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Author Topic: another fast food worker strike coming 05/15
raybond
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Thousands of fast food workers will go on strike in 150 cities on May 15, according to Salon’s Josh Eidelson.

That will include some cities that haven’t been home to fast food strikes before, such as Philadelphia, Miami, Orlando, and Sacramento. Organizers also expect hundreds of workers to go on strike in some cities like Chicago, Detroit, Los Angeles, and New York City. The strikes will be the largest in the industry yet after they hit 100 cities in December and 50 in August last year.

The day will also mark the first spread of fast food labor unrest abroad, as it will include protests in 30 other countries on six continents, many of them targeting McDonald’s. Activists will hold a teach-in outside of the company’s head office in New Zealand and shut down a major location in Belgium during the lunch hour. Protests will crop up in cities from London to Bangkok and countries from India to Nigeria. Then Italian fast food workers in Milan, Rome, and Venice will go on strike the next day.

American fast food workers have been walking out in protest of low wages and poor working conditions since late 2012, when 200 went on strike in New York City in the first strike to ever hit the industry. The demands have remained constant: $15 an hour at minimum and the right to form a union. Since that initial action in New York City, the strikes have quickly spread across the country, starting in the northeast but moving to the midwest and south. Workers also recently filed seven class-action lawsuits against McDonald’s in March alleging a widespread practice of cheating them out of the pay that they are owed.

The sector has been booming since the recession, but the median wage is only $8.85. And that’s if they get their full pay. Wage theft of the sort alleged against McDonald’s is widespread in the industry, experienced by nearly 90 percent of workers. While some argue that the jobs are meant as a way for teenagers to earn extra money and gain work experience, workers between the ages of 25 and 54 hold the largest share of fast food jobs, and more than a quarter are supporting a child. Meanwhile, they are not the kind of jobs that give people a leg up toward advancement: while a third of the workforce ends up in managerial, professional, or supervisory jobs, less than 9 percent of fast food employees will make it to supervisor and just 2.2 percent are in managerial, professional, or technical roles.

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CashCowMoo
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I think we need to pay more attention to the unemployment issue rather than kicking and screaming over min wage. What does it matter what the min wage is when so many people dont even have a job?

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It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.

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buckstalker
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Really??? Is that a real question?

What are you, if you go to work 40 to 50 hours a week and make just enough to rent a roof over your head, eat enough food to survive, and buy or rent transportation to get you to your job?

You are a phucking SLAVE that's what you are...

For you to ask the question "what does it matter what the minimum wage is" says a lot about just how brainwashed you have become...

quote:
Originally posted by CashCowMoo:
I think we need to pay more attention to the unemployment issue rather than kicking and screaming over min wage. What does it matter what the min wage is when so many people dont even have a job?


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CashCowMoo
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quote:
Originally posted by buckstalker:
Really??? Is that a real question?

What are you, if you go to work 40 to 50 hours a week and make just enough to rent a roof over your head, eat enough food to survive, and buy or rent transportation to get you to your job?

You are a phucking SLAVE that's what you are...

For you to ask the question "what does it matter what the minimum wage is" says a lot about just how brainwashed you have become...

quote:
Originally posted by CashCowMoo:
I think we need to pay more attention to the unemployment issue rather than kicking and screaming over min wage. What does it matter what the min wage is when so many people dont even have a job?


The bigger picture is the value of our currency, and the unemployment. Good grief minimum wage could be $20 an hour, health care 100% free, and you would still be *****ing about it. Its always more more more. No buck, I am not the slave. Your mind is though.

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It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.

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raybond
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Cash you are a jerk

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NR
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Just keep printing money with nothing of real value to back it. That way, the fast food workers can have their $20/hr and everything will be just fine.

 -

http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/hyperinflation_weimar_germany.htm

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buckstalker
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NR...I don't follow your thinking here...they have been printing money forever and it sure as hell hasn't been going into the pockets of the working class...

How bout we stop paying CEO's, CFO's, COO's CPA's athletes, and movie stars (who all by the way contribute very little to society) millions of dollars, and start paying regular working class people a LIVING WAGE

Why does a carpenter make a third of what a mechanical engineer makes? Is the engineer smarter? Is the engineers work more important to society? Does the engineer work harder?

I have many friends that are engineers that will answer no to all three of the questions above, and not one of them can explain why they are paid so much...I also have many friends on the other side of the fence (working class) that don't understand why they are paid so little...

We are no longer a "free market society"...we are controlled and manipulated by the wealthy

quote:
Originally posted by NR:
Just keep printing money with nothing of real value to back it. That way, the fast food workers can have their $20/hr and everything will be just fine.

 -

http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/hyperinflation_weimar_germany.htm



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It's all in the timing...

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NR
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I thought it was pretty clear, but let me spell it out for you.

When you have a country that has no manufacturing base, has massive amounts of debt, and those who are "producing" what little is left go on strike, and the government prints massive amounts of money with nothing of real value backing it to cover increased debt and increased wages or to carry those who are producing nothing, (the unemployed), you get hyperinflation.

So go ahead you little hamburger flippers, with your demands for more and more wages for assembling the same steaming pile of meat and sauce between two buns you have already been assembling for years, and strike away. Shut the system down demanding your "living wage" of 15/hr until you get it, and see where you end up. It's just a shame that you are going to drag the rest of us who know better down with you. At least you can use your worthless dollars to heat up your burgers like the woman in the photo above when the shell game is finally up and it all goes to crap.

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by NR:
I thought it was pretty clear, but let me spell it out for you.

When you have a country that has no manufacturing base, has massive amounts of debt, and those who are "producing" what little is left go on strike, and the government prints massive amounts of money with nothing of real value backing it to cover increased debt and increased wages or to carry those who are producing nothing, (the unemployed), you get hyperinflation.

So go ahead you little hamburger flippers, with your demands for more and more wages for assembling the same steaming pile of meat and sauce between two buns you have already been assembling for years, and strike away. Shut the system down demanding your "living wage" of 15/hr until you get it, and see where you end up. It's just a shame that you are going to drag the rest of us who know better down with you. At least you can use your worthless dollars to heat up your burgers like the woman in the photo above when the shell game is finally up and it all goes to crap.

the S&P just set another record because there is too much money in the supply already...

also? i don't want to eat food prepared by unhealthy or unsanitary people.
unhappy people tend to be unsanitary "accidently on purpose".... [Eek!]

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NR
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I worked as a short order cook in a restaurant for 3 years back in the day, trust me I know all about "accidentally on purpose" when it comes to sanitation. The solution? Cook your own burger, or go to a restaurant with an open kitchen design.

P.S., All health inspection results for any restaurant are available for free on the appropriate state's "Health Services" website. Be warned though, you may never eat anywhere but home again after browsing the results from your favorite restaurants.

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One is never completely useless. One can always serve as a bad example.

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CashCowMoo
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
quote:
Originally posted by NR:
I thought it was pretty clear, but let me spell it out for you.

When you have a country that has no manufacturing base, has massive amounts of debt, and those who are "producing" what little is left go on strike, and the government prints massive amounts of money with nothing of real value backing it to cover increased debt and increased wages or to carry those who are producing nothing, (the unemployed), you get hyperinflation.

So go ahead you little hamburger flippers, with your demands for more and more wages for assembling the same steaming pile of meat and sauce between two buns you have already been assembling for years, and strike away. Shut the system down demanding your "living wage" of 15/hr until you get it, and see where you end up. It's just a shame that you are going to drag the rest of us who know better down with you. At least you can use your worthless dollars to heat up your burgers like the woman in the photo above when the shell game is finally up and it all goes to crap.

the S&P just set another record because there is too much money in the supply already...

also? i don't want to eat food prepared by unhealthy or unsanitary people.
unhappy people tend to be unsanitary "accidently on purpose".... [Eek!]

Although it does taste good, I have always believed real food does not come through a car window like that.

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It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.

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buckstalker
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Oh That clears things up LMAO

I see...so people that flip burgers are not as important or as valuable as you are...is that it?

I'll ask the question again...Why do we pay a CEO 600 times more than the average working class worker in this country?

BTW...the government printing money has NOTHING to do with wages

quote:
Originally posted by NR:
I thought it was pretty clear, but let me spell it out for you.

When you have a country that has no manufacturing base, has massive amounts of debt, and those who are "producing" what little is left go on strike, and the government prints massive amounts of money with nothing of real value backing it to cover increased debt and increased wages or to carry those who are producing nothing, (the unemployed), you get hyperinflation.

So go ahead you little hamburger flippers, with your demands for more and more wages for assembling the same steaming pile of meat and sauce between two buns you have already been assembling for years, and strike away. Shut the system down demanding your "living wage" of 15/hr until you get it, and see where you end up. It's just a shame that you are going to drag the rest of us who know better down with you. At least you can use your worthless dollars to heat up your burgers like the woman in the photo above when the shell game is finally up and it all goes to crap.



--------------------
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It's all in the timing...

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raybond
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This is crazy, if I understand this, It is being said that the survival of our economy depends on the fast food worker staying at starvation wages. And if I don't agree I have no vision for the larger future. I suppose health care is something they should not get either, because they may use it and that would have a negative affect on the medical business.

The bottom line IMO is that everybody's labor is important and if a person works full time they should at least be able to get the necessities of life and plan for the future.

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Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise.

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raybond
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CREDIT: Rebecca Leber

ATLANTA, GEORGIA — “We can’t survive on $7.25!” Surrounded by fast food chains Long John Silver’s, McDonald’s, and Wendy’s in Atlanta, Georgia, a couple dozen workers chanted that message on Thursday morning, drawing the attention — and a lot of honking — from passing car and truck drivers.

The fast food strikes that first began in New York City in 2012 have spread across the country and worldwide. Atlanta was one of the 150 cities that saw strikes on Thursday to demand a $15 living wage. In Georgia, workers take home the federal minimum of $7.25 an hour.

atlanta strike 2.jpg
CREDIT: Rebecca Leber

Even though the day began for some at 5:30 a.m., energy was high and the workers optimistic by the time they lined up outside of a Burger King, the final stop of the day. Armando Dukes, a Burger King employee for six years who makes $7.35 an hour, led the crowd by megaphone around the restaurant. Like many, this was Dukes’s first time participating.

By comparison, Antwon Brown is a seasoned striker. He’s worked at Long John Silver’s for seven years and has participated in four or five protests since December. Over that time, Brown received his first ever raise from the company, which brings him to $7.50 an hour. He was excited to participate in the action, cutting the interview short because he wanted to rejoin the crowd. “It gave us a stage to vent and express how we feel and hopefully the right person who’s listening will do something about it,” Brown said. “That’s all we’re trying to do.” He thinks they’ve already made a difference. “They get tired of it,” he said. “It’s making them look bad… They’re hoping we go away.”

Another participant, Angela Clark, has been working for the same Burger King franchise for three years and for the company on and off since 1999. “It feels good to stand up for something you believe in,” she said. A single mother and a grandmother of three, she said it’s difficult to pay rent and buy other necessities on a wage of $7.25 an hour.

The workers realize they are taking a risk. Some told me their managers have been discouraging while one “put up the middle finger.” In Atlanta, there was one case of direct retaliation in December. A Subway worker was fired for walking off the job in December and was offered back pay and her job back only when a lawsuit was threatened.

Eddie Foreman, a McDonald’s worker in Alabama who holds two roles for $7.75 an hour, said one reason he joined today is his two kids. “I don’t want them to make $7.25,” he said. “I don’t want them to make $7.50, $8 because they can’t make it off that. They need to make $15 or above to make it in today’s society.”

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CashCowMoo
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$15 an hour to take a burger order? Time to get automated systems.

McDonald's hires 7,000 touch-screen cashiers

"Welcome to McDonald's . My name is HAL 9000. May I take your order?"

McDonalds recently went on a hiring binge in the U.S., adding 62,000 employees to its roster. The hiring picture doesn't look quite so rosy for Europe, where the fast food chain is drafting 7,000 touch-screen kiosks to handle cashiering duties.

The move is designed to boost efficiency and make ordering more convenient for customers. In an interview with the Financial Times, McDonald's Europe President Steve Easterbrook notes that the new system will also open up a goldmine of data. McDonald's could potentially track every Big Mac, McNugget, and large shake you order. A calorie account tally at the end of the year could be a real shocker.

The touch screens will only accept debit or credit cards, adding to the slow death knell of cash and coins. This all goes along with an overall revamp of McDonald's restaurants worldwide aimed at projecting a modern image as opposed to the old-fashioned golden arches with a slightly creepy (to my taste anyway) clown guy hanging around the french fries.

This puts McDonald's one step closer to opening up its first Alphaville location. At least our new computer overlords will be nice enough to serve us a Filet-o-Fish. Maybe they'll even throw in an iPad with the Happy Meal one of these days.

http://www.cnet.com/news/mcdonalds-hires-7000-touch-screen-cashiers/

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It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.

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raybond
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automation just makes for more social unrest. What do we do with all the millions of people we don't need anymore? That is what is going to be the big problem in the future.

Another thing automation will come if fast food workers are making 7.25 or 15.00 dollars an hour.
So get your 15.00 an hour now while they still need you is what I say.

never be afraid to fight for what is wright and never be afraid threats.

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Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise.

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by NR:
I worked as a short order cook in a restaurant for 3 years back in the day, trust me I know all about "accidentally on purpose" when it comes to sanitation. The solution? Cook your own burger, or go to a restaurant with an open kitchen design.

P.S., All health inspection results for any restaurant are available for free on the appropriate state's "Health Services" website. Be warned though, you may never eat anywhere but home again after browsing the results from your favorite restaurants.

i know. it really isn't easy to be sanitary, and it is n't just food prep either. more than 100,000 people die every year from hosptial acquired infections. it's as easy as setting the raw meat on the veggie prep surface to make everyone eating there that whole night sick.
in hospitals? wearing rubber glove MAY protect yo, but if you wear that glove dirty,and touch the door knob, everything gets shared everywhere.

details like these should make everyone realise that all jobs are important. no, a LPN shouldn't get paid th smae as doctor, nor should a manager have to take the wages of the burger flipper. but when the differneces in pay become as great as they have become, the fabric of society becomes ragged and everyone does pay whetehr they want to beleive that or not. how you pay may not be obvious...

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by raybond:
automation just makes for more social unrest. What do we do with all the millions of people we don't need anymore? That is what is going to be the big problem in the future.

Another thing automation will come if fast food workers are making 7.25 or 15.00 dollars an hour.
So get your 15.00 an hour now while they still need you is what I say.

never be afraid to fight for what is wright and never be afraid threats.

i've been introduced to some really bizzare notions by some of my younger friends in the last couple years.
in specific; My gut reaction to the notion that we should just issue money to people was that it's ludicrous. however th emore i thought about it the more i realsied that it woould work just as well as th esystem we have now.
I know, it goes against what i (an most Captialists)have always beleived in, but the honest truth is that the FED ALREADY just issues money to people today, but only to their own club,and only in huge chunks- then it is supposedly trickled down to the rest of society on a "responsible" manner. Who is more responsible with the way they spend their money the ultra-wealthy that run the show today? or average people? in the last ten years it has become obvious to me that the ultra-wealthy are just as clueless as the unwashed masses [Big Grin]

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raybond
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Workers went on strike in a total of 158 American cities Thursday, according to a press release from FastFoodGlobal.org, including in 56 U.S. cities where there had not been a strike during the most recent December wave of worker actions. In addition, international worker solidarity actions are taking place in 93 international cities spread across 36 countries. From the release:

Fast-food workers went on strike in the following U.S. cities:


Alameda, CA; Arvada, CO; Atlanta, GA; Auburn Hills, MI; Aurora, CO; Austin, TX; Ballwin, MO; Belleville, IL; Bellevue, PA; Berkeley, CA; Bloomfield, CT; Bloomington, IN; Boston, MA; Cahoka, IL; Cary, NC; Central Falls, RI; Charleston, SC; Charlotte, NC; Chesterfield, MO; Chicago, IL; Commerce City, CO; Concord, NC; Creve Coeur, MO; Dearborn, MI; Decatur, GA; Denver, CO; Dublin, CA; Durham, NC; East St. Louis, IL; Eastpointe, MI; El Cerrito, CA; Fairfield, CA; Farmington Hills, MI; Ferguson, MO; Ferndale, MI; Flint, MI; Flint Township, MI; Florissant, MO; Forsynth, MO; Fremont, CA; Glendale, CA; Glendale, WI; Greendale, WI; Greenfield, WI; Goldsboro, NC; Greensboro, NC; Greenville, NC; Grandview, MO; Gretna, LA; Haines City, FL; Hamden, CT; Hamtramck, MI; Hartford, CT; Harvey, LA; Hayward, CA; Henderson, NV; Henrico, VA; Highland Park, MI; Houston, TX; Huntington Park, CA; Indianapolis, IN; Inglewood, CA; Independence, MO; James Island, SC; Jennings, MO; Kannapolis, NC; Kansas City, KS; Kansas City, MO; Knightdale, NC; Lakewood, CO; Lansing, MI; Las Vegas, NV; Lenaxa, KS; Lincoln Park, MI; Livonia, MI; Los Angeles, CA; Madison, WI; Milwaukee, WI; Melvindale, MI; Memphis, TN; Metarie, LA; Miami, FL; Miami Beach, FL; Miami Gardens, FL; Morrisville, NC; Mt. Olive, NC; Nanuet, NY; Nashville, TN; New Haven, CT; New Orleans, LA; New York, NY; North Charleston, SC; North Las Vegas, NV; Oak Park, MI; Oakland, CA; Opelika, AL; Orlando, FL; Overland Park, KS; Pawtucket, RI; Peoria, IL; Philadelphia, PA; Pittsburgh, PA; Pleasant Hills, PA; Phoenix, AZ; Pleasanton, CA; Plymouth, NC; Pontiac, MI; Providence, RI; Pueblo, CO; Raleigh, NC; Raytown, MO; Redford, MI; Redford Township, MI; Richmond, CA; Richmond, VA; River Rouge, MI; Rockford, IL; Roeland Park, KS; Sacramento, CA; San Antonio, TX; San Diego, CA; San Leandro, CA; San Lorenzo, CA; Seattle, WA; Seekonk, MA; Slidel, LA; Southfield, MI; Southhaven, MS; Spencer, NC; Springfield, MO; St. Louis, MO; St. Petersburg, FL; Tampa, FL; Taylor, CA; Taylor, MI; Temple Terrace, FL; Union City, CA; University City, MO; Warren, MI; Warwick, RI; Waterford, MI; Wayne, MI; Wausau, WI; Wauwatosa, WI; West Allis, WI; West Milwaukee, WI; Westin, WI; West Memphis, AR; Westview, PA; Wilkinsburg, PA; Wheat Ridge, CO; West Haven, CT; Wethersfield, CT; Wilmington, DE; Windsor Locks, CT; Wentzville, MO; Wiliamston, NC; Winston-Salem, NC.

Fast-food workers protested in the following global cities/countries:


Akita, Japan; Aomori, Japan; Antigua; Auckland, New Zealand; Auxerre, France; Bandung, Indonesia; Bangkok, Thailand; Batangas, Philippines; Belfast, Ireland; Berlin, Germany; Bermuda; Bogota, Colombia; Bologna, Italy; Bordeaux, France; Brasilla, Brazil; Brussels, Belgium; Buenos Aires, Argentina; Busan, South Korea; Cardiff, United Kingdom; Casablanca, Morocco; Cebu, Philippines; Cesenatico, Italy; Colombo, Sri Lanka; Copenhagen, Denmark; Cork, Ireland; Curitiba, Brazil; Davao, Philippines; Djakarta, Indonesia; Dublin, Ireland; Florence, Italy; Fukuoka, Japan; Fukushima, Japan; Geneva, Switzerland; Gifu, Japan; Glasgow, United Kingdom; Goias, Brazil; Hachinoche, Japan; Helsinki, Finland; Hirosaki, Japan; Hong Kong; Kagoshima, Japan; Karachi, Pakistan; Kathmandu, Nepal; Kofu, Japan; Kyoto, Japan; Lahore, Pakistan; Leicester, United Kingdom; Lilongwe, Malawi; London, United Kingdom; Manaus, Brazil; Manila, Philippines; Matuyama, Japan; Milan, Italy; Mito, Japan; Morioka, Japan; Mumbai, India; Nagano, Japan; Nagasaki, Japan; Nagoya, Japan; Nara, Japan; Newcastle, United Kingdom; Oita, Japan; Okayama, Japan; Osaka, Japan; Oslo, Norway; Panama City, Panama; Paris, France; Porto Seguro, Brazil; Rawalpindi, Pakistan; Rome, Italy; Saga, Japan; San Juan, Puerto Rico; San Salvador, El Salvador; Santo Domingo, Dominican Republic; Sao Paulo, Brazil; Sapporo, Japan; Sendai, Japan; Seoul, South Korea; Sheffield, United Kingdom; Shizuoka, Japan; Stockholm, Sweden; Swansea, United Kingdom; Taipei, Taiwan; Takasaki, Japan; Tokushima, Japan; Tokyo, Japan; Trinidad; Valletta, Malta; Venice, Italy; Wigan, United Kingdom; Yamagata, Japan; Yogyakarta, Indonesia; Zurich, Switzerland. (Note that the Italian strikes are taking place May 16.)


Update

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IWISHIHAD
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If this goes through you will see a lot of mom and pop businesses go under. In Ca. we have a lot of small burger/taco etc. businesses and they will be gone. Just like the small pharmacies have disappeared in this state.

Not sure this is a good thing, some people will make more money and a lot will make nothing.

The Burger Kings etc. will be the only ones standing in the end, just like Walgreens etc. are now in the drug business. The big burger companies will figure a better way to automate the process of flipping a burger.

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NR
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quote:
Originally posted by buckstalker:
Oh That clears things up LMAO

I see...so people that flip burgers are not as important or as valuable as you are...is that it?

I'll ask the question again...Why do we pay a CEO 600 times more than the average working class worker in this country?

BTW...the government printing money has NOTHING to do with wages

quote:
Originally posted by NR:
I thought it was pretty clear, but let me spell it out for you.

When you have a country that has no manufacturing base, has massive amounts of debt, and those who are "producing" what little is left go on strike, and the government prints massive amounts of money with nothing of real value backing it to cover increased debt and increased wages or to carry those who are producing nothing, (the unemployed), you get hyperinflation.

So go ahead you little hamburger flippers, with your demands for more and more wages for assembling the same steaming pile of meat and sauce between two buns you have already been assembling for years, and strike away. Shut the system down demanding your "living wage" of 15/hr until you get it, and see where you end up. It's just a shame that you are going to drag the rest of us who know better down with you. At least you can use your worthless dollars to heat up your burgers like the woman in the photo above when the shell game is finally up and it all goes to crap.


Ummm, for starters... I used to be the guy flipping burgers. I started out at minimum wage and by the time I left 3 years later I was shift manager and earned more than when I started.

Did I refuse to work and hold up a sign demanding more to get a raise and a promotion? No, I showed up on time, did my job well, and worked harder than everyone else.

This is NOT an issue about whether a PERSON who flips burgers is more important than the PERSON who designs bridges, and that's where I think you are going wrong with your thinking.

The issue is about the JOB being done, the skill level required to do said JOB, and the IMPORTANCE of the JOB to the economy.

Cry social "injustice" all you want, but there is no way the guy that designs bridges deserves to be paid the same as the guy who flips burgers. Plain and simple. To think otherwise is just plain insanity.

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raybond
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I don't think anybody says a burger flipper should make as much as a bridge designer. And that is not the disagreement here. A burger flipper deserves to make a living and that is what they are fighting for. I personally give them a lot of credit for getting off there butts and doing something about it. And further more if a bridge designer only makes 15 dollars an hour he should be out on the street also.

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IWISHIHAD
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Everyone working at fast food etc. will be making $15 an hour or more, good bye many small businesses!

There will be a lot more people on the streets etc. if this goes through, again there will be less and less jobs, period.

I would rather see us substidize the differance then end up running a lot more businesses out and a lot less jobs.

Actually what might happen is what your seeing at many other businesses now, hiring the people on ss and paying them less. That means young people will be out on the streets finding other things to get their money.

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CashCowMoo
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quote:
Originally posted by IWISHIHAD:
Everyone working at fast food etc. will be making $15 an hour or more, good bye many small businesses!

There will be a lot more people on the streets etc. if this goes through, again there will be less and less jobs, period.

I would rather see us substidize the differance then end up running a lot more businesses out and a lot less jobs.

Actually what might happen is what your seeing at many other businesses now, hiring the people on ss and paying them less. That means young people will be out on the streets finding other things to get their money.

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Exactly, but the ideology behind this does not seem worried about that.
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NR
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quote:
Originally posted by raybond:
I don't think anybody says a burger flipper should make as much as a bridge designer. And that is not the disagreement here. A burger flipper deserves to make a living and that is what they are fighting for. I personally give them a lot of credit for getting off there butts and doing something about it. And further more if a bridge designer only makes 15 dollars an hour he should be out on the street also.

The burger flipper deserves to make a living...

Ok, fine, lets follow this nonsense out to it's illogical conclusion.

For the sake of this argument, lets say the burger flippers get the $15/hr they "deserve" so they can make a "living", doing nothing but grilling meat all day until retirement.

What about all the people who already earn $15/hr like a Paramedic? You know, the person who shows up to save your life after you collapse from a heart attack, perhaps from eating to many fast food burgers? Do they get a pay raise? Should they go on strike to get it?

Also, maybe you can explain why $15/hr is the magic number at which one can earn a "living". This website I looked at seems to suggest that a "living" wage in my area is only $10/hr.

http://livingwage.mit.edu/

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raybond
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nonsense? Well you can call this what you want. I have heard this same argument since the minimum wage was $1.25 per hour, and hear we sit today. So your scenario does not scare me or move me in anyway to believe in your prediction.

First thing you have to realize is a strike or protest does not occur unless there is an imbalance in economic society. And there is a reason for that. I am sure that employers eventually will have to play catchup and if that means some will not be able to then they will go down and that's just business. Weather any thing happens this time around through protest or not remains to be seen but this is not going away and the cost of living will continue to rise, Profits will increase and the minimum wage worker won't be getting a dime more unless he fights for it. Companies like Walmart will pay the poor and the give there low wage workers advice on how to collect welfare so tax payers can subsidize there crappy wages same for restaurant workers and an assortment of other scumbag industries.

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IWISHIHAD
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The problem with the idea that raising minium wage to $15 an hour won't hurt most businesses, appears to be aimed at the big businesses.

I would agree if that was who took the blow, but you do understand that "Big" business is a very very small part of the total businesses in the US!

Fortunately a lot of small businesses are owned and run by families.

But the majority of the rest of businesses are very small and this would be a hugh blow to possibly knock them out.

The idea of hitting the big businesses that are paying hugh saleries etc. to CEO's and others, i like. The rest of this idea, is just not looking at who will actually will take the major blow, by constantly adding new cost factors that affect the small guy and never even pinch the toe of the big guy.

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buckstalker
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I disagree...I see nothing but BIG businesses putting small family owned businesses out of business...and paying their employees less and less

Walmart is a perfect example...

quote:
Originally posted by IWISHIHAD:


I would agree if that was who took the blow, but you do understand that "Big" business is a very very small part of the total businesses in the US!


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raybond
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CREDIT: Flickr user bobbosphere

More than 100 workers and dozens of other protesters were arrested during peaceful protests outside McDonald’s corporate headquarters on Wednesday. On Thursday morning, a thousand McDonald’s workers and their supporters are marching on the company’s Oak Brook, Illinois campus as the company’s annual shareholder meeting kicks off.

Those arrested on Wednesday included 101 McDonald’s employees and 37 supporters, including Service Employees International Union (SEIU) president Mary Kay Henry. The company asked corporate headquarters employees to work from home in anticipation of the protest. The group of about 2,000 marchers were met at the edge of the property by dozens of police, many of them in riot gear.

By bringing the fight to the company’s doorstep, workers and organizers are escalating a conflict that has built steadily over the past year and a half. Fast food workers at McDonald’s and other chains have been going on strike to demand $15 an hour and union rights since late 2012. Since then, the strikes have spread from New York City to 150 U.S. cities across all regions of the country.

Fast food workers earn 1,200 times less than what the CEOs get paid, the widest disparity of any American economic sector. McDonald’s employees make about $8.25 per hour on average before taxes, and the corporation tacitly acknowledges that it pays poverty wages. The company drew flak last year for a website that advised its employees to budget by spending nothing on keeping their homes warm, finding a place to live that costs less than $600 a month, and getting health insurance for just $20 per month. Even that advice was predicated on McDonald’s workers getting a second job. (McDonald’s eventually took the website down because it was drawing “unwarranted scrutiny” from outsiders.)

McDonald’s reported net profits of $5.6 billion in 2013.

The campaign has drawn greater scrutiny to business practices at McDonald’s and in the broader fast food industry. It turns out that 90 percent of fast food workers report getting cheated out of even the low wage they are supposed to be paid, as managers edit their timecards or require off-the-clock work. Such wage theft allegations have led to a wave of landmark class-action lawsuits against not just McDonald’s franchise owners but the corporation itself.

The protests have also called attention to how the public pads fast food profits. Even without spending a nickle in a McDonald’s, anyone who pays taxes is subsidizing the company’s poverty wages. McDonald’s employees need over a billion dollars each year in public assistance money just to get by. Overall, low-wage workers cost the public a quarter-trillion dollars per year in anti-poverty spending that would not be necessary if these highly profitable companies committed to paying wages that would allow a full-time worker to stand on her own feet.

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Upside
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When did minimum wage become synonymous with living wage? My first job was a pinchaser at a bowling alley, a minimum wage position that paid me $2.10 per hour. Through hard work and doing right by my employer I was eventually promoted to the lofty position of lead man which paid a living wage.

Somewhere along the line in our new gimmedat society the concept of work equals reward got lost. The current thinking is that an entry level position that requires no skills whatsoever deserves a living wage. To me that's the definition of insanity.

Here's my personal scenario. I employ a person whose sole required skill is differentiating a garbage dumpster from a steel scrap dumpster. As we cut steel and chips accumulate he gathers them up and empties them into the steel dumpster. As steel banding scraps accumulate on the floor he does the same thing. When he empties the regular garbage though he has to know to throw that in the garbage dumpster. That's it, no other skills are required.

I pay him $13.00 an hour to do this. Not a living wage according to Ray but damn more than what the job is actually worth in my eyes. So what's going to happen if the minimum wage were to go to 15 bucks an hour? Think he's going to sit still for that? Oh no, he was already way above minimum wage so his 13 dollar an hour job is now worth about 20. Bump that right up the chain to all the other employees pay rates and guess what Ray, that 20 dollar piece of steel you needed is now going to cost you 40.

That's really the direction you think this country should head? Really?

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glassman
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but that 20$ peice of steel only cost 10$ ten years ago anyway ...
this is how Capitalism has always worked.

1960 prices:

Cost of a new home: $16,500.00
Cost of a new car: $ 1200???? for a low end car
Cost of a first-class stamp: $0.04
Cost of a gallon of regular gas: $0.31
Cost of a dozen eggs: $0.57
Cost of a gallon of Milk: $0.49

Corn 6 for 25 cents
Cheerios 25 cents per pk....

Gerbers baby Food 25 cents for 3 California 1966
Green Peppers 5 cents each Wisconsin 1963
Ground Beef 45 cents per pound Wisconsin 1963
Ham 39 cents per pound Wisconsin 1963


her in MS where i live now? 15$ an hour is above the average HOUSEHOLD INCOME! these peope are just plain poor and income ain't going up ... on th other hand? food and gas has doubled in the last ten years and more... basic stuff you can't live without....

it has always been this way, and the way they bailed out hte 2008 eonomic collapse with Quantitative Easing has doubled the money supply....whic means infaltion is going to get uglier than it has been - the moany is just pouring out of th eFED

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glassman
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Estimated median household income in 2011: $28,644 (it was $25,928 in 2000)
Greenville MS: $28,644 thats about 14.75/hr


Mississippi: $36,919 'Bout 18.50/hr for the whole damng state....

http://www.city-data.com/city/Greenville-Mississippi.html#ixzz32UwiK3J2

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Upside
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Yeah, that 20 dollar piece of steel might have only been 10 bucks a decade ago but it took a decade to inflate it that much. So now we're going to double it again overnight? Hyper inflation might be something we're going to soon face but let's not hasten it.

My situation is far from unique, it's a scenario that'll be played out across small businesses nationwide. How much did your first job pay you Glass? Was it enough to provide a living for you? Was it supposed to? You and I are the same age, have things changed that drastically where our first jobs are now supposed to provide for a comfortable living?

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Upside:
Yeah, that 20 dollar piece of steel might have only been 10 bucks a decade ago but it took a decade to inflate it that much. So now we're going to double it again overnight? Hyper inflation might be something we're going to soon face but let's not hasten it.

My situation is far from unique, it's a scenario that'll be played out across small businesses nationwide. How much did your first job pay you Glass? Was it enough to provide a living for you? Was it supposed to? You and I are the same age, have things changed that drastically where our first jobs are now supposed to provide for a comfortable living?

A) i'm not a proponent of any natioanl minimum wages, only making a point about how this is not the "fault" of poor people.
B)My first job was as blood drawer at huge coutny hosptial(500 plus beds) just outside the DC line in MD and they screwed me bad. I had to pay union dues, got no union benefits AND they would only hire me 39 hours, hich meant part time and no benefits. I got 6.60 per hour in 78. It was not enough to pay for a living in the DC area then. It actaully required a high degree of skill and responsibity. I could screw up everybodies lives really bad. I did the job well because i don't do anything halfassed. I have always supplementd my income with other work. Cutting/delivering firewood weekends was actually one of my favorites in htose days. Made more at that in one day than i did all week. I would spin wrenches for extra money too. I don't get why people expect to live on flipping burger wages, but i realise that they don't see the world as full of opportunities like you and i and most people here do.

i used to deliver a cord of wood for 150 and i usually also got paid to cut it down.
Here in MS? there aren't any jobs. There's no customers either. Even the wealthy peopel here are on the grant gravy train. When i lived around DC there was planty of moeny and jobs, but it was all Govt based money that flowed. I think most Americans today are lazy and wimpy... But lazy people with moeny to spend are the best way to make alot of moeny if you want to. I like working. 15$ an hour here in MS would make some of these people think they were rich. 15$ in Seattle would still make you poor.... It's all relative.

If i am stuck here( more specifically my wife's work keeps us stuck here) for the next five years i'll go insane watching how slow these folks move..... They move even slower at work...

actually i ahve to admit that i do type less than half-assed.. [Big Grin]

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glassman
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BTW Up, it sounds to me like you are overpaying that guy at 13 an hour.

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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