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The Bigfoot
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Why does my state keep re-electing this horrid woman! It's like her district enjoys turning our political establishment into the Jerry Springer Show. It's sick.

quote:
The claim: The United States will be "spending a whopping $200 million per day" on President Barack Obama's trip to Asia.

......

That's roughly the amount the federal government spends each day on the war in Afghanistan.

......

Those numbers, according to Republican Rep. Michele Bachmann, are: $200 million a day, $2 billion total, 34 diverted Navy ships, a 2,000-person presidential entourage, and 870 hotel rooms in India.

.............

"I will take the liberty this time of dismissing as absolutely absurd this notion that somehow we're deploying 10 percent of the Navy, some 34 ships and an aircraft carrier in support of the president's trip to Asia," Pentagon spokesman Geoff Morrell told reporters this week.

http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/11/05/obama.asia.cost/index.html?hpt=C1

hey tex, what is the correct way to signal that you are taking quotes from different paragraphs within the article? I am sure my dots are not correct.

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glassman
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you can italisize by usin [ i ] at teh beginning and [ / i ] at teh end without using spaces...

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glassman
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she is a nut...

i know a few nuts from minnesota most of 'em are harmless and fun esp after a beer and a schnappes...

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jordanreed
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Thanks.......

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jordan

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jordanreed
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Bachmans whole campaign was based entirely on fear. Much like the rest of the country

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jordan

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CashCowMoo
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No, they arent sending a Navy super fleet. They ARE however removing coconuts to make sure one doesnt fall on dumbos head while he reads teleprompters.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/barackobama/8109295/C oconuts-removed-from-trees-in-preparation-for-Barack-Obamas-India-trip.html

Coconuts removed from trees in preparation for Barack Obama's India trip
India is preparing for Barack Obama's first visit to the country by removing coconuts from palm trees in Mumbai to protect the US president.

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It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.

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SeekingFreedom
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quote:
Why does my state keep re-electing this horrid woman! It's like her district enjoys turning our political establishment into the Jerry Springer Show. It's sick.

Kind of the same question as the Predictions thread question, Big; but that's a good question.

What IS it about her that apparently appeals to her electorate? What is it in her message that resonates with the people? Answer that honestly and without bias and that will tell you alot about the people and the political climate.

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/weepforthenation

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jordanreed
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she's cute??...and shes got a great whiny voice...?she appeals to the mass of morons in her district?....she has no solutions , just rhetoric?...

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jordan

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jordanreed
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SF...with your intelligence...I'm sure you wouldnt of voted for her.

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jordan

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SeekingFreedom
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Thanks for the vote of confidence, Jordan. I really don't know much about her other than Tea Partiers like her...and pretty much nobody else does. [Razz]

But my question is about her message, not the messanger. What was it about her message that draws votes? Smaller government, coservative values, whatever other Tea Party ideas she used? What was it?

That's what I mean. If you analyze the message that won, you can tell a lot about those that voted for her.

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/weepforthenation

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CashCowMoo
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quote:
Originally posted by SeekingFreedom:
Thanks for the vote of confidence, Jordan. I really don't know much about her other than Tea Partiers like her...and pretty much nobody else does. [Razz]

But my question is about her message, not the messanger. What was it about her message that draws votes? Smaller government, coservative values, whatever other Tea Party ideas she used? What was it?

That's what I mean. If you analyze the message that won, you can tell a lot about those that voted for her.

Its been a rough week for the left. A nice thumping to get them on track, and now Keith Olberman. [Were Down]
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The Bigfoot
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her message?

lie

lie

lie

misrepresentation

progressives are the spawn of communist gay loving devil cats (which at least is a personal opinion)

lie

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glassman
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conservative values?

which conservative values? the ones Rush has?

the ones Glen Beck has?

the ones Sarah Palin has?

the ones Bush has?

LOL...

those go out the window the minute they get their hands on the lobbyist teat...

i remeber when i told people right here five years ago that Bush was not a real conservative...

i was told i was FOS and all kinds of other pleasntries... i was even told i couldn't be conservative or a GOP...

well, two years and a bailout or two later Bush's own supporters admitted he wasn't Conservative, because they knew he had lost them GOP's New American Century Hold on America.

well, i am no longer a GOP... the GOP is a joke, and even tho they won the house? they lost the Senate cuz of the TParty fools.


The U.S. Senate election, 1994 was an election held on November 8, in which the Republican Party was able to take control of the Senate from the Democrats. In a midterm election, the opposition Republicans held the traditional advantage. Congressional Republicans campaigned against the early presidency of Bill Clinton, including his unsuccessful health care plan.

The GOP is weaker now that it was in 94. And the resoans are because the GOP, by it's own admission, has not lived up to it's own claims. and will not again. Yhe Tparty is nothing more than a new brand of opportunists changing the drapes in offices around DC and licking their chops at how to get the lobbyists to pay up.

watch. we get gridlock and fingerpointing...

oh yeah and another 100 million$ worth of investigations that lead to impeachment for lying about stains on dresses.....LOL... or even funnier shenannigans i'm sure.

this country is aspirating it's own vomit.

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SeekingFreedom
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(sigh)

This is why neither side will give, Big. Both claim to be too offended by whatever the other ran on (whether lies or not) to objectively look at the message.

Let me use your sarcasm as an example:

progressives are the spawn of communist gay loving devil cats (which at least is a personal opinion)


If that message changed someone's mind, what does it mean? It could mean nothing more than that the voters were anti-cat. LoL

Seriously, though, show me a real campaign message from her camp and we can look at what kind of voter it drew.

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/weepforthenation

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SeekingFreedom
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quote:
which conservative values? the ones Rush has?

the ones Glen Beck has?

the ones Sarah Palin has?

the ones Bush has?

LOL...


No, Glass, the ones the electorate has that they WANT Washington to respect.

quote:
watch. we get gridlock and fingerpointing...

I already said I agree with this Glass. But watch and see...it will come from BOTH sides instead of just one now.

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The Bigfoot
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Seek

She said on national TV that the presidents trip was going to cost 200 Million per day.

That he required a 2000 person retinue.

That he was going to tie up 10% of the navy fleet for his travel.

This is just the latest in a never ending string of slander. That is what the republican voice has become. It slanders against anything that opposes it to destroy credibility and obfuscate real debate.

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SeekingFreedom
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That's playing to the base, Big. Not that I'm defending it, mind you. But there is a distinction here that is important. The Right are going to believe the worst about him no matter what. The Left are going to disbelieve it because it came from Bachmann in the first place.

What do the Independants believe and why?

What was her campaign message that made the INDEPENDANTS vote her back into office? As Glass has pointed out so many times, most elections are not decided by either the Left or the Right. It's the aprox. 15% in the middle that make the difference.

So, what did she campaign on that drew that 15% (or at least the bulk of that 15%) to her side?

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SeekingFreedom
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quote:
This is just the latest in a never ending string of slander. That is what the republican voice has become. It slanders against anything that opposes it to destroy credibility and obfuscate real debate.

Be careful here, Big...pots and kettles...both sides are on thin ice in this regard...

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jordanreed
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This website has turned into a hate website...it used to be fun...not anymore,,,there is no debate going on here..its just the same arguments over and over and no one is going to give any ground or change anyones mind. Same ol agendas and political bashing. None of this brings us together..only separates us further. What is going on here is identical to what is going on in this country...and its disgusting. The posts bring anger and hate and so much vitriol that is very unsettling.

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jordan

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SeekingFreedom
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Then make a difference Jordan...answer my question:

Why did the Repubs pick up 60+ seats in the House?

Was it their message?

Or was it simply the Dems went against the will of the people and the Repubs were the only alternative?

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/weepforthenation

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jordanreed
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No more politics for me,amigo....peace......I'm just a simple man, trying to get by in my simple life with as few headaches as possible. To each his own....good luck,brother! [Cool]

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jordan

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The Bigfoot
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REALLY!

Give me the democratic equivalent to inflating costs on a normal presidential activity by more than a factor of 10.

Give me the democratic equivalent of saying the president and his party want to create death panels and kill grandma.

Give me the democratic equivalent to saying the serve America bill would create
quote:
“re-education camps for young people, where young people have to go and get trained in a philosophy that the government puts forward and then they have to go to work in some of these politically correct forums.”
Give me the democratic equivalent of saying
quote:
"Speaker Pelosi, who has been busy sticking the taxpayer for a $100,000 bar tab for alcohol on the military jets that she is flying."
By the way...she said this one in September based off a lying report from a republican think-tank that was debunked back in march. Just cuz it was proven completely false didn't stop her from using it on the campaign trail to stir up partisan hatred.

Give me the democratic equivalent of saying
quote:
“It isn’t that some gay will get some rights. It’s that everyone else in our state will lose rights. For instance, parents will lose the right to protect and direct the upbringing of their children. Because our K-12 public school system, of which ninety per cent of all youth are in the public school system, they will be required to learn that homosexuality is normal, equal and perhaps you should try it. And that will occur immediately, that all schools will begin teaching homosexuality.”
I agree that many political appointees on both sides of the aisle distort the truth on occasion in order to get elected or create a point. In that sense you are correct, pots and kettles are both black.

This woman along with Rush and Beck take black to an entirely new shade. She doesn't just tweek the truth to paint a good light on herself. (Which is still wrong.) She purposefully spreads obviously false information to create an emotional response in her victims ...ahem...I mean supporters. They forget the lie but the emotional distaste remains.

It is out and out manipulation. It has nothing to do with political theory or conservative values and everything to do with power and control. It is sickening and I am sad to see you defend this type of behavior.

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jordanreed
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9KC7uhMY9s

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jordan

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The Bigfoot
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quote:
Originally posted by jordanreed:
This website has turned into a hate website...it used to be fun...not anymore,,,

so much vitriol that is very unsettling.

Sorry jordan. You are right to call me out. I will try to tone it down. I just don't understand how anyone can support this woman.

I can understand voting based on view of abortion. That's rational, even if I don't agree with your position.

I can understand voting based on fiscal discipline. That's rational, even if I disagree on what brings the most long term value.

I can understand voting on immigration, education, taxes, welfare, or any other political issue though I would hope it would be a mix of issues that garnered your vote and not just one black and white issue.

I can even understand voting based on your religious beliefs even though I think that leaves you open to undue influence by your religious leaders who (in my opinion) are (in general) already too involved in politics.

What I can't understand is supporting a proven power hungry manipulator who is a proven liar no matter what party they belong to or what values they supposedly uphold.

...
Seek, I take back the 'sad to see you defending her behavior' comment. I know you don't have a stake here, are simply playing devils advocate, and don't really know the woman or her politics. She has only been on the national scene since 2007. I have been watching her antics since 2001 with the state senate.

The woman just riles me as much as a bad case of fleas!

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SeekingFreedom
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(cough)Alan Grayson(cough)

That should say it all, but I'm in a good mood so I'll do a little digging. From Fact Check.org

Embattled Democrats strained to discredit the U.S. Chamber of Commerce with an unproven allegation, claiming that it was "stealing our democracy" by funneling secret, illegal contributions from foreign corporations. The truth is that the chamber gets only a tiny fraction of its money from foreign corporations, and has more than enough from domestic companies to legally fund its planned $75 million election spending.

...

Whopper: Daniel Webster is un-American. Webster’s opponent for the House seat in Florida’s 8th Congressional District, Democrat Alan Grayson, falsely claimed that Webster was a draft dodger who "doesn’t love his country." In fact, Webster dutifully reported for the draft after finishing his undergraduate degree, but was rejected for medical reasons. Grayson then launched an ad calling his opponent "Taliban Dan" and misrepresenting a quote in which Webster talked about a woman’s role in marriage. The ad’s misleading editing changed "don’t pick the [Bible verses] that say, ‘She should submit to me’ " into "she should submit to me."

...

Whopper: Rick Scott loves prisoners. And pornography. An outside group in Florida ran an ad claiming that gubernatorial candidate Rick Scott, a Republican, had a plan to close prisons that would "release tens of thousands of prisoners early." In fact, Scott proposed cutting prison spending per prisoner. That led a state official to speculate that "you would have to close prisons," but that’s not what Scott proposed. Another group accused Scott of "profiting from porn." The weak backup? Scott has an investment in a Latin American social networking site that has partnered with Playboy Mexico to find the Playmate of the Year.

...

Everybody took the Wall Street bailout’s name in vain this campaign season. Democratic House incumbents in nine states claimed that they voted against "the bailout" — meaning the Troubled Asset Relief Program — when in fact they weren’t yet in office when it was enacted. (They voted against a later bill to allow release of the second half of TARP funds, a purely symbolic and futile vote. The Senate had already approved release and only disapproval by both houses could freeze the funds under terms set by the original bailout legislation.)

...

In dozens of TV ads, Democrats or Democratic-leaning groups accused Republicans of favoring a 23 percent national sales tax, as though such a thing would come in addition to existing taxes. The attacks (which were also made in fancy mail pieces) amounted to a misrepresentation of the "FairTax" proposal. The claims failed to mention that the sales tax would replace — not add to — existing federal income and payroll taxes. Democrats also left out any mention of offsetting rebates designed to mitigate the increased cost of essentials like food and medicine — a main feature of the FairTax proposal.

...

At one point, the president himself claimed that Republican leaders were as eager to "privatize" Social Security as they were to repeal his health care law, which isn’t true.

Some Republican candidates and incumbents do favor allowing younger workers to invest some portion of their payroll taxes in the stock market, but few if any have supported replacing the current system entirely with a fully privatized system, like the one in Chile. And even voluntary, partial privatization is far from the top of the GOP agenda. The idea died for lack of GOP support when President Bush tried to push it through a Republican-controlled Congress in 2005.



I can go on and on and on to make this point if you want, Big, but I hope this will suffice.

Neither side is completely honest and neither side is above flat out fabrication when it suits them. You offer up Bachmann...I offer Grayson. We can go on like that forever...or we can admit the truth and discuss where we go from here. [Razz]

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SeekingFreedom
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It's all good, Big. I gots thicker skin than most. [Razz]

My original question was directed at why she is getting elected. The only way to answer that is to look at her message and what part of it appealed to her electorate.

For instance, Bob Bennett was a repub here for YEARS. This time around enough of us had had it with some of his votes and we issued him his pink slip. Until enough people don't agree with how she campaigns\votes she will stay there...to your quite apparent dismay. [Razz]

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/weepforthenation

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glassman
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At one point, the president himself claimed that Republican leaders were as eager to "privatize" Social Security as they were to repeal his health care law, which isn’t true.


that's a flat out LIE!

or, gee i must have been hallucinating when i heard them say it on Fox news any number of times in the last 6 months...

the only question is who you call a Republican Leaders.

i have heard any number of GOP elected officials and pundits still calling for privatization to this day..
this took me two minutes to find cut and paste: straight from one horses mouth:

ndividuals 55 and older will remain in the current system and will not be affected by this proposal in any way: they will receive the benefits they have been promised, and have planned for, during their working years. All other workers will have a choice to stay in the current system or begin contributing to personal accounts. Those who choose the personal account option will have the opportunity to begin investing a significant portion of their payroll taxes into a series of funds managed by the U.S. government. The system would closely resemble the investment options available to Members of Congress and Federal employees through the Thrift Savings Plan [TSP]. As these personal accounts continue to accumulate wealth, they will eventually replace the funding that comes through the government’s pay-as-you-go system. This will reduce the demand on government spending, lead to a larger overall benefit for retired workers, and restore solvency to the Social Security Program.


http://www.roadmap.republicans.budget.house.gov/plan/


http://www.roadmap.republicans.budget.house.gov/

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glassman
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and BTW? i am under 55 and i have always expected this and much worse to happen before i recieve my SS benefits...

it's like watching a train wreck and not being able to do anything about it...

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SeekingFreedom
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ROFL...I think those words do not mean what you think they mean, Glass....

quote:
All other workers will have a choice to stay in the current system or begin contributing to personal accounts.

...

The system would closely resemble the investment options available to Members of Congress and Federal employees through the Thrift Savings Plan [TSP].

That's a FAR cry from privatizing the system.

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The Bigfoot
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yep.

Alan Grayson is a twit who got one big reaction when he made a sensational remark and since has been nothing but an attention seeker mugging for the camera. I will say that at least Grayson stopped at un-American instead of going even further to say anti-American. Floridians were smart to vote him out and put someone in who would concentrate on the tasks at hand instead of 'playing politics'.

The outside group that bashed and mischaracterized Rick Scott as a felon lover and purveyor of adult materials...which democratic congressman was it that go on national TV and repeated those obviously false statements again?

We could go back and forth on the privatized social security thing but it isn't worth it. I get your point, my point is that as bad as all that is (and it is bad and half of why no one trusts their representatives to tell them the truth anymore) Bachmann takes it to a whole new level. She wraps herself in a flag with the cross over her shoulder and jumps on anything she sees as politically advantageous without even hesitating to consider the veracity of the information.

Anyway....starting to get itchy again after jr's tunes mellowed me out so I am gonna drop that subject for now.

Looked at her website and was amazed at how reasonable her five listed issues are.

-Funny aside...I take this off her website. [quoteA big part of the problem has roots in the Tax Code, which favors employer-provided health insurance. My Health Care Freedom of Choice Act would provide full tax deductibility for individual health expenses, including medical care, dental care, long-term care and insurance premiums.[/quote] That's actually one of the big things the healthcare reform addresses. Different words, same meaning but since they are written in red ink I guess it is now somehow acceptable now. lol

Her website doesn't mention anything about her stance against same sex relationships though she is a big defense of marriage act supporter and loves to tell people at nearly every event she speaks at that same sex marriage will corrupt their children.

It is mostly the typical stuff

Washington is out of control in spending. She said Obama, Pelosi, Reid, and her opponent Terrel Clark made up the four faces of Mount Spendmore in her most frequent commercial.

Cut spending (though she never said what she would cut)
Reduce welfare only to those who need it (though she never said how they would define who needs it)

out of time more later

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by SeekingFreedom:
ROFL...I think those words do not mean what you think they mean, Glass....

quote:
All other workers will have a choice to stay in the current system or begin contributing to personal accounts.

...

The system would closely resemble the investment options available to Members of Congress and Federal employees through the Thrift Savings Plan [TSP].

That's a FAR cry from privatizing the system.
i am extremely familiar with the Thrift Savings Plan. Had i not called the exact top of the market in 2007 two day before it actually peaked? I would have seen it lose 50% like most everybody else did.

i know many people int heir early 60's right now that are totally depressed and freaked out cuz they lost even more than half...

they are too old to switch jobs even if they could find one and they expect to be axed iny day due to age. all of that is not even their fault dude, they don't have the time or inclination to sresearch like we do here, and they worked very hard to SAVE that money. they thought they were saving anyway [Wink]

you don't get what SS is what it was designed to be and what it has to remain.

that is privatisation and at what age exaclty do people choose?

18? 25? 30? 55? do they jump in and out?

it's a lameass idear and it is privatisaion of Federal Taken Funds if only one person chooses.

that's privatisation and Wall St will not have it.

and i even know why they won't have anythng to do with it.

because Revolution would come if they put SS funds into and we have a crash, like we just had- either that or there would be Congressional hearings for two years and heads would roll. and i don't mean that figuratively, the Revolution would be ON big time.
at best? People would go to jail and even worse regualtions and laws would be DEMANDED by the same TParty types that calim they want less Govt todday.

the system is not capable of having the kind of scrutiny that it would come under if SS was required to be taken from your pay, and then put into the "free market"
it wouldn't be Freemarket either anymore, that's the very definiton of a State managed market and the market would know exaclty how much they can skim out of the SS moeny and exaclty whne it pours in every two weeks or month or wahtever.

you have no idear just how rigged the game is... (that doesn't make me not play, because i at least know what's going on, but i have spoent years learning it and do not stop learning it either)

it is foolish to suggest that the Govt REQUIRE people to invest in eitehr or becuse people will be mad if they lose on either side, the people who don't "jump in" will be mad when it goes up and the people who do will be mad when it goes down because the Govt did it....

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
glassman
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I already said I agree with this Glass. But watch and see...it will come from BOTH sides instead of just one now.

watch how Darrell Issa proceeds. we will see.

one thing i noticed is that Dems have been getting investigated and in trouble under the all-Dem Govt. Even ACORN i snow gone, and thathad to be doner by the Dems even tho the "right" was the ones complaining, they really had no power to destroy them, the dems did it...

we'll see how partisan this guy is with his mew toy:

The Committee on Oversight and Government Reform is a United States House of Representatives committee that has existed in varying forms since 1816.

The Committee on Oversight and Government Reform is the main investigative committee in the U.S. House of Representatives. After Republicans gained control of the House in 1995, the committee was reorganized to include just seven subcommittees. This reorganization consolidated the jurisdiction previously covered by 3 full committees and 14 subcommittees, and resulted in a 50 percent cut in staff.[1] In 2007, Henry Waxman (D-CA) the chairman of the committee proposed an additional reorganization which combined the duties of the seven previous subcommittees into five. This reorganization was adopted by the full committee January 18, 2007.[2]

The Committee's government-wide oversight jurisdiction and expanded legislative authority make it one of the most influential and powerful committees in the House. The Committee serves as Congress' chief investigative and oversight committee, and is granted broad jurisdiction. The chairman of the committee is the only committee chairman in the House with the authority to issue subpoenas without a committee vote.


who was the last chair?

Edolphus "Ed" Towns (born July 21, 1934) is the U.S. Representative for New York's 10th congressional district, serving since 1983, and the Chairman of the House Oversight and Government Reform Committee since 2008. He is a member of the Democratic Party.


i don't think i ever heard of him... but i've already heard of Issa from Fox, not the "left"...

never hearing of the guy was a bad thing IMO. there was plenty that needed to be done there, but we'll see how partisan Issa is won't we?

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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glassman
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wow, i just looked up Michelle on the politifact site..

she really is crazy as a loon..


http://politifact.com/personalities/michele-bachmann/

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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jordanreed
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...and she gets voted in again!?...whats that tell ya?

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jordan

Posts: 5812 | From: st paul,mn | Registered: Feb 2004  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by jordanreed:
...and she gets voted in again!?...whats that tell ya?

jordan, i began posting off-topic in the free-fro-all thread almost immediately when i got here, it was free-for-all after all...
Bob created this off-topic thread after a few pumpers [Big Grin] (rightfully) complained that we were cloggin up their threads with our political discussions...

i only got seriously "interested" in politics again (which i actaully hate from having been raised in them) after i realised that 70% of Americans beleived that Sadam was involved in 9-11 and that the WMD were still just "not found yet" even after the Senate had released it's intelligence report showing that none of the above was true in early June of '04.

i was so dismayed that people were still unaware of what's going on even tho they had the proof publicly available that i decided i had to start shouting, which i did....

some peopl calim Obama has had the "general media" in th bag? Bush had th emedia hog-tied and in th ebag so bad that more than half of the US population beleived lies and the general media di dnothing to ed-jktum. Heck Fox was cheering Bush on and righ in the White House and the Pentagon planning the whole propaganda campaign.

it still took another year before people began to relise that Bush and CHENEY had pulled the wool over the countries eyes...

politics ahs always been like this and prolly always will be cuz, well, that's just the nature of people.....

even with the internet and the abiltiy to check and compare five to ten significant news sources to find some consistancy? the truth is still a rare thing... rare indeed...

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
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