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glassman
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Palin's record isn't all that great.

she raised the tax on oil co's and gave the cash to her constituents.


sound familiar?

isn't this the big complaint against Obama?

she got where she is by back-stabbing (if you're part of the GOP power structure)she's even campaigning against her own party now...

that's easier to get away with in a small town than it is in Wash DC... Alaska is a small town with very long streets, Memphis has as many people as Alaska does...

it's not likely she will be able to garner any party power because nobody will trust her...

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Lockman
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PALIN has her fault's and I can't say I agree with everything she says, but I feel she was attacked from the beginning and never really given a chance to learn how to face the national media.
Joe Biden has made many gaffs during the last couple of months and there dismissed as that's just Joe.

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ohio_trader
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if any republican ever won this election after all the complaining about bush then the democratic party should be broken up for ever!

golf term and very appropriate to this election- this was A TAP IN!

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Lockman
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quote:
Originally posted by ohio_trader:
if any republican ever won this election after all the complaining about bush then the democrat party should be broken up for ever!

golf term and very appropriate to this election- this was A TAP IN!

Your right.

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wallymac
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I believe that Obama will win and that the Democrats will have a large Majority in Congress.

With the number of problems they will be facing, thanks to Bush, they will not be able to push most of the programs that might have in other years.

2 years from now. I'm sure Congress will look much different than it does when Obama takes office. THe reason I say that is that the Right will jump all over the fact that Obama and the Dem's won't be able to fix the problems in the 18 months leading up to the Mid Term elections.

Heck, in reality I doubt that either party could fix what ails the country during the full 4 yr term. There is just too much damage control to be done. It won't matter that it took 8 yrs to get into the mess, all that will matter is that there isn't a quick fix.

As far as campaign promises, get real. Even the Conservative Icon, Ronald Reagan didn't live up to his campaign promises. (see the article link below).

So McCain, a Reaganite, and many of today's conservatives that idolize Reagan say that taxing corporations is bad economics. How can that be:
"Reagan continued these "modest rollbacks" in his second term. The historic Tax Reform Act of 1986, though it achieved the supply side goal of lowering individual income tax rates, was a startlingly progressive reform. The plan imposed the largest corporate tax increase in history--an act utterly unimaginable for any conservative to support today. Just two years after declaring, "there is no justification" for taxing corporate income, Reagan raised corporate taxes by $120 billion over five years and closed corporate tax loopholes worth about $300 billion over that same period. In addition to broadening the tax base, the plan increased standard deductions and personal exemptions to the point that no family with an income below the poverty line would have to pay federal income tax. Even at the time, conservatives within Reagan's administration were aghast. According to Wall Street Journal reporters Jeffrey Birnbaum and Alan Murray, whose book Showdown at Gucci Gulch chronicles the 1986 measure, "the conservative president's support for an effort once considered the bastion of liberals carried tremendous symbolic significance." When Reagan's conservative acting chief economic adviser, William Niskanen, was apprised of the plan he replied, "Walter Mondale would have been proud."(see complete article link below)

http://www.washingtonmonthly.com/features/2001/0301.green.html

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bdgee
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Careful, wallymac. It's one thing to point out a king has no clothes, but Reagan is their god.
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glassman
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the Right will jump all over the fact that Obama and the Dem's won't be able to fix the problems in the 18 months

LOL, that's nothing. i was listening to a net broadcast yesterday where the whole sub-prime crisis was blamed on Carter. And it's funny cuz it is a pretty serious broadcast with a lot of criticism of the market problems

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Peaser
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Neither candidate can fix this mess anytime soon, not even in the next four years IMO.

I wonder how long social security will be thrown on the back burner for? I guess untill it actually fails.

My guess is that it will be a major issue in the next election.

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osubucks30
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Obama: 348 McCain: 190

Popular vote: Obama: 52 McCain: 46

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osubucks30
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Tax cuts under Obama. (Unless you make $250,000 a year)See what you would get!

Link:
http://taxcut.barackobama.com/

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a surfer
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quote:
Originally posted by osubucks30:
Tax cuts under Obama. (Unless you make $250,000 a year)See what you would get!

Link:
http://taxcut.barackobama.com/

Tax cuts under Obama. LOL

Isn't that an oxymoron...

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bdgee
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"Tax cuts under Obama. LOL

Isn't that an oxymoron..."

Absolutely not.

Only one so the narrow minded that they refuse to check it out or the hopelessly undereducated that can't do the simple arithmetic or won't go to one of the many non-partisan sites that will and have done it for them can believe that lie.

In other words, only an outré-moron could imagine a tax cut under Obama's plan could be an oxymoron.

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Propertymanager
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Well, actually the numbers keep changing. It started out at $250K, then $200K, then $150K, now $120K...and that's what they're willing to admit. The truth is that when they allow the Bush tax cuts to expire and Osama Obama raises taxes, almost everyone that works will get a tax increase. But the good news is that those that are too lazy to work will get a tax cut......oops, I guess they can't get a tax cut if they don't pay taxes. The lazy people will get a "share the wealth" welfare check!
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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
Well, actually the numbers keep changing. It started out at $250K, then $200K, then $150K, now $120K...and that's what they're willing to admit. The truth is that when they allow the Bush tax cuts to expire and Osama Obama raises taxes, almost everyone that works will get a tax increase. But the good news is that those that are too lazy to work will get a tax cut......oops, I guess they can't get a tax cut if they don't pay taxes. The lazy people will get a "share the wealth" welfare check!

they only changed if you watch Fox "News"

the lying over there is so intense, they've lost track of even what they have said...

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Peaser
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Didn't Biden just recently contradict Obama's $250K no tax increase number?

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Propertymanager
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Yes, Biden, Richardson, and even Obama have contradicted the $250K. The truth is that almost everyone paying taxes will end up with a tax increase. That's ok, it's our civic duty to share our wealth with those that are too lazy to work!
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glassman
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it's in the semantics.

"What we're saying is, that $87 billion tax break doesn't need to go to people making an average of $1.4 million," Biden said.

"It should go to middle-class people, people who make $150,000 a year."

Actually, Barack Obama has promised to cut taxes on households earning less than $200,000 a year while raising taxes on those who make more than $250,000 annually.


there's big difference between saying your taxes won't go up (at 200-250) and saying your taxes will go down at 150...


"Senator Obama has made a lot of promises. First, he said people making less than $250,000 would benefit from his plan.

"Then, this weekend, he announced in an ad that if you're a family making less than $200,000 you'll benefit - but yesterday right here in Pennsylvania, Senator Biden said tax relief should only go to 'middle-class people' - people making under $150,000 a year.


http://www.nypost.com/seven/10292008/news/politics/biden_blows_fuzzy_tax_math_13 5787.htm

everybody wants to twist the words into lies when they are perfeclty consistent...

if you make 150K$? your taxes will go dwon..

if you make 200K$? they WON'T and Obama never said they would...

this seems to confuse the feebs...

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Peaser
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So then FOX news is accurate in that statement, according to the NY Post?

Has Biden come out and mentioned any mis-statements on his part?

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Peaser:
So then FOX news is accurate in that statement.

which?

i watch Fox "news" constantly...


what i hear is the same stuff PM is saying...

Obama never said your taxes would go down if you make 250K$ that i heard..

it's a progressive thing just like it alwyas has been...

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
Yes, Biden, Richardson, and even Obama have contradicted the $250K. The truth is that almost everyone paying taxes will end up with a tax increase. That's ok, it's our civic duty to share our wealth with those that are too lazy to work!

Obama campaign spokesman Tommy Vietor issued a statement that corrected the vice-presidential candidate without explicitly saying so.

"No family making less than $250,000 will see their tax increases one cent," Vietor said. "And if your family makes less than $200,000 - as 95 percent of workers and their families do - you'll get a tax cut."

from the same article as above...

PM you don't even have clue what honesty means..

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Propertymanager
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...and then Richardson, another Obama surrogate said $120K. They can't get the numbers straight because it's all a big lie! If you work hard and pay taxes, YOUR taxes are going up. If you're a lazy deadbeat, you're getting an additional welfare check.
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Peaser
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Reversing the Bush tax breaks wouldn't have anything to do with it by chance?

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Propertymanager:
...and then Richardson, another Obama surrogate said $120K. They can't get the numbers straight because it's all a big lie! If you work hard and pay taxes, YOUR taxes are going up. If you're a lazy deadbeat, you're getting an additional welfare check.

once again? mentioning a pay level and saying that that pay level will get a tax decrease doesn't mean that it's the "cutoff point"

and i have a difficult time understanding how stupid you would have to be to attempt to make the leap...

of course if you want Mccain to be president than you might try to make up lies.

thing is? America is tired of being lied to...

it's not as though Obama has some sort of magic truth gene in him... but he just hasn't bene running a campaign on lies.. like everybody else has for the last.... well,forever..

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Peaser
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but he just hasn't bene running a campaign on lies..

No one can say that for sure just yet.

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Peaser:
but he just hasn't bene running a campaign on lies..

No one can say that for sure just yet.

i agree absolutely Peaser.

it's not like i'm campaigning for him (in spite of what some feebs would think) i'm just interested in sorting thru the lies.

for all i know? he will raise taxes on everybody...

in '04? when Bush got re-elected? 70% of America still beleived that sadam was involved in 9-11.. today ? about 5% do...

thing is? there was a Senate (GOP run) report out for four months before the election that said in plain english that Sadam was not involved...

when you go into the booth? there's nobody else there to see who you vote for.

but as for spreading lies? it's just wrong...

when Obama's tax plan cam e out? there was no trillion dollar bailout...

i fully expect Obama will not be out of Iraq in 16 months like he's said he would be.. and he knows it. and it's going to piss off his own people... it's not going to piss me off, cuz i'm not "one of his people"...

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Peaser
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I watch Fox most of the time, sometimes CNN.

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glassman
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LOL... Hannity has some guy on right now already blaming the coming depression on Obama... what a hoot.. boy am i scared.... [Eek!]

i can't beleive they pay this guy money to get on TV...

he "earns" how many millions a year? it's more like selling your soul than anything else..

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by Peaser:
I watch Fox most of the time, sometimes CNN.

i switch 'em around every few minutes... NPR. MSNBS CNBC CNN and Fox...

i wish my cable co. would get bloomberg, they seem to be th emost unbiased of any of them...

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Propertymanager
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Here's the video of Osama Obama and all his surrogates quoting the tax cut numbers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TihPRGlYH0o

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Peaser
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Almost forgot CNBC, lol watch that just about every day for hours.

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Peaser
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Hannity was just upset, he doesn't want to pay more in taxes...

He also just brought up Reagan, and what he did when he first took over. lol

I wonder what our national debt will climb to when we finally get it on with Iran? I don't even wanna think about it. We might just have to confiscate the oil in that one... [Big Grin]

Maybe make Iran a US territory, in some twisted way.

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Peaser
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"Read my lips, no new taxes." [Wall Bang]

- Bush Sr.

Wait and see if we'll see any new famous quotes in the upcoming term.

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bdgee
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PM, you are a dimwit at most.

If you ask a man if he is 6 feet tall and says "Yes", it is not a lie becausae he is 6'3". He is also five feet tall and four feet tall and so on.

If a 30 year old man says he is eligible to buy beer because the law says it is illegal to sell it to anyone under 21, he is not declaring he is only 21.

You are a joke.

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Peaser
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--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
glassman writes:
but he just hasn't bene running a campaign on lies..

Peaser reply:
No one can say that for sure just yet.


glassman writes:
i agree absolutely Peaser.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

When did you become sarcastic? [BadOne]

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glassman
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When did you become sarcastic?

sarcastic? who? me? [Big Grin] heck, i like paying taxes. i want to give all my money to the lazy poor people...

you know what?, i think i'll take a second job just so i can give more alms....

truth is? i'm not too excited about either one...

i am pretty "excited" about the bull crap tho...

people are all worried about paying the Govt bills all of a sudden? why? "they"'ll just print more money...

isn't that what "they"'ve been doing all along?

and voting? what's the big deal? your vote doesn't count. "they" decide in the back room and tell us whatever the count "they" decided upon...


one day a few weeks ago? Bush said "they" need 700 billion$ and after a few days arguing? "they" got it...

and then "they" crashed the DOW just to prove "they" needed the money...

why on earth does anybody thing McCain or Obama matter? both of 'em'll just do whatever "they" tell 'em to [Big Grin]


you know what i don't get? why isn't anybody asking WHO it was that was on the winning side of all the CDS'es? somebody is actually making billions offa "they" and i haven't heard one single person ask who is on the winning side of the trade...
instead? the pundits want to villify Obama or Mccai depending on which station they work at...

i guess i'm just geting to be too jaded...

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