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IN DEFENSE OF AMERICA
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by kevin954: [QB] Wow. I don't know where to start with this one. I'm Canadian, and although I agree with a lot of what you said, a lot of it was also a little misinformed and incorrect. OK, you seem to have the idea that America goes around freeing countries out of the goodwill of its citizens to support such operations? Give me a break. What about Chile? Where America overthrew a democratically elected government and installed a military dictatorship that murdered thousands of people. They don't movies about that one. Why don't they? The real truth behind America's actions since WW2 to 1990 was that they had more to do with fighting communism and expanded captialism then "spreading freedom". Now, in the course of fighting communism, America has spread an awful lot of freedom (along with canada and european NATO allies, who without your assistance such things would not have been possible). If fighting communism and spreading capitalism meant putting in place or supporting dictators, America did it. The intention was never to liberate people. The intention was to open up new markets for American corporations to exploit. Sometimes this meant liberating a people (if the democratic sentiment there was pro-capitlaism and pro-free market) and sometimes this meant installing dictators that would kill thousands of people (if the democratic movements were to socialist for american tastes). America DID spread freedom, but the problem is that they exclusively spread THEIR INTERPRETATION of freedom for better or worse. I agree with you on the south korean issue. The people in that region hated the USSR and America in equal spades during the cold war, believe me. They blame them for tearing their nation (the people, not the land) apart during the war. Their is no USSR to blame, and north koreans don't have the right to blame. So south koreans still don't appreaciate being political pawns to a super power, even if on a lot of levels its for their own good. The only real solution in the immeadiate present is for south korea to raise their own military strength, but this is hardly feasible for a variety of political and cultural reasons. America really is doing the dirty work for the world in south korea and not getting respect for it. But as for Iraq and Afaganistan... not so much. At least if you understand history as much as you do CNN and Fox NEWS. "MY HUSBAND went to Kuwait because that government begged us to please help." Begged you for help? Absolutely. But why did they beg you to help? Because America, while fighting the cold war with the communists, GAVE SADDAM THE WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION. Donald Rumsfeld himself oversaw the buildup of Saddam Hussien. Make absolutely no mistake about it... Saddam Hussien is a monster, but it is with no historical doubt that America gave him the power to do what hes done. America gave him the WMDs. America helped TRAIN the republican guard that attacked kuwait years later. America let Saddam get away with his military aggression in the 80s against Iran because they were on America's side during the cold war. "TO FREE Iraq of disqusting & violent Tyranny" A tryanny that was created by America in fighting a greater threat that was communism. I applaud America for cleaning up their mess and setting things right again. But painting the picture that middle eastern countries come to you begging for freedom is very incorrect, and completely ignorant of the history in the region. "AS WE DID in World War I for Russia, France & Britain. LIKE WE DID AGAIN FOR FRANCE, and yes, even the majority of the German people who hated & feared Hitler for his threats to them during World War II." America got involved in WW2 only after Pearl harbour. If they got in it to liberate france, then they were a few years too late. America fought WW2 when it became a matter of self-preservation. America never saved Russia either. America was terrified of Russia, thats why they dropped the bomb on nagasaki and hiroshima. As far as "saving europe" goes, had America not done it, Russia would have done it (without question), and America (wisely) didn't want communists bringing their intrepretation of freedom. America let europe suffer for years before getting involved in the war, historians will tell you that it was England and Russia that really turn the tide of the war, by refusing to back down. Want to know the real kicker? America's current enemy, Osama Bin Laden and his Al Qaeda thugs, are also products of the cold war. In the 80s when the communists were coming into afganistan, already a war torn country of decades of fighting, American CIA agents were training resistance fighters to beat back the communists. The techniques involved all sorts of guerilla tactics, car bombings, explosives, assisinations, etc. After nearly destroying in years of fighting, Afganistan had become Russia's Vietname. America, having done its job and costed the communists dearly, left Afganistan in a sorry war torn wreck. Enter Osama Bin Laden. A rich incredibly intelligent religous zealot + tens of thousands of poor, starving, drug addicted muslisms who hate America = Al Qeada. Just as in Iraq, I think its great that America is cleaning up their mistakes with Afganistan (with the help of europe and other allies). As far as the alternative fuel sources go. What?! America, the bastian of alternative fuel methods? I'm afraid not. Bush spent 200 billion (and counting!) fighting in Iraq alone, and invested a mere $200 million in alternative fuel sources research. Believe me, I actually do love America. I went to New York after 9/11 with my girlfriend, we saw the WTC site and were both disgusted that their could be that much hatered in the world. But you have to look at THE ENTIRE situation, not just your own perspective and your own media, to get a true grasp of what has and what is happening in the world. My ancestors died with yours in WW2 (4 of them), my cousin is American and fought in Iraq for the first Bush. I am very aware in the importance of military strength to preserve freedom. But the intentions of a nation does not always reflect her actions. If you are a little more open with your views, pay attention to the media a little less and pay attention to history a little more, you find that things are a lot more grey than they are black and white. Sorry if this pisses you off, that was not my intention, but after reading your rant, I had to respond. - Kevin [/QB][/QUOTE]
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