Thought I would share this email from one of the silent majority.

Liberals hate big business. Yet they LOVE big cities. Just take a look at the blue territories on the county map - they're all counties with big cities. Interesting part - you don't find "nature loving" liberals outside of big cities. Big cities are the epitome of unnatural, "big corporation" living. They absolutely love to live in the big industrial concrete jungles they claim to hate. After all, cities stand where nature once flourished. Nature had to be ripped, burned, plowed and chopped down to build large cities. So where do these "nature activists" choose to live? Yup - cities. The bigger the better, for some reason. And I've never met a liberal who wanted to live out in the country. With all that nature/environment talk, they sure are bedazzled by city life. Go figure. The only time you meet a liberal out in the countryside is when you bump into them as they are in the process of driving from one big city to another, and even then, they prefer to fly (hence the liberal term "fly-over country", otherwise known as the red states).
Speaking of red states: With much weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth, heathen liberals everywhere are labeling all the "red" territories as "Jesus Country". Darned straight! Besides, how else would you expect these sniveling, godless weasels to react? A key point to keep in mind: In grudgingly naming the red zones "Jesus Country", the liberals have inadvertently judged themselves to be the godless heathen we have always claimed them to be. Their utter disgust for religion is now on parade for all to see (and as we already know, this is only the beginning).
No matter how much the libs whine and snivel about how the entire country slam-voted gay marriage, they're simply going to have to get used to the fact that the vast majority of all humanity is not homophobic (we don't fear homosexuality at all) we just HATE it. It sickens us, it repulses us, and it turns our stomachs to even have images of it in our minds. Homosexuality is a direct assault on nature itself. We will NEVER be open to it, no matter how much the liberal media tries to ram it down our throats.

The libs can go right ahead and move up to Canada, the country that likes to lead people to believe that it's superior to the United States (they turn their noses up at us - what do you you expect from a country that speaks french?). On their way out the door, remind your liberal friends that 85% of the entire Canadian population and nearly all of it's major cities are right up against the United States border. Who's your daddy, Canada?
It just tickles me pink to see the liberal reaction. I mean, we're talking Sauron when Frodo destroys the ring. They just discovered that they have been dead wrong about what this country really thinks and what it believes. The libs have been believing their own lies for a long time now, and they just found out that they are a very small number compared to the "rest of us", otherwise known as the silent majority. It's beautiful.

[This message has been edited by tigertony (edited November 16, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by tigertony (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

mooseville? been up that way in a float plane, no towns just numbers....

i get the picture though.
 

Who voted:
Bush Kerry Nader Total
Men 54% 45% 1% 46%
Women 47 52 1 54
White 57 42 1 77
Black 11 89 0 11
Hispanic/Latino 42 55 2 9
Did not finish HS 49 50 0 4
High School 51 48 1 22
College Grad 51 47 1 26
City 50,000+ 43 56 0 30
Small city/Rural 56 43 1 24

What voters cared about the most:

Moral values 79% 18% 2 22
Economy/jobs 18 80 1 20
Terrorism 86 14 0 19
Iraq 25 74 0 15
Health Care 22 78 - 8
Taxes 56 44 0 5
Education 25 75 - 4

This chart seems to be a reflection, to me, on how a moral society thinks! From my own faith, I believe that if you put God first in your life, give Him his tythe first, he will provide you with all of your needs, so you don't have to worry about most of these things! Not your wants, your needs! Ok Glass! Your turn!
 

We are each God - each of us a part of a cosmic quantum computation process that runs the materialization of the universe.

It is not about acting morally. It is about becoming wise. Put your faith in yourself and learn from your experience. Then you will get in harmony with the flow of the universe - in harmony with all-that-is or God. This is how you participate in the cosmic process some call God.

The God of religion, where morality is part of ontology, is a myth. You might as well believe in Santa Claus.

 

i don't think they are ready for ALL of that in such a concise statement...
 

i hope it doesn't come down to who prays harder......
how many time do the Muslims face Mecca each day?

[This message has been edited by glassman (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

You have 4 circle all three being 10 miles wide. 3 circle have 1 person in it and one circle has 100 in it. The 3 with 1 are red and the 1 with 100 are blue. If you only looked at the color then the Red would be overwhelming. Thats the Midwest.

Ric

[This message has been edited by Ric (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

the interesting part is how the rhetoric is so violent..
"endangered species"? those are fighting words...LOL

 

"Speaking of red states: With much weeping, wailing and gnashing of teeth, heathen liberals everywhere are labeling all the "red" territories as "Jesus Country". Darned straight! Besides, how else would you expect these sniveling, godless weasels to react?"

I consider myself a christian but this kind of talk is why I think the church is going down hill. Hatred is in so much of the christian's talk in American now. Not all of them but a lot. Its like the ones that kill the abortion doctors in the name of God.

Ric
 

it does take two to tango....

------------------
'wid ma mind on ma money an' ma money on ma MIND!!!!!!!

Do Da Due!!!

RUFF!!!

Dog
 

personnally i am only surprised that i so severely overestimated the IQ of the country....

as i post, they are announcing confirmation of another murder of a TRUE humanitarian in Iraq....

no LOL

i think it's time to re-consider the embedded journalists with the marines too... this kid is a hero, wounded the day before and right back to work...
and i don't think ANYBODY needed to hear about the shooting of the "captive"

PS... Art, did you ever notice the anagram for santa?...LOL just another of the subliminal battles raging in the "group mind"

[This message has been edited by glassman (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

There is no way, I could ever convince you that God exists, unless you want to believe in Him, and you are set on believing that the power is within yourself, and around you, because YOU want to be in control, but I can tell you,from my own testimony, that I know Jesus, on a very personal level, and there is no doubt in my mind, that HE exists, and I have given HIM control! God has shown me that he is here, in supernatural ways, many times, and my husband could attest to it, because he has been involved on several occasions! I leave it up to my husband, to deny anything I ever say on this board, if I'm not saying the truth, if he so chooses; because we keep our identities separate, so we can voice our own opinions, but if it comes down to it, he can deny what I am saying, if I am not being truthful!

My husband has physically been picked up, held in mid air, and dropped, by an unseen force, right in front of my eyes, after he just got done saying he didn't know why God never answered his prayers! When this happened, my husband was an alcoholic. I prayed for seven years for God to heal him. Right after it happened,(him being physically picked up in mid air, held, and then dropped without being injured) we questioned the evidence of what happened to him, and what I had seen, and I blurted out that maybe God was trying to tell him to quit drinking! We were both in shock, afterward! We both started to explain it away like it didn't happen, and we were sitting and holding our Bibles, which we had pledged to read so many chapters a night from our sunday school class, when the Lord moved a book mark, from his Bible, to mine, and back to my husbands, without either one of us opening them up, just looking down on the top of them. We each had our own marker, and when I looked down on mine, there were two in there, and he was looking for his, and asked me where his marker was, and I looked up at him, and said, it is in my Bible, and when I looked down again, it was gone, and back in his Bible. When he looked at where his Bible was marked, it was in Matthew, Chapter 22, where it says, Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all of thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. That night, my husband was healed of alchololism! He hasn't had a drink since! It has been over fourteen years!

I have felt Gods physical presence in my body, as sort of an electrical charge, on many occasions, and touched others, without telling them, and have had them tell me they could feel it coming from my hands! There is such a feeling of joy, and peace when this happens! I have also prayed with someone on the internet, and touched the monitor, and they have felt the same thing! You can think this crazy, but it really happens!

The Lord healed me physically, within seconds one day, while I was canning with a friend, and accidentally dumped boiling water down over my arm, and was in agony! It was red, and blistering, and I was asking her to take me to the emergency room. My friend prayed for me,and we sat and watched the burns physically go away, within seconds!

I've seen rainbows in my home, when the sun wasn't shining!

The Lord has given me knowledge about people, and things on occasion, that defies any other answer! My husband took me to a race one evening, and he asked me who I thought was going to win, and I prayed and asked God, and he told me who was going to win the first thirteen races! My husbands face was in shock, and I was scared, because I didn't know what God wanted from me, telling me what I asked, but I have since learned that He is just proving to me, that He is right here with me, and sharing with me, and telling me things to help others! Nothing bad ever comes of it, only good! God has told me the numbers before they have fallen in the lottery! I've told people who were injured, what was wrong with them, and that they would be healed, and the doctor verifies what I've said. And no, I would never use this gift, for financial gain, it is just proof the the Lord is with me!

I've prayed with a friend, with cancer cells, and she was healed!

I was at the deathbed of a very dear old friend, who could actually see Jesus, standing behind my shoulder, as I was standing beside her, holding her hand! Her eyes followed the beautiful light,(she said) from the foot of the bed, up the side of the bed, until she was looking behind me! I couldn't see Him, but I could feel His presence in my body! I asked her who she saw, and she said "Jesus"

My father, who HAD melanoma cancer, has had brain surgery, twice, since finding it in his chest, and glands, and having surgery, and we had so many people praying, the first tumor was completely dead, which the surgeon has never seen, and the second completely contained! He has been cancer free, for eight years now!

My forty eight year old aunt, is alive today, because of the faith of my grandmother! She was three, and was dying in the hospital, with a noncurable disease, which is like leukemia, and causes brusing, and bleeding from the nose, ears, mouth, when near death, and my grandmother wanted to take her home for one more weekend, so the doctor allowed her to do it, since he didn't think she would make it through the next week, and she took her to a tent meeting healing service, and they all watched, as the bruises disappeared, and she stopped bleeding! The doctors were amazed, and said it was a miracle!

I have a famous friend, who has a rare form of bone cancer, and was given until 1999 to live, and he is still going strong! He lives in California, and I met him on the internet, through a prayer chain! He is a Christian, and is traveling the USA, sharing his lifes story! He is a famous author, and was the manager for the most famous rock group ever! He made it to the east coast, and visited me and my church, to share his story! He and his wife and I, had a wonderful day together, and took several pictures! His cancer has been in remission, and doing better each time the doctors test his blood! I continue to pray for his healing, so he can continue to share what the Lord has done in his life!

There is no way anyone will ever convince me, that there isn't a God! I will continue to share my testimony, because I care about you, and want you to know the joy that I feel, at the risk of what you think of me, because to be honest, what God thinks of me, is much more important than what anyone on this earth, thinks of me! There is absolutely no debate here, on this subject, with me! I pray that someday, you will know Him, like I do!

[This message has been edited by Kate (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

Art: Assume that God is the underlying non-material source of the material universe, the question is not "Does God exist?", but "What is the nature of God's existence?".

Religion asserts that morality is a part of ontology (the basis of existence), and this is nuts. Morality is restricted to being a function of human personality - it has no existence in the universe outside of personality. It is an evaluation of actual/predicted reward/punishment consequnces, and generates many kinds of good and bad feelings.

The material universe is continually unfolding in descrete steps of quantum leaps. This is produced by a quantum computation process which regulates energy to manifest physical waves and particles. Our brains particiapte in this computation, as does all things, and the sum total of this is God.

Kate:... but I can tell you,from my own testimony, that I know Jesus, on a very personal level, and there is no doubt in my mind, that HE exists, and I have given HIM control!

Art: You are nuts, in this area of your belief.

Kate: God has shown me that he is here, in supernatural ways, many times, and my husband could attest to it, because he has been involved on several occasions! I leave it up to my husband, to deny anything I ever say on this board, if I'm not saying the truth, if he so chooses; because we keep our identities separate, so we can voice our own opinions, but if it comes down to it, he can deny what I am saying, if I am not being truthful!

Art: Paranormal events do occur, but thay are really rare but natural manifestations of underlying non-material realities.

Kate: My husband has physically been picked up, held in mid air, and dropped, by an unseen force, right in front of my eyes, after he just got done saying he didn't know why God never answered his prayers!

Art: Yes, such things have happened, as well as far stranger things, but has nothing to do with God as you conceptualize God.

Kate: I have felt Gods physical presence in my body, as sort of an electrical charge, on many occasions, and touched others, without telling them, and have had them tell me they could feel it coming from my hands!

Art: Yes, non-materrial energy can be communicated.

Kate: There is such a feeling of joy, and peace when this happens! I have also prayed with someone on the internet, and touched the monitor, and they have felt the same thing! You can think this crazy, but it really happens!

Art: Something really happened, but your interpretation of it is crazy. Same applies to the other things you describe.

[This message has been edited by Kate (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

what good is it to be right in THESE matters if nobody believes you? LOL

it takes time to de-program people...LOL
if you haven't read Dune, and you enjoy reading, pick it up, pay special attention to the Bene Gesserit practice of seeeding planets with myth to prepare them for future visits...if you know the code, you can easily pick up the reins of power....
 

quote:

---

Originally posted by Kate:
And how many cause it, by not living the way they should? Who dumps chemicals into our water, and buries poisons in our land? In our food? People, with free will! Who smokes cigarettes, gets lung cancer, drinks alcohol, gets liver disease, has sex with multiple partners, gets Herpes, Aids, and any other number of diseases, because they don't want to listen to God? People with the free will God gave them!! You can't blame God, for something that WE have done!

---

Kate? all those things are mans laws....we can overcome each of those problems simply by studying them...that is what the Fruit of the tree of knowledge was....

IT'S IMPOSSIBLE TO BREAK GOD'S LAWS
you just can't do it
 

[This message has been edited by glassman (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

and in general the women SHOULD be content to allow the men to feel this becasue it encourages them to behave better...LOL ruff ruf, oink oink...LOL

[This message has been edited by glassman (edited November 16, 2004).]
 

A material present is a holonomic interference precipitate created by quantum computation of the non-material past (wave function collapses) and the non-material future (wave functions uncollapsed). Each such "material present" pulses on in succession - the universe blinks on and off in quantum leaps.

We are connected to All via quantum entanglement (where everything is ONE).

David Bohm had it right!
 

" St. Peter asserts the same identity when he thus remonstrates with Ananias (Acts 5:3-4): "Why hath Satan tempted thy heart, that thou shouldst lie to the Holy Ghost . . . ? Thou hast not lied to men, but to God."

the Holy Ghost is what conects the universe together...it's all in there if you know the right questions to ask....
 

the Holy Ghost is in EVERYBODY.....
 

i don't like people that take advantage of other peoples faith very much....
 

I am god!

I love that, i've said it before too, scary.

Art, I love the conversational work you do.

Ric, the funniest part of that map was california was so red i couldn't find the state lines.

i had to skip a lot of the religous argument etc.... it gets a little slow on me, i'm more of a believe what you want kind of guy. just behave so we don't have to kill you.

enjoy the day, art, i like one of them swingers....
 

been trying to figure out how they pull that part off so smooth...

everybody complains about taxes to
the government, but church taxes? they just line up and fight to give the most......

Ric
 

All reality is cocreated and we reap what we sow.
I will defend this country but the policies we have i dont think are i the best interests of the american folks.

But, I will not add to the hatred. I teach my kids to be good people but assert themselvews. I teach them early on good and bad in the world. In the end, maybe all is good and in our collective experience, all is necessary for the collective awareness of who we are.
we all choose between good and bad deeds daily an d i try very hard to be the best person i can to add to the positive energy in this world. But i am human,and i can be angered but as i grow, i am angered less.
 

1. As for this whole red state versus blue state thing, people who get all inflamed about it and call one "color" a bunch of nasty names seem to be forgetting one thing...Every one of these people is a human, and they are just as smart as you, so before you get all angry and call half of the country city-dwelling, know-nothing atheists who don't care about America and prefer Canada, just remember that those "blue" people are just as American as you, they were born here too, and they love their country too. So get a grip, it is not red against blue. That is a tribal mentality of "us versus them" and it tends to influence how you perceive the world but doesn't actually change reality. So for the love of America, stop calling people red and blue.

2. Listening to a group of Christians argue about the nature of God is like listening to a group of children argue about the nature of a Unicorn. At the end of the day, has anyone actually seen it? (aside from Kate of course, who converses daily with her best friend Jesus). There is humanity, art, and beauty in religion, but when you start acting righteous about it and when you turn your brain off (ahem KATE) you are missing out on all of it.

sorry I know you guys hate me but for some reason I sometimes really feel like posting....
 

it's a shell game....

[This message has been edited by glassman (edited November 17, 2004).]
 

[This message has been edited by timberman (edited November 17, 2004).]

[This message has been edited by timberman (edited November 17, 2004).]
 

and since when does fasting for 40 days NOT cause serious hallucinations?....heck, after that you don't even need to breathe any of the smoke from the burning bush to have a vision....stone tablets or not...
 

Also, why doesn't Jews embrace Islam as jews. I mean that Islam was started when the son of Abraham and his son's servent mother left after Abrahams wife had a child. His son and his mother went out to now Iraq and found a dry well. Abraham's son dropped a stone in the well and water sprang forth and the Islam faith began.

So why are the jews the choosen people. Was it that they wrote the text that became the bible. Sorta of like the christians wrote the new testament. Just questions. I mean The Jews wrote the old testament (at least what we christian want to translate), Christian's wrote the new Testament, and Muslium's wrote the Koran. Yet we are to believe that man did not write these without bias. And if that is true and the bible is to be taken literally then a women has no place to tell a man what to do, at least thats what the bible says.

Ric

[This message has been edited by Ric (edited November 17, 2004).]
 

There are pilgrimages of Jews that have been going to Israel, the last several years! They have accounted for at least nine different tribes, that have started back! If you want to check further about them, look online for the Twelve tribes of Israel!

I don't know why the Lord chose the Jewish people, except for the fact that Jesus was born a Jew! The Jewish people, for the most part, are still waiting for Jesus to come! They were in the crowd, that had Jesus crucified, because the High Priests, couldn't imagine how a plain gentle man, could command such an audience, and that he was able to do miracles, so they hated him, because he said He was the Son of God, and wanted Him dead, so they could continue on, thinking they were better than everyone else! The Jewish crowd, had their choice, between Jesus and Barabus, and they chose the criminal to be set free! I guess it is like a parent is now! God loves his children, even when they do wrong! He is waiting to forgive them, like the Father in the Prodigal Son!
 

In the pages of the Bible, we read in the opening words of the book of Genesis: "And God created the heavens and the earth. And the earth was [the Hebrew word can just as easily be translated "became"] without form and void" (Gen.1:1-2). This word usually translated "was" as it is in this verse in the King James Version, is translated "became" in Genesis 19:26 regarding Lot's wife: "and she became a pillar of salt."

The words translated "without form and void" are from the Hebrew tohu va vohu, and mean, "empty, chaotic, confused." The word tohu is #8414 in Strong's Exhaustive Concordance, and is defined as "be waste, a desolation (of surface), i.e., a desert," figuratively "a worthless thing," "in vain, confusion, empty place, waste, wilderness." The word vohu is #922 and means "to be empty, a vacuity, an undistinguishable ruin."

But did God create the Earth originally in such a condition? Or did it become that way due to some ancient cosmic event, which could have included a collision with another celestial body, such as a massive planet with an elongated orbit, such as that of a comet?

In the book of Isaiah, we read:

"For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else" (Isaiah 45:18).

In this verse we see that God did NOT create the Earth "in vain." The Hebrew word here, also, is tohu, and means -- as above -- "a waste, desolation, desert, a worthless thing, empty place," etc. So we see that originally God did NOT create the Earth in a condition of tohu! Therefore, the logical explanation is that somehow, in the process of time, at some point after it was originally created, the Earth BECAME tohu -- a vain, empty, wasted desolation and ruin!

The logical question is -- what happened?

SATAN AND THE FALLEN ANGELS

Text: I Thessalonians 2:9-12

Unexplained things:

There are many things on this earth (megaliths, pyramids, the heads on Easter Island, perfectly round stones some bigger than man is tall, iron poles that never rust, the drawing at Nazacas in Peru, etc.) And off this earth (Mars face and city) that are unusual and unexplainable by our normal way of thinking. Yet, these things demand an answer that fits very well into what the Bible records. Always remember that there is much we don’t understand and most probably never will be able to explain with all certainty. However, as a Christian, I feel a need to explain to the best of my ability with help from God’s Word what these unusual things are. For my own faith and belief I need to be able to place such unusual unexplained things on earth as well as in space with some logic into the order of God’s things. To simply say, "I don’t believe such things exist is foolish." Because some thing is there, we can often see them, feel them, and even see their remains. And the world tries to explain these things in ways that leaves God completely out of it, which is unacceptable.

The question is "what?" To say , "Such things are from hundreds of millions of years ago " blows the Word of God away. The Bible records only about 6,000 years since Adam and Eve were created. I believe that God’s Word, if it is to be believed, must allow some kind of explanation.

The question is "when?" To say, "I don’t understand" and leave it at that is to close one’s mind to new ways of glorifying God.

The question is "how?" God never intended for us to stop thinking, but to think with a view towards faith and with a spiritual end in mind.

The "what’s", "when’s", and "how’s" can be answered if we will look into God’s Word with a new openness. And through it all our faith will not be shaken, but fortified and made ready to endure the never ending questions of an unbelieving world.

The angelical world includes the entire solar system:

To understand the real existence of the world before ours is to blow just about every orthodoxy wide open. Yet, there are too many things in the heavens and on this earth that we cannot explain in any reasonable way. What we have chosen to do is ignore these unexplainable mysteries. To attempt to explain them is to reach beyond our present belief structure.

In the early 1970's NASA sent the Viking 1 space craft to Mars to photograph the planet. Two of those fly by’s revealed a human looking face staring upward into space along with several monuments that look very much like the pyramids of earth. What are these structures? Are they real? Where did they come from? Who made them? Does this prove that the Bible is wrong and can no longer be believed? Many fear that if the face on Mars is determined to be human like, then the Christian religion is doomed. That is exactly what Satan desires to do.

In my opinion there is a logical, reasonable answer for the face and pyramids on Mars. An answer that fits very well into what the Bible records.

Satan’s great civilization of angels:

Lucifer (Satan) was created to lead the angelic hierarchy, ruling over physical civilizations of angels on many planets in our solar system before God recreated everything (Genesis 1:3-2:25). He and the other angels were stewards of creation, building civilizations on the terrestrial planets of our solar system designed to glorify God and His Word.

Satan’s original name was Lucifer (Isaiah 14:12) which means "O shining star, son of morning ". We know that Lucifer was the most beautiful and greatest angel that God ever created. He "sealed the measure" of perfection and beauty of all creation (Ezekiel 28:12). His nature reflected the glory of God, thus his name "shining".

The actual Hebrew words "O shining star" mean "bright, clear sounding or shining" and "boastful and pride". And the Hebrew words "son of morning" means "son of dawning, or earliest, of first". So the correct interpretation of Lucifer is "O clear sounding, boasting son from the beginning". Or what we all understand Lucifer and Satan to be - the boasting angel. This portrays a much clearer picture of this rebellious angel whose realm was destroyed by God.

When Satan rebelled (Isaiah 14:13-14) God destroyed his realm, his literal dwelling places. According to scripture this destruction was swift and decisive. There was a fifth planet between Mars and Jupiter named Rahab (meaning boaster and pride) which God obliterated:

"The pillars of heaven tremble, and are astonished at His (God’s) rebuke. He stirs up the sea with His power, and by His understanding He breaks up the storm. By His Spirit He adorned the heavens; His hand pierced the fleeing serpent (Satan)" (Job 26:11-13).

"You (God) have broken Rahab in pieces, as one who is slain; You have scattered Your enemies with Your mighty arm" (Psalm 89:10 also see Psalm 87:4).

"Awake, awake, put on strength, O arm of the Lord! Awake as in the ancient days, in the generations of old. Are You not the arm that cut Rahab apart, and wounded the serpent (Satan)?" (Isaiah 51:9).

Are not these scriptures speaking of a time before man when God put down Satan’s rebellion? If so, then what is Rahab? For sure it was "broke in pieces" and "cut apart" by God has He destroyed Lucifer’s (Satan’s) rebellion. Could Rahab been Lucifer’s headquarters? Could that headquarters been on a planet which now the asteroid belt?

This could be two different planets or the same one. These names along with Mars are called the "stones of fire" and were capable of supporting some form of life. These were the seat of Satan’s civilization (Ezekiel 28:14-18). And it was a great civilization of angelic beings. It is here that the scripture tells us he reigned over a literal material kingdom known as "Eden the garden of gems and stones" (Ezekiel 28:13).

Before the creation of Adam, the civilization of angels existed and created habitations on the terrestrial planets Rahab, Mars, Earth, and maybe the moon. Throughout scripture there is a consistent reference to the first dwelling places of some of the ancient sons (angels) of God (II Peter 2:4 and Jude 6).

The rebellion of Satan plunged all of creation into a state of corruption, where before it was perfect and glorified (Romans 8:20). God brought fire out of Satan’s midst and the planet Rahab exploded, sending planetesimal and asteroid size pieces of itself into the orbits of the interior terrestrial worlds (Mars and Earth). The present asteroid belt is all that is left of Satan’s planet. Scientist have stated for a long time that the asteroid belt must have been a planet which was destroyed millenniums ago. Present studies have concluded that these asteroids show evidence that they once possessed an atmosphere and water. Presently only planets contain these two elements. Because this planet was totally destroyed, could it be that this was actually Lucifers head quarters.

The force of the explosion destroyed the angelic habitation on Mars and left it a lifeless planet. We presently can see the remains in the Cydonia faces and city. The face on Mars, represents an angelic or cherubim wearing a headdress. Satan is referred to as the "cherub that covers" (Ezekiel 28:14 and 16). Could this face been that of Satan? It is interesting to note that it seems to have the same type of headdress as worn by the Egyptians and Mayan royalty. Further more, the face on Mars is half cherubim and half lion. Just as the Sphinx is half cherubim and half lion.

Even Earth was effected by this destruction. Earth was placed in a deep freeze. "And the earth had become (was something else before) without form and void (to lie waste, desolation, empty, in vain, wilderness, nothing, confusion) and darkness (absence of light and heat) was upon the face of the deep (bringing a sudden deep freeze)" (Genesis 1:2).

Jeremiah’s (4:23-26) description must be of the world before Adam. He looked into the ages before Adam and described the destruction of the earth and heavens. "There were no men, (descendants of Adam), yet there were cities which had been obliterated." The inhabitants of these cities were in fact the angelic host and their leader was Satan, before this rebellion.

Isaiah (34:11) tells us of a earth that was a "line of confusion and stones of emptiness".

Peter (II Peter 3:5-) also describes "the earth standing out of water and in the water, by which the world that then existed perished, being flood with water". This couldn’t be Noah’s flood, because every mountain was covered by twenty-two and one-half feet of water (Genesis 7:19-20).

God’s original creation must have been perfect:

God created the entire universe, which was a perfect universe (Genesis 1:1). Even the Morning (Day) Star and sons of God (angles) shouted (sung) with joy over the creation (Job 38:7). They would not rejoice over a creation of confusion. God would not nor could He create chaos. God is not the author of confusion (I Corinthians 14:33). He would not create confusion out of nothing. He would create order and harmony (Isaiah 45:18). Yet, that is exactly what Genesis tells us. The earth "became formless and void" (Genesis 1:1). To become something means it was something different before. Genesis tells us that earth was "laid to waste". Some kind of cosmic cataclysmic event took place in the distant past that we have little record of. But what? God’s judgment and destruction of the earth and heavens before the re-creation of earth and the creation of man. When God decided to recreate, this time with humans, He choose planet Earth because it was best suited for mankind. A new creation for a new beginning (Genesis 1:3+). The purpose of the creation of the human race was so they should rule the earth under God.

[This message has been edited by Kate (edited November 17, 2004).]
 

Babel...another good one...let's see?? tower of Babel: to reach the heavens? God doesn't want us to reach the heavens? hmmm maybe it was a rocket ship....they would look like a tower......is this prophecy or is it something else....

no matter how you translate it Kate, it can be translated in multiple ways....self righteousness is the problem here
 

I think this is a perfect example on why you can't take the bible literally. I am not saying the bible dosen't teach us lessons but to take it as fact? It was written in a time when there were no scientist and they tried to explain the logic of the universe in the only way they could. Its like folk tells passed down through generations. It changes a little each time and becomes a grand event long before it is ever written down. The scriptures in the bible were written by scholers of the times to give the people a sense of direction and laws of god. Fables are used to teach lessons on what will happen if you disobey these laws. Of course you can't see God. If that wasn't told to the people then they would wonder why God doesn't appear to them. Put what always gets me is those who said they were healed by God while there are so many that suffer and pray for help and never recieve it. Yet God says in the bible that he has no respect of person. But the worst thing is there is so much proof out there on how the earth took shape but since its not in the Bible its untrue. Come on. God will punish a group of people trying to build a tower to the heavens but not a man that goes to the moon in a spaceship. God destroyed the earth by a flood yet there has been no evidence of a mass flood in fossil records. And many have tried to prove it with no luck. Evolution is a proven fact, they have the fossil records. Yet we can't have evolved because the bible says so. Man wrote the sciptures for the masses. You can claim that God gave them the message but there is no evidence of this except our own belief. And the ones that wrote it made themself more superior then other races. You know believing in God dosen't mean you have to take the bible literally. It means living your life by example and love your neighbors as yourself and excepting god in your life.

Ric

[This message has been edited by Ric (edited November 18, 2004).]
 

You could'nt of even read what I painstakenly copied, for you to read! Why won't God heal some, while he heals others? My mother died of cancer, but my Dad didn't. Is one of them better than the other? Does God love one of them more than the other? Why did God answer the prayers for one, and not the other? Because there is a time for everything! My mother went to live with God, and that is the ultimate healing! Her time on this earth was done! She is in the best place she could ever be! My Dad was healed in his earthy body, to be a witness to others, for the time he has left on this earth, before he goes to be with the Lord too! To share with others, how God has healed him, and to give them hope. He can be of comfort to someone, who is going through what he went through! It isn't all for nothing! We all have one life to live! If we choose to have Jesus as Savior, we will live eternally with him in heaven someday! Do you realize what eternity is? This life is NOTHING, except what we do for Jesus! Pfhhhhhhht, it's gone, and where will be be after? What will be have to tell God, that we can be accountable for?

[This message has been edited by Kate (edited November 18, 2004).]
 

I don't read where God punished the people, at the Tower of Babel! He just separated them, all over the world! If he is powerful enough to create the universe, why wouldn't he be able to do this? You guys contradict yourselves, when you say you believe in a God, but that he can't do this or do that! It all comes down to faith!

2Corinthians 5:6 Therefore we are always confident, knowing that, whilst we are at home in the body, we are absent from the Lord: for we walk by faith, not by sight: We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord. Wherefore we labour, that, whether present or absent, we my be accepted of him. For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad. Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your consciences.

2 Corinthians 6:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new!

Ephesians 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:

Hebrews 11:1 Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

Hebrews 11:3 Through faith we understand that the worlds were framed by the Word of God, so that things which are seen were not made of things which do appear.

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and not have works? can faith save him?

James 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not work, is dead, being alone.

James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

Just read my post, THEN we can discuss!
 

...energy can not be lost or gained, only transformed...

if you need to call on Jesus to invoke your power, that's fine.....
but when you start trying to tell everybody else that it's Jesus doing it for you and we must worship him as you do, well, you are gonna get some greif girl.....

the lessons are all in the bible, the guys that are making money off it by controlling and manipulating your life with it are not nice people......

pastors and ministers, i'm not talking about....but millionaires and multi's that are trying to gain political favor???????

you do not have the corner on interpreting the bible...

and some of the references you made to to Satans home being destroyed have scientific merit, and some don't....
ice ages didn't destroy the world...
but 65 million years ago it ALMOST got destroyed....and Mars may very well have gotten peeled like an orange by an NEO.....
and i am more than a little ticked off that we can spend hundreds of billions to fight over the name of God, but we can't get our act together long enough to set up a defense system to protect ourselves from the next big rock to come along...

[This message has been edited by glassman (edited November 18, 2004).]
 

But yet some take it as the literal word of god and refuse to except facts that a modern era has proven. Oh well, no one is changing here. Just stating not all believe blindly in something. Yet because we don't believe blindly in it, dosen't make us less of a believer in god.

Ric
 

Ric, I'm sorry your wife is in pain! Nothing about that, is easy to live with! All I can say, is there is a reason for God to allow things like this, not because he is mean, but because He sees the larger picture, and knows that this life is but an instant! What people has she affected around her, during her life? Who has gained strength, from her strength. I don't know the answer here, as I don't know why my friend who prayed with me, to have the burns go away on my arm, is steadily declining with MS, and praising God, because she knows Him, and wants to be used by Him, to help others! Why did Joni Eriksen Tada, become totally paralyzed from the neck down, to spend the rest of her life Praising God, and sharing her lifes story? Only God knows these things! We are only to accept them on faith! If you read the chapter of Job, it has a remarkably good example of putting God first, no matter what happens to you, and having God make it all up to you, whether in this life, or the next. It's ok that you guys feel different than I do, I just want us all to be sure that we are right, so no one ends up in the wrong place! I think I've hit a nerve with Glass, so I'm going to stop discussing this now! God bless!