I'm preparing to take the US Postal exam. On a practice test I'm taking is a number series part.
Example: 12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_
7 11 3 8 13 15 19 18 _?_ _?_
20 3 6 9 17 14 12 15 18 _?_ _?_
30 20 25 28 30 35 26 40 _?_ _?_
18 14 13 16 12 11 14 10 _?_ _?_
answers are: 19, 4. 23, 28. 11, 8. 45, 24. 9, 12.
My question is what is the equation to get these answers.
Posted by Relentless. on :
No wonder postal workers shoot people.
Posted by cottonjim on :
No formula Lockman, they are algorithms, and one seems to be a Probabilistic algorithm because it looks fairly random and I can't figure it out in the short time I have looked at it.
Look for the patterns ie. 12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_ 10-8=2 16+17=1 following the same pattern would be 6, 18, (19), (4) (6-4=2 and 18+19=1)
20 3 6 9 17 14 12 15 18 _?_ _?_ 20-17=3 3+3=6+3=9 so 14-3= (11) 12+3=15+3=18 the pattern to find the last digit is 20-3=17-3=14-3=11-3= (8)
Second one looks very random but I am sure it is in there, just need to give it some thought. Does that help? Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
It kind of nice to know where these answers come from in these tests.
The bad thing is that in a lot of these tests Postal, Computer Certs etc. are floating on the internet.
If you know how to accesss the right website usually they are there for a price.
My son went through a computer course where he spent 8 hours a day 6 days a week + several hours of homework getting ready to take the Cert. tests.
He passed 3 Certifications but was close to the bottom of his class.( rated on a curve) He chalked up being at the bottom to others having a lot more experience in the field. Many of the students knew each other from the computer industry.
One day he found out that these guys were getting all the tests from a particular website and they were just memorizing them, he was one of the few in the class that did not have the tests. I think he got one more Cert. the hard way then went on his way.
Posted by Lockman on :
quote:Originally posted by cottonjim: No formula Lockman, they are algorithms, and one seems to be a Probabilistic algorithm because it looks fairly random and I can't figure it out in the short time I have looked at it.
Look for the patterns ie. 12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_ 10-8=2 16+17=1 following the same pattern would be 6, 18, (19), (4) (6-4=2 and 18+19=1)
20 3 6 9 17 14 12 15 18 _?_ _?_ 20-17=3 3+3=6+3=9 so 14-3= (11) 12+3=15+3=18 the pattern to find the last digit is 20-3=17-3=14-3=11-3= (8)
Second one looks very random but I am sure it is in there, just need to give it some thought. Does that help?
Thanks CJ. I'm gonna have to study your answers but at least I'm going at it with some idea of what's going on. I never realized the people in the post office knew this stuff. lol
Posted by glassman on :
be careful, it looks to me like they are actually recruiting for the crypto branch of the CIA
Posted by PCola77 on :
Not sure if this helps, because Jims answer made my head spin, but here's my crack at it:
Example 1) 12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_
Group them into alternating 2 number groups, and look for the pattern:
12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_
12, 10....8, 6...? ? So you can see the next two in this piece of the pattern are 4, 2. So the number you are looking for is 4.
The other "two-piece pattern" is:
16, 17, ... 18, ?
That just increments by 1, so the number 19 goes there.
I'm heading home now, but I'll try to do the otehr 4 later tonight.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
About 6 years ago i put and application in for the postal service and was suppose to take the test. I started looking at the sample tests for the different departments and was thinking, do most of those people in the departments really understand those tests.
Look at some of those sample tests and you be the judge. Lockman posted one example.
Posted by T e x on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: Not sure if this helps, because Jims answer made my head spin, but here's my crack at it:
Example 1) 12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_
Group them into alternating 2 number groups, and look for the pattern:
12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_
12, 10....8, 6...? ? So you can see the next two in this piece of the pattern are 4, 2. So the number you are looking for is 4.
The other "two-piece pattern" is:
16, 17, ... 18, ?
That just increments by 1, so the number 19 goes there.
I'm heading home now, but I'll try to do the otehr 4 later tonight.
I agree...saw that same pattern. The others? nothing leapt out at me, cept maybe adding "5" in the second one...
Posted by PCola77 on :
Last one looked kind of obvious to me:
18 14 13 16 12 11 14 10 ? ?
pattern is x, x - 4, x - 4 - 1 then start over with x-2, so x - 2, x - 2 - 4, x - 2 - 4 - 1
and repeat. Giving you
18, 14, 13...16, 12, 11...14, 10, 9...12, 8, 7...
Posted by PCola77 on :
4th one:
30 20 25 28 30 35 26 40 ? ?
again the first number in each "section" decreases by an increment of 2. then the other two pieces increment by 5.
30, 20, 25...28, 30, 35...26, 40, 45...24, 50, 55
Posted by PCola77 on :
LOL. I just started writing how I couldn't figure out #3, and in writing it, I figured it out...
the grouping is 5 numbers. First and last decrease by 3 each time, middle 3 increase by 3 each time.
20 3 6 9 17 14 12 15 18 ??
So 1st and 5th numbers go 20, 17, 14, 11, 8, 5, 2...
2nd 3rd, and 4th go 3, 6, 9, 12, 15, 18, 21, 24, 27...
Actuary is different than bean counter (accountant).
We're way smarter
quote:Originally posted by IMAKEMONEY: PCola77 DAM YOU OR A BEAN COUNTER, LOL, NICE WORK!
Posted by IMAKEMONEY on :
SORRY, I STAND IN YOUR SHADOW,LOL
Posted by PCola77 on :
LOL. To be honest though, I didn't get through all of the actuarial exams, and am actually bailing on that career after the new year to become a financial analyst.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
PCola77 can you do my taxes? I think i will have a few write off's this year from the other side of the board. Nice Job.
Posted by T e x on :
fun...lol
However, I still haven't made the connection regarding hiring peeps to case and deliver mail, which is based on Zip codes...
Lockman, do you mind sharing what position this test is screening?
Posted by IMAKEMONEY on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: LOL. To be honest though, I didn't get through all of the actuarial exams, and am actually bailing on that career after the new year to become a financial analyst.
I THINK YOU WILL DO WELL!!!
Posted by PCola77 on :
I don;t thikn you want me to. I wasn't paying attention 2 years ago and forgeot to send some form. Got a bill this past spring/summer saying I owed like $15,000. Wife almost had a heart attack. I ended up having to pay a few bucks and some late fees and stuff, but doubt you'd want to get that letter
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: PCola77 can you do my taxes? I think i will have a few write off's this year from the other side of the board. Nice Job.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
I have probably got worst things in the mail before.
Posted by PCola77 on :
I'm curious as well. Seems like fairly challenging questions, especially if they were part of a long, timed exam. Like that last one took me almost 20 minutes to figure out. Under exam pressure it could increase significantly.
quote:Originally posted by T e x: However, I still haven't made the connection regarding hiring peeps to case and deliver mail, which is based on Zip codes...
Lockman, do you mind sharing what position this test is screening?
Posted by T e x on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: Oh geez, finally figured out the second one...That was drivin me f*cking nuts...
7 11 3 8 13 15 19 18 ? ?
So in this one, the first two positions increment by 4, and the last 3 increment by 5
thought I saw a 5 in there... Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
Sorry Tex no postal job for you.
PCola77 better not show his wife what he did or she will have him working at nights at the post office and days as a financial analyst.
Posted by PCola77 on :
LOL. I can sort with the best of 'em! Posted by T e x on :
lol, my ol' Daddy routed all the mail for Louisiana and Texas...which trucks, which trains, etc...
If a town had a post office? He knew where it was...
Get this, though--Nixon phukked him, his boss, and his boss's boss (all 30-year-plus guys) outta jobs when Nixon "streamlined" the Postal Service. Not just them, either--but their counterparts, nationwide.
Not too awful long after that, going postal entered the lexicon...
Was pretty easy for me to avoid the temptation, lol
Posted by PCola77 on :
My grandfather was a letter carrier on Long Island for most of his life. Not my thing, but it was fun when we were younger hearing stories about peopel he'd meet.
Posted by T e x on :
One of my best high-school girlfriend's dad was a career mailman; he delivered in a rough part of town, where black folk kept bad-azz dogs.
When attacked? He killed 'em...
Those folks called him "that mean, white sum'bich"
But they always got their mail...
Posted by wdcisco on :
lol...good story Tex...You can't do that nowadays without a lawsuit....lol...
Posted by Ace of Spades on :
ACE of SPADES is a math expert!
But I don't like to brag
I used to know a buch of cool math tricks....
Like 11 times tables add the numbers and put that int he middle
EXAMPLE 23 x 11....2 plus five, put in middle = 253...if the number is more than ten put the second number in the middle and carry number to left... 57 x 11....5 + 7 = 12....put 2 in middle carry 1 to left = 627
Posted by T e x on :
ya...
different world.
Nowadays, "gangstaz" go on parade with pit bulls, like canine bling.
Posted by PCola77 on :
No offense dude, but I don't think that's a very good "trick.
Just multiplying them out in two pieces makes it a lot easier.
E.g., 11 x any number is the same as (10 + 1)*x which you can commute to 10x +1x. So to multiply by 11 you move the decimal one point to the right, then add the original number
11 x 425 = 10 x 425 + 425 = 4250 + 425 = 4675
Doesn't that seem much more intuitive than adding two numbers, carrying one to the left, etc?
In your example, doesn't 570+57 seem easier to do then try to remember which numbers are on the ends and in the middle and which gets carried over?
Mayeb we should get the Munchkin man to weigh in, didn't he claim to be a math teacher?
quote:Originally posted by Ace of Spades: ACE of SPADES is a math expert!
But I don't like to brag
I used to know a buch of cool math tricks....
Like 11 times tables add the numbers and put that int he middle
EXAMPLE 23 x 11....2 plus five, put in middle = 253...if the number is more than ten put the second number in the middle and carry number to left... 57 x 11....5 + 7 = 12....put 2 in middle carry 1 to left = 627
Posted by Ace of Spades on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: No offense dude, but I don't think that's a very good "trick.
Just multiplying them out in two pieces makes it a lot easier.
E.g., 11 x any number is the same as (10 + 1)*x which you can commute to 10x +1x. So to multiply by 11 you move the decimal one point to the right, then add the original number
11 x 425 = 10 x 425 + 425 = 4250 + 425 = 4675
Doesn't that seem much more intuitive than adding two numbers, carrying one to the left, etc?
In your example, doesn't 570+57 seem easier to do then try to remember which numbers are on the ends and in the middle and which gets carried over?
Mayeb we should get the Munchkin man to weigh in, didn't he claim to be a math teacher?
quote:Originally posted by Ace of Spades: ACE of SPADES is a math expert!
But I don't like to brag
I used to know a buch of cool math tricks....
Like 11 times tables add the numbers and put that int he middle
EXAMPLE 23 x 11....2 plus five, put in middle = 253...if the number is more than ten put the second number in the middle and carry number to left... 57 x 11....5 + 7 = 12....put 2 in middle carry 1 to left = 627
No offense taking my friend...if you are a math wiz....take you gift here!!!
However, I still haven't made the connection regarding hiring peeps to case and deliver mail, which is based on Zip codes...
Lockman, do you mind sharing what position this test is screening?
The test is 473C- Delivery, Distribution and Retail Jobs.
The hard part of the test is the memorization part, you study five blocks of addresses each consisting of five examples. You study them for 11 minutes and then have five minutes to answer 85 questions as to there location.
I'd like to thank everyone for responing in such a robust way.
Posted by glassman on :
The hard part of the test is the memorization part, you study five blocks of addresses each consisting of five examples.
that would be really hard for me...
any time i get numbers like addresses or telphones? it doesn't "downlaod" well...
if you gave me a map? i could redraw it to a fairly high degree of detail...
if i watch a movie or read a book? i can rewrite the story line.
but blocks of addresses? just don't compute...
Posted by cottonjim on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: Not sure if this helps, because Jims answer made my head spin
Are you saying that I "over explained" the answer? I do have a tendancy to do that. It only took me about 5 minutes to figure them all out, figuring out how to type out the answer was the hard part. If you can unspin your head you will see that I am right, as are you in your answers, I just didn't explain to well.
When "they" ask questions like these "they" are not after mathematical skill, only common sense and the ability to apply it.
Posted by bdgee on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: The hard part of the test is the memorization part, you study five blocks of addresses each consisting of five examples.
that would be really hard for me...
any time i get numbers like addresses or telphones? it doesn't "downlaod" well...
if you gave me a map? i could redraw it to a fairly high degree of detail...
if i watch a movie or read a book? i can rewrite the story line.
but blocks of addresses? just don't compute...
Different people have differing types and methods of memory.
For example, there truly is a thing that is "photographic memory" and some one with it need not remember the actual numbers from a page of a book, but can simply read them from the "picture" he carries in his head of the "photo" of the page. (Consider the recent scientific results of chimps have better visual image memory than humans.)
And I point out that a student that I had once had an excellent memory, not any of which could be due to any sort of visual image retention, as the student was born without optical nerves.
I am convinced that an individual's eventual "intelligence" is more a measure of how he learns to manage his means of memory than most anything else.
Posted by glassman on :
yep. memory is funny stuff.. i literally don't have a way to "store" the phone number blocks... my wife can look at a phone number and memorise it instantly, i have to use it.
i can look at them and see them, but they just don't have a place to go...
i have a student that asked me how many steps there are to blowing a glass bottle... i said millions, cuz it's true and i know every one of them...
Posted by bdgee on :
You shoulda sent that student to me, 'cause I've got all 3,240,910,567 steps stored in my picture book and can sequence them by looking at the page numbers. (I mean so long as you don't want to add a new color, then I'd need to find a couple of more pages I ain't read yet.)
.......lol........
Posted by glassman on :
well, you mentioned page numbers? i can't do that. but can pick up a book that i've already read and find the page/paragraph of a specific scene pretty quick by scanning passages.
Posted by bdgee on :
I doubt that I can now, but back in grad school I could do a lot of it. I can't physically work those hours any more and I wonder if that has anything to do with it. Be an interesting topic of research for a psychologist, I think.
Posted by PCola77 on :
I was thinking the other day how I used to be able to remember phone numbers after hearing them once. I still know phone numbers from 15 years or so ago that I haven't used since then.
one time I was in Pittsburgh for college, and had to go to the hospital. They asked who my gastroenterologist was at home. I couldn't remember the name, but I knew the number, even though I had only called it once, and months prior.
Nowadays? I think part of it is due to having cell phones with number storing capabilities, but I barely remember my own phone number. No need to, when you just type the name in your cell phone and it dials for you.
Posted by bdgee on :
Or maybe senility is creeping in, PCola77..
For you I mean, not me. I never could remember phone numbers, so I am not loosing that ability.
lol
Posted by glassman on :
yeah, i don't know anybody's number that i have on speed-dial anymore either.
but i remember my first real G-friends number from 7th grade cuz i dialed it so much
sheeesh that over 30 years ago now. i think i'll go cry for ahwile...
Posted by Lockman on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: yeah, i don't know anybody's number that i have on speed-dial anymore either.
but i remember my first real G-friends number from 7th grade cuz i dialed it so much
Has she answered in a while? lol
Posted by bdgee on :
I have a friend at the U. of Delaware that can rattle off, in sequence, every phone number I have had, at home or at work, since back when I first knew him, in the 60s.
Damned smartazz showoff p-sses me off!
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by Lockman:
quote:Originally posted by glassman: yeah, i don't know anybody's number that i have on speed-dial anymore either.
but i remember my first real G-friends number from 7th grade cuz i dialed it so much
Has she answered in a while? lol
hoooowlll... in order to maintain domestic tranquility? i don't dial it... ruff.
Posted by cottonjim on :
I remember 10 digit phone numbers of companies that I dealt with years ago as well as the ones i currently deal with, I seldom use the speed dial function on our phone systems.
I have my drivers license # memorized, I don't know why either, I didn't try it just happened.
I also still remember all of my friends phone numbers going back to the 80's. I havent dialed them in 20+ years. The mind is a funny thing, I sometimes can't remember what I had for lunch yesterday Posted by bdgee on :
Yes, can remember each detail of what I did yesterday, just like it was yesterday.
I think.....
Posted by T e x on :
You guys remember nekkid details?
I do... wasn't it Ron White who said: You know how it is, fellas...if you've seen one? YOU WANNA SEE 'EM ALL!
Posted by glassman on :
LOL...you trying to get me to catch fleas Tex?
Posted by bdgee on :
Oh, yeAHHH!
Diane Mitchel back in jr high. You betcha I remember.
Now here's a sad sad fact of life. 'Bout 15 years back, I was in a grocery store and a really hugely fat woman I didn't have any idea who she might be called me by name as a pushed a cart down an aisle. When I turned and looked back at her, she clearly noticed I needed help and added, "I'm Diane from the 8th grade...Mitchel back then".
But, what the hey.....I weighed only 140 then, myself.
Posted by The Bigfoot on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: The hard part of the test is the memorization part, you study five blocks of addresses each consisting of five examples.
that would be really hard for me...
any time i get numbers like addresses or telphones? it doesn't "downlaod" well...
if you gave me a map? i could redraw it to a fairly high degree of detail...
if i watch a movie or read a book? i can rewrite the story line.
but blocks of addresses? just don't compute...
I'm almost completely opposite Glass. : )
They tell me that I have a great memory but my filing system totally screws the pooch.
When I try drawing from memory there is no rhyme or reason to what I draw but if you want me to remember a string of numbers for a while? No problem. Can't do that long term though like some of you guys and your ex's numbers. Longterm it all just falls into the shuffle in back and needs a jog from someone else if it is going to come out.
Posted by T e x on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: LOL...you trying to get me to catch fleas Tex?
fleas?
lol, not talking about dogs! nekkid dawgs look phunnie
Posted by bdgee on :
I think other things may have a way to alter the ability to remember.
I long ago lost count of how many times I have taught trigonometry. From the days I first learned it myself, I have never been able to remember all those identities and formulas, except for one:
(sin^2)x + (cos^2)x = 1,
which really isn't itself trigonometry, but a weird way of stating the Pythagorean Theorem from geometry.
From that point I can, via manipulation, arithmetic, algebra, inference, hook or crook, and other methods of deduction, develop the rest of the subject.
I do much the same with integral and differential calculus, but with a oither starting points.
I don't "need" to remember it, so I can't.
Posted by cottonjim on :
quote:Originally posted by bdgee: Pythagorean Theorem
Bless you! Posted by glassman on :
when i was learning math in Jr high and High school it seemed like gibberish to me UNTIL we would do the final.
if i had known then what i know now about how i learn? i would have skipped ahead to the last pages of each chapter and read them before we ever started the new chapters...
Posted by cottonjim on :
bdgee, perfect example of how the mind seems to store unused information for long periods of time. I remember back from my days as a young hyd./pneumatic eng. tech. stupid little formulas that I never, ever, need or use today.
pneumatic HP= Compressed CFM x PSI x 144/ 33,000?????????? why do I still need to know this????
Posted by glassman on :
144 i get, inches 2 what's the 33K for?
Posted by bdgee on :
Yes, cj, but don't forget, given two people, they may have entirely different memory abilities, even different mechanisms of memory. That doesn't mean either is the brighter or that one can learn some topic (here I don't mean just some memory trick) easier than the other. They may need to journey different paths to the desired goal, though.
Where so often teachers (by job title, not necessarily by accomplishment) make the mistake is teaching via what seems to them to be THE way to learn, since it is how they were successful.
Student A may have those same learning characteristics, whereas, student B simply has a memory technique such that he cannot learn by that route, thus the teachers fails with student B. Sadly, it isn't the teacher, but student B who receives the failing grade.
A good teacher learns that the old sculptor's description of his art as "I just cut away all the parts of the tree that don't look like a horse" tells a lot about art and teaching and the teacher must realize that two trees may have different horses inside, but horses, never-the-less.
Posted by BooDog on :
The term "horsepower" was coined by the engineer James Watt (1736 to 1819) in 1782 while working on improving the performance of steam engines. This occurred while using a mine pony to lift coal out of a coal mine. He conceived the idea of defining the power exerted by these animals to accomplish this work. He found that, on the average, a mine horse could pull (lift by means of a pulley) 22,000 foot-pounds per minute. Rather than call this "pony" power, he increased these test results by 50 percent, and called it horsepower i.e. 33,000 foot-pounds of work per minute. Posted by cottonjim on :
exactly, 1hp = 33,000 pounds-foot per minute
Posted by BooDog on :
yep i was a blackshoe. Had to get a special chit to go topside lol.
Posted by glassman on :
us twidgets didn't bother with formulas we just kept spare parts lists and lots of paint.
Posted by cottonjim on :
I do use a cyl. HP formula frequently, which is kind of similar. Cyl. HP = cyl. speed x cyl. force/ 33,000
Posted by cottonjim on :
equations and theoretic formulas can come in very handy sometimes though glass. There is a saying that goes something like.... If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle 'em with bull sh*t (ie. formulas and equations )
Posted by glassman on :
we had a few pneumatic cylinders on my rocket launcher, it was mostly hydraulics tho...
the dang thing leaked Hyd. fluid no matter what we did... the non-skid was permanently slippery inside the warning lines....
i guess the lowest bid doesn't always work as well as it does at NASA ... General "Leaky" Dynamics...
Posted by cottonjim on :
Hydraulics are my thing, design and work with every day.
Posted by bdgee on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: we had a few pneumatic cylinders on my rocket launcher, it was mostly hydraulics tho...
the dang thing leaked Hyd. fluid no matter what we did... the non-skid was permanently slippery inside the warning lines....
i guess the lowest bid doesn't always work as well as it does at NASA :D ... General "Leaky" Dynamics...
O-rings have made tremendous changes, when leaks are a concern.
Posted by cottonjim on :
Teflon tape and pipe dope are crap, JIC flare's are good but extreme temp. swings can cause/expose leaks, ORB (O-Ring Boss) fittings are excellent against leaks but you want a good compound o-ring (90 durometer is good). To soft a o-ring will get destroyed by pressure.
Posted by glassman on :
now you tell me, we hoarded teflon tape like dope fiends...
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
Is there any way to find out which cell phone carrier is being used if i have a phone number and name?
I am having a tough time finding the carrier in order to report a problem with a phone.
Posted by BooDog on :
call the operator, she may be able to help.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
I have tried that one, seems like that was the way i always did it before. It should be easy but have found out differently today.
I have a relative with a pre pay cell phone in another state and we cannot contact. He calls me free anytime so i thought he had to have the same service as me, ATT. But i have contacted them three times today and they cannot find his service.
They said maybe he is using a carrier that sub leases from ATT, they gave me the main sub-lease carrier which it was not. This carrier told me if they someone was subleasing from ATT they should know who the carrier is by the phone number. No luck.
Just saw your post Tex Thanks.
Posted by T e x on :
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: Is there any way to find out which cell phone carrier is being used if i have a phone number and name?
I am having a tough time finding the carrier in order to report a problem with a phone.
call 611...unless you're "roaming," should be the home carrier.
Posted by wdcisco on :
Or...pop off the back of your cell...look if the sim says att..tmobile...or no SIM at all..
another way is to restart your phone and look what comes up as it starts...cingular (att)m, verizon...If you relative has a pay as you go att...att is the only service they can talk to free...
I am guessing you have att...GL!
[edit] full of typos lol
Posted by BooDog on :
Check Ntelos just a WAG. We had one of those for the daughter for a bit. pain in the ass service that was.
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
I do have ATT Wdcisco and it has to be ATT service that our relative has unless someone signed a special contract with ATT.
ATT said that they have no record of the phone number or name and that came from both customer service and the service techs 3 different times. I am going to try again tomorrrow at ATT maybe i just need to get someone that can go beyond the basics.
The problem with the circuit (if thats what it is) has been going on for three days. Our big concern would be if he had no minutes left on the phone. That means there is something else wrong, thats why i am trying to find out. I am pretty sure it's the circuit but we have nobody close to this person that can go check on him and at this point do not want to call the police to check.
I never thought it would be this hard to find out about a possible problem with a circuit no matter who's circuit it is.
I call one time it does not ring, i call later and it says all the circuits are busy, then another call indicates it's out of service, it changes between them all day long. Got to be the circuit.
Thanks for all the help.
Posted by T e x on :
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: I have tried that one, seems like that was the way i always did it before. It should be easy but have found out differently today.
I have a relative with a pre pay cell phone in another state and we cannot contact. He calls me free anytime so i thought he had to have the same service as me, ATT. But i have contacted them three times today and they cannot find his service.
They said maybe he is using a carrier that sub leases from ATT, they gave me the main sub-lease carrier which it was not. This carrier told me if they someone was subleasing from ATT they should know who the carrier is by the phone number. No luck.
Just saw your post Tex Thanks.
oh...misunderstood...gotchya.
If you have the home address, use theultimates.com to get other addresses on the block, then reverse lookup to call a neighbor and ask them to check... maybe? I do that sometimes when checking out hard-to-reach companies, TAs, etc...
Posted by T e x on :
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: I do have ATT Wdcisco and it has to be ATT service that our relative has unless someone signed a special contract with ATT.
ATT said that they have no record of the phone number or name and that came from both customer service and the service techs 3 different times. I am going to try again tomorrrow at ATT maybe i just need to get someone that can go beyond the basics.
The problem with the circuit (if thats what it is) has been going on for three days. Our big concern would be if he had no minutes left on the phone. That means there is something else wrong, thats why i am trying to find out. I am pretty sure it's the circuit but we have nobody close to this person that can go check on him and at this point do not want to call the police to check.
I never thought it would be this hard to find out about a possible problem with a circuit no matter who's circuit it is.
I call one time it does not ring, i call later and it says all the circuits are busy, then another call indicates it's out of service, it changes between them all day long. Got to be the circuit.
Thanks for all the help.
sounds like a router/server is down...
Posted by IWISHIHAD on :
Sometimes i do not write perfectly clear. Every so often i go back and read one of my own posts and think to myself that does not even make sense to me and i wrote it. Then i go in the other room and blame my wife for not correcting my grammer. She's the blame.
Posted by *Mag* on :
Little off topic of math, but I have had some bouts with insomnia in my life time so sometimes I will play little games in my head to put myself to sleep. Well last saturday I really needed to take a nap because I was drained, so one game I got to was using the alphabet and thinking of an anatomical part in the body. ex. A- aorta, B- bracial plexus... all was good and my task was nearing completion I could feel Mr. sandman was near X- Xiphiod process Y- ??? hmmmm I started squirming around ummmm Y- wtf oh no I tried to rationalize in my mind that a Y chromosome counted because it made up the essence of anatomy but it didnt satisfy me; now I was wide awake. I did a little searching through some books and nothing except yolk sac and some diseases that began with the letter Y... my wife said, I thought you were gonna take a nap; I said nahhh I am obsessing over nonesense let's go get some food... I fell asleep that night by fooling myself into thinking Y chromosome was good enough... The next day we went to an educational toy store and as my wife and daughter played with some products I stood in the corner like a freak searching through 8th grade anatomy posters because I knew Y- chromosome didn't really work since it only works for males and not females XX anyways........ There it was my answer ahhhhhhh it was in bone... YELLOW bone marrow.... Please remind me never to try and calculate pie; I would hate to self destruct like one of the machines in the old star trek episodes...
Posted by T e x on :
tears!
Posted by bdgee on :
Calculate pie?
Ya cook pie...or eat it.
Can't calculate Pi, either, but that's another story.
Posted by T e x on :
That's a famous fraternity, right?
Eata Bita Pi?
Big brothers to Bita Betta Thi?
Posted by *Mag* on :
LOL good catch it must be the season of pies and cakes; but bdgee your calculation leaves out the possibilty for cooking AND eating the pie!
Tex I think I have tasted some Bita pi on more than one occasion; not sure but I believe vinegar is used in Masingil...
Posted by bdgee on :
"Or" is not restrictive and includes that possibility.
That a person is fat or lazy doesn't exclude the possibility that he (or she) is both.
Posted by *Mag* on :
Muah bdgee; BTW thanks, a while back you told me about using Simoniz wax it helped on 2 scratches but the deeper 1 remains... 2 out of 3 aint bad Posted by Munchkin Man on :
quote:Originally posted by Lockman: I'm preparing to take the US Postal exam. On a practice test I'm taking is a number series part.
Example: 12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_
7 11 3 8 13 15 19 18 _?_ _?_
20 3 6 9 17 14 12 15 18 _?_ _?_
30 20 25 28 30 35 26 40 _?_ _?_
18 14 13 16 12 11 14 10 _?_ _?_
answers are: 19, 4. 23, 28. 11, 8. 45, 24. 9, 12.
My question is what is the equation to get these answers.
The Munchkin Man would like to apologize to each and every one of you for his late arrival to this thread.
Had the Munchkin Man responded immediately to the first post in this thread, the Munchkin Man would have saved you many hours of agony and stress by coming up with the correct solutions and explanations instantly.
Unfortunately, the Munchkin Man was away.
Now the Munchkin Man is back.
Best Wishes,
Munchkin Man
Posted by Lockman on :
quote:Originally posted by Munchkin Man:
quote:Originally posted by Lockman: I'm preparing to take the US Postal exam. On a practice test I'm taking is a number series part.
Example: 12 10 16 17 8 6 18 _?_ _?_
7 11 3 8 13 15 19 18 _?_ _?_
20 3 6 9 17 14 12 15 18 _?_ _?_
30 20 25 28 30 35 26 40 _?_ _?_
18 14 13 16 12 11 14 10 _?_ _?_
answers are: 19, 4. 23, 28. 11, 8. 45, 24. 9, 12.
My question is what is the equation to get these answers.
The Munchkin Man would like to apologize to each and every one of you for his late arrival to this thread.
Had the Munchkin Man responded immediately to the first post in this thread, the Munchkin Man would have saved you many hours of agony and stress by coming up with the correct solutions and explanations instantly.
Unfortunately, the Munchkin Man was away.
Now the Munchkin Man is back.
Best Wishes,
Munchkin Man
You can still answer maybe you have a different method. Any help is appriciated. Thanks
Posted by Munchkin Man on :
quote:Originally posted by bdgee: I think other things may have a way to alter the ability to remember.
I long ago lost count of how many times I have taught trigonometry. From the days I first learned it myself, I have never been able to remember all those identities and formulas, except for one:
(sin^2)x + (cos^2)x = 1
Congratulations!
You got that one correct!
Munchkin Man
Posted by bdgee on :
Of course I did, dufus.
It is surprising you could tell.
Posted by Munchkin Man on :
quote:Originally posted by bdgee: Where so often teachers (by job title, not necessarily by accomplishment) make the mistake is teaching via what seems to them to be THE way to learn, since it is how they were successful.
Student A may have those same learning characteristics, whereas, student B simply has a memory technique such that he cannot learn by that route, thus the teachers fails with student B. Sadly, it isn't the teacher, but student B who receives the failing grade.
A good teacher learns that the old sculptor's description of his art as "I just cut away all the parts of the tree that don't look like a horse" tells a lot about art and teaching and the teacher must realize that two trees may have different horses inside, but horses, never-the-less.
Even though you and the Munchkin Man have entirely different philosophies on mathematics and what characteristics make and do not make "a good teacher", the Munchkin Man would like to pick your brain a bit with the following questions:
***Do you think a separate and distinct course in Geometry is needed in a sound secondary level mathematics curriculum?
Or:
***Do you think that Geometry can be better taught in a more synthesized manner, interspersed throughout the curriculums of Algebra 1, Algebra 2, Trigonometry, and Math Analysis (or Pre-Calculus)?
***Do you favor an inductive or a deductive approach to the teaching of Geometry?
***Do you think that "proofs" in Geometry are overrated and overemphasized -- or underrated and underemphasized?
The Munchkin Man would be interested in your replies to the questions above.
Thanks in advance.
Best Wishes,
Munchkin Man
Posted by cottonjim on :
I like pie. Peach, Cherry, Apple, and 3.14159 26535 89793 23846 26433 83279 50288 41971 69399 37510...
Posted by bdgee on :
MM,
Yes, No, No, No.
Sorry, cj, if that is intended to be Pi, it is wrong. No physical or written decimal representation of Pi is possible, since it is an irrational number.
Posted by cottonjim on :
Of course it is, but 3.14.............................. is the closest representation to the number that is known and used.
Posted by bdgee on :
Except it is not known.
It is impossible to know (or for there to be one you just happen to not know) a decimal representation of Pi or it wouldn't be Pi, because that would make it be a rationalnumber.
Posted by cottonjim on :
OK, I just threw on a liitle Pink Floyd and lit some incense... your meaning is getting clearer Posted by bdgee on :
Good work, cj......
No sense in getting far into to much in this weather.
Quoting Omar, "I have never been deep in anything but wine."
Posted by cottonjim on :
Posted by glassman on :
i figure it like this:
Pi will never be known until the universe stops expanding...
Posted by wdcisco on :
quote:Originally posted by IWISHIHAD: I do have ATT Wdcisco and it has to be ATT service that our relative has unless someone signed a special contract with ATT.
ATT said that they have no record of the phone number or name and that came from both customer service and the service techs 3 different times. I am going to try again tomorrrow at ATT maybe i just need to get someone that can go beyond the basics.
The problem with the circuit (if thats what it is) has been going on for three days. Our big concern would be if he had no minutes left on the phone. That means there is something else wrong, thats why i am trying to find out. I am pretty sure it's the circuit but we have nobody close to this person that can go check on him and at this point do not want to call the police to check.
I never thought it would be this hard to find out about a possible problem with a circuit no matter who's circuit it is.
I call one time it does not ring, i call later and it says all the circuits are busy, then another call indicates it's out of service, it changes between them all day long. Got to be the circuit.
Thanks for all the help.
Oh..ok..well you know if he had a prepaid phone and he didn't put minutes on it for a while it gets disconnected and the number gets redistributed...GL! Posted by bdgee on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: i figure it like this:
Pi will never be known until the universe stops expanding...
It isn't that it is unknown, glass...., it is known and known for exactly what it is, the ratio of the circumference and the diameter of a circle.
It is an entity of logic.
It isn't derived from the existence or circumstances of the physical being of things, so the expansion or contraction or even the very existence of the universe or God or anything has nothing to do with it and what it is or isn't.
But, just as it is a logical derivative, it logically is impossible for there to be any decimal representation of Pi that can be expressed as either a finite or infinitely repeating decimal. Thus any decimal representation of Pi (or any other irrational number, for that matter), would be infinite and non-repeating....and that is something beyond the possibility of writing or indicating with writing, since writing is a physical thing.
The numbers that are the square root of 2 (there are two of them, one negative and one positive), the square roots of 10, the number e, that is the base of the natural logarithms, and many many others are in that same situation. They are the "irrational numbers". Indeed, there are even more than simply "infinitely many" irrational numbers, which most numbers are, there are "uncountably infinitely many"....even as many irrational numbers as all the numbers put together.
The strange query is: is there an uncountable set of numbers that forms a set less numerous than the set of all numbers. That turns out to neither true nor false. The assumption that there is such a set is called the "continuum hypothesis" and is one of the fundamentals allowable in formal logic.
Oops....
Sometimes the mathematician and logician deep within stirs to life and exerts himself openly and uncontrollably.
(Down, boy, DOWN. Back in your den and be quiet! Sleep now....hibernate, damned you...)
My apologies folk....
Posted by glassman on :
party pooper.
Posted by bdgee on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: party pooper.
You wanted maybe me to let it continue and then you might be subjected to a complete development of cardinality and ordinality?
You are a brave soul.
Posted by cottonjim on :
THE HUMANITY.............................WONT SOMEBODY PLEASE THINK OF THE CHILDREN Posted by BooDog on :
Wow Bdgee.
After that....It's 5 o'clock somewhere for me. lol.
Posted by glassman on :
The strange query is: is there an uncountable set of numbers that forms a set less numerous than the set of all numbers. That turns out to neither true nor false. The assumption that there is such a set is called the "continuum hypothesis" and is one of the fundamentals allowable in formal logic.
lemme ask you a simple question budge. if the universe is infinite in size and mass? then can it ever finish expanding?
and if it can never finish expanding? then where in the hell is it expanding to?
infinity is an illogical concept...
Posted by cottonjim on :
<------ lighting incense, again.
Cool glass. Lets assume that the universe is constantly expanding. We have to assume that is expanding into a void, which brings up a series of questions on its own. Is the void infinite or does the universe have walls?
Posted by glassman on :
it's turtles all the way down Posted by glassman on :
seriously? i'm just saying that infinity is a human construct that has no basis for reality and demonstrates the hubrus of the human mind...
here's another thing that occurred to me one day while i was listening to the dark side of the moon... we assume black holes exist. Dr Hawkings proved it..
i admit i can't read his proof...
then he turned around and proved they weren't black...
that one i understand...
but?
what if the black holes are the exact opposite of what he assumed...
what if they are really *holes* as in absolutely nothing (in this universe) and entropy forces matter into them instead of gravity sucking it in?
Posted by glassman on :
we assume the universe is exapanding ONLY because of the doppler effect on the EM spectrum (red shift) there are other possible explanations for the red shift...
the universe APPEARS to be expanding no matter which direction we look...
that is hard to reconcile...
Posted by cottonjim on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: we assume the universe is exapanding ONLY because of the doppler effect on the EM spectrum (red shift) there are other possible explanations for the red shift...
the universe APPEARS to be expanding no matter which direction we look...
that is hard to reconcile...
Expanding into WHAT????? Nothingness, dark matter, complete void???
Posted by cottonjim on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: The strange query is: is there an uncountable set of numbers that forms a set less numerous than the set of all numbers. That turns out to neither true nor false. The assumption that there is such a set is called the "continuum hypothesis" and is one of the fundamentals allowable in formal logic.
lemme ask you a simple question budge. if the universe is infinite in size and mass? then can it ever finish expanding?
and if it can never finish expanding? then where in the hell is it expanding to?
infinity is an illogical concept...
Infinity is not a place or a distance or measure of something. It only has logical validity in the consideration of things like sets and sequences.
....such as there is no end to the sequence of positive integers 1,2,3, - - -.
Strictly speaking we cannot "define" any word and we cannot define the word "infinitely". It has "usages", though and we can define (say what is meant by) a phrase or statement, provided we outlaw any that are illogical, (such as the set of all people that go to each others funeral......and you can never say what a set is, sometime what it isn't though).
We can give meaning to the statement that a sequence is infinite:
The statement that a sequence is infinite means that, it has no last term (or any term is followed by another.)
Equivalently: The statement that a sequence, S, is infinite , means that, if N is any positive integer, then S has at least N elements.
That "definition" of the statement that "the sequence, S, is infinite" can be the model to offer meaning to infinite sets:
The statement that the set, S, is infinitemeans that.if N is a positive integer, S has N elements.
(Careful, with that....the statement that 1 is a positive integer does not say 1 is the only positive integer the statement that a set has N elements does not preclude it from having more than N elememts.)
Digressing a moment, the question of whether or not the universe is infinite and even if it contains infinitely many "things" are questions of physics and not logic. If the distance "across" the universe is not infinite (the universe could turn out to be bounded but still infinite), if it is a mertic Euclidean space, and we accept the old argument of Archimedes to proved that the beach does not contain infinitely many grains of sand, then there cannot be infinitely many "things". (Even that does not disallow infinitely many possible positions for "things".)
This can go on and on and actually does amongst cosmologist.
Logically, infinity is a property that sets sequences may or may not have and is only a valid concept for them.
THUS, in fact, your conclusion that "infinity is an illogical concept..." is faulty because
infinity is ONLY a concept of logic. Posted by glassman on :
give me some time man...
that article referenced a new pub from Case western...
it was published;
Observation of Incipient Black Holes and the Information Loss Problem Authors: Tanmay Vachaspati, Dejan Stojkovic, Lawrence M. Krauss (Submitted on 7 Sep 2006 (v1), last revised 7 Jun 2007 (this version, v3))
Abstract: We study the formation of black holes by spherical domain wall collapse as seen by an asymptotic observer, using the functional Schrodinger formalism. To explore what signals such observers will see, we study radiation of a scalar quantum field in the collapsing domain wall background. The total energy flux radiated diverges when backreaction of the radiation on the collapsing wall is ignored, and the domain wall is seen by the asymptotic observer to evaporate by non-thermal ``pre-Hawking radiation'' during the collapse process. Evaporation by pre-Hawking radiation implies that an asymptotic observer can never lose objects down a black hole. Together with the non-thermal nature of the radiation, this may resolve the black hole information loss problem.
here's some posts that were put up by me and blue in mich before they published....
i wonder if they were reading.... or if blue is one of "them"
Member
Icon 1 posted March 23, 2004 23:38 Profile for glassman Send New Private Message Edit/Delete Post Reply With Quote Ok--I'll bite---I really didn't want to do much typing tonite-BUT
The red shift is the basic evidence for the expansion of the universe right now(well OK last year. we may have some new stuff worked up that isn't in print yet) the red shift is a phenomena splained currently as the "stretching" of light waves as they are emitted from an object that is moving directly away from the viewer--One of the BIG problems presented by this theory is that EVERYTHING we look at in deep space is displaying it---That means that EVERYTHING in the universe is moving away from everything else----HMMMMMMMM One possible explanation that is not fully accepted YET--is that the red shift may actually be caused by gravity-----------there are a lot of implications produced by this theory and Einstein did in fact say plainly that gravity sretches/curves space-- the curvature of space could in fact be causing the red shift not "the traveling away".
There are a lot of theories that are accepted and considered to be fact by the general populace--- the theophysicists debate these theories constantly--if you read the discusions/arguments they have--it becomes clear that there is a lot of assumption going on. We still are a long way from a unified theory. That in itself proves we don't have anywhere near the right answers yet--our current poor theories don't even give us ONE theory that we can start to test.
The string theory has been falling out of favor lately.
you'll have to find the thread yourself since no matter how i try i can't figger out how to post a link thru my searches. i have to go an put a response on the old thread to bring it forward, and i would appreciate it you did NOT do that....
Posted by glassman on :
infinity is ONLY a concept of logic.
and that, Budge, is exactly why academics "annoy" me
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by cottonjim:
quote:Originally posted by glassman: we assume the universe is exapanding ONLY because of the doppler effect on the EM spectrum (red shift) there are other possible explanations for the red shift...
the universe APPEARS to be expanding no matter which direction we look...
that is hard to reconcile...
Expanding into WHAT????? Nothingness, dark matter, complete void???
the answers that we have right now depend on which branch of study you favor....
surgeons are gonna cure you with a scalpel.. radiologists prefer a gamma knife...
if you are a quantum physics person? the edges of the universe are literally everywhere.. in you outside you etc...
see quantum foam... they are "holes" that are sub-nano-scopic...
they are so small that we can't exchange information or matter across the "boundary"... if they are correct? and since you are a Dark Side of the Moon person? i'll offer up the idea that complex neural nets may be able to exchange information across the boundaries Posted by cottonjim on :
I will accept that idea, I am in agreement with the thought that black holes, no matter how powerful, do not have the ability to completely destroy or erase matter or data. Some part still remains, if even energy.
If I may recomend some light, and entertaining, reading. The four book series: The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy The restraunt at the end of the Universe Life, the Universe and everything So long and thanks for all the fish.
Posted by bdgee on :
Maybe light's frequency deteriorates with distance traveled (equivalently with time), but at such a rate as to seem not to be locally. Then the change in the frequency of blue light that starts and we measure it across a laboratory or an ocean is so small we can't measure it, but over light years of distance we detect it and interpret it as a Dopler shift?
Posted by glassman on :
Ok, i sorta mispoke..
electrons probably can go thru the holes...
are they matter? hmmmm.....
next step?
one of the assumptions of astrophysicists is that every galaxy has a black hole in the center as sort of a well, a uh, gravity "anchor"... of course? we can't SEE them....
but? if you reverse the gravitational function and look at a black hole as a drain?
you get this:
the rotational energy of the galaxy keeps it out of the "hole"..
where did the hole come from?
the rotational energy of the galaxy stretches the quantum holes to unusual dimension?
who knows?
Posted by cottonjim on :
Is that not how they determined that the universe is indeed expanding?
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by cottonjim: I will accept that idea, I am in agreement with the thought that black holes, no matter how powerful, do not have the ability to completely destroy or erase matter or data. Some part still remains, if even energy.
If I may recomend some light, and entertaining, reading. The four book series: The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy The restraunt at the end of the Universe Life, the Universe and everything So long and thanks for all the fish.
Tau Zero by Poul Anderson is good,
Have Spacesuit Will Travel explores the edges of the unvierse concepts too... it's a classic...
Posted by cottonjim on :
Glass, by that logic then we can assume that, since the water goes down the drain in a clockwise rotation we could stop the water from draining if we could force the water into a equal couter clockwise rotation. Sounds like a freakin science fair experiment. THis is all way to heavy for a Friday afternoon Posted by cottonjim on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman:
quote:Originally posted by cottonjim: I will accept that idea, I am in agreement with the thought that black holes, no matter how powerful, do not have the ability to completely destroy or erase matter or data. Some part still remains, if even energy.
If I may recomend some light, and entertaining, reading. The four book series: The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy The restraunt at the end of the Universe Life, the Universe and everything So long and thanks for all the fish.
Tau Zero by Poul Anderson is good,
Have Spacesuit Will Travel explores the edges of the unvierse concepts too... it's a classic...
I will write that down and look for it next time I am at Barnes, thanks.
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by bdgee: Maybe light's frequency deteriorates with distance traveled (equivalently with time), but at such a rate as to seem not to be locally. Then the change in the frequency of blue light that starts and we measure it across a laboratory or an ocean is so small we can't measure it, but over light years of distance we detect it and interpret it as a Dopler shift?
could be,
it could also simply be that light is "slowed down" (doppler shifted) by gravity and every time we point our scopes at a source? well, there's gravity in the source...
it is als possible the space is not "nothing" and space itself distorts the wavelength...
the "space is not nothing" assumption also answers the glaring question of where all the extra mass in the universe is "hiding"...
do fish know they are in water?
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by cottonjim: Glass, by that logic then we can assume that, since the water goes down the drain in a clockwise rotation we could stop the water from draining if we could force the water into a equal couter clockwise rotation. Sounds like a freakin science fair experiment. THis is all way to heavy for a Friday afternoon
how do i 'splain this????
the reverseness isn't on that plane
(i'm actually just posting this between peices..., and the furnace is hot so i can't waste $$)
maybe this will help, it's not really a drain that i'm trying to make the comparison to...
it's the creation of the hole you are seeing in the water...
Posted by cottonjim on :
So what you are saying is, the drain is not the black hole, rather the hole that is created by the vortex of water is the "black Hole". That I understand, but... that does then not explain why "the rotational energy of the galaxy keeps it out of the hole".. The hole, while draining water, is caused by the rotation of mass. Are you possibly implying that is the rotation of the mass in the universe that causes a black hole in the very center of the universe? This could go on all day Posted by glassman on :
Are you possibly implying that is the rotation of the mass in the universe that causes a black hole in the very center of the universe?
exactly.
not just the universe, but each galaxy too...
remember those quantum holes i mentioned?
think of a pizza dough being tossed and spun for a galaxy...
or doughnut dough being tossed like a pizza dough for the universe..
say theres a few tiny holes in the very center of the pizza dough when you start . (quantum holes in the real galaxy)
those holes will get bigger and bigger, and prolly become one big one as you make the big pizza pie shape out of the dough..
this is speculation.
Posted by bdgee on :
Another possibility is that time is not homogenous with respect to itself. Maybe light is, though, and over time it remains the same, but with a sped up or slowed down time, the distance between wave peaks "look" to have changed, when in actuality it is the variation in the rate of time that changes.
That too would make for a a Dopler effect and maybe explain the red shift observations without necessitating an expanding universe.
Something that is in vogue among the cosmologist now and has been considered only recently is the possibility that time doesn't exists and is but an illusion.
Posted by cottonjim on :
So here’s a thought using your theory. The universe is not growing; it is just spreading out as the hole is the pizza crust gets bigger. OR is this what is meant by the univ. expanding? It is not "growing" in mass, merely spreading out. Basically we are living in a doughnut and as the hole in the center keeps getting larger, the mass that makes up the bread is getting thinner and thinner until one day.......................... Poof, no more doughnut
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by cottonjim: So here’s a thought using your theory. The universe is not growing; it is just spreading out as the hole is the pizza crust gets bigger. OR is this what is meant by the univ. expanding? It is not "growing" in mass, merely spreading out. Basically we are living in a doughnut and as the hole in the center keeps getting larger, the mass that makes up the bread is getting thinner and thinner until one day.......................... Poof, no more doughnut
if we build a telescope powerful enough? we'll see the back of our head Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by bdgee: Another possibility is that time is not homogenous with respect to itself. Maybe light is, though, and over time it remains the same, but with a sped up or slowed down time, the distance between wave peaks "look" to have changed, when in actuality it is the variation in the rate of time that changes.
That too would make for a a Dopler effect and maybe explain the red shift observations without necessitating an expanding universe.
Something that is in vogue among the cosmologist now and has been considered only recently is the possibility that time doesn't exists and is but an illusion.
with your math back gorund? you might be able to prove some of these theories..
i don't have the math... i just have the "visual playground"...
i'll keep making glass, it's more fun than a slide rule to me..
Posted by bdgee on :
There was a time I considered that, glass....
Back in the student days, I considered that maybe there was some character of time we can see or even know is ther from observation, that maybe what we see of time is only a closed dense in itself subset embedded as a nowhere dense subset of another set (or space), such as results when one embeds the real line in what is called a Souslin space.
What we know as the "time continuum" is basically a topological equivalent of the real line, so if it is embedded in a broader space that, like a Souslin space, does not have uncountably many mutually exclusive open sets and is not separable, then as a subspace of the larger space, it is nowhere dense and closed, implying that between any two points of time, there is a lot of time we cannot observe.
A professor heard of my ideas and talked to me about pursuing the questions as a possible dissertation topic under him. I considered it, but found other queries that were more intriguing and followed another path.
Posted by glassman on :
i know time speeds up and slows down...
every time i quit smoking time gets reaaalll slow Posted by glassman on :
time is just a function of energy...
if you have a block of ice? time is much slower in there than it is in a pressure cooker...
Posted by bdgee on :
Once upon a time I was working in chemistry and physics and studied quantum mechanics. I noted right off that if one doesn't require time to be connected and continuous, then there is no need to require energy to be quantized to make all the equations of the subject work. Things work just as well by quantizing time.
Posted by glassman on :
what do you think about the POSSIBLITY that the reason we can't definitively quantify the location of an electron or a photon is because they are in fact travling into and out of other universes (or dimensions if that's what you want to call them)...
basically i see light particles as analogues of electrons, they seem "paired up " to me...
Posted by bdgee on :
I don't know what to think about it being a fact that they move into and out of this universe, but, according to Heisenberg's principle of uncertainty, which is quite well founded and not at all in question, whether they stay in this universe or jump to another, it would still be impossible to know their location and velocity precisely at any specific time, since the only way to know that is to observe them by bombarding them with some form of matter or energy, which then alters that position and velocity.
Posted by glassman on :
Heisenberg? he's got nothing to do with this...
the some of us have known for years that Schroedingers cat is dead cuz the grad student forgot to put food in the box with him..
Although it, by modern standards is ancient now, you might enjoy reading "Matter and Light. The New Physics" by Louis de Broglie or his later "The Revolution in Physics : A Non mathematical Survey of Quanta", which is an easier read.
"In 1929 the Swedish Academy of Sciences conferred on (de Broglie) the Nobel Prize for Physics "for his discovery of the wave nature of electrons".
Just reading through a very brief biography of de Broglie is fascinating, as he belies the often claimed "fact" that science and mathematics are a game of the young, since he was well beyond youth when he began his scientific efforts.
Posted by glassman on :
if they spent more time making educational programs like that? our kids would at least be better informed.. it doesn't really make them better students or more productive tho....
Posted by bdgee on :
Might make 'em pay attention and ask a few questions themselves, though. Enough of that and they might start trying to answer too.
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