There’s a term that’s commonly applied to the economic systems of some Asian and Latin American countries. It’s “crony capitalism.”
Crony capitalism is when government controls significant parts of the economy. Under this kind of bureaucratic micromanagement, politicians -- not the free market -- call the shots. And that means that the decisions that control the economy are of necessity political decisions, not economic ones.
Crony capitalism is bad for government. Economic power in the hands of politicians breeds corruption.
Crony capitalism is bad for democracy. Individuals and businesses outside favored industries have an unequal voice in self-government.
Crony capitalism is bad for business. Politicians wedded to the status quo stifle growth and innovation.
And there’s one more thing about crony capitalism: It’s come to America.
Predatory Politicians Practicing Crony Capitalism Created the Economic Crisis
It’s the nature of crony capitalism to expand -- for government to acquire more and more of the economy.
The agents of this expansion are elected officials. Call them “predatory politicians.”
Crony capitalism practiced by predatory politicians is at the root of the current financial meltdown.
In exchange for campaign cash and support for favored constituents, predatory politicians aided and abetted the government-backed Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as they created and fed the subprime mortgage market.
Now Predatory Politicians Are About to Make It Worse
And to fix the mess they created, what have predatory politicians turned to? Why, more crony capitalism of course.
First, they designed Wall Street bailouts in which a former chairman of Goldman Sachs got a blank check to disburse hundreds of billions of dollars to his former colleagues on Wall Street.
Then they took over an insurance company at a hugely inflated cost.
Now predatory politicians want taxpayers to fund a bailout of three bloated, stagnant companies that have been losing money for years, one of which is currently hemorrhaging over $1 billion a month.
The Detroit Three: An Investment Only a Predatory Politician Would Propose
To reward the unions that helped produce its electoral victory, the newly empowered Democratic Congress is proposing that American taxpayers pony up $25 billion to bail out the Detroit Three automakers, Ford, GM and Chrysler.
Democrats are using the current financial crisis as their excuse to bailout the autos. But in fact, the Detroit three were unprofitable long before the current crisis hit.
According to one economist, GM and Ford made more money-losing investments in the 1980s than any other U.S. companies. And the Detroit money pit only got deeper in the ensuing two decades. Since 1998, GM has been losing an astonishing $1.5 billion a month.
That’s an investment only a predatory politician would propose.
Bringing Fannie and Freddie Style Accountability to the Auto Industry
One of the things that makes crony capitalism so profitable for politicians is that Washington exempts itself from the economic and financial rules it imposes on private industry.
For example, in 2003, federal regulators discovered that Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac had engaged in Enron-style accounting fraud. But while executives at private companies who engaged in similar fraud went to prison -- and Congress responded by imposing the draconian and business-killing Sarbanes-Oxley bill on private businesses -- Fannie and Freddie executives barely received a slap on the wrist.
One of the reasons was House Financial Services Committee Chairman Barney Frank (D-Mass.). Frank fought tenaciously against the regulation that would have held Fannie and Freddie executives accountable and might have averted the financial crisis.
Now Chairman Frank wants to bring his particular style of crony capitalism to the auto industry.
Any Detroit Bailout Government Board Should Be Subject To Sarbanes-Oxley
On “Face the Nation” this Sunday, Chairman Frank announced that not only would he push for a taxpayer bailout of the Detroit Three during the special session of Congress this week, but he would also create a government oversight board for the three companies -- in effect, a board of directors made up of predatory politicians.
I believe that it would be a mistake for the taxpayers to be forced to bail out Detroit. Companies at which union workers make $71 an hour in wages and benefits -- compared to just $47 an hour at Toyota’s U.S. plants -- are not going to be saved by a $25 billion government check.
But if Democrats do find the votes to bring crony capitalism to Detroit, Americans should at the very least insist that any government board of directors created for the auto industry be subject to the criminal penalties and lengthy prison sentences in Sarbanes-Oxley.
What’s fair for the rest of us is fair for predatory politicians.
A Chance For President-Elect Obama to Deliver Real Change
The solution to our economic problems, be they in Detroit or on Wall Street, isn’t more crony capitalism; it’s economic growth.
While politicians in Washington are constantly calling on taxpayers to put up more and more money to bail out flagging businesses, there are practical things that wouldn't cost the taxpayers a penny that we could do to make America a better place to create jobs.
One of these things is to repeal Sarbanes-Oxley. As my wife Callista and I outline in more detail in this video, Sarbanes-Oxley has had the unintended consequences of stifling innovation, killing new business start-ups and driving listings overseas.
President-elect Obama won an historic victory two weeks ago on the promise of delivering change to the American people. Bailing out the Detroit auto dinosaurs is not change. It is crony capitalism in service of a failed status quo.
President-elect Obama should stand up to congressional Democrats and say “no” -- “no” to saddling future generations of Americans with the bill for today’s crony capitalism.
That would be change we could believe in.
Posts: 6410 | Registered: Jul 2006
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Future generations have already been saddled with a bill beyond anything in our history buy a bunch of right wing republican traitors and thieves
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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Freemarketism is bad for the world and your plea for Obama to stand for maintaining freemarketism is a demand for more of the same, not change.
So get off that right-wing freemarket bull sh-t.
Claiming Obama would, by resisting congressional efforts to put some restrictions on the run away freemarketism, that has been the instrument that brought us this mess, be changing anything, is obsurd.
We don't need more of the same and we don't need you trying to define it as change.
Or maybe you really are that dumb, in which case I apologize for insulting your intent. It then is your reasoning that is faulty.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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quote:Originally posted by a surfer: Companies at which union workers make $71 an hour in wages and benefits -- compared to just $47 an hour at Toyota’s U.S. plants --
This is the bullsh!t rhetoric that I am sick and tired of hearing...I worked for GM for 30 years and NEVER came close to making $71 an hour with any and all benefits included...That is crap being spewed by the right wing elitists that are attempting to dissolve the unions and eiminate the middle class...
Furthermore...the UAW, GM, Ford, and Chrysler negotiated NEW contracts in 2007...New hires now make $14 an hour with NO retirement benefits and reduced health care benefits...
The problems the automakers are facing right now are NOT the fault of the companies OR the unions...The problems are direct result of the financial meltdown and unfair trade agreements that have been orchestrated by the scumbag right wing POS mentioned above...
Another thing...Obama isn't going to do sh!t to solve any of your problems, because he too is OWNED...
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It's all in the timing... Posts: 4303 | From: DSA | Registered: Dec 2003
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recently i saw a car in the mall that you enter to win in a drawing, i belive it was a hummer.. and with 0 miles it was leaking oil on the mall floor.. it would be funny if it wasnt true.
-------------------- "Gentleman, you have come sixty days too late. The depression is over." Herbert Hoover 1930 Posts: 678 | From: currently in hiding due to investigation | Registered: Oct 2004
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quote:Originally posted by a surfer: Companies at which union workers make $71 an hour in wages and benefits -- compared to just $47 an hour at Toyota’s U.S. plants --
This is the bullsh!t rhetoric that I am sick and tired of hearing...I worked for GM for 30 years and NEVER came close to making $71 an hour with any and all benefits included...That is crap being spewed by the right wing elitists that are attempting to dissolve the unions and eiminate the middle class...
Furthermore...the UAW, GM, Ford, and Chrysler negotiated NEW contracts in 2007...New hires now make $14 an hour with NO retirement benefits and reduced health care benefits...
The problems the automakers are facing right now are NOT the fault of the companies OR the unions...The problems are direct result of the financial meltdown and unfair trade agreements that have been orchestrated by the scumbag right wing POS mentioned above...
Another thing...Obama isn't going to do sh!t to solve any of your problems, because he too is OWNED...
More right wing rhetoric? I got to ask you, you mention in another post about buying American, and I agree 100%.
Also thanks to BILL CLINTON we exploded trade with China with the whole favored nation mess. Now we import massive amounts more than we export. NAFTA the shafta....the Clintons sold out on America. Now blow job bill who disgraced the oval office is making big bucks speaking.
Retired, you are not going to like what I am about to write so be forewarned.
I really think that buying American also means the ability to have so many options. So many different choices. Right now I drive a lexus. My next car? Out of symbolism it will be an American owned. Notice I dont say American made because they have plants in MEXICO!!!!
I wont by a Ford or GM product based on reliability because that has been proven. Not by fault of the worker but by the designer. American engineers really screwed up by letter Japanese reliability surpass them. I have had 10 cars so far in my lifetime. The Japanese cars have been Mitsubishi (total crap) Honda (amazing reliability and gas mileage) and Lexus (basically a fancy Toyota) and again amazing reliability and good gas mileage.
My American cars have been Mustangs (several) and 1 Chevy Camaro. These cars were in the shop more than they could be driven. Always a check engine light on, always something going out or some cheap part breaking.
Growing up my dad always bought American. We had Chrysler mini vans with the sliding doors which was so cool back then for our family. The engines were complete crap, and again always in the shop. The big conversion vans were always breaking down. My friends in high school who said I had a jap trap Nissan Pulsar found themselves unable to start their cars or found smoking engines while I drove past them no problem. Then I remember when I was 15 in 1995 my dad bought a brand new Jeep Grand Cherokee. I thought it was the coolest thing ever. Turned out to be a real piece of work. After 50,000 miles the damn thing just started falling apart. Even the radio went out. A/C, heater core, everything. The Jeep was very expensive to drive, and we had taken such good care of it.
After that it was no more American cars. Guess my parents got tired of spending thousands per year on repairs and maintenance. After the switch from that to Honda and Lexus there were never any problems, and a full tank of gas lasted longer too. Regular maintenance meant you had little chance of random failure unlike previous cars we dealt with.
I never saw it as a import vs American issue. I wanted what was most economical. Now I dont care, and plan on buying a diesel truck probably an F-250 or Ram 2500 in summer 2009 for business. Maybe I will buy a Hummer so I can be the big evil right wing earth destroyer since hummers produce more pollution than volcano islands.
As much as the Mustangs and Camaro would break down there sure wasnt anything better than being at a red light next to a Honda that sounded like a weed whacker. Him reving his 4 banger up to show off for his girl while her panties get wet by the vibration of my V-8 with flowmaster exhaust.
Since you are a retired worker of the industry, I have to ask you something. Did the union ever demand better ENINGEERING from the auto companies? Did you ever sit there and wonder "why are these cars designed the way they are sometimes?"
I always saw unions going on strike all the time on the news growing up with the claycomo plant here in Kansas City. So naturally as I grew older the word union was immediately associated with strike. Never thought much of it though. Took a tour of the plant in junior high and had a lot of fun. Got to see some Grand Prixs being made. Some people said you dont ever want to buy an American car made on Monday morning or Friday afternoon. Never paid much attention to that though.
Do I think they should fail? Well, I instinctively am against helping a company that has failed over and over. The CEOs should be ousted immediately for being such idiots. They fly to DC to ask for billions on corporate jets, get scolded, then ride in cars the next time, ask for more billions, and say: "see daddy we are good boys we rode in our new eco cars."
Give me a Fn Break. Those guys are overpaid big time and are some arrogant sons of *****es.
They should lend the money on the condition that the CEOs step down, and the entire board of directors does too for extreme incompetence for not kicking such idiots out.
Now retiredat49, what is this thing where laid off workers get 95% of their wages paid to them while they dont work? Keep hearing about it on TV but dont know much. They keep saying that the costs of the union demands get passed down to the consumer.
The Japanese car makers seem to be doing ok. They arent going to their capital or to Washington saying if they dont get billions by the end of the year their company will fail.
Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
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The engines were complete crap, and again always in the shop. The big conversion vans were always breaking down.
i've put at least a million miles on FORD products. Pick'emups, explorer, i even have a conversion right now that is in awesome condition and over 150,000 mile.
when MY stuff has gone to the shop? the service managers have always tried to jerk me around, until i mention that i put 1964 289HP heads on a 1970 351W with forged flat-tops to make 12 to one compressionon offa all stock parts. then my repairs suddenly don't seem to be so major.
seems to me that service mangers across the country have made alotta dough by convincing people they bought junk when they didn't...
Ford did have some serious problems for a couple of years when they switched to timing belts (i hate em) and they've also had some problems in the PAST with head gaskets shredding due to incomaptible metal expansions between the block and ht heads. the problems were solved fairly quickly in both cases...
Taurus SHO? too much motor for the transmissions... junk? no.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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MARK PHELAN 7 myths about Detroit automakers BY MARK PHELAN • FREE PRESS COLUMNIST • December 5, 2008
Read Comments(288)Recommend(54)Print this page E-mail this article Share this article: Del.icio.us Facebook Digg Reddit Newsvine Buzz up! This column by Free Press auto critic Mark Phelan originally was published on Nov. 17 and has been updated.
Shop Proud with New Program that Benefits the Troops Checklist to Boost your Credit Score Working Moms Can Win a $10,000 Scholarship The debate over aid to the Detroit-based automakers is awash with half-truths and misrepresentations that are endlessly repeated by everyone from members of Congress to journalists. Here are seven myths about the companies and their vehicles, and the reality in each case.
Myth No. 1: Nobody buys their vehicles Reality: General Motors Corp., Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC sold 8.5 million vehicles in the United States last year and millions more around the world. GM outsold Toyota by about 1.2 million vehicles in the United States last year and holds a U.S. lead over Toyota of nearly 700,000 so far this year. Globally, GM in 2007 remained the world's largest automaker, selling 9,369,524 vehicles worldwide -- about 3,000 more than Toyota.
Ford outsold Honda by about 850,000 and Nissan by more than 1.3 million vehicles in the United States last year.
Chrysler sold more vehicles here than Nissan and Hyundai combined in 2007 and so far this year.
Myth No. 2: They build unreliable junk Reality: The creaky, leaky vehicles of the 1980s and '90s are long gone. Consumer Reports recently found that "Ford's reliability is now on par with good Japanese automakers."
The independent J.D. Power Initial Quality Study scored Buick, Cadillac, Chevrolet, Ford, GMC, Mercury, Pontiac and Lincoln brands' overall quality as high as or higher than that of Acura, Audi, BMW, Honda, Nissan, Scion, Volkswagen and Volvo.
J.D. Power rated the Chevrolet Malibu the highest-quality midsize sedan. Both the Malibu and Ford Fusion scored better than the Honda Accord and Toyota Camry.
Myth No. 3: They build gas-guzzlers Reality: All of the Detroit Three build midsize sedans that the Environmental Protection Agency rates at 29-33 miles per gallon on the highway.
The most fuel-efficient Chevrolet Malibu gets 33 m.p.g. on the highway, 2 m.p.g. better than the best Honda Accord. The most fuel-efficient Ford Focus has the same highway fuel economy ratings as the most efficient Toyota Corolla. The most fuel-efficient Chevrolet Cobalt has the same city fuel economy and better highway fuel economy than the most efficient non-hybrid Honda Civic.
A recent study by Edmunds.com found that the Chevrolet Aveo subcompact is the least expensive car to buy and operate.
Myth No. 4: They already got a $25-billion bailout Reality: None of that money has been lent out and may not be for more than a year. In addition, it can, by law, be used only to invest in future vehicles and technology, so it has no effect on the shortage of operating cash the companies face because of the economic slowdown that's killing them now.
Myth No. 5: GM, Ford and Chrysler are idiots for investing in pickups and SUVs Reality: The domestics' lineup has been truck-heavy, but Toyota, Nissan, Mercedes-Benz and BMW have spent billions of dollars on pickups and SUVs because trucks are a large and historically profitable part of the auto industry.
The most fuel-efficient full-size pickups from GM, Ford and Chrysler all have higher EPA fuel-economy ratings than Toyota and Nissan's full-size pickups.
Myth No. 6: They don't build hybrids Reality: The Detroit Three got into the hybrid business late, but Ford and GM each now offers more hybrid models than Honda or Nissan, with several more due to hit the road in early 2009.
Myth No. 7: Their union workers are lazy and overpaid Reality: Chrysler tied Toyota as the most productive automaker in North America this year, according to the Harbour Report on manufacturing, which measures the amount of work done per employee. Eight of the 10 most productive vehicle assembly plants in North America belong to Chrysler, Ford or GM.
The oft-cited $70-an-hour wage and benefit figure for UAW workers inaccurately adds benefits that millions of retirees get to the pay of current workers, but divides the total only by current employees. That's like assuming you get your parents' retirement and Social Security benefits in addition to your own income.
Hourly pay for assembly line workers tops out around $28; benefits add about $14. New hires at the Detroit Three get $14 an hour. There's no pension or health care when they retire, but benefits raise their total hourly compensation to $29 while they're working. UAW wages are now comparable with Toyota workers, according to a Free Press analysis.
Contact MARK PHELAN at 313-222-6731 or phelan*freepress.com.
If this is so and I believe it is why are the big three in the crapper?
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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But the facts won't faze the republican freemarket worshipers. They have concockted their lies to attack and destroy the unions and only listen to Fat Rush the Doper and the blathering Prince of Ignorance, Sean Hanity, and other republican propaganda heads.
Something that they like to completely ignore is the fact that those foreign auto plants here, particularly the Japanese ones, only assemble cars, using all the parts manufactured in Japan, where the workers get lower wages than american workers, but full health coverage for life from the government.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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Myth No. 1: Nobody buys their vehicles Reality: General Motors Corp., Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC sold 8.5 million vehicles in the United States last year and millions more around the world. GM outsold Toyota by about 1.2 million vehicles in the United States last year and holds a U.S. lead over Toyota of nearly 700,000 so far this year. Globally, GM in 2007 remained the world's largest automaker, selling 9,369,524 vehicles worldwide -- about 3,000 more than Toyota.
Ford outsold Honda by about 850,000 and Nissan by more than 1.3 million vehicles in the United States last year.
Chrysler sold more vehicles here than Nissan and Hyundai combined in 2007 and so far this year.
Well, the argument of buying American made cars to save the industry just went out the window retiredat49.
-------------------- Buy Low. Sell High. Posts: 10754 | From: The Land Of The Giants | Registered: Feb 2005
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"car czar" to oversee the rescue plan and would require each automaker --
oh yeah, that's the answer, why don't we just allow the drug czar to do double duty... then it will at least still be "free-market" in reality, if not in name
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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Hey glass, do they still have a drug czar? Why the hell would they use the word czar in America anyway for a government position that doesnt sound right at all!
War on drugs has failed. Either do it right or dont do it at all.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so. Posts: 6949 | Registered: Apr 2004
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December 8, 2008, 12:23 pm Drug Czar Controversy By John Tierney
Representative Jim Ramstad, a Republican from Minnesota, is a candidate to become the next drug czar — the director of the office of National Drug Control Policy. In a joint letter to President-elect Barack Obama, coordinated by Andrew Tatarsky, the past president of the division of addictions of the New York State Psychological Association, dozens of academics and other professionals in substance-abuse treatment write:
This country needs a drug czar who supports evidence-based policies and one who will make decisions based on science, not politics or ideology. We strongly believe that Congressman Ramstad is not that person.
Rep. Ramstad voted in 1998 in favor of making permanent the federal funding ban on syringe exchange. In 2000, he voted to prohibit the District of Columbia from spending its own locally-raised funds on syringe exchange programs, and in 2007, he voted against lifting the same DC ban, despite decades of research showing that syringe exchange programs reduce the spread of HIV/AIDS, save lives, save money, and do not increase drug use. Representative Ramstad has also consistently opposed congressional efforts to stop the arrest of patients with HIV/AIDS, cancer, and other illnesses who use medical marijuana to ease their pain and suffering in states where it is legal.
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: Myth No. 1: Nobody buys their vehicles Reality: General Motors Corp., Ford Motor Co. and Chrysler LLC sold 8.5 million vehicles in the United States last year and millions more around the world. GM outsold Toyota by about 1.2 million vehicles in the United States last year and holds a U.S. lead over Toyota of nearly 700,000 so far this year. Globally, GM in 2007 remained the world's largest automaker, selling 9,369,524 vehicles worldwide -- about 3,000 more than Toyota.
Ford outsold Honda by about 850,000 and Nissan by more than 1.3 million vehicles in the United States last year.
Chrysler sold more vehicles here than Nissan and Hyundai combined in 2007 and so far this year.
Well, the argument of buying American made cars to save the industry just went out the window retiredat49.
Peaser...you evidently have no intention of learning the truth here...
keep believing what you want or what you are being told, but when your job is gone or you are required to take a 50% pay cut...DON'T look for sympathy here...
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It's all in the timing... Posts: 4303 | From: DSA | Registered: Dec 2003
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IMO, the only way that congress could get Bush to approve this was to let him put someone in charge of overseeing how the funds should be used. However, once these funds are used up, the next request for a "loan" might just result in a new, or an additional "car czar" apointee(s)...
-------------------- Buy Low. Sell High. Posts: 10754 | From: The Land Of The Giants | Registered: Feb 2005
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All reason says we should bail them out and we will.
But saying no just seems to come out easy
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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The purpose IS NOT to save the auto makers, but to salvage some part of the economy.
Just because some irresponsible drunken fool managed to set his house ablaze is no reason to cheer on the fire 'til it burns the house to the foundation and claim he deserves it. First get in there and rescue the children that were innocently sleeping when papa chunked the capped empty gin bottle in the fire place, which, with heat, explode scattering burning coals about the room.
If, in order to save those children, you must stop the fire and save papa having a total loss, so be it.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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agreed the purpose is to salvage a big section of the economy.
This is just not the right time to add more unemployment to the roles and ruin a host of towns in the mid west.
Not only to mention our heritage and pride as a nation.
Don't forgrt that thease same corporations helped us win WWII.
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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Well I know that they made money and grew but it was our superior industrial power that made the difference
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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Almost every one of the foreign car plants in the U.S. is funded constantly by enormous tax breaks given by the states in which they are located.
Maybe Congress should pass a law requiring them to pay exactly the same taxes the Big Three have to pay, no matter what the state of county want to give them?
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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what a country its elected leaders have there states give tax breaks to foriegn auto plants to compete with the domestic industry of the same. Buy the product with tax dollars to add to the state and county fleets until they are choking on foriegn cars
And they try to put them out of business to get rid of the compition.
Who needs terrorist we have our very own leaders to finish us off. Is there really another country on the face of the esrth that does that great little piece of statesmanship as well we do. What an American Shelby snd his bunch are.
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise. Posts: 3827 | From: beautiful California | Registered: Sep 2008
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Yeah, bond, but those same leaders have brought us terrorist too!
I had direct dealings with Dick Shelby back when he was still a state senator. Dick is a good name for the two faced lying jerk.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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quote:Originally posted by bdgee: The purpose IS NOT to save the auto makers, but to salvage some part of the economy.
Just because some irresponsible drunken fool managed to set his house ablaze is no reason to cheer on the fire 'til it burns the house to the foundation and claim he deserves it. First get in there and rescue the children that were innocently sleeping when papa chunked the capped empty gin bottle in the fire place, which, with heat, explode scattering burning coals about the room.
If, in order to save those children, you must stop the fire and save papa having a total loss, so be it.
How is a bailout of the American Auto Industry going to work if the biggest reason they aren't competative is their union agreements, and the unions aren't willing to compromise on a package that will work? The unions will force the hands of management and drive them into BK and then they'll be left with the scraps to pick thru.
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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How is a bailout of the American Auto Industry going to work if the biggest reason they aren't competative is their union agreements, and the unions aren't willing to compromise on a package that will work? The unions will force the hands of management and drive them into BK and then they'll be left with the scraps to pick thru.
because the compettitors all have socialised medicine?
and govt help ALREADY?
how many times do i have to explain this?
you don't send a middle weight fighter (non-govt industry) against heavy weight govt subsidised industry...
all of our compettitors are govt subsidized to the hilt. we aren't.
it's a fight.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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How is a bailout of the American Auto Industry going to work if the biggest reason they aren't competative is their union agreements, and the unions aren't willing to compromise on a package that will work? The unions will force the hands of management and drive them into BK and then they'll be left with the scraps to pick thru.
because the compettitors all have socialised medicine?
and govt help ALREADY?
how many times do i have to explain this?
you don't send a middle weight fighter (non-govt industry) against heavy weight govt subsidised industry...
all of our compettitors are govt subsidized to the hilt. we aren't.
it's a fight.
It makes no difference what the other guys have. The unions in America have to deal with this situation and it requires compromise, plain and simple.
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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It makes no difference what the other guys have. The unions in America have to deal with this situation and it requires compromise, plain and simple.
the parts of the union agreements that are "bad" are health and pensions.
i got news for you, the health concerns US all. you are forcing socilaised medicine if you cut costs there.
and pensions? the Japanese have govt pensions.
you are demanding the very things that you fear as a "free-marketeer"...
you want blood in the streets? kill the unions.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise. Posts: 36378 | From: USA | Registered: Sep 2003
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Glass, If they want their jobs there's going to have to be some deal with the company or it dies.
They can try and work something out now or when the go into BK. And can you believe they are putting earmarks in this bailout bill that will give Judges a cost of living increase. What a bunch of clowns we have in office.
-------------------- Let's Go METS!!! Posts: 3317 | From: CT | Registered: Dec 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Lockman: Glass, If they want their jobs there's going to have to be some deal with the company or it dies.
They can try and work something out now or when the go into BK. And can you believe they are putting earmarks in this bailout bill that will give Judges a cost of living increase. What a bunch of clowns we have in office.
Less than 10% of the cost of a manufacturing a vehicle from the Big Three is labor cost. That's of the cost, mot the selling price. It's way less than 10% of the selling price, maybe 6%. So, if you are planning, as the republicans are, of reducing that cost by about 1/3rd, then you are suggesting that lowering the price of a car by less than around 1.5%% is all that is needed to save the American auto industry.
That truly stupid and irresponsible. It's also un-American.
And you are one sick jerkoff that has no idea what you are talking about.
Posts: 11304 | From: Fort Worth, Texas | Registered: Mar 2005
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