We all know the feeling of " WOW, what if something catastrophic happens??? "
Posted by glassman on :
so how much bank do you need to be considered above upper middle class?
5 mill$$$$$$??????
if so? i'M ONLY 4.99 MILL AWAY yeehaaaa
Posted by ohdagagain on :
I am only 5 mill away!
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
I'm only $5,180,000.00 away!
That means I'm only $180,000.00 upside down..
Hey, I have arrived!
Luv dat middle class!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If ya gimme a hamburger today, I'll gladly pay ya tomorrow........With the glassmans money!!!!
Posted by glassman on :
don't get too excited with my money there dusty, i'm so cheap i didn't even hire any movers and the coolest day day the last week was 104 heat index but i have managed so far without a stroke or heart attack, i bet there are a few disappointed people out there
don't give up hope yet Art, i still have 7 or 8 more tons to move......
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
Whats a mover?
O ya, friends. ----------------------------------------------- Merck just lost! They will APPEAL!
Posted by glassman on :
what are friends? LOL
i have four, no five
Jim Beam
Jose Cuervo
Sam Adams
and Mr's Smith & Wesson......
Mr Colt is family, so i don't count him as a friend Posted by Dustoff101 on :
O great, a drunk mover!!
Yer neighbors are gonna string ya up if ya splat!!
they'uns cow.
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
They not only are taking all our money, now they're killing us off with the help of the FDA!!
gO mErCk ,,,,,to hell.!!!@#$%^&*()((*&^%$#@!
Don't ya just luv the alternate income tax law?!!!@#$%^&*((**&^%$#@!
Posted by bdgee on :
Heh heh heh heh
"Damned fools really thought there was going to be a tax break for the un-fabulously wealthy", Carl!
"Yeah", George, "it's a riot. We put another one over on them, but laughing like this makes my sides hurt!"
Posted by keithsan on :
quote:Originally posted by bdgee: Heh heh heh heh
"Damned fools really thought there was going to be a tax break for the un-fabulously wealthy", Carl!
"Yeah", George, "it's a riot. We put another one over on them, but laughing like this makes my sides hurt!"
Tell ya what, I got a nice tax break and I aint fabulously rich. Besides that I lowered my mortgage rate and my educational loans to rates rarely seen before.
The problem with this rich argument is families making 100k a year are considered rich, that may be true in alabama, but not in boston and N.Y.
Its a sad argument when I'm considered fabulously wealthy, I guess there wasnt a huge tax break on welfare recipients but thats kind of tough aint it.
Posted by bdgee on :
Most families in this country will never see 100K a year or anything close to that. I have no idea what it is you are intending to imply about Alabama.
Posted by keithsan on :
I was implying nothing about Alabama, but I know you can pay 350. a month for a really nice 2 floor 3 bedroom apartment. While living outside the city limits of Boston, nowhere near the expensive areas a 2 bedroom apartment in a 3 decker is 1500 I've paid it and it was a steal.
You are right most families won't get 100k a year but in boston thats a cop and a janitor. NO WHERE NEAR THE RICHEST OR the SUPPOSED "UPPER CLASS WEALTHY"! its Exactly the definition of middle class.
N.Y. is even more expensive, not sure where LA fits in.
My only point is the "media/politcal" argument does not take these facts into account. They won't show you a fireman when they say richest, they'll show you bill o'reilly.
Posted by glassman on :
I was implying nothing about Alabama, but I know you can pay 350. a month for a really nice 2 floor 3 bedroom apartment.
i am very skeptical about 350 amonth for a nice 1 bedroom place anywhere in the uS...
i live in one of the most depressed parts of the country... for 350 a month? you get a shack in Mississississississipi.... and the schools? well lets just say it would be funny if it wasn't our future.... the auto insurance is outrageous here too..cuz there are so many uninsured drivers... and groceries cost the same as in socali......
in Riverside CA? for a grand a month you get a 2 bedroom 1 bath MAYBE, if you are lucky...
avge home price in america is 235K$....
30 yr fixed 6% note on 200K$ is 18K$ year at least.....PITI...
median income is under 50K$ and 3 times 18K is 54K$... something is VERY wrong here.... mortgages should never exceed 1/3 of your gross pay.... the math don't work...
math don't lie...but mortgage applicants do all the time...
i see a bad moon rising...
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
Creedance Clearwater. Well ya might have sumpun dare glassman.
He does go well with sippin Whiskey and a good Cigar.
Posted by glassman on :
sippin Whiskey and a good Cigar?
yeah that's what i'll be doin' as i watch all the mortgage co's re-possess... no big deal to me, but the trap has been set, and it'll be sprung soon.... Posted by keithsan on :
glass was talking 2 years ago, had a buddy tennis coach saw pictures of the place, know the price. Was just after we stopped renting, I'm sure boston prices are higher now.
short the moon.
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
glassman, I think the new B/K interpations will create havoc in some area's.....
I am not concerned about the debt scammers, it's the solid folks I am concerned about...
I see concerned good people struggling against the pit falls of middle age, who should not be fearful at this point in they're financial lives.
FEAR, of being trapped and losing everything without a way to get out, may couse some to pre-maturly sell they're homes.
Debt { personal } is out of control, for many.
I know some very so-called " solid citizens " who are facing a major financial crisis..
The huge losses incured by many in they're Mutual Funds, coused by the bubble [2000] well, the losses are still there.
Caring for elderly parents is cousing financial and personal chaos for many...
Health problems that pop up out of nowhere are sending people into the courts for financial re-lief..
It happens so fast people just plain go into shock.
Medical bills are completely wiping people out.
[ August 20, 2005, 18:06: Message edited by: Dustoff101 ]
Posted by glassman on :
my kids' TIA creff accounts have been stale for 5 years...
good thing iALSO put them in some dividend re-investments on local power/nat gas co's....
yes, a lot of people are gonna hurt bad...
when you do the math? 65K/yr for a family of four and a mortgage over a grand amonth is a recipe for disaster if gasoline don't come back to 2$..
i've watched GASOLINE go up and OIL follow it NOT the vice-versa..i think we been scammed myself....
i think the oil-refining co's have gotten therebadselves a very good monopoly....
oil just followed gasoline up....
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
I did an edit on my last post, whats your take on medical bills and personal family obligations to our elderly parents?
Posted by glassman on :
medicine? no fix....
the AMA is the most powerful labor union ever seen on the planet.. they set up the insurance deal to get rich and put themselves on a pedastal... ever do any real research on your OWN health "conditions" and ask the doc? they get real pi$$ed.... they deserve to be paying ridiculous insurance premiums...more people die from medical mistakes than car accidents in the US....alot more...
funny? while you were posting that? i was checking our blue cross blue sheild bill.... it's not too bad, but we have a lot of co-pays...
there is a myth that we americans have the best health-care in the world...it's a myth.....it's not bad, but what we have is unsustainable, and that has been known since the 70's... it's just a matter of time . esp. with all of the illegal aliens we insured people are paying the bills for......
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
I am fortunate personaly and financialy to have the VA.
Most of my health problems are due in part or totaly becouse of service in ya know where. I am not spewing sour grapes, just a fact.
What I do see is a suddle discrimination against my wife. They are really playing games with middle-aged women. She is well educated and works in the medical feild. She is one of the "go to people" in her department when the "ahemmm" hits the fan. Her supervisor told me face to face that she is a front line gem. Now here's the strange part.... I think they are trying to get rid of the best people, so they can re do the health and retirement programs... They want to bring in Philipinos to replace them. Many of the degrees these people have are suspect at best. Medical care will deteriate, accidents and just plain mal-practice will pre-vail. Do they think they can hide behind the new Tort re-forms?
Posted by bdgee on :
In this country. medical cost are the single greatest inflationary expenses ever. Something must be done to get it under control, but that won't happen any time soon as the medical profession is, per capita and per dollar, the biggest contributers to the Republiucan party.
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
Bdgee, care to tackle my statement and question to glassman about discrimination against well qualified people?
I know about the politics bdgee, I want to focus on the age and seniority problem...
bdgee i know you are well educated and a teacher. my question is this, is tort re-form out of your league?
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
Well, that was a lead balloon. Let me ask it this way.
Are these companys gambling on Tort re-forms to have they're way with salaried professionals?
Posted by glassman on :
it's not just tort reform dusty... that was a head-fake.. tort reform won't fix anything except the insurance companies bottom lines... and screw the trial lawyers.... when they( the dems) get back in power? the laws will be repealed...and they will get back in power sooner or later.. just another sand in the vaseline job by the politicos... as far as your wife's situation? you are probly suspecting correctly.. i've seen it in the grad schools too...
they are all looking for compliant people who can live on beans and rice, and don't have any real options... 80 hrs a week is the expectation in grad school research positions, even tho its ILLEGAL...they expect you to lie on your time sheets and they sign them and turn them in.....yeah, i want to see the job get done...but the law is the law. quit making stupid laws that will have broken and just lookin the other way when they are...
it doesn't matter if you work hard anymore, the bottom line is what counts..that's capitalism. only problem is? many foreigners are happy to have phones, running water and electricity...things we(most of us anyway) take for granted...
if you would bring up some specifics about tort reform? we could kick them around... IMO?? new bankruptcy laws new tort reform and the alternative minimum tax are putting US common folks in a box....
everybody wants something for nothing...
look at the markets the last few years, same deal...
Martha goes to jail for lying to investigators... wonder how you compare that to the lies the white house staff has been putting out to US ????
i wanna see some justice... not much to be found tho
Posted by bdgee on :
The best way io can start this is to say I agree with you, whole heartedly, about the "intent" to undermine the security of the educated and, as you aptly point out, the "salaried professionals", but not simply because they want to pay less for that work. Those people are the strangth of what they like to refer to as "liberals". Actually, to the out and out staunch Republican gut feel conservative, anything that might bring about consideration of their 18th century view of society and politics and science and reality is "liberal". Learning too much (that is more than is required to follow orders and do the repetitive things General Motors wants done....specialist, you know....holders of the left side of a fron bummper while adifferent specialist slips in the bolts and another the nut and another tightens it) causes people to wonder about things. Then comes the big rub! They think for themselves and are not obedient! They turn into "liberals" in spite of all the teachings of gramma and the church and can even be caught watchin public tv! But mostly, they are difficult to control.
In the 70s and 80s, in the better graduate schools, it was the in thing to weed out American students in favor of foreign students, not because they were cheaper, but because they were afraid to not "fit the mold." (That was not what they claimed to be doing, but it was what they were doing. I have theories of what caused that too.) The didn't pay them less....indeed, in many cases they were more expensive. (Here let me retrace a bit for those of you not familiar with the operaation of first class graduate schools. Teaching of lower level undergraduates is done almost entirely by graduate students, called Teaching assistants. having been on all sides of that situation, let me assure you they are far better teachers, for those lower level classes, than the senior faculty members.) They we NOT wanting a cheaper or better operation, they wanted an obedient following.....and they got it! I have to be somewhere soon, so I'll get back on this later. I'll leave you with one scary as hell thought.......unifirm examination of students isn't cheaper or more effective, but it can be done by a collection of near clones spouting Big Brother's Endoctrinations!
Posted by BuyTex on :
hope this helps anecdotally, but "tort reform" specifically is not something I've looked into...
1) age-ism thrives, one quick example of dozens: Recently a big-time govt contractor got jammed up on a proposal for communication-support for the Army. A player there knew my work, so when they asked if he knew anybody who could break the logjam, he recommended me. They offered me a contract, via -email, no interview. Went in, did the work, left. Yay...
Yet, if I go to an agency just looking for 2- to 6-week assignments? They look at my resume and try not to chuckle. Finally: "I'm sorry, sir--we can't even SEND you on-site. You have too much management experience."
lol, true story, I kid you not...
It's rigged now to rent "contractors" so they can avoid bennies for as long as possible, then finally hire the warmest body that costs the least.
2) Medical system? Insurance companies have THE HAMMER. Spent about 6 months getting my buddy's back-office systems in shape. He's a popular chiropractor (and please...I don't want to debate the merits of "who's a doctor?") and helps a lotta folks and has had a successful sideline explaining insuarance regs and coding to other practices. I became, by default, the in-house "expert" on cold files and worker's comp.
Bottom line--it's all a game. First thing they do is deny. period. just to see what the practice will do next...
If you resubmit--as most "office managers" do--it gets denied again...but when you look into it and follow the code-trail? It was denied the second time because it had *already been denied."
I call that "bad-faith tautology."
Turns out, you have to get a little rubber stamp (or appropriate software ) and place these words in the margins of your new (duplicate) forms: "Request for Reconsideration," and once you do, yip, yip, cowboy--checks start hitting the mailbox...
However, sometimes that doesn't work--then you start *warning them* with bracing language, quoting the exact regs they're violating...
Guess what? cha-cha-ching...
The office manager? Hated me...
Dusty, it ain't exactly new, either. Just more pronounced and obvious nowadays...My mom ran all the insurance for major media corporation here, that was family owned for decades...treated her well...when they got bought by ABC/Disney, I think it was, she had trouble getting raises. Yet, when she retired a few years early for health reasons? They divvied her job among two on-staff...and hired *three new employees.*
Kinda hard to believe they couldn't afford a good raise, yet to replace her took five people, lol...
I agree with Glassy--if you think "tort reform" needsa check-up, post some good leads...
best, y'alllllllllll!
Posted by bdgee on :
Here's a specific about tort reform. That multi multi million dollar court awarded to that widdow earlier in the week isn't legal! The Texas tort reforms don't allow it. She'll be lucky to end up with 100K in the end and that's BEFORE expenses of the suit. It'll take ten years to finish the appeals that law puts in place for the the drug company and another ten to collect. And the drug companies will use it to get even more out of the government by advertising and calling it communist and "liberal" and getting the conservatives scared of the "liberals", i.e., the non-docil and the educated.
Posted by glassman on :
advertising pharmaceuticals.... i hate it..
we PAY for those ads in our insurance premiums .. and they spnend a hellofalot more on advertising than they do on R&D.....
got ED? LOL NASCAR wouldn't let 'em use hard liquor sponsorships, but Viagra is OK...and even on the world news(at dinnertime with yer kids??) sheesh..
BTW? i have VA benee's too, but i don't use 'em since Iraq...others need 'em more and the budget is limited....
Posted by DeportTheWitless on :
Just wait glass, soon there will be stipulations on viavara advertising. To be honest it isn't viagara that offends me... irritates... yeah but not offend. It's the pepto bismal ads... Do I really need a catchy little jingle floating around in my head all day that ends with diarhea?
Posted by BuyTex on :
from your tone, you seem to be familiar, here--is this a new alias?
Posted by BuyTex on :
yup--answered on another thread-- "Diqueiriesco" ot however he/she spells it...
Posted by DeportTheWitless on :
Tex... you need not tell anyone who I am as they already know by my vernacular.
Posted by BuyTex on :
manana, man--lol, i'm sure if it's a problem, we'll circle the wagons.
If not?
welcome back!
I do wonder: why the new alias?
Posted by DeportTheWitless on :
You don't want to circle my wagon... If anything.. say "Thank you for the understandable name"
Posted by BuyTex on :
agreed--when the new alias first showed up? understandably, I'm wondering...but now you seem like a vet--what's with the new handle?
Posted by DeportTheWitless on :
it isn't evident? No I guess not... get to know me and soon you will see... My "New handle" is more of a suggestion than a name.
Posted by BuyTex on :
ya...but why the new handle? What was wrong with "deriesisqo" or whatver?
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
Thanks guys for all the imput. I was busy working on a carpenter ant problem.
Ok, for the purpose of clairity let me list a list of topics for this thread.
1 Age discrimination in general 2 Medical expense's 3 Medical care 4 Tort reform 5 declining buying power 6 Abuse of Professional people 7 Discrimination against middle aged women 8 Caring for our elderly parents 9 Debt 10 Dealing with the pitfalls of middle age in this new society 11 Fear of financial insecurity where there should be none 12 Are our homes at jeopardy, more so now becouse of coming Tort reforms, regarding B/K 13 Alternative minimum tax laws
glassman, is the above a little more specific fer ya.LOL
P.S 1 last major headache, carpenter ants and termites!
Posted by DeportTheWitless on :
How about #14 No middle class means communism wins. 99% in poverty receiving bread crumbs from the three people who comprise the upper crust. #15 capitalism Wins: thirty percent of us are losers and will remain poor. Fifty percent are reasonably capable and are living as such. Twenty percent are more than capable and are living as such. Yeah I like number fifteen seems more real... more honest.
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
DEport, whats your take on #9 and #12?
Posted by bill1352 on :
ya ever think it's just the normal course of a changing economy? tthe U.S. has been based on manufacturing for close to 100 years. history says everything changes & maybe during that change many do get hurt for a time, even a whole generation but on the other side things look brighter. the U.S. has become a place of sue everyone for anything. there are no more accidents in the US, everything is someone else's fault. we are becoming a country of victims not taking responsibility for our own actions. if something goes wrong sue somebody. this attitude can not make a country stronger. there is no perfect place where nothing ever goes wrong. at the same time greed of big business will cause ppl to get hurt. the solution is very difficult. tort reform is needed but not at the loss of going after big business that doesn't care about safety of the buyer.
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
#16 moral decay of the middle class, both conservative and libral.
Posted by bdgee on :
Middle class? Weren't those the people that worked at General Moters and Montgomery Ward and in a thousand huge offices in New York City and Denver and Seattle and whose jos are now in Mexico and India? You know, the ones with insurance and vacation time and belonged to loyal industry groups even into retirement. Hey...and they had retirement.
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
bdgee, good point. I am not so sure the Darwinion theory of survival of the fitest is going to is be the best course for our declining middle class to follow.....
From the heart, we know as a decent society we can not survive as a dog eat dog group, only functioning to serve our own desires.
This huge loss of decent middle age and middle class bread winners is becoming an American tradgedy.
Posted by bdgee on :
Hear! Hear! Dusty, well said.
Posted by BuyTex on :
Hope you don't get sued for that post, Bill...
Posted by Wallace#1 on :
Hell, I gave up thinking about those items (1 thru ??). With the politicians we have voted into office, nothing will change. It will only get worse. Doesn't matter which party. In addition to screwing us every which way and back, they find ways to waste billions of dollars on pork barrel riders. Maybe if they were given free reign, they would end up fighting each other and terminate both. Then, we might be able to start over again. Sure, Wallace, sure.
PS: Real problem is that there are too many vested interests in politics.
Posted by Dustoff101 on :
#17 inflation,
O,,,, EXUZZZZEE me, I forgot, we're not supposed to know that...
Posted by glassman on :
dusty... carpenter ants eat termites go figger that one
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
yeehaaaa
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
and the coolest day day the last week was 104 heat index ![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
but i have managed so far without a stroke or heart attack, i bet there are a few disappointed people out there ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)