I received that link through facebook recently myself.
This was my response.
"Totally. As a small mitigation (not to lessen the seriousness but to stave off some of the panic) lets also point out that over 65% of this debt is owed to ourselves. Only about 32-33% of the national debt is owned by foreign investors (China holding the largest piece by far.)"
-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues. Posts: 5178 | From: Up North | Registered: Dec 2005
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also? if you look at it like mortgage instead of credit card? it ain't that bad...
so, which is it? and remember that the mortgage rule is 1/3 of income devoted to payments... also? who is the mortgage holder? mostly US, but not completely. If China were to stop buying notes tomorrow? We'd be in trouble. Bad trouble.
i've defended mos tof Obamas actions to date, as sane policy. However, he is cutting taxes too, and that's notthe right answer.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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Hadn't thought about it like that but yes, it could be a mortgage. In fact, when you think of what we are paying for when we accrue statistically relevant portions of our debt (war, economic depressions, major infrastructure initiatives) it acts very much like second mortgage.
The main problems are that we have opened up a relevant percentage to outside parties and that we are not making monthly payments to principle.
-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues. Posts: 5178 | From: Up North | Registered: Dec 2005
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I know this is mixing apples and oranges but I feel compelled to also point out that for 2011 the United States poverty level was set at a yearly income of $22,350 for a family of four.
-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues. Posts: 5178 | From: Up North | Registered: Dec 2005
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exactly. that is why Ron Paul is promoting "isolationist ideas". We are financing the security of the world pretty much by ourselves.
the mortgage question begs on big answer tho. We all look to pay off our mortgage someday. Otherwise we are just renters with maintenance responsibility.
I'm beginning to feel like that.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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I know this is mixing apples and oranges but I feel compelled to also point out that for 2011 the United States poverty level was set at a yearly income of $22,350 for a family of four.
great point. consider too that the last time Cap Gains taxes were this low was the Great depression..
I don't WANT to pay more taxes, i just know i (and the reso of US) must.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues. Posts: 5178 | From: Up North | Registered: Dec 2005
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i've defended mos tof Obamas actions to date, as sane policy. However, he is cutting taxes too, and that's notthe right answer. [/QB][/QUOTE]
Okay Glass, I am not baiting you on this. I am legitimately curious and you are good at "splaining" chit and much more diligent in your research than I. Obama is cutting taxes?
I have heard in several places about the Fed mortgage buyouts. Supposedly the fed bought up something to the tune of 7 Trillion in bad/troubled mortgages.
Here is where I get really confused (and p-i-s-s-e-d). THAT IS A TAX.... the worst type of tax because it is done in a manner that leaves 95% of Americans not realizing that they just suffered one of the worst "one time" tax hikes in history. Rather than saying:
"okay guys, we are in trouble. I need all you patriotic americans to surrender 20 -25% of you wealth to the government.... just mail us the check and we will get this chit back together."
They EFFING stole it by having the Fed buy it with fiat money.....7 Trillion (or thereabouts).....almost half of our deficit.....diminished the savings and purchasing power of every single person in this country. When the government takes your money that is a TAX. The fact that they are sneaky as hell and creative does not diminish the effect on the individual nor does it change the beneficiary to the individual hardship. It is a d@#n tax.
But here is the thing.... the "Fed" is supposedly not a government agency. There is no accounting for an organization like the fed in our constitutional system of checks and balances. They are a unchecked. Their only allegiance is to their own financial interests. If we can agree that the actions that they took are in fact a "de facto" tax..... How the Fcuk can that happen? There is only one body that has the authority to do that..... and it ain't them.
Sorry, if I seemed accusatory toward you...didn't mean to be. Please point out to me if you know things that I stated to be in error..... I would probably feel better knowing that I was wrong.
I am interested in hearing your (or any of y'alls) take on it. I probably won't respond to any replies before monday as I will be out of town..... headed to Thomasville GA to see some friends. On a side note, it is a cool little town. Google "Thomasville, GA, The Big Oak"..... The tree is impressive..... I think that it is supposed to be the largest of its type East of the Mississippi.
-------------------- "The greatest argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter." (WC) Posts: 386 | From: Georgia | Registered: May 2009
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They EFFING stole it by having the Fed buy it with fiat money.....7 Trillion (or thereabouts).....almost half of our deficit.....
hmmmm.... who is 'they"? the Fed is not a Govt entity. furthermore? that 7 trillion number *just happens* to be the amount of money "lost" (LOL) when the DJIA wet form 14000 to 7000- ya think maybe that Fed money was replaced? i do... short sales recoup the "losses"
Sorry, if I seemed accusatory toward you...didn't mean to be. Please point out to me if you know things that I stated to be in error..... I would probably feel better knowing that I was wrong.
dude, don't apologise to me. bring it. i respect that stuff, and so should you, this what is supposed to happen in Democratic Republic. Heck, i've been a Republican all my life, and i still beleive in Republican form of govt (as in the masses rarely want what's best for them) but i cannot support the GOP anymore cuz they have no ehtics.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:Originally posted by glassman: Obama is cutting taxes?
yes indeed. he's cut taxes considerably. if you collect a paycheck? he cut your taxes.
the stimulus bill was about half tax cuts...
Good God glassman. Why would you say that!!! Don't you know Obama is raising taxes on everything? WTH is wrong with you?!?!?! I'm sure CCM will be along shortly to totally refute what you said with some intelligent reparte! Oops...wait...probably not.
-------------------- It is impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious. Posts: 3311 | From: St. Louis | Registered: Feb 2005
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partisanship is like sibling rivalry, theoretically it improves the breed, especially of an apex predator. but the dishonesty we have been seeing is just plain disgusting huh Pagan?
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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Yes it is glass....but you have to make sacrifices in a Democratic regime. Many don't realize that. Hence our problem.
-------------------- It is impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious. Posts: 3311 | From: St. Louis | Registered: Feb 2005
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i just heard Fox news try to pin the highprice of Oil on Obama due to "regualtory issues"-
i challenge anyone to find me his regulations that have caused oil to prices to be up.
they don't exist. the reason oil prices are high is because the commodity markets are unregulated and the traders have been putting all their money into them.
we are in a commodity bubble right now. there is a 4MBPD *glut* of oil in the world market right now, and the price is still too high. The bubble was stimulated byt eh Arab spring movement, but it is still a bubble and has nothign to do with Obama's regulatory policy.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues. Posts: 5178 | From: Up North | Registered: Dec 2005
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The Washington Post and ABC News are out with a new poll today showing that Americans recognize that our tax code is broken and want to fix it by making the wealthiest Americans pay their fair share: •72 percent favor raising taxes on millionaires, including 59 percent who strongly favor doing so — this includes a majority of Republicans. •68 percent believe that our tax code is rigged for the benefit of the wealthy, including 56 percent who strongly believe that to be the case. •66 percent believe that Mitt Romney is NOT paying his fair share in taxes and in a head-to-head comparison on the issue of taxes, President Obama was favored over Romney 52 percent to 42 percent. Additionally, Americans trust President Obama over Romney to “protect the middle class” by an overwhelming 55 percent to 37 percent margin.
IN TWO SENTENCES: It’s time to create an economy — and a tax code — that work for everyone, not just the privileged few. We can start by ending the unfair tax loopholes for millionaires like Mitt Romney that even Ronald Reagan called “crazy.”
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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So here is the situaiton, you all get your wish and federal income tax rates are high, 45-50% just to make you that much more happy. Years from now the country is still TRILLIONS in debt, and we keep borrowing from the Chinese. Whos fault is it then? The Tea Party?
Did you see what the CEO of Facebook is going to be paying in taxes? 35% fed, 10% California, add the rest in and you are well over 50% of your income that you made is gone. Paying high taxes is a great way to feed the machine in DC more money. They get it and blow it, and yet people want us to pay MORE taxes when it just gets wasted? Good grief!
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
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quote:Originally posted by glassman: another point about the bold faced lies:
i just heard Fox news try to pin the highprice of Oil on Obama due to "regualtory issues"-
i challenge anyone to find me his regulations that have caused oil to prices to be up.
they don't exist. the reason oil prices are high is because the commodity markets are unregulated and the traders have been putting all their money into them.
we are in a commodity bubble right now. there is a 4MBPD *glut* of oil in the world market right now, and the price is still too high. The bubble was stimulated byt eh Arab spring movement, but it is still a bubble and has nothign to do with Obama's regulatory policy.
Obama promised regulation, and true wall st reform, and once he got in office he just listened to what the Goldman crew says and viola. There really hasnt been any financial reform like he championed he would do.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
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Obama promised regulation, and true wall st reform, and once he got in office he just listened to what the Goldman crew says and viola. There really hasnt been any financial reform like he championed he would do.
cash, you ever hear of Dodd-Frank?
Obama's financial reform: Winners and losers After weeks in limbo, the Dodd-Frank Bill has finally passed Congress. Who stands to benefit from the banking reforms — and who will lose out?
posted on July 19, 2010, at 12:55 PM
It's taken many weeks of setbacks and stalled negotiations, but the Democrats' long-promised financial reform bill has finally been approved by the Senate and will be signed into law on Wednesday. The Dodd-Frank Act promises to put new controls on the banking industry and protect consumers. Amongst its initiatives are a Consumer Protection Financial Bureau that would oversee lenders of private loans such as mortgages and credit cards and a clampdown on derivatives trading by Wall Street banks.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: So here is the situaiton, you all get your wish and federal income tax rates are high, 45-50% just to make you that much more happy. Years from now the country is still TRILLIONS in debt, and we keep borrowing from the Chinese. Whos fault is it then? The Tea Party?
Did you see what the CEO of Facebook is going to be paying in taxes? 35% fed, 10% California, add the rest in and you are well over 50% of your income that you made is gone. Paying high taxes is a great way to feed the machine in DC more money. They get it and blow it, and yet people want us to pay MORE taxes when it just gets wasted? Good grief!
the money is already spent cash. it's not about "wishing", and as much as you hate to hear it, the legislation spending most of the money was passed before Obama got itno office. Gotta pay the bill now.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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Not what you see on CNN, is it? In Iowa, Colorado, Minnesota, and Maine, delegates are unbound all the way through the national convention, and the votes reported are just straw votes--and often, the numbers of delegates reported by news organizations are simply made up!
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It's all in the timing... Posts: 4303 | From: DSA | Registered: Dec 2003
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Good point buck. The stations report based on current vote totals but because those delegates are unbound they are just as easily swayed by the future political fortunes of the candidates as the voters in states that have not had a primary or caucus yet.
Honestly I like the structure of it. If an early front runner should have something inexcusable come out 3/4ths through the campaign those unbound delegates provide a check against being forced to field a bad candidate.
It is a good system of combining the popular vote, insider approval (super-delegates), and leaving out a trump card in case of deception and/or massive failure, to my mind.
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If Mitt Romney wins the GOP nomination I sure hope he picks a good VP.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
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-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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quote:Originally posted by The Bigfoot: Good point buck. The stations report based on current vote totals but because those delegates are unbound they are just as easily swayed by the future political fortunes of the candidates as the voters in states that have not had a primary or caucus yet.
The "news" stations report false delegate totals based on what they are told to report by their handlers (elitists, big business, big banks, etc.) and those false reports are clear evidence of who the handlers "want" their nominee to be...
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It's all in the timing... Posts: 4303 | From: DSA | Registered: Dec 2003
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