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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by urnso77:
Their hatred is blind rimasco. They will say anything, even if it includes a STOCK MARKET forum.

yawn, blind? i have no clue, nor could i care less if Rove is gay...


ROVE has however engineered the downfall of the GOP...
Rove has in fact, made a mockery of True Conservatism in America by "pushing" Bush as a true conservative.. Bush is as liberal as Bill Clinton...

Rove started this back in '99 in South Carolina when he started "push polling" on McCain, asking people how they would feel about him if he had an illegitimate child with a black woman... which is kinda funny cuz Strom Thurmon REALLY DID...

read up on him... he's the snake in the GOP sleeping bag...
he's hated in the GOP (by people that really know all his "dirty tricks") almost as much as he is in the Dems

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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So true, glass.....so true....
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glassman
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every time i see a picture of Rove? i hear this Georgia mountain bubba sayin' "ahh betchou cayn skweel lak a pig caintcha? weyell boy?"

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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rimasco
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Buddah boy has fasted for six months!!!! sombody get that kid a burger

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2005/11/21/wbuddha21.xml&sS heet=/portal/2005/11/21/ixportal.html

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bdgee
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
every time i see a picture of Rove? i hear this Georgia mountain bubba sayin' "ahh betchou cayn skweel lak a pig caintcha? weyell boy?"

Why not?

You do know he comes fromn that same Alabama/Georgia range of hills where the book and movie were placed.

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glassman
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yes i did...

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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he he he he


Ya got 'im nailed!

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trade04
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quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
every time i see a picture of Rove? i hear this Georgia mountain bubba sayin' "ahh betchou cayn skweel lak a pig caintcha? weyell boy?"

ur pretty good at that...i read it like 3 times lol..would be funny if someone typed like that on these forums
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bdgee
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I don't hate the t_rd. But just the mention of him and his ideas roils my stomach.


Somewhere, for the first time since how many years since he was in office, Milard Filmore is setting not feeling like everybody in creation and most in Heaven and Hell think he was the worst of all.

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glassman
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quote:
Originally posted by trade04:
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
every time i see a picture of Rove? i hear this Georgia mountain bubba sayin' "ahh betchou cayn skweel lak a pig caintcha? weyell boy?"

ur pretty good at that...i read it like 3 times lol..would be funny if someone typed like that on these forums
sheesh mayyan, ah leyive eyin de meyissesseeppee dayelta...

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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bdgee
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Ya, but he be a domyankee Wastonian, Ah kahrpit baggarh, ya no.
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glassman
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true bdgee, but i was raised there by people from other places....

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bdgee
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Mars?

Venus?

Balwasteron?

North Umbria?

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glassman
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LOL bdgee. yanks and confederates both....

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Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.

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MAGICK
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There may be no proof, but one has to wonder.


Why did his disciples forsake him (they would of had to else they wouldn't have lived, they would have been crucified with him) only to turn around and preach everywhere about him?

Paul's sudden turnaround alone gives one pause.

His "job" was to hunt down Christians, he forsook that job though it meant his life.
His death by decapitation is an historical fact.

One has to come to the conclusion that the apostles had to have witnessed SOMETHING in order for them to gain such bravery and disregard for their very lives any longer.

Now what would make YOU forsake your very life?

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bdgee
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All that being said, I wonder what Charles Manson's followers witnessed that made them so loyal?

I could point to a few others that had avid followings too, like Adolph and El Duce.

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MAGICK
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quote:
All that being said, I wonder what Charles Manson's followers witnessed that made them so loyal?
A whole lotta LSD


Adolph?

Wouldn't that be like asking "What makes America's troops so loyal to Bush?"


El Duce?

"There are four sacraments in the Church of El Duce : Sex, Porno, Booze, and Pot"

There will always be followers in that kinda church.


I would add, none of these gave a single enlightening statement his entire life, which only goes to prove there are many lost souls out there. All of these advocated killing with the possible exception of El Duce which I gladly know little about, but the "four sacraments" say enough.

None fulfilled hundreds of prophecies either which came thousands of years before they were born over which he had no control over. None performed any miracles. None cured anybody of anything or even made the attempt.

How does anyone know he was who he said he was?

Ya don't. That's why it's a matter of faith.
See Pascal's "The Wager"

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Gordon Bennett
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"Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live. Whoever lieth with a beast shall surely be put to death. He that sacrificeth unto any god, save to the LORD only, he shall be utterly destroyed." (Exodus 22:18-20)

[Roll Eyes]

File under: Historical Fiction

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little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

- Benjamin Franklin

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The Bigfoot
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quote:
Originally posted by bdgee:
I've never been able to accept claims by people that free will and Calvinism can or should co-exist in a person.

They are, after all, totally disparate and, by design, particularly, with respect to religious matters that are non-Catholic, antagonistic.

I point out that the assumption that free will and Calvanism can co-exist in a mind, with or without religious concern on a question, is logically absurd.

I can and will grant that your religion is of your own free will, free from influence of any other entity and any reason or basis for it is not required.

And I can accept the belief that you being religious is part of God's "plan",

But not the two at one time, because it is impossible.

To suggest that I waver on that point is the same to me as me suggesting that you ignore your religion on some matter.

But, I have seldom if ever found a religious person that was willing to grant me that respect.

Bdgee,

I tend to agree with you but for the sake of nothing to do on a Saturday night I'll play devils advocate for a moment.

If you were to approach a Calvinist about the seemingly impossible co-existence of Free Will and Predestination they would likely say this:

God is in all things and created all things. Time is a thing that is measured by the instruments that God created such as the Sun and the orbit of the Earth etc.. As these things were created by God then it stands to logic that God exists both inside and outside time.

As God exists inside time and does not influence directly our decisions we have free will. As God exists outside time he can look forward and see the results of our decisions, thereby we have predestination. As WE can not exist outside time and look forward Free Will and Predestination can indeed co-exist.

My main problem with predestination (other than some theological and philosophical stuff I don't really want to get into) is the same as my problem with the church as a whole.

Predestination is used by believers to separate themselves from the world. When a family who believes in predestination has a young member who is misbehaving...that person has demons to conquer. When someone they don't know enters their lives for a moment with pain/suffering/or hate...it was predestined. It was predestined is all the answer that is needed to shut the door and think no more about that person or problem. It gives an excuse to think less of those you don't know and to keep your generosity of spirit which Christ commands close to the comfort zone. Or if they do go outside their comfort zone it is with pessimism and classism.
It affords the wealthy to think of themselves as favored by God when wealth is "supposed" to have nothing to do with the Christian religion.

This mode of thought will not solve problems such as homelessness. It might force the homeless from the streets but it will not solve the problems that some of our neighbors do not have the resources, support, or capabilities to take care of themselves and their families. Such a solution would have to come from a mission with much more intimate ties to those around us. I use this issue as my example because helping and loving our brother is listed as the top priority of any Christian servant. Same holds true in many other areas of life and within the religion as well.

How many people have been driven away from the church and the religion by those who make up its body? More than those who have been driven away by the basic tenants of faith for sure.

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bdgee
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You make many excellent points, Big.
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bdgee
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"I would add, none of these gave a single enlightening statement his entire life, which only goes to prove there are many lost souls out there. All of these advocated killing with the possible exception of El Duce which I gladly know little about, but the "four sacraments" say enough.

None fulfilled hundreds of prophecies either which came thousands of years before they were born over which he had no control over. None performed any miracles. None cured anybody of anything or even made the attempt.

How does anyone know he was who he said he was?

Ya don't. That's why it's a matter of faith.
See Pascal's "The Wager""

If you were one of the faithful (I shouldn't put that in past tense, as the world is still blessed(?) with them), you would know that Adolph made many "enlightening statements" during his time and many of his prophecies are yet to unfold. To them he performed mericals and, for a time, saved the world for the right people. Perhaps your particular bias limits your acceptance of Adolph's "enlightening statements" while awarding the status of "enlightening statement" to things said by your own particular favorite, which others see as only the shot in the dark of a babbling egomanaical mind.

I think you may have misplaced my intent about el Duce. He was the fascist leader of Italy in the 1920s and 30s and 40s and was not averse to killing anyone not of his own mind and bent.

I am familiar withmuch of Pascal's works, but am not with the term "Pascal's Wager". Perhaps it has another name, by which I might recognize it?

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T e x
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Beedg:

"To put it crudely, we should wager that God exists because it is the best bet."

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/pascal-wager/

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Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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bdgee
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Then we should also wager that mohamed is a savior and pledge our souls to Zeus, which are equally likely to be a good bet.
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T e x
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Pantheism!

lol...

hey, what if all the different "names" are simply the result of glimpsing the elephant through the fence?

Yikes...

Anyhow, I doubt betting replaces faith...

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Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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bdgee
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To the gambling challenged (i.e., addicks and fools), faith and betting coincide.
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T e x
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lol...

we see that everyday... [Roll Eyes]

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Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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The Bigfoot
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Yep, more than a few go to church "just in case..."

Terrible reason to lose a chance to sleep in. LOL

Either you believe or you don't. And if you believe, that doesn't mean you have to swallow the whole kittenkaboodle that the church is selling.

edit: Don't mean that one to come out Calvinistic. Just saying 'Just in Case' probably ain't gonna get you through those pearlly gates.

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The Bigfoot
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Greek and Roman Pantheism does sound pretty cool when you read about it. I get the feeling that the gods got all the hot chicks though. LOL

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T e x
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is good to be boss...

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Nashoba Holba Chepulechi
Adventures in microcapitalism...

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bdgee
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That's why am aiming to bosshood, don't ya know.....
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dinner42
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quote:
Originally posted by T e x:
is good to be boss...

[Smile] Hey Tex

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Bill Gates, Donald Trump and James Dean, Willie Nelson, John Lennon and Neil McCoy

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Gordon Bennett
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Precisely.

quote:
Originally posted by bdgee:
Then we should also wager that mohamed is a savior and pledge our souls to Zeus, which are equally likely to be a good bet.



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"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a
little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

- Benjamin Franklin

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MAGICK
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quote:
If you were one of the faithful (I shouldn't put that in past tense, as the world is still blessed(?) with them), you would know that Adolph made many "enlightening statements" during his time and many of his prophecies are yet to unfold. To them he performed mericals and, for a time, saved the world for the right people. Perhaps your particular bias limits your acceptance of Adolph's "enlightening statements" while awarding the status of "enlightening statement" to things said by your own particular favorite, which others see as only the shot in the dark of a babbling egomanaical mind.
Let me get this straight, your talking about Adolph Hitler right?

Your comparing Jesus to Adolph Hitler?

If that's the case, yes your correct inasmuch as my particular bias would prevent me from seeing Adolph Hitler as the son of God and the Messiah, it would also prevent me from seeing anything that sprung from his lips as enlightened. Maybe it's just me, but I find it hard to accept as enlightened anyone who had a mission of wiping from the face of the earth, an entire race of people, especially when they were civilians living in different countries and not an army of any kind threatening. Not to mention the means whereby he went about it either.

You don't need Pascal's wager to decide whether or not to worship Mohammed, or anyone else for that matter, Pascal made it in reference to God.

But since you brought it up.
Mohammed also killed people. Arabs, christians and Jews. For me, it is automatic exclusion to divinity. Not to mention marrying a six year old. That supposed to be divine too?

"The prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old."Vol. 7:64

Nine? A murderer and a pedophile, yet look at all the people who follow. In this country you would have got a letter in the mail about your new prophet neighbor under Megan's law.


What is with the anger you have towards either Jesus or those who believe in him?

quote:
to things said by your own particular favorite, which others see as only the shot in the dark of a babbling egomanaical mind.
By that I assume your saying that "others" see Jesus this way>?
Never met any of these "others"

Would love to though.

Jesus...the babbling egomaniac.

Such egocentric ramblings as,

"Of mine own self I can do nothing, it is the father which worketh through me."

"Ye are Gods...and ye know it not."

"Love one another, even as I have loved you."

"Do unto others as ye would have others do unto you."

Just who did he think he was anyway?

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bdgee
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I specifically referred to those who chose to believe and soke of them having faith that he said enlightened things.

Let's not mis-assign things.

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Gordon Bennett
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I wonder which wing of Hell they're preparing for the Bush Administration?

--------------------
"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a
little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

- Benjamin Franklin

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