quote:What are the chances that Barack Obama had time to read the stimulus bill he's about to sign?
ZERO!
And I doubt any of our senators or reps read it either. It's amazing that the largest fiscal bill ever has been pushed through our congress and no one can say for sure what's in it.
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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posted
LMAO! at both of you. They didn't have to read the entire 1,100 pages. Only the few revisions involved in the comprimise. Good effort on Lugnut and PM's effort to obscure that fact. The House and Senate have been debating this for weeks. If they had not read it before then...well that's just for GOP whining purposes. The only thing they had to read were some revisions. Your arguments get weaker by the day. It's sad really. The GOP consertavies lost the presidency and the congress, get over it.
-------------------- It is impossible to make anything foolproof because fools are so ingenious. Posts: 3311 | From: St. Louis | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
I don't see how they could. What did they have? Ten hours to read 1,100 pages of legaleze? I suspect they did that on purpose. This way that can deny even knowing what they voted on! For example, this ridiculous bill virtually destroyed Bill Clinton's welfare reform. Somehow, that hasn't quite made it to the drive-by media yet.
Posts: 1577 | From: Ohio | Registered: Oct 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Propertymanager: I don't see how they could. What did they have? Ten hours to read 1,100 pages of legaleze? I suspect they did that on purpose. This way that can deny even knowing what they voted on! For example, this ridiculous bill virtually destroyed Bill Clinton's welfare reform. Somehow, that hasn't quite made it to the drive-by media yet.
howz come nobody was asking these important questions 4 years ago?
one minute people are complaining that there's no change, the next minute they are complaining about the change...
one minute the complaint is that congress can't get anything done, the next minute they are doing too much
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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You guys are so childish and silly it is pathetic. We don't elect and send people to be Congressmen or presidents to read through that stuff and all its detail, put there to hope to allay improper use of the provisions, so that the bill may direct attention to what it is intended. If you know of any congressperson or administrative person that does that and is above the level of a second level gofer or secretary, a motion for impeachment is in order.
Those guys are there to make judgments and have huge staffs of brilliant and enormously qualified people to sift through and make professional recommendations, in the case of the Administration, to the offices of the Administration, and in the case of the Congress, to the members who sit on the special committees charged with that responsibility, then that committee passes on the appropriateness of inappropriateness of a bill and conveys that decision to the whole branch of Congress to which that Committee is responsible.
What you are proposing would be the death knell of almost any modern government. It might work with a nation of maybe half a million people or even a bigger one if the government is a dictatorship, but representative government is impossible when the population reaches any size at all.
Get serious and grow up. Would you expect the chairmen of the board of Boeing to study the details of the landing gear mechanism of a 757 or have participated in the metallurgical considerations and final decision for the chemical make up of the alloys used for rivets in the horizontal stabilizer of a new design? That's about the same duty you are demanding of a Congressman when you suggest he should have read and absorbed the details of any bill, let alone some one specific bill (and that is true with every bill, whether or not that bill ever got to a vote or not).
Grow up!
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Pagan: LMAO! at both of you. They didn't have to read the entire 1,100 pages. Only the few revisions involved in the comprimise. Good effort on Lugnut and PM's effort to obscure that fact. The House and Senate have been debating this for weeks. If they had not read it before then...well that's just for GOP whining purposes. The only thing they had to read were some revisions. Your arguments get weaker by the day. It's sad really. The GOP consertavies lost the presidency and the congress, get over it.
Have you read it? How do you know what the final content of the bill was? Could there have been items added that some of our congressmen and women would have like to debate further.?
I hope your satisfied when the items in this bill start to take effect cause you and I own them.
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Propertymanager: I don't see how they could. What did they have? Ten hours to read 1,100 pages of legaleze? I suspect they did that on purpose. This way that can deny even knowing what they voted on! For example, this ridiculous bill virtually destroyed Bill Clinton's welfare reform. Somehow, that hasn't quite made it to the drive-by media yet.
howz come nobody was asking these important questions 4 years ago?
one minute people are complaining that there's no change, the next minute they are complaining about the change...
one minute the complaint is that congress can't get anything done, the next minute they are doing too much
I don't remember a bill like this from 4 years ago? What are you refering too?
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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quote:Originally posted by bdgee: You guys are so childish and silly it is pathetic. We don't elect and send people to be Congressmen or presidents to read through that stuff and all its detail, put there to hope to allay improper use of the provisions, so that the bill may direct attention to what it is intended. If you know of any congressperson or administrative person that does that and is above the level of a second level gofer or secretary, a motion for impeachment is in order.
Those guys are there to make judgments and have huge staffs of brilliant and enormously qualified people to sift through and make professional recommendations, in the case of the Administration, to the offices of the Administration, and in the case of the Congress, to the members who sit on the special committees charged with that responsibility, then that committee passes on the appropriateness of inappropriateness of a bill and conveys that decision to the whole branch of Congress to which that Committee is responsible.
What you are proposing would be the death knell of almost any modern government. It might work with a nation of maybe half a million people or even a bigger one if the government is a dictatorship, but representative government is impossible when the population reaches any size at all.
Get serious and grow up. Would you expect the chairmen of the board of Boeing to study the details of the landing gear mechanism of a 757 or have participated in the metallurgical considerations and final decision for the chemical make up of the alloys used for rivets in the horizontal stabilizer of a new design? That's about the same duty you are demanding of a Congressman when you suggest he should have read and absorbed the details of any bill, let alone some one specific bill (and that is true with every bill, whether or not that bill ever got to a vote or not).
Grow up!
Geez i hope someone is paying attention to what's in this bill. My senator is Chris "I didn't know I was getting a deal" Dodd, I would speculate that he has no idea what's in this bill other than what the Democrat leadership generally lead him to believe. That way when this doesn't work he can say "I didn't know that was in there".
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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quote:Originally posted by glassman: I don't remember a bill like this from 4 years ago? What are you refering too?
at least half of all the bills EVER passed.. they're all like this every single damn one of em...
4 years ago? people gave me a hard time for asking the same questions.
the white house wrote the patriot act and nobody read it. they just passed it because it was "patriotic"
So do you care that the folks voting on this haven't read it? We were promised CHANGE if I remember correctly. This is the same old crap.
The only CHANGE I see is we had a budget defecit of 1 trillion and now we have 2 trillion. I hope that's what you all were looking for when you voted for this guy.
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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posted
But, then, lock, you CHOOSE to only see want to see. It's how Fat Rush has told your Party to do and, after all, he controls the Party.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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So do you care that the folks voting on this haven't read it? We were promised CHANGE if I remember correctly. This is the same old crap.
The only CHANGE I see is we had a budget defecit of 1 trillion and now we have 2 trillion. I hope that's what you all were looking for when you voted for this guy.
we had a national debt of 10 trillion now it's 11...
Bush doubled it.
we'll see how it looks in three years won't we? that's a more apropriate way of looking at it.
the best i hope for is to hold it flat while the economy grows.
that's not even likely considering how tattered the economy is.
not doing anything would make 12-15% unemployemnt inevitable...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:Well at least the stock market isn't crashing...
Not to worry. The Messiah will be unveiling his bailout (handout) de jour today. On today's menu is more handouts to deadbeat homeowners who won't pay their mortgage (courtesy of hard working taxpayers). The government is counting on that to keep the stock market up.
Posts: 1577 | From: Ohio | Registered: Oct 2007
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Well said Jordan! However, you left out "helpless victims that need their socialist government to be their mother and father".
Posts: 1577 | From: Ohio | Registered: Oct 2007
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quote:Originally posted by Highwaychild: Yeah, I doubt any republicans lost their homes...
i haven't seen any thing about party affiliation but, i did notice that the wealthy are not immune by a long shot:
Default Rate On Jumbo Loans Another Concern The Wall Street Journal reports the increasing default rate for prime "jumbo" loans is "raising the specter of another cloud over banks and investors, which could get stuck with thousands of expensive homes." About "6.9% of prime 'jumbo' loans were at least 90 days delinquent in December," compared to 2.1% for conforming non-jumbo prime loans.
quote:Originally posted by bdgee: *still listening for a denial*
there can be no denial. this was predicted right here in off-topics by several of us... it wasn't hard to see coming.
since October? the number of prime mortgages in default passed the subprime numbers...
it's worst in CA, Nevada and Florida...
in Nevada half the homes are behind on their payments.
we still have two more years of adjustable rate mortgages to reset, and when they do? allot of people won't qualify for a new one because one in every five homes nationwide is worth less than the mortgage on it...
the funny thing is that Obama has been in office for three weeks and people are blaming him
the other funny thing is that all these people are guilty, guilty of being optimistic and beleiving in a good future...
they shoulda been pessimists and anti-social like PM...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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quote:the other funny thing is that all these people are guilty, guilty of being optimistic and beleiving in a good future...
they shoulda been pessimists and anti-social like PM...
No, they are guilty of being ignorant and they are guilty of being deadbeats. Anyone that didn't know we were in a huge real estate bubble wasn't intelligent enough to own a house. Banks that were ignorant enough to lend money to buyers that weren't credit worthy, aren't intelligent enough to remain in business. This ain't brain surgery y'all!
Posts: 1577 | From: Ohio | Registered: Oct 2007
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It's a good thing too, because you are for sure, not a brain surgeon.
But anyway...So, if you're someone that lost their job, or someone that just got Bushhhhed, someone who's American dream turned into an American nightmare... you got to be a deadbeat.
"Nearly half of those questioned, 47 percent, worry at least somewhat about losing a job, up from 28 percent in February 2008. Nearly three-fourths, or 71 percent, say they know someone — a friend or relative — who has lost a job in the past six months because of the economy."
"Nearly two-thirds, or 62 percent, think Obama is making about the right amount of effort to cooperate with Republicans in Congress on solving the country's economic problems. About the same percentage, 64 percent, think Republicans aren't doing enough to cooperate with the Democratic president. Obama courted Republicans during negotiations on the stimulus bill, but it passed with no Republican votes in the House and just three GOP votes in the Senate."
"People don't think much of last year's $700 billion bailout for the financial industry. Nearly half, or 47 percent, say it had no real effect on the economy, and almost a third, or 32 percent, say it actually made things worse."
"Fear of being thrown out of work is so widespread that equal percentages of higher- and lower-income workers, 47 percent, worry about losing their jobs. Last year, only 20 percent of those earning $50,000 annually or more worried about joblessness, as did 35 percent of those earning less than that amount."
I wonder how many of those people are deadbeats?
Posts: 2634 | From: The highway | Registered: Feb 2004
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Then after a LOOOOONG wait for a response by PM, I posted.
"*still listening for a denial*"
And, now, after hours, with PM even posting again in this thread, I'm still waiting to hear PM's denial of what Jordan asked about.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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You must have missed it b, he said...Well said Jordan! However, you left out "helpless victims that need their socialist government to be their mother and father".
sick 'em boy...
Posts: 2634 | From: The highway | Registered: Feb 2004
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Yes, but he never actually responded to Jordan's query.
He won't, because, if he did and told the truth, he'd be admitting that he's a mean S.O.B. rather than just an ignorant and noisy conservative.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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Anyway, being that 'apparently' more people voted for Bush these last 8 yrs., I can damn well guarantee some die-hard conservative, hard working, Christians, got put out on their asses here lately. And Bush 1 thought Regan's policies were Voodoo economics... Bet he didn't even think it would have been his own squirt.lol
Posts: 2634 | From: The highway | Registered: Feb 2004
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quote:Anyway, being that 'apparently' more people voted for Bush these last 8 yrs., I can damn well guarantee some die-hard conservative, hard working, Christians, got put out on their asses here lately.
...and they won't be crying for a handout. They'll simply get another job and move on.
quote:Yes, but he never actually responded to Jordan's query.
Is there ANYONE in your house that can read and write? If so, you might have them read the posts to you, and write your posts for you. Of course, as Highway correctly pointed out, I did respond.
Posts: 1577 | From: Ohio | Registered: Oct 2007
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