fu grip. "And my wife won't make love to me cos I ain't got no money." They're panicking, screaming, "Sell, sell." They don't want to lose all their money. They are panicking right now. I can feel it. Look at them. He's right, Mortimer, my God, look at it. I'd wait till you get to *** then buy. You'll have cleared out all the suckers by then.
Great Flick!
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
Don't give a chit what Turek says anymore, or what this company does anymore. On to greener pastures.
Posts: 55 | Registered: May 2005
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In February, the SEC charged Donald Oehmke, Bryan Kos and five partners with putting out false press releases, faxes, e-mails, and webcasts and websites to promote two Pink Sheets-listed penny stocks. Maybe Turek and Bill can join them. Thanks to PLNI i have been doing alot more reading about the pinks and other stocks. Found an interesting point made here.
The SEC usually gets involved only if scamsters get so greedy that they issue additional shares rather than just pumping and dumping existing shares, says Gidon Caine, securities lawyer at Dechert LLP. Isn't this what turek just did last month???
-------------------- Do your own DD Posts: 27 | From: NY | Registered: Nov 2005
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The SEC usually gets involved only if scamsters get so greedy that they issue additional shares rather than just pumping and dumping existing shares, says Gidon Caine, securities lawyer at Dechert LLP. Isn't this what turek just did last month???
Not only last month, looks like yesterday and today as well. VFIN is back and selling in the tens of millions so far. VFIN=PLNI whether directly or through a third party. Its dilution.
It takes some nerve to go back to the scene of the crime after you've been identified and do it again. They must be under some serious time and financing pressures.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
We are having the same problem with VFIN on FCDH.
Many have filed SEC complaints against them today.
GLTA!!!
-------------------- All IMHO. Do not rely upon anything I post to base your financial decisions upon. Posts: 970 | From: Montana | Registered: Jul 2005
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vFinance Inc. 3010 North Military Trail Suite 300 Boca Raton, FL 33431 Phone: 561-981-1000 Fax: 561-981-3969 Web Site: http://www.vfinance.com
GLTA!!!!!
-------------------- All IMHO. Do not rely upon anything I post to base your financial decisions upon. Posts: 970 | From: Montana | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted December 09, 2005 17:48 -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I expect it to recurr without a doubt, it's a relatively easy way for the company to get $ for ANY purpose they choose. Especially a nonreporting pink sheet. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The "it" I referred to was dilution. They do it a couple of times and it becomes too easy to pass up. Selling shares is a lot easier than working for money. Being a pink they don't have to tell anyone anything. It looks like they knew what they were going to do with that unreported, unpublished, increase of A/S to 5B.
[ December 14, 2005, 18:33: Message edited by: will ]
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Originally posted by rasica: We are having the same problem with VFIN on FCDH.
Many have filed SEC complaints against them today.
GLTA!!!
Here VFIN is just the MM handling the order for the company. I talked to them a couple months ago and they were totally open with me. The order comes from another source(not for their acct) and feeds through a computer to their desk where they work the order. FYI, they are a wholesaler only and do not handle any retail biz.
I'm not familiar with FCDH, but be careful you're not just shooting the messanger. The 1 minute I spent googling the co. president, Sandy Winick, produced an old link referencing HEE corp where he was CEO (they claim a cure for type 2 diabetes. Google "Sandy Winick" and "fraud", go to Forteon.be link and hit 'cached'). The same week he resigned the company complained they were investigating voluminous short sales hurting their stock. In pinks it seems the same people keep showing up in new companies with the same old complaint that short sellers are the reason they fail. Usually its a smoke screen for their own questionable management and activities. Please don't take my one minute of DD for gospel, but as a general rule its a red flag.
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
FCDH has BILLIONS outstanding. They are trying to catch QBID and CMKX. Someone at the company has to sign and issue those shares, the MM just brings them to market. It's a printing press.
-------------------- A million seconds is 13 days. A billion seconds is 31 years. Posts: 4893 | From: Burbank IL USA | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
Stock, Which phone number for VFIN did you call? I have four offices listed. I would like to call the same one you did and hear it straight from the horse. I called a couple of months ago as well and they said nothing of what you are reporting. Not doubting you, just would like to confirm your findings. TIA GLTY
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :) Posts: 1161 | From: NC | Registered: Mar 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Chopper: Stock, Which phone number for VFIN did you call? I have four offices listed. I would like to call the same one you did and hear it straight from the horse. I called a couple of months ago as well and they said nothing of what you are reporting. Not doubting you, just would like to confirm your findings. TIA GLTY
Their OTCBB/PINK SHEETS desk: 800-487-0577
Called them in early Nov.(7th?) I asked for info on the share structure and he gave me what they had (same as pinksheets). I expected him to put up a wall as a matter of policy, but he was very open and helpful. He said 99.9% of the time when people blame the MMs for naked shorting its the company diluting stock.
I told him I was surprised he didn't put up a wall. Once he realized I knew the business he figured he could discuss it with me. They get calls from less sophisticated investors who have lost lots of money in poor companies. These people come with an agenda accusing the MMs for all their woes. I can understand if they did not want to put a lot of effort into those phone calls.
When I was making markets(in options) people would occassionally call down blaming the MMs for their losses. Even a stock specialist once accused me of picking him off with inside information and would not fill my orders. Paranoia knows no bounds. Its part and parcel of trading. I've had my share of paranoid moments as well.
If and when you call just tell them you're an investor and would like share structure info. They are suppossed to keep this for all companies in which they make markets, but its usually just pinksheet info. You can say you called them since they were the most active MM recently. Ask where the orders they get come from. If you don't come with an agenda they should tell you how they handle the orders. At the end you may want to ask what they think of the perception that MMs are behind naked shorting of viable companies.
When I called Rodney recently, I asked him for information just telling him I was an investor. He then proceeded to feed me the same lies as Matt did. I let him give me all sorts of information in the form he desired. He confirmed my suspicion they were intentionally giving out the false information the company wanted them to, despite their knowledge of the truth. There is no way I could have gotten that information if they knew I was POd when I started asking questions. Its all in the approach.
BTW, if they said nothing of what I was reporting when you called, what exactly did they tell you?
-------------------- Logic can protect you from the hazards of faith, hope and trust. Posts: 382 | From: California | Registered: May 2005
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posted
"He said 99.9% of the time when people blame the MMs for naked shorting its the company diluting stock." Put the blame where it belongs...on the company. Remember, MM stands for Market Maker. Without them there would be no stock market. If the company is forthcoming, there is no reason to call a market maker for info. This is why 99.9% of pennies suck. They all claim naked short selling, and it simply isnt the case.
-------------------- If I give you bad information, please feel free to sue me. I have nothing left anyway. Ed Posts: 1772 | From: Oxford, PA, USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Good Afternoon Everyone... Longs and Shorts alike.
This trading pattern we are in is synonymous with the pink market. No new PR or industry related news, the flippers, swingers or day traders have long left, the weak get tired, sell and leave as their threshold of pain is reached. The short interest mm’s play the game to drive the stock price down looking for new weak hands to accumulate more shares on the way down. Should Jim ad more shares into the float for more equipment this could drive the price down as well along with the shorters taking advantage of that prime opportunity untill significant material events are announced.
As much as I would love to hear that someone has the inside scoop with great predictions of PR's forth coming, the fact is no one knows when they will be released or what will be in them. Jim will not let that cat out of the bag for any stock holder and violate SEC rules. PERIOD! IMO as stated before material events should flow in this next 30 day time period using today as a reference point.
So what exactly is the point to this bash fest being conducted in the last several weeks? Most is seasoned with half truths or down right lack of any DD on the company. Any little negative is multiplied exponentially into the doom and gloom scenerio with the CEO running off with diluted cash coffers stuffed with stockholders money to Cancun. I should only guess that some feel that they may be the New breed of brilliant thinkers or seasoned stock gurus. Maybe they have the god syndrome thinking they should save all the unsuspecting from imminent DOOOM. Or maybe a group of opportunists thinking they will buy up the weak shares on technical lows… But more likely a group of minimum wage monkeys that are employed by certain MM’s to shake the market Tree as hard as they can so they can scoop up any shares prior to an impending run , whether it be a technical or a true PR run on the horizon. This is observed as fact in the Exact Same multiple postings using multiple aliases on EVERY board on the internet!
I really try not to pump or bash any stock. I happen to like this company but only after exhaustive DD on my part. I have called Every principle party related to this company going back years. IMO the SILENT period is due to the total SOX audit package and has been a stopping point for some very important reasons. The sudden and opportune timing of 2 acquisitions made by Plasticon in the early stages of their audit. These 2 companies had to have due diligence performed prior to purchase and once that had been done and all claims verified by independant Labs, technical sources, vendors, lean holders, ect.. and Plasticon then an SEC SOX Audit was ordered to seal the deal on EACH company. My instincts and DD tell me that they are complete and the purchases are complete. I further believe that the Overall SOX Auidt for Plasticon has been submitted to the SEC and the tweeking period is underway between the SEC and Plasticon. Upon Audit approval by the SEC the following uplisting forms will be in play and left for the SEC to give the Official OKIE DOKIE for Uplisting.
On the brighter side as well.... IMO we will also see more contracts gearing up for the spring construction season. These orders always come months in advance for scheduling and availability. Do your own due but in my opinion we are in a great opportunity. Just stinks that the market forces have been in play to the downside.
Peace on the boards Good Luck to All.
-------------------- It will run when you least expect it. :) Posts: 1161 | From: NC | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
Nice post Chopper...Oh...If anyone believes there's not naked shorting in pennies they're due for a labodomy...They just are not paying attention...
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
IMHO that's a lot of wishful thinking, Chop. Regardless of what VFIN is up to, this is a rational selloff, based on issues like this:
The sudden and opportune timing of 2 acquisitions made by Plasticon in the early stages of their audit.
Which still have not been confirmed, and one of which was misleadingly advertised as "completed" in a PR that went on to explain it has not been completed.
I would be delighted if this turns around and has a happy ending. But the problem is that the negatives are based on available evidence (lots of broken promises on the audit, still unexplained increases in float, o/s and a/s, missing webcasts, you know the list) and all the positives are based on theories (or wishes), including supposed manipulation by paid bashers.
But again, I'd be delighted if I'm proven wrong.
Posts: 610 | From: DC Metro area | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
State... Your absolutely right! The negatives are based on YOUR available evidence stated over and over and over again... Consider stop using your broken 78 rpm record and fork up the cash for a new IPOD...
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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quote:Originally posted by Bearclaw: State... Your absolutely right! The negatives are based on YOUR available evidence stated over and over and over again... Consider stop using your broken 78 rpm record and fork up the cash for a new IPOD...
Sorry, Bearclaw, did an allstocks moderator change the rules? I missed the memo where I'm supposed to respectfully bow before posts that express opinions I disagree with. Everything Chop says has been expressed before too.
I'll check my messages, must have missed the new directive.
Posts: 610 | From: DC Metro area | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
State... No the rules haven't changed. It's just obvious that some folks don't read the opinions they disagree with...They just look for ways to poke holes in it...I'd say the truth lies somewhere in between... I just get sick of reading the same opinions over and over...I'm looking for something new...and...I expect the new information is close at hand...
Posts: 2660 | From: Pennyland USA | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
Very cool. One of these days I'm going to find one of those really ancient machines that plays Edison Cylinders, if you've ever heard of those--precursors to the 78s. I have ten of those cylinders sitting on my bookcase--got them at an antique store some years ago.
Posts: 610 | From: DC Metro area | Registered: Jun 2005
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posted
I have an antique wind-up Victrola, and a large supple of needles....and about 4 boxes of 78s, so you guys dont feel old....LOL
-------------------- If I give you bad information, please feel free to sue me. I have nothing left anyway. Ed Posts: 1772 | From: Oxford, PA, USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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