posted
I can see it now....Obama loses and the urban areas of major cities cry racism and start rioting. Honestly I guess I dont see anything on the scale of Rodney King, but I am about 98% sure it would get rather ugly. Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton, and Rev Wright will all be out marching say it was rigged to keep the "black man down".
Police prepare for unrest By Alexander Bolton Posted: 10/21/08 07:58 PM [ET] Police departments in cities across the country are beefing up their ranks for Election Day, preparing for possible civil unrest and riots after the historic presidential contest.
Public safety officials said in interviews with The Hill that the election, which will end with either the nation’s first black president or its first female vice president, demanded a stronger police presence.
Some worry that if Barack Obama loses and there is suspicion of foul play in the election, violence could ensue in cities with large black populations. Others based the need for enhanced patrols on past riots in urban areas (following professional sports events) and also on Internet rumors.
Democratic strategists and advocates for black voters say they understand officers wanting to keep the peace, but caution that excessive police presence could intimidate voters.
Sen. Obama (Ill.), the Democratic nominee for president, has seen his lead over rival Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) grow in recent weeks, prompting speculation that there could be a violent backlash if he loses unexpectedly.
Cities that have suffered unrest before, such as Detroit, Chicago, Oakland and Philadelphia, will have extra police deployed.
In Oakland, the police will deploy extra units trained in riot control, as well as extra traffic police, and even put SWAT teams on standby.
“Are we anticipating it will be a riot situation? No. But will we be prepared if it goes awry? Yes,” said Jeff Thomason, spokesman for the Oakland Police Department.
“I think it is a big deal — you got an African-American running and [a] woman running,” he added, in reference to Obama and GOP vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin. “Whoever wins it, it will be a national event. We will have more officers on the street in anticipation that things may go south.”
The Oakland police last faced big riots in 2003 when the Raiders lost to the Tampa Bay Buccaneers in the Super Bowl. Officials are bracing themselves in case residents of Oakland take Obama’s loss badly.
Political observers such as Hilary Shelton and James Carville fear that record voter turnout could overload polling places on Election Day and could raise tension levels.
Shelton, the director of the NAACP’s Washington bureau, said inadequate voting facilities is a bigger problem in poor communities with large numbers of minorities.
“What are local election officials doing to prepare for what people think will be record turnout at the polls?” said Shelton, who added that during the 2004 election in Ohio voters in predominantly black communities had to wait in line six to eight hours to vote.
“On Election Day, if this continues, you may have some tempers flare; we should be prepared to deal with that but do it without intimidation,” said Shelton, who added that police have to be able to maintain order at polling stations without scaring voters, especially immigrants from “police states.”
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.
IP: Logged |
posted
If McCain wins it will and should be crazy. No way McCain should win. I see we are starting to get polls in that say its about even. That is a joke!! Just covering there buts so if McCain wins they can say the polls showed the race tightening!!
IP: Logged |
The AP-GfK survey included interviews with a nationally representative random sample totaling 1,101 adults, including 931 registered voters and 800 adults deemed likely to vote. For the entire sample, the survey showed Obama ahead 47 percent to 37 percent. He was up by five points among all registered voters, including the likely voters.
Looks to me like they are screwing with the numbers claiming its 44-43. Like I said laughable!!
IP: Logged |
posted
The closing poll numbers are actually rather interesting. McCain is somewhat of a comeback kid. I just wish he would have picked Mitt Romney, then I would have felt somewhat safer with him winning as far as the economy goes.
Of course, liberals would be VERY butt hurt to have Mitt around. Regardless of where he goes to church I could care less, the man is a financial genius.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.
IP: Logged |
His entire youth seems to have comprised a series of misadventures--including basically walking away from one of the Navy's largest on-ship accidents--yet being "rescued" by the prominence and reputations of his father and grandfather.
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
IP: Logged |
posted
I wasnt really thinking that far back Tex. I was thinking more about when his campaign was broke, and everyone was telling him to quit. He didnt quit, and look what it got him...although I had hoped for a different Republican pick myself.
posted
Oh I think a lot more people were rootin for Obama than most people think. He was popular before he really hit mainstream. Hillary has an amazing loyal base, but she couldnt get them all. It really came down to likeability. As much as I despise Hillary she is technically more qualified to be President than Obama. However, there are a lot of people who see her as an evil witch.
-------------------- It isn't so much that liberals are ignorant. It's just that they know so many things that aren't so.
IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: I wasnt really thinking that far back Tex. I was thinking more about when his campaign was broke, and everyone was telling him to quit. He didnt quit, and look what it got him...although I had hoped for a different Republican pick myself.
McCain's "comback" on the republican primary was not so much an actual comeback or victory as it was an example of the one fool among a bunch that was unable to recognize that the road they were traveling was dooming them to failure. Everyone else stopped dreaming a lie that the Party hadn't brutally and hatefully failed the people and, as a result, the people were about to deal it a loosing hand, whoever was left at the end.
IP: Logged |
quote:Democratic strategists and advocates for black voters say they understand officers wanting to keep the peace, but caution that excessive police presence could intimidate voters.
Why would a police presence intimidate honest voters? Are they trying to say that they are afraid that a police presence will cut down on all the leftist FRAUD? If so, GOOD!
IP: Logged |
It isn't fraud from anyone but the right-wing that is a problem. It's the rigging of the last two presidential elections that cause the concern and you know it.
"Why would a police presence intimidate honest voters?"
They do it so democratic votes can't be made or tallied, so as to throw the election to the republicans, as was the case in 2004 in Ohio.
IP: Logged |
quote:They do it so democratic votes can't be made or tallied, so as to throw the election to the republicans, as was the case in 2004 in Ohio.
That's ridiculous! The police don't prevent democrats from voting. Everyone that is legally allowed to vote can still vote even if the police are standing nearby. How would the police know who a person is going to vote for? How would the police know whether a person is registered as a democrat or republican? I'm registered as a democrat and I guarantee you that the police won't stop me from voting!!!
IP: Logged |
In Ohio in 2004 and in Florida in 200 they harassed and stymied black voters so they couldn't get into the polls to vote.
Hahahahaha
You registered as a democrat? That just goes to show how lenient the democratic party is and how dishonest you are. (I have no doubt you "registered" as a democrat to falsely abuse the primary system. It is a standard "dirty trick" of far right-wing extremist fanatics.)
I have never understood that nonsense about being "registered" in any party. In today's world of computerts, it makes even less sense.
You clearly have no idea the social stains black people have to live every day of their lives and the fear that even a sight of a cop brings to them. My God, man, half the racial lynchings through the worst of the problems in this country included loud mouth cops in the gangs that did the lynching, many participating as the leaders of the pack.
IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by CashCowMoo: Oh I think a lot more people were rootin for Obama than most people think. He was popular before he really hit mainstream.
There is some truth to this. Last time I was in D.C. was during his first year in the senate. My brother (a much smarter man than I) pointed him out to me and said "That's Barrack Obama. Remember his name, he's going places."
-------------------- No longer eligible for government service due to lack of tax issues.
IP: Logged |
posted
(I have no doubt you "registered" as a democrat to falsely abuse the primary system. It is a standard "dirty trick" of far right-wing extremist fanatics.)
you shouldn't have any doubt he bragged about it...
shows a distinct lack of scruples, among other things.
kinda funny huh? here's a guy who says racism doesn't even exist anymore, yet he found a way to vote against Obama twice?
Obama scares some people, but their fears don't come from Obama or anything he does or says.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
Ronald Reagan said a lot of stupid things and did them to.
Look at our current mess 25 billion to auto companies and I don't know how many billion to banking,lending,insurance,and wall street. In this case did you hear them making bonzo's famous saying were they in dread answer NO NO NO!!!!!! They could not take the money fast enough and I bet they won't pay it off either. As far as Obama's tax plan we are just playing catch up the tax has very shamefully uneven for years and it sould be on a fair course
-------------------- Wise men learn more from fools than fools from the wise.
IP: Logged |
posted
CC, i was a fan of Uncle Ronnie, but all these sayings are just so much BS.
Reagan was not an economist. his cheif economist that conceieved of the "trickle down" plan renounced it after a few years.
all i am hearing from people "it's mine i got. it doesn't matter how i got it and i ain't sharing".
kindergarten crap!
we are all in this mess together. the people who got payed 20 to 100 million a year were paid that to keep US all in the GREEN, they failed. BLAME THEM!
Greenspan, who headed the nation's central bank for 18 1/2 years, said that he and others who believed lending institutions would do a good job of protecting their shareholders are in a "state of shocked disbelief."
In his testimony, Greenspan blamed the problems on heavy demand for securities backed by subprime mortgages by investors who did not worry that the boom in home prices might come to a crashing halt.
"Given the financial damage to date, I cannot see how we can avoid a significant rise in layoffs and unemployment," Greenspan said. "Fearful American households are attempting to adjust, as best they can, to a rapid contraction in credit availability, threats to retirement funds and increased job insecurity."
it's the people that have the money that ALSO have responsibilty to utilise it WISELY they didn't... blaming this mess on poor people is for wimps (and i'd like to use a stronger word here but i won't) losers balme other people for their mistkaes.
winners OWN thier mistakes and learn form them...
In his testimony, Greenspan put the blame for the subprime collapse on over-eager investors who did not properly take into account the threats that would be posed once home prices stopped surging upward.
and that is that.
Obama is not a socialist. he's simply trying to cahnge teh economy to a trickle up economy which will aloow anybody who hasa good business plan to take advanatage of all the consumers with losts of CASH in their pockets..
sheesh.. all this crap about redistributing wealth is the big bad wolf and little red riding hood all over again...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
what in specific? and be clear as to why you are AFRAID. cuz he don't scare me. i don't agree with many of his policy plans, but i'm not afraid.
Ok, let's take his words right from his official web page...
Enact a Windfall Profits Tax to Provide a $1,000 Emergency Energy Rebate to American Families:Barack Obama and Joe Biden will enact a windfall profits tax on excessive oil company profits to give American families an immediate $1,000 emergency energy rebate to help families pay rising bills. This relief would be a down payment on the Obama-Biden long-term plan to provide middle-class families with at least $1,000 per year in permanent tax relief.
This was already attempted under Carter. It's results were disastrous economically. This will be amplified under our current economicc crisis.
I am afraid that it will send a message to an already distrustful business sector that heaven help you if you make 'too much money'. Big Governement is going to tax the crap out of you until you only make an 'acceptable' amount of money. Let alone the fact that this tax will just be passed onto the consumer anyway.
Provide a Tax Cut for Working Families: Obama and Biden will restore fairness to the tax code and provide 150 million workers the tax relief they need. Obama and Biden will create a new "Making Work Pay" tax credit of up to $500 per person, or $1,000 per working family. The "Making Work Pay" tax credit will completely eliminate income taxes for 10 million Americans.
Good idea. Let's add to the already 40% of americans that don't pay income tax. And I'm sure that the money we don't take in will just be removed from the budget. Right? Right?
No. It will simply be pulled from the 'rich' again. Once again adding to the disincentivizing of people to become 'rich.'
I am afraid that this will only add to the class warfare by shouldering yet more of the burden of the many onto the few.
Simplify Tax Filings for Middle Class Americans: Obama and Biden will dramatically simplify tax filings so that millions of Americans will be able to do their taxes in less than five minutes. Obama and Biden will ensure that the IRS uses the information it already gets from banks and employers to give taxpayers the option of pre-filled tax forms to verify, sign and return. Experts estimate that the Obama-Biden proposal will save Americans up to 200 million total hours of work and aggravation and up to $2 billion in tax preparer fees.
And how many more jobs at the IRS are going to be needed to utilize that information and send out forms that will have to be returned and reprocessed. That estimated $2 Billion saved? How much of it is going to be needed to staff the additional help needed to address concerns by people that don't agree with the infomation the IRS sends to them?
I'm afraid that this is only more of the Big Government over private sector that will eliminate any competition and thus the need to be more accurate or faster than the next guy to compete. More red tape.
Create a National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will address the infrastructure challenge by creating a National Infrastructure Reinvestment Bank to expand and enhance, not supplant, existing federal transportation investments. This independent entity will be directed to invest in our nation’s most challenging transportation infrastructure needs. The Bank will receive an infusion of federal money, $60 billion over 10 years, to provide financing to transportation infrastructure projects across the nation. These projects will create up to two million new direct and indirect jobs and stimulate approximately $35 billion per year in new economic activity.
Maybe I misunderstand their goal here, but I always thought that 'investment' meant that you were trying to get money back from offering funding to other people\businesses. If they are 'investing' in infrastructure, are they planning on making it all toll roads to recoup the money 'invested'?
I am afraid that this is just more ways to spread money around under the guise of helping the people. Who gets this large chunck of tax payer dollars? I'm sure it won't be to some contracting firms that supported Obama. Right?
Provide Tax Relief for Small Businesses and Start Up Companies: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will eliminate all capital gains taxes on start-up and small businesses to encourage innovation and job creation. Obama and Biden will also support small business owners by providing a $500 “Making Work Pay” tax credit to almost every worker in America. Self-employed small business owners pay both the employee and the employer side of the payroll tax, and this measure will reduce the burdens of this double taxation.
Good and Bad. No capital gains tax on small businesses? Good. Making small business double their contributions to payroll taxes? Bad!
I am afraid that this is once again simply shifting the tax burden onto the successful.
Raise the Minimum Wage: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will raise the minimum wage, index it to inflation and increase the Earned Income Tax Credit to make sure that full-time workers earn a living wage that allows them to raise their families and pay for basic needs.
That sounds nice, until you remember that many union contracts are based on 'minimum wage +". When the minimum wage goes up, so does everyone elses pay no matter how much they make above minimum wage. Add to that the fact that the increased outgo of money must be made up somewhere else to maintain profitability. That is done through increased prices.
I am afraid that yet again we have a feel good answer that does nothing but hurt those who are supposed to be being helped.
Close Bankruptcy Loophole for Mortgage Companies: Obama and Biden will work to eliminate the provision that prevents bankruptcy courts from modifying an individual's mortgage payments. They believe that the subprime mortgage industry, which has engaged in dangerous and sometimes unscrupulous business practices, should not be shielded by outdated federal law.
Sure. Why not allow government to change any and ALL contracts legally entered into? That wouldn't be abused. Right?
I am really afraid of this one. Too much power can be easily abused if one allows the law to pick and choose what it will enforce.
I could go on, but I hope this makes my point. I am worried that if\when he becomes elected, this congress will be as much of a rubber stamp as Bush had in the first term. Alot of the Big Government control plans that he has will only serve to make people less self reliant and more dependant on the state. Business will NOT be encouraged as the better you succeed, the more taxation will be drawn on your profits.
posted
we are all in this mess together. the people who got payed 20 to 100 million a year were paid that to keep US all in the GREEN, they failed. BLAME THEM!
Do you have any examples here, Glass? Who was supposed to keep US ALL in the green? I thought we were responsible for ourselves?
it's the people that have the money that ALSO have responsibilty to utilise it WISELY they didn't... blaming this mess on poor people is for wimps (and i'd like to use a stronger word here but i won't) losers balme other people for their mistkaes.
winners OWN thier mistakes and learn form them...
Same question. Who was supposed to be responsible with their money? I assume of course you mean the people with LOTS of money. Why should they be FORCED to use is in a way you consider wise?
IP: Logged |
posted
"Who was supposed to be responsible with their money?"
We were promised the free market would, over and over and over again. That was clearly a lie. The free market is a fiction, a fiction designed by the rich to prey off the masses, to act so as to use the Government to transfer wealth to the offshore accounts of the very rich, where it and its use can escape taxation ever again.
"I thought we were responsible for ourselves?"
No way. That's the reason for havinmg a Country, in the first place. So that we may act as an organized body to protect the individual from both foreign and domestic ememies, even if that enemy is economic.
IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by SeekingFreedom: we are all in this mess together. the people who got payed 20 to 100 million a year were paid that to keep US all in the GREEN, they failed. BLAME THEM!
Do you have any examples here, Glass? Who was supposed to keep US ALL in the green? I thought we were responsible for ourselves?
it's the people that have the money that ALSO have responsibilty to utilise it WISELY they didn't... blaming this mess on poor people is for wimps (and i'd like to use a stronger word here but i won't) losers balme other people for their mistkaes.
winners OWN thier mistakes and learn form them...
Same question. Who was supposed to be responsible with their money? I assume of course you mean the people with LOTS of money. Why should they be FORCED to use is in a way you consider wise?
because when they don't? people lose their jobs. you cannot seem to grasp that the economy is one big wheel.
people who make money lose it if they don't invest. if they DON'T invest in other peoples work? inflation eats their money...
if you want to think like the wealthy? you are going to have to look at consumers differently. instead of seeing them as lazy fools? you have to see them as uninspired wokrers. they have no choice but to make enough to live. most people ONLY do that.
it's like being a farmer. you can grow crops in almost any soil as long as it has some water, but if you don't fertilise it? you aren't going to make any money.
Enact a Windfall Profits Tax to Provide a $1,000 Emergency Energy Rebate to American Families:Barack Obama and Joe Biden will enact a windfall profits tax on excessive oil company profits to give American families an immediate $1,000 emergency energy rebate to help families pay rising bills. This relief would be a down payment on the Obama-Biden long-term plan to provide middle-class families with at least $1,000 per year in permanent tax relief.
uhhhh... Palin already does this in Alaska. the idea being that everybody in the state should enjoy the benefits of the ownership of the state.
those middle class people will simply spend that money on YOUR products if you aren't too friggin LAZY to go make some ...
and yeah, you'll be taxed too much, so you just add it into your expenses. at least you'll know what to plan for
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
Close Bankruptcy Loophole for Mortgage Companies: Obama and Biden will work to eliminate the provision that prevents bankruptcy courts from modifying an individual's mortgage payments. They believe that the subprime mortgage industry, which has engaged in dangerous and sometimes unscrupulous business practices, should not be shielded by outdated federal law.
Sure. Why not allow government to change any and ALL contracts legally entered into? That wouldn't be abused. Right?
actually they already are allowed to abrogate contracts, and that right is reserved to the federal governmnet in the constituion.
McPain has the same intention if you bother to go look at his plans...
in fact? he wants to buy bad mortgages indivdually and absorb the losses within the tax system...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
Raise the Minimum Wage: Barack Obama and Joe Biden will raise the minimum wage, index it to inflation and increase the Earned Income Tax Credit to make sure that full-time workers earn a living wage that allows them to raise their families and pay for basic needs.
That sounds nice, until you remember that many union contracts are based on 'minimum wage +". When the minimum wage goes up, so does everyone elses pay no matter how much they make above minimum wage. Add to that the fact that the increased outgo of money must be made up somewhere else to maintain profitability. That is done through increased prices.
uhh, median household income is 48 grand, median household price is 200 grand... the math don't add up, and ask any economist, until we can fix the affordability of homeownership? we are dead in the water...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
"I could go on, but I hope this makes my point. I am worried that if\when he becomes elected, this congress will be as much of a rubber stamp as Bush had in the first term. Alot of the Big Government control plans that he has will only serve to make people less self reliant and more dependant on the state. Business will NOT be encouraged as the better you succeed, the more taxation will be drawn on your profits."
"A 2004 U.S. Government Accountability Office (GAO) study found that 61% of American corporations, including 39% of large companies, paid no corporate income taxes between 1996 and 2000. Last year, corporations shouldered just 14.4% of the total U.S. tax burden, compared with about 50% in 1940.
While companies are getting off easy, thanks to loopholes, ordinary wage earners are getting stuck with the tab. The tax burden on individuals is expected to climb from $1.16 trillion in 2007 to $1.21 trillion this year, according to the Congressional Budget Office (CBO), while corporate tax receipts are expected to decline from $370 billion to $364 billion. By 2013, the CBO estimates, ordinary taxpayers’ bills may climb to $1.86 trillion while corporate tax bills drop to $327 billion."
There are a couple of things that are very ironic to me.
(1) Conservative Repub's never seem to have a problem with their party being in control yet are afraid that the Dem's might take control. They say that the Dem's Tax and Spend Liberals yet during the 20 Years they held the Presidency many of which they had power in Congress they were cut taxes, spend and borrow.
(2) Seeking Freedom is afraid of windfall taxes on Corps yet Palin, the VP on their ticket, not only agrees with that policy but used it in Alaska.
(3) Retail stores and Financial Institution are closing and unemployment is rising even though the highest earners and Corps have recieved the tax cuts for the past 8 yrs. Could it be because Middle America doesn't have enough money to buy products? Partially, if the common, as they like to say: Joe Plumber, teacher, Fireman ect can't afford to buy then business suffers.
(4) I'm amazed at how the Republicans get so much support from Middle Income earners. Talk about drinking the kool-aid, they have suffered yet in spite of it still believe that Trickle Down works.
From what I have seen, it's the Republicans that rule by fear.
IP: Logged |
posted
And how many more jobs at the IRS are going to be needed to utilize that information and send out forms that will have to be returned and reprocessed. That estimated $2 Billion saved? How much of it is going to be needed to staff the additional help needed to address concerns by people that don't agree with the infomation the IRS sends to them?
I'm afraid that this is only more of the Big Government over private sector that will eliminate any competition and thus the need to be more accurate or faster than the next guy to compete. More red tape.
actually you are afraid your wife will have to find another job at tax time.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
(4) I'm amazed at how the Republicans get so much support from Middle Income earners. Talk about drinking the kool-aid, they have suffered yet in spite of it still believe that Trickle Down works.
From what I have seen, it's the Republicans that rule by fear.
this is the thing that amazes me the most... it reminds me of the poor dirt farmers that went to war for the Confederacy even tho the cost of a single slave was more than their homes and land combined, and way more than their yearly icomes...
they would never be able to afford a slave based on the economic conditions of the 1850's...
i'm not at 250K/year. but? i expect to be pretty soon.
getting there for me will be EASIER if avg. consumers have an extra 50 or 100$/month to spend on something they do not NEED. they don't right now. i'm seeing people with real money money cut back on spending right now.
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
...![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
