the ads are of the same ilk as Moore's "documentary" only worse cuz they aren't even done under the "guise" of commerce or "art"--they are one of the most repulsive campaign tactics in US history....
- Kevin
i want Bush to tell us he has no affilliation with them.....
i'm no Kerry fan, but this matters....
KERY was in the Nam, and the guy he rescued is glad he was.....
it's about the integrity of my party
at least one of these people is DEFINITELY in steering committees for the GOP.....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited August 21, 2004).]
i have a friend who was marine recon....he will talk on rare occaions...(can you say Jaegermeister?)--war is hell- anybody who says different is a liar....
the guy on the front page of the web-site?? Ken Cordier?? GOP party old boy...
holds political appointments in the VA???
we face a war on terror....
whoever wins needs to be able to lead....
this kind of stuff hurts the whole country....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited August 21, 2004).]
here here!
and god bless america's fighting troops over seas! 'dem brown people gotta learn not to mess with amerr-ica's milli-tarry power, to fight da terrarists and their dubbaya-M-ds!
Q the rest of the world:
(even though they're just dying in an oil war unbehalf of profiteering gluttons, while ignorant people clap their hands in support like the obedient little bitches that they are)
- Kevin
KEVIN- do me a favor... stick to Canada on this one OK, we have an election to decide and if you go to FLA you can probably find a way vote in it....LOL
DQR my issue is simple....if Bush starts running a scorched earth campaign, we are all shafted...no more, no less.. i started humming this tune in the spring, and this is scorched earth if ever there was.....war is hell, nobody has film of what happened and people are gonna believe what they want to.....
a lot of guys i served with, and know, had problems with what they did in the nam...and i'll say no more about that..
a lot of guys had no problems with what they did......
Bush didn't even go......
that's why this is happening and i think it will hurt him, much more than it will hurt Kerry.....
my opinion has absolutely nothing to do with picking a winner or loser--its about US
and especially our troops in harms way...think about how they will be affected by all of this...
whoever wins will be the CIC....
I know Kerrys side has been tooting his own horn on that war record......
Therefore in my book attacking back is fair game especially with veterans against kerry.
This is politics no free rides, if bush does take it to far, he will feel it in the polls, this is early enough that he will be forgiven if he pulls them. But, it may also put some doubt on kerry in voters eyes.
obviously he has 3 stories for everything, i find that amusing though.
keith
that may clear up some of the crap also like some of his other comments.
I dislike smear campaigns, so i thought id read up.
Dole, who has a disabled right arm from war wounds, said Kerry received an early exit from combat for "superficial wounds." He called on the nominee to release all of his Vietnam service records.
Dole told CNN's "Late Edition" that he warned Kerry months ago about going "too far" and that the Democrat may have himself to blame for the current situation, in which polls show him losing support among veterans.
"One day he's saying that we were shooting civilians, cutting off their ears, cutting off their heads, throwing away his medals or his ribbons," Dole said. "The next day he's standing there, `I want to be president because I'm a Vietnam veteran.' Maybe he should apologize to all the other 2.5 million veterans who served. He wasn't the only one in Vietnam."
Dole added: "And here's, you know, a good guy, a good friend. I respect his record. But three Purple Hearts and never bled that I know of. I mean, they're all superficial wounds. Three Purple Hearts and you're out."
interesting at least....
Kerry ( Democrats ) talks of Bush giving companies Tax breaks for moving jobs over seas.
Bush ( Republicans ) talk of Kerry being a liar when it comes to his military service.
All Fair In Love War and Politics?
CATCH 22-----one of the truest pieces of fiction ever written
Signed,
Sarah
800,000 Canadians have dual citizenship and are residing in Canada, all of which have the right to vote. Their is a lot of effort going in to getting those people to vote, and you can pretty much garuntee 80-90% of those votes will be going to Kerry.
- Kevin
bob also agree and sarah you too.
i did not vote for bush, i will never vote for kerry (sorry I'm from Mass.) just check out his lies and senate voting record.
kevin, canada wont be happy with kerry either, they havent liked a pres since kennedy.
ON a side not- went to see track and field olympics last night (afternoon for you folks) twas incredible. I had never been, the greek gold medal ceremony and winning the silver in triple jump was great to see. 3 americans winning the 400 meter was great and got a great round of applause for the achivment. although their medal ceremony was the last thing and place had pretty much cleared out.
also- irish woman 500k race was so hurt she was passed, she fininshed anyways and was cheered around the track on last lap, was very nice. i dont know what american or canadian t.v captures but being there was a pleasure.
sorry for the digression.
keith
[This message has been edited by keithsan (edited August 24, 2004).]
now this.
i would rather see the politicians doing there hatred thing than fake media....
Documentary Highlights Kerry's Heroics
Monday, August 23, 2004
PHOTOS VIDEO OTHER
Click image to enlarge
STORIES LINKS
•Transcript: Debating Kerry's Vietnam Record•Dole Hits Kerry for War Comments•Debate Rages on Kerry War Record•Bush Campaign Volunteer in Swift Boat Ad Steps Down•Chicago Tribune Editor Backs Kerry's Story•Group's Flier Found in Bush Camp Office•Kerry Urges Bush to Demand Attacks Stop•Gen. Merrill McPeak Tapes Ad for Kerry•Kerry Camp, Opponents Release Dueling Ads•Kerry Strikes Back Against Vietnam Criticism•Anti-Kerry Vietnam Ads a Hit •New Ads Reignite Vietnam Debate•Kerry Cambodia Visit Scrutinized
WASHINGTON — John Kerry's (search) former crew mates vouch for his Vietnam war heroics in a documentary being released in the midst of a campaign debate about his actions as a swift boat skipper.
- Kevin
by the way DQR i was watching Fox News (i randomly switch to them all) when Bush gave his live PR.... did you see it live????
His little black dog made a donation to the DNC right on the lawn before the cameraman figured out what was going on and tightened the field of view...LOL
kevin-are you kidding, the same complaints about bush were all over clinton and kosovo.
except the word cowboy wasnt used.
flying today back in a day or so.
keith
nother side not: caught boxing tonight greek disqualified with eye cut, felt like i was at a new york giants game with water bottles flying....
not as much sportsmanship there but fun.
later
Believe me, the Candian hatered (indeed, world hatered) of Bush is completely unprecidented. You have NO IDEA how deep that hatered runs.
- Kevin
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
hi keith....
LOL
let's get the records out...
you know what--my DD214 has mistakes on it..... almost every document i ever got in the service had flaws on it--ask anybody in...
none of this is gonna get any clearer...belive me.....
that is what will be the real sad part of the story...CATCH 22-----one of the truest pieces of fiction ever written
Man, they still never spelled my name right
anybody who tells you different is a liar....
going to war should be the LAST resort..
abu graib is not an anomoly...
gitmo is not an anomoly....
good people do bad things in war....
afganistan is a correct war...
i am surprised that Bush even thought about running again after the Iraq thing.....
nobody in recent history has made such a big mistake.....
the CIA is falling on their sword over this and,
the CIA is paying for Bush political ambitions.....
from my perspective, there is no reason or accountability apparent in society anymore....
remeber the farmer in the dell???
the cheese stands alone?????
want a burger with your cheese?
both of them cost twice what they did( at the grocery store) when Bush came into office....
i have seen data indicating that more people have left the State Dept (in frustration) in the last 3 years than ever before....
US citizens are afraid to speak against the governmnet...
some CIA operatives have even been exposed by this administration for political reasons....
i don't see one shred of evidence that we are safer as a result of any of this...
we have enemies that we need to destroy---how many more years will it take?????
this is not a political statement--just an observation of the FACTS as i see them....
Kerry won't do any better IMO
i am embarrassed to be represented by alan iverson on the world stage.....
look into his history..i was living in VA when he was pardonned.....
the lesson here is easy to see....
teamwork wins.....
In my opinion Richard Nixon was a GREAT president.....
what he did wrong was very minor.
Man, do you and I think alike when it comes to alan iverson. Never thought much about that coach who did nothing but baby him either.
Sad to have to say we agree on Bush and Kerry as well. I liked McCain.
Nice to talk with you.
Later.
[This message has been edited by Wallace#1 (edited August 29, 2004).]
[This message has been edited by timberman (edited August 29, 2004).]
[This message has been edited by timberman (edited August 29, 2004).]
his bowling for columbine is a pice of crap too
mike is making a buck.....(but not mine)
fighting fire with fire just lowers the bar....
we are in a bad way-- people see the boogeyman everywhere....
we are fighting a very small group of people..
they are trying to destroy our freedom, and they are winning---i HATE it....
divide to conquer is the oldest and most reliable military concept....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited August 29, 2004).]
why did MY PARTY chooes NYC????
i dunno...
isn't that the city that fixed their laws to allow ANYBODY( haha dems?) to become a senator there????
NYC is about 4 or 5 to 1 democrats versus republicans....
the GOP ASKED for this type of thing and i admit i am confuesed about the strategy....
emotions are being played on by both sides...
all of this in a time when cold calculated LOGIC is essential for the survival of our way of life....
just remeber what watergate was all about....impropriety in the campaigns....
Nixon didn't do it..or even order it..all he did was circle the wagons around his boys.....
Note that in the end just like most Dems it was someone elses fault. He invited me to punch him, oh brother.
[This message has been edited by timberman (edited August 29, 2004).]
teamwork
all i am really trying to say is that emotions are running high and they are being played...this is bad....
the republicans in the senate are dismantling the CIA as we read and write this....
that doesn't make me feel safer...
why? because it's political...
I think the real motivation for the NYC location:
middle america will watch Fox News and see protestors acting "anti-american" and will reach the conclusion that Bush is therefore "pro-american", helping his cause
- Kevin
they say it's legal, but is it moral...
your pension is likely in it...
thats exactly the kind of ideology that Natzi Germany used to justify their superiority over England\America\Canada and our non-elitist anglo-saxon ideology, but we bitch slapped the **** out of them
- Kevin
sibling rivalry has been the only real selective force in humanity for several hundred thousand years.....
cooperative ability has been selected for a lot longer...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited August 30, 2004).]
- Kevin
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited August 30, 2004).]
- Kevin
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
war is HELL....anybody who tells you different is a liar....
going to war should be the LAST resort..
abu graib is not an anomoly...
gitmo is not an anomoly....
good people do bad things in war....
afganistan is a correct war...
i am surprised that Bush even thought about running again after the Iraq thing.....
nobody in recent history has made such a big mistake.....the CIA is falling on their sword over this and,
the CIA is paying for Bush political ambitions.....from my perspective, there is no reason or accountability apparent in society anymore....
remeber the farmer in the dell???
the cheese stands alone?????
want a burger with your cheese?
both of them cost twice what they did( at the grocery store) when Bush came into office....
i have seen data indicating that more people have left the State Dept (in frustration) in the last 3 years than ever before....US citizens are afraid to speak against the governmnet...
some CIA operatives have even been exposed by this administration for political reasons....
i don't see one shred of evidence that we are safer as a result of any of this...
we have enemies that we need to destroy---how many more years will it take?????
this is not a political statement--just an observation of the FACTS as i see them....
Kerry won't do any better IMO
How can getting Saddam be a bad thing? How can getting a guy who gassed his own people be a bad thing?
here are a few interesting reads. http://www.greenberet.net/kerry/ http://www.kerryoniraq.com http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/02/21/wirq221.xml
quote:
Originally posted by ohdagagain:
How can getting Saddam be a bad thing? How can getting a guy who gassed his own people be a bad thing?
here are a few interesting reads. http://www.greenberet.net/kerry/ http://www.kerryoniraq.com http://news.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2003/02/21/wirq221.xml
simply put..the answer( to the iraq question) is still the question of cost-benefit analysis. CBA is yet to be determined fully.
right now-there IS NO BENEFIT to be measured.
Take the time to watch the Matt Lauer interview.
I can't believe that Bush agreed to do the interview, and i am surprised Matt had the guts to ask him the questions he did.
there is no other time to get any politician to speak like this except at election time....
We don't have the luxury of saying "we had no choice" this time.
I started this thread by saying the swift boat ads are BS...THEY ARE and John McCain agrees with me..i wish i could vote for him......
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited August 31, 2004).]
i heard kerrys version of what bush did during the war thats for sure. he wants his record off limits too bad.
quote:
Originally posted by ohdagagain:
so what was our other choice? Sit back like Clinton and watch saddam kill more and more innocent people? If sitting around a camp fire singing kumbayah would have solved it, I would have been all for it. But I don't think that would have happened.
maybe if there was a bong
quote:
Originally posted by keithsan:
maybe if there was a bong
Or, in Clinton's case a thong.
these guys putting these ads out are an embarrassment.
how about this....maybe we can now hold ourselves to a higher standard because some people told the truth's of war?
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 01, 2004).]
setting the record straight on who sat back and watched Saddam gas his people....as i recall, it started long before Clinton came into office.
i was a lot harder on Clinton than i have been on Bush.....i definitely did not vote for Gore.....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 01, 2004).]
These vets have a right to be mad at him for what he said and trying to wrap himself in his service history. Throwing medals away (they werernt mine). Talking of the attrocities (not my words, what i was told).
Kerry also has a right to be mad, he served and doesnt want that questioned.
I just want the truth and some honesty.
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:setting the record straight on who sat back and watched Saddam gas his people....as i recall, it started long before Clinton came into office.
i was a lot harder on Clinton than i have been on Bush.....i definitely did not vote for Gore.....[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 01, 2004).]
Wasn't the attack in 1998? Wasn't clinton pres then?
[This message has been edited by ohdagagain (edited September 01, 2004).]
you always have to read between the lines.
He had been gassing people in another war..with Iran....(which by the way is where MOST of these mass graves you hear about come from)
and he built his (old) WMD infrastructure using US$ and German engineering.....
he invaded Kuwait after getting what he believed to be the green light from the US state Dept......(he misinterpreted the signals to suit his own needs)
all well documented......
We created Saddam...like it or not...he came to power under our guidance...
what i am annoyed about here is that the truth does hurt, and nobody seems willing to confront it. we did not invade a sovereign nation to free it's repressed peoples...we went in to confiscate nonexistent WMD. And those Al-Queda connections? not.......
those unwilling to acknowledge their mistakes are doomed to repeat them
righteousness scares me........
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 01, 2004).]
the east coast just got nailed by several bad storms.
the regular army and the reserves showed up after hurricane andrew and showed the US and the world it's humanitarian value.they did a fantastic job.
we are staring down that barrel again RIGHT NOW.....
when all is said and done in Iraq, will it be an Islamic nation?--when we give them the freedom to choose, what will their choice be? what will we do if we don't like their choice?
Iraq was non-secular under Hussein.fighting Iran no less.
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
my recollections were (since you ask) that as the Gulf War (a correct war that i suport-ed)ended, we encouraged an uprising in Iraq. Saddam gassed his people to put it down and THE WHOLE WORLD stood by and watched.He had been gassing people in another war..with Iran....(which by the way is where MOST of these mass graves you hear about come from)
and he built his (old) WMD infrastructure using US$ and German engineering.....
he invaded Kuwait after getting what he believed to be the green light from the US state Dept......(he misinterpreted the signals to suit his own needs)
all well documented......We created Saddam...like it or not...he came to power under our guidance...
what i am annoyed about here is that the truth does hurt, and nobody seems willing to confront it. we did not invade a sovereign nation to free it's repressed peoples...we went in to confiscate nonexistent WMD. And those Al-Queda connections? not.......
those unwilling to acknowledge their mistakes are doomed to repeat them
righteousness scares me........[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 01, 2004).]
I never said we didn't create Saddam. Glass on the WMD part, let me ask you a question. You have a neighbor, you know he isn't all there, He is a known killer. The neighbor on your other side says "Hey glassman, I hear the guy next door has a few guns in his house and plans to kill your wife and kids." Then another neighbor comes over and say he definatly has guns and planning on using them on your family. Would you sit around and wait for your family to get attacked? Just curious.
of course not.....
but i also know better than to take out my own gun and blow his head off cuz i WILL go to jail(in most states) unless he has brought a gun INSIDE MY HOUSE....front porch doesn't even count in most states(i'm not sure about Texas)....
seems to me that's what Bush did.
the evidence is not even in question.
Bush was GRANTED the authority by the congress to make the decision to go to war.
congress DID NOT vote directly on it.
the american people did not support it (according to polls)
Bush made the decision against the advice of MANY inside the pentagon, the state dept and the UN......
now he says he did the right thing......
and he admits that it was unpopular....
we are trying to suger-coat a BITTER pill....
and i will say again i don't like Kerry...
Bush 2 rolls in, choking on pretzels. with thoughts that we can not be hit on our soil.
hes wrong. Al Queda strikes, bush stikes back (thankfully).
next thought, who else wants to harm us, clinton/gore said Sadam number one enemy.
CIA says has WMD wants to hit us.
Putin says has WMD wants to hit you.
Blairs secret army says same.
As does Israel and Jordan.
thats enough for me to go, no warning to u.n. and that crap....
now theres no weapons, i am more scared of where they are than of everyone being wrong.
on creating sadam i dont buy the argument same as i dont buy we created bin laden. I dont buy the crossed signals bull either, we werent playing kissy face. When he was gassing Iran we were sending money. good.
I'm ready to go there now too.
i was pissed about the hostages too.
I voted Nadar, beat that.
keith
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
LOL Keith...and Fox News is the ONLY unbiased news channel......
They are all biased!
we'll just throw 'em all in jail and maybe we will get one of the right bad guys....
wake up people we are losing the war on terrorism cuz we are lowering our standards, WILLINGLY giving up our rights and freedom......
(by the way hes ex-marine so bashing him is off limits too)
[This message has been edited by keithsan (edited September 02, 2004).]
i guess the infinite number of parrallel universe theories are true.....
TV makes it all possible...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 02, 2004).]
(by the way hes ex-marine so bashing him is off limits too)
is it OK to point out that he is flip-floppping too, or is that bashing???
i think it is in the job description of senators and congressmen
I wont call the swift vets or kerry liar (well kerry on crap i know about in mass.)
He still whinning and he has paid way more for his 527 ads. and moore was free... supposedly..
Kerry getting scared shaking up his crew, goin for clinton cronnies.
Kevin worry about Canada, watch out for those new republicans....
in his book "stupid white men" he accurately drew lines between a bunch of energy players at enron etc. to the Bush whitehouse...he forgot to mention that they were already visiting the white house when Clinton was there too...LOL
one thing he did point out in in that book that bothere me was the Fla. election ...
i was pissed when Gore challenged the count in Fla. it really was ridiculous....
BUT, what the news didn't cover very well was how many people were tossed off the voting books ILLEGALLY before the election...
well guess who ordered that...and guess which party most of the voters that were tossed were in?
guess who tried to do it again this year????
this time they got caught BEFORE election time...sick.....that doesn't make big healines tho???
i have never seen a sitting president's convention so negative
tonight will probably be the make or break for the election....
i can't wait for the debates...stocking up on plenty of kettle corn....
doubt bush will do much to endear him or lothe him tonight.
Zell Miller obviously needs to increase his Aricept dosage.
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 02, 2004).]
he says we should be judge, jury and executioner too....
this is not GOOD people...when will you be the next percieved enemy of the state???
maybe we don't need a State Dept anymore?????
and we are in a global economy???
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 02, 2004).]
thank GOD your good at stock picking
If the republicans want to play dirty, they are in for the absolute **** kicking of a life time. This is where we see how much balls Kerry has, if he fights back and takes it to Bush's level, its all over.
- Kevin
even the republican back patters on Fox acknowledged it..help from beyond the stars.....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 02, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
i thought the crusades ended a few centuries ago....
ZELL MAN as soon as i put on CNN and they were only discussing Kerry's upcoming response I knew i'd find you here.
LOL
quote:
Originally posted by kevin954:
so thousands of screaming losers chanting 'flip flop, flip flop' isn't name calling? Sorry if that offends you, but vast majority of people in the world refer to Bush in terms *much* more offensieve then 'monkey'.If the republicans want to play dirty, they are in for the absolute **** kicking of a life time. This is where we see how much balls Kerry has, if he fights back and takes it to Bush's level, its all over.
- Kevin
WOW really into AM. politics, i'll be catching the next canadian politician speach LOL
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
what am i missing here??? i heard it CLEARLY-- he said it.... look in the transcripts....i didn't expect him to say he screwed up--but God wants us to invade other countries??????
even the republican back patters on Fox acknowledged it..help from beyond the stars.....[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 02, 2004).]
ZELL, ill check out transcripts but i space out etc..... Was watching though didnt hear that, but, been wrong before.
I'm good with the war, wish he would've brought up taking out iran and syria though.
FREEDOM at home FIRST......
back to the swift boat ads.....
let's see, Kerry was testifiying about the horrors of war on TV and in front of congress........
Vets feelings are hurt....
hmmmmmmm
what was George Bush doing then???? i would like to see some film of him being given a sobriety test.......too bad they didn't have cameras in cop cars back then....
man I flip on CNN to see what they think of bush speach, i flip channels and we all know the usuall suspects, but, cnn running, Kerry gonna be on attack now, only 20 mins.... Thought that really weird.
and then, Kerry sucked, LOL rambled on.
totally thought hed have better attack, he voted for war and says supported it but kind of attacked bush for doing it, but not really, thought it was awful.
and that gas price high thing, if there are lower prices, he says, bush used his friends in saudi to get lower prices for votes....(said it a few months ago)
Sorry synical mass native here.
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
even better-- a Judge ordered 470 protesters released this afternoon NYC Police Refused now the NY City police are going to be fined...i wonder who will come up with the money?????FREEDOM at home FIRST......
for DNC protesters were not even allowed in a viewing radius of fleetcenter, protesting teachers, and firemen and policemen received contracts or promises within 6 weeks of convention.....
usually only the VP and well now, both sides 547 groups show up.
? i was in greece but have heard that cnn wont run swiftboat ads. is that true?
on fox i've seen both sides negativity, at least in the commercials.
Msnbc is way to boring for me to watch.
seriously.. i do have a problem with this party Faithful thing.....
it was not lost on me that they chose the Battle Hymn of the Republic at the services held right after 9-11. Afghanistan was a correct war....
if we are going to war we need to know why....and the 9-11 commission was pretty clear that we were wrong on Iraq....
Bush won't admit it...
here's the real scary part...we may need to do something about Iran real soon....
like my dad used to say...its all fun and games 'till somebody loses an eye...(or in this case their life)
righteousness is scary to me....
give me a man who questions his own judgement any day...call it flip-flopping if you want,
we are all sinners...asking forgiveness is only the FIRST step
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 03, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
what am i missing here??? i heard it CLEARLY-- he said it.... look in the transcripts....i didn't expect him to say he screwed up--but God wants us to invade other countries??????
even the republican back patters on Fox acknowledged it..help from beyond the stars.....[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 02, 2004).]
Here is a cut and paste of the part of the text posted by The Associated Press in question:
The progress we and our friends and allies seek in the broader Middle East will not come easily, or all at once. Yet Americans, of all people, should never be surprised by the power of liberty to transform lives and nations. That power brought settlers on perilous journeys, inspired colonies to rebellion, ended the sin of slavery, and set our Nation against the tyrannies of the 20th century. We were honored to aid the rise of democracy in Germany and Japan and Nicaragua and Central Europe and the Baltics — and that noble story goes on. I believe that America is called to lead the cause of freedom in a new century. I believe that millions in the Middle East plead in silence for their liberty. I believe that given the chance, they will embrace the most honorable form of government ever devised by man. I believe all these things because freedom is not America's gift to the world, it is the Almighty God's gift to every man and woman in this world.
[This message has been edited by timberman (edited September 03, 2004).]
[This message has been edited by timberman (edited September 03, 2004).]
iran is not scary, its about time to take that country seriously.
keep watching to see how those meetings go with NK, we have both koreas us china and couple other countries talking together...
they have nukes already,
you watching this russian disaster.....
there were a few other allusions as well, but that does say that he believes he has been pursuing war as an agent of God. in the past i have read numerous conservative commentators claiming him to be a democratic evangelist but that is the first time i have heard it directly from him. i do not like to discuss religion. but i do not believe the Creator wants us to carry the Terrble Swift Sword to third world nations that can't defend themselves. and Iraq didn't and couldn't defend itself as PROVEN by the resistance they offered when we invaded. we have been attacked and we must respond and plan for the future. but we are not winnining over our enemies minds and hearts...we are creating more... and i clearly heard numerous world leaders warn of that PRIOR to invading Iraq.
by the way---i was only looking for a sign that he has remorse in him ..instead he comes out like this....
we can't stand alone in the war on terrorism.
quote:
Originally posted by keithsan:
g- man, i'm not a party hard-liner and feel we did the right thing by going in Iraq, (very worried about WMD)(my belief is they are somewhere). too many countries intelligence is my reasoning....iran is not scary, its about time to take that country seriously.
keep watching to see how those meetings go with NK, we have both koreas us china and couple other countries talking together...
they have nukes already,
you watching this russian disaster.....
yeah Keith and S Korea just admitted they have purified uranium ILLEGALLY....
Pakistan made them already and they are BARELY legit (as far as being an ally)......
we have troops in harms way.....
i want to support them in their pursuit of LIFE, LIBERTY, AND HAPPINESS.....
the political debates, and the direction they have taken are making it more difficult....
i see the direction being chosen by the president's supporters
as i said in the spring there are no American's in the Senate, the House or the White House that are soft on terrorism --
it's BS rhetoric and i angry at MY PARTY for even insinuating it.....
and yes i will keep my party because i still believe in fiscal responsibility....
but the Iraq war is going to be big bill, and SOMEDAY we are going to have to pay more taxes because of it....
step one pre-bombing.
Fiscal responsibility is currently out the window, but, these terrorists are nuts. Attack on our soil gotta fix everything thats been going to hell for years.
The spending sucks but currently acceptable for me.
no doubt it's a democrat plot to steal the republican thunder....not laughing...praying
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 03, 2004).]
here's some Wisdom from the ages....
Sun Tzu (The Art of War)
For to win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the acme of skill.
To subdue the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill.
and
Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster. And if you gaze long into the abyss, the abyss gazes into you.
Friedrich Nietzche
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 03, 2004).]
Christian Zionist leaders today have access to the White House and strong support within Congress, including the backing of the two most recent majority leaders in the House of Representatives.
this isn't from some left-wing liberal group either......
this is BRAGGING...from a powerful religious magazine.....
http://www.csmonitor.com/2004/0707/p15s01-lire.html
To this end, Christian groups have sponsored the migration of thousands of Jews from Russia, Ethiopia, and other countries. They've funneled resources into social programs for Israeli communities, and they encourage churches in the US to support Jewish settlements in the occupied territories.
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 04, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
well, i guess we aren't going to see an admission of error.....i can't support somebody who thinks they are perfect and on a mission from God....back to the swift boat ads.....
let's see, Kerry was testifiying about the horrors of war on TV and in front of congress........
Vets feelings are hurt....
hmmmmmmmwhat was George Bush doing then???? i would like to see some film of him being given a sobriety test.......too bad they didn't have cameras in cop cars back then....
Glass I used to think you were only 12% commie, but now I am convinced you are atleast 75%. Kerry was not testifying he was telling a story, a story he now says wasn't true. He has now said he never once saw war crimes committed. What you fail to understand is that his words after his safe return to the states helped our enemy. Do you understand that. He single handedly gave the enemy their best weapon against us. To top it all off, his words were absolute bullsh!t. He never once witnessed or talked to anyone who did witness war crimes. He made it up. Namm was a crucial battle in the cold war and John Effin Kerry did everything in his power to make us lose it. How the hell can anyone support someone who has done so much to kill this country. Please review his voting record. Please note he has voted against every major weapon system our millitary now uses. Were it up to John Effin Kerry our millitary would be armed with sling shots. We would not be the only global super power. We would have lost the cold war. In esscence we would be France.
Is that what you really want?
Is that what the majority of Americans want?
commie?? LOL...
the RNC was whitewash to try to make Royalty of the republican party look centrist and you know it....
i am a true Son of the American Revolution--ON BOTH SIDES of my family.
i hate imperialism....
matter of fact, i qualify on all 4 of my grandparents...LOL
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 04, 2004).]
but,,, I never said we didn't create Saddam. Glass on the WMD part, let me ask you a question. You have a neighbor, you know he isn't all there, He is a known killer. The neighbor on your other side says "Hey glassman, I hear the guy next door has a few guns in his house and plans to kill your wife and kids." Then another neighbor comes over and say he definatly has guns and planning on using them on your family. Would you sit around and wait for your family to get attacked? Just curious.
IP: Logged
glassman
Member posted September 01, 2004 13:06
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[QUOTE Then another neighbor comes over and say he definatly has guns and planning on using them on your family. Would you sit around and wait for your family to get attacked? Just curious. [/B][/QUOTE]
of course not.....
but i also know better than to take out my own gun and blow his head off cuz i WILL go to jail(in most states) unless he has brought a gun INSIDE MY HOUSE....front porch doesn't even count in most states(i'm not sure about Texas)....
Glass, don't you consider 9/11, on our front porch, or inside our house? Or are you thinking only of YOUR house? I know you don't want to shoot someone, because your neighbor might of said it is true, but the terrorists WERE HERE! We watched it, some of us LIVE, on TV! The criminals CAME! They threatened our families, and friends, and neighbors, and killed a lot of loved ones!
Also,since you mentioned the Christian Zionist article, and God, and what they were doing, if you are interested, here are the scriptures that I'm sure they are trying to follow. God commands us all, to pray for the peace of Jerusalem in Psalm 122:6. He talks about the gathering of Jews to Israel, and returning to the homeland, in Isaiah 43:1-6, and Isaiah 60:1/22. He talks about the danger of harming Israel in Obadiah 10-15, and He explains that Israel is "The Apple of His Eye" in Zechariah 2:8.
Personally, I prefer having a President, who tries to do what the scripture asks of us to do, and supports Israel! Only the Lord God knows what he would do to us, if we didn't!! I can't tell anyone what to believe, but since I believe in God, and his Word, I take it at face value!
As it says in Matthew 22:37to 40, We are to love God first, and then our neighbors as ourselves. It is God's greatest commandments. Just who do YOU think, GOD considers our neighbors?
From my own observations, what I get from what the President is saying, is that freedom is a gift from God. When I read what the President said in one of the other posts, I didn't see anywhere, where he said that God told him to attack Irac! Where did you see that? Not trying to start a war here, just have to add my 2 cents!
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Glass I used to think you were only 12% commie, but now I am convinced you are atleast 75%. Kerry was not testifying he was telling a story, a story he now says wasn't true. He has now said he never once saw war crimes committed. What you fail to understand is that his words after his safe return to the states helped our enemy. Do you understand that. He single handedly gave the enemy their best weapon against us. To top it all off, his words were absolute bullsh!t. He never once witnessed or talked to anyone who did witness war crimes. He made it up. Namm was a crucial battle in the cold war and John Effin Kerry did everything in his power to make us lose it. How the hell can anyone support someone who has done so much to kill this country. Please review his voting record. Please note he has voted against every major weapon system our millitary now uses. Were it up to John Effin Kerry our millitary would be armed with sling shots. We would not be the only global super power. We would have lost the cold war. In esscence we would be France.
Is that what you really want?
Is that what the majority of Americans want?
ISSUES....OK
I saw the same RNC speeches.... they were all about HATE. Ronald Reagan was a great leader, he represented conservative values, when he was running and in office, i was a conservative. I have not changed. The conservative view has broadened, and left me MUCH closer to the middle.
I am not even close to being a true liberal, as 99% of the people i have associated with on Univ. campuses around the country would tell you. I have been X'ed off of a lot of invitiation lists.
Kerry: He told what was told to him, and presented it that way when he testified, he DID NOT LIE. I have been told the same stories (by people who really did it).They are TRUE.
the swift boat LIARS are the ones that are making up stories.
I find it interesting that Nam was entered by Dems and ended by Repubs. Kerry DID NOT lose the war for US, we (the politicians) never spent the energy to win it........
and saying Nam was critical to the cold war??? we won the cold war even tho WE LOST NAM, remember?
We haven't won the war in IRAQ either despite Bush's declaration. BUSH isn't spending the energy we need to win it either.
The war in Iraq is a farce....Why? because we are not likely to end up with a friendly government there. WHY? because we are in a holy war with Iranian Islam, and Iranian Islam is well on the way to ending up with control there. Freedom(religious) is what is going to lose that war for us in the end. They will have elections, and they will elect RELIGIOUS LEADERS..and Bush is acting like one now TOOO......
I am no turn the other cheek wimp. But i am a FISCAL conservative and we are not spending our money wisely. We have empowered Islam--whether or not they are fundamentalists or moderates in the end is a GAMBLE and i don't like to GAMBLE......
this isn't a checkers game.... the pitbull mentality is running wild and pitbulls (when they go mad) get put down in the end......
Also,since you mentioned the Christian Zionist article, and God, and what they were doing, if you are interested, here are the scriptures that I'm sure they are trying to follow. God commands us all, to pray for the peace of Jerusalem in Psalm 122:6. He talks about the gathering of Jews to Israel, and returning to the homeland, in Isaiah 43:1-6, and Isaiah 60:1/22. He talks about the danger of harming Israel in Obadiah 10-15, and He explains that Israel is "The Apple of His Eye" in Zechariah 2:8.
Personally, I prefer having a President, who tries to do what the scripture asks of us to do, and supports Israel! Only the Lord God knows what he would do to us, if we didn't!! I can't tell anyone what to believe, but since I believe in God, and his Word, I take it at face value!
As it says in Matthew 22:37to 40, We are to love God first, and then our neighbors as ourselves. It is God's greatest commandments. Just who do YOU think, GOD considers our neighbors?
From my own observations, what I get from what the President is saying, is that freedom is a gift from God. When I read what the President said in one of the other posts, I didn't see anywhere, where he said that God told him to attack Irac! Where did you see that? Not trying to start a war here, just have to add my 2 cents!
first: 9/11 was Osama Bin alive too long...NOT SADDAM....there is NO QUESTION OF IT..Cheney and BUSH BOTH said we have PROOF.. they did not say MAYBE we suspect them they said we have PROOF.....they sent my and your HEROES to Iraq for their own personal battle.....they blamed the CIA for their mistake...not very Christian....
think back to watching the invasion..we all believed Bush then....now he changes his story and you accept it? why do you accept such a big mistake???
Second: The Christian Zions are attempting to satisfy the prophecies to bring about the final days. Read up on it..I have. this from their site http://www.israelmybeloved.com/
The Bible tells us that the end of this wicked age will not come until God has restored the Jews to the land of Israel, the city of Jerusalem and the Temple Mount, and until He has restored them in their relationship to Himself
Third: Bush is saying very CLEARLY that GOD is on his side and that he is right. If you believe in God then vote for ME.
This is his REVISED justification attacking a sovereign nation. He is using OUR religion to justify his actions. If you don't see the connection i am pointing to it's because you dont want to see it.....
i believe that he made a big mistake on his own, now he shoud stand up and take the consequences......
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 04, 2004).]
As for President Bush, I believe for myself, as a Christian, as it says in the Word, when we receive Jesus as Savior, we are given one or more gifts to use, for the body of Christ. Since President Bush says HE has accepted Jesus as Savior, I would rather believe that he has the best interests at heart, for everyone. He is asking the Lord for wisdom in making his decisions, and believing in faith, that he is doing what is right. He may have been given the gift of wisdom or knowledge, only God knows! I never heard him say that God told him to attack Irac! The scripture also commands us to support our government! Not to support what we feel is wrong, but to pray for our leaders, so that they make the right decisions! Maybe if more of us would do this, things would be a whole lot better, and I wouldn't be making people uncomfortable with my beliefs!
I believe that millions in the Middle East plead in silence for their liberty. I believe that given the chance, they will embrace the most honorable form of government ever devised by man.
this statement is clear to ME that he is JUSTIFYING his use of military force to do GODs work....i don't think it can be interpreted ANY other way.....this attitude has been used to start more wars than end them...
two wrongs don't make a right.....
i would also like to point out you that this is a LONG-TERM plan and the war was NOT something these guys just cooked up on 9-11.......
try some of this on for size and be sure to read the NAMES and the DATES.....
http://www.newamericancentury.org/statementofprinciples.htm
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 04, 2004).]
this statement is clear to ME that he is JUSTIFYING his use of military force to do GODs work....i don't think it can be interpreted ANY other way.....this attitude has been used to start more wars than end them...
thats not how i read it. what a surprise eh.... i cannot connect the god thing to liberating people, i think its great to liberate folks who want it ( not saying they do) really dont get the god connection. I'm pretty simple in my ways and educated in some of other peoples ways. Liberating the oppressed is a good thing, keeping them from being oppressed again MAY keep them from becoming terrorists....
I still get chills looking at that disaster in Russia what a mess. the eu called putin for explanation and he said that was blasfamous (sp.) I thought his army and the chechans behavior was a disgrace on both sides dont know if god fits in their somewhere. Just disgusted with people and ignorances.
P.S. The DNC was very negative also read kennedy and the Reverand Sharpton speaches. whats fair is fair.
Bush got a big bump of this in first poll taken before his speach (time) Kerry only got a burp from DNC. that doesnt bold well for him.
Again, as i stated last year, picking kerry was one of the dumbest moves the Dems could make besides picking kennedy. picking Edwards was smart. he gets some southern votes. but kerry isnt a middle of the road option to bush and that will hurt him.
plus he says he would have attacked iraq too. so if thats the problem, there is not an alternative.
i'll post some stocks later on, been busy this week.
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 04, 2004).]
as you look around in the site see if you can find some policy advice on Al-Queda/Afghanistan PRIOR to 9-11--i can't, but i might have missed it...
you can plainly see that this Iraq war was insisted upon YEARS in advance and these guys took advantage of our FEAR to implement it.....and they WERE WRONG!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 04, 2004).]
Sometimes we have to have war first, to reach peace, not just for us, but for others! Again, my two cents!As far as the economy goes, they said today on the news, that the unemployment is much lower than it was, and considering the effects of 9/11, I think we are doing pretty well! Neither Clinton, or the first George Bush, had to deal with that issue in their presidency!
I hate to think about how the devastation in Florida will affect things, but we can't help that except by praying, and support! I just keep watching the storm on the news, and praying it moves the other way!
I'm glad we can discuss things like adults!
peole keep saying mike moore started it...but he's not a politician...he's lot of other nasty, creepy things, but not a politician....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 05, 2004).]
I sort of wonder where you are coming from, especially since I belong to a non-denominational Bible Church, that lives by the Word of God, Old AND new testaments, and the whole church pretty much feels the way that I do! I work at the election polls, and we live,there are around ninety percent Republicans, and for the most part, they ALL voted for Bush, and most of our Democrats did also! I am glad that people pray for me, I will never turn that down, but I would like to know to what you are referring to in the scriptures! The ones that I go by, are in the New Testament, Matthew 22: 37 to 40, the words of Jesus,"Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and prophets. I consider anyone that isn't me, my neighbor! Anyone that is oppressed, starving, being tortured, bombed, raped, forced into slavery, these are my neighbors! Jesus commands us to love thy neighbor! How do we do this, by sitting by, and doing nothing, allowing them to live on in their ignorance,(I don't mean that offensively, but when people are tyrants and oppress you, you can't vote, you can't go to school,you don't have the opportunity to be educated, especially about the love of Jesus! How will they ever know? The Lord wants us to share the news of his love, grace, and salvation, with all four corners of the earth! Not just the ones on our small hunk of the earth, the USA! It isn't just about freeing the Iraqi people, it is also about showing them that there are people out there, that actually care about them. I believe that President Bush is trying to do this! As I said before, we will have to agree to disagree!
I consider anyone that isn't me, my neighbor! Anyone that is oppressed, starving, being tortured, bombed, raped, forced into slavery, these are my neighbors! Jesus commands us to love thy neighbor! How do we do this, by sitting by, and doing nothing, allowing them to live on in their ignorance,(I don't mean that offensively, but when people are tyrants and oppress you, you can't vote, you can't go to school,you don't have the opportunity to be educated, especially about the love of Jesus! How will they ever know? The Lord wants us to share the news of his love, grace, and salvation, with all four corners of the earth! Not just the ones on our small hunk of the earth, the USA! It isn't just about freeing the Iraqi people, it is also about showing them that there are people out there, that actually care about them. I believe that President Bush is trying to do this! As I said before, we will have to agree to disagree! [/QUOTE]
The WHOLE CHURCH- once again you make my point Kate. Bush and Cheney have been campaigning thru the churches..SHAME on them. They have been using Church rosters to solicit funds..this is fact.Many churches have complained about it.
They have used our religion for their own political gains. They are using the churches to convince you to commit crimes against humanity. The whole world is watching us. Those BOMBS we tried to kill Saddam with? How many children got murdered? Saddam didn't.....we did it for their own good???
as i said earlier in the thread WAR=HELL and these politicians are making more of it not less.
I am not going to get into scriptural debates with you...why? it's a waste of time we don't have...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 05, 2004).]
I understand that you don't want a debate, and that is fine, I never want to fight about the scripture, but this is how I believe! I care about you, and what you think though, so I will end this as always! I will agree to disagree!
Kate i don't like to brag, but my reading comprehension skills are a little above average....
much better than my typing skills...LOL
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 05, 2004).]
guess what --this will DESTROY the religious part of the churches and turn them in to BUSINESSES and we all know what Jesus thought about the money-changers in the Temples
not tried by HIS people but by OUR people...
this is FREEDOM?
I wonder what makes him angry today? War isn't pretty! No one likes war! God didn't like war, but he asked people to go to war! Joshua fought a great battle, and there were women and children killed, during the battle that God had commanded! Sometimes, we have to do what we have to do, to make things better in the end! Sometimes it is a matter of trying to stop the evil, and loosing a few, than not trying, and loosing a lot, especially when souls are involved! Not that we want to ever loose lives, but it is inevitable when we are fighting, not just evil people, but also principalities!
churches will be writing GRANT proposals, and competing for these funds.
when they win them, they will then have to set up COMMITTEES to spend the money...
we will be fighting at church.
we will be COMPETING with other churches to get any and or the biggest grants....
who am i to supppose what would/might make JESUS weep????
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 05, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by Kate:
Hey, I only try to type the way I talk!
Yes, Jesus was angry at the money changers! Why was he angry with them?
Kate. Did Jesus ask anyone to go to war? this is why i am praying for Christians to focus more on the New Testament.
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 05, 2004).]
Chechneya (sp?) is a war that has been going on for 10+years. it is breeding more terrorism not less.
Iraq--we have no exit point....we are an occuppying force..we will have more terrorism because of it NOT LESS
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
the current Russian situation is another strong argument that war doesn't solve terrorism problems, it creates them.Chechneya (sp?) is a war that has been going on for 10+years. it is breeding more terrorism not less.
Iraq--we have no exit point....we are an occuppying force..we will have more terrorism because of it NOT LESS
bit different, the way i see that one is. soviet union let other parcels go as their own country, Chechnya (sp.) is loaded with oil and russia refused to let them go. now they're pissed.- doesnt give'em a right to act like that though.
in John 12: 44 and 45, in Jesus words," Jesus cried and said, He that believeth on me, believeth not on me, but on him that sent me. And he that seeth me seeth him that sent me.They are one and the same! Some people seem to think that God is an ogre, and Jesus is the Peace, and the Holy Spirit is somewhere floating around, but the reason that Jesus didn't order war, is because in the old testament, God gave us freewill,As he still does today, but before Jesus came, in the old Testament, when we didn't follow God's laws, he wasn't able to look upon their sin, so he killed them. He drowned them in the flood, and killed them in Soddom and Gahmorrah, however it's spelled! As awful as that sounds, every man had his own choice to make, and they went against God! The reason he doesn't do that now, is because he came to earth, in the form of a man, his son Jesus, to show us how to live, which is the New Testament! That is our example!
God, or Jesus, or the Holy Spirit, doesn't kill us, with war, because He can't see our sins anymore, because they are covered with Jesus' blood! Jesus said, No one gets to the Father, but by Me! Everyones name is in the book of life, until the moment of death, where it is taken away, if you haven't accepted Jesus as Savior. He loves us all so much, that he waits till the second of our death, to give us a choice, whether to follow him, or follow our own selfish ways! I also live in the New Testament, but you can't disregard the old, because that was inspired by God also! It is important to follow it as a whole, not take from it what you want! That is one reason this world is in such a mess! Some religions follow the Old, some, just the New! I believe that we should follow it all! I like to think of it as it says in the last chapter of Revelation, blending the old laws with the new, in verse 14, Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life and may enter into the city. For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie. It also says, in 18, that whoever adds to the words of this book, God will add unto him the plagues that are written in this book. Not Jesus, but God. Next verse, And if any man shall take away from the words of the book, God shall take away his part out of the book of life! Since I'm not God, I'm going on faith, that it means the Bible as a whole, not just talking about one chapter, because it doesn't say just one chapter! If you read Revelation, Chapter 14, Jesus, the Lamb, is coming back with the saints, and fight a mighty war! He is coming to avenge the blood of his servants! Again, sounds terrible, but we all have a choice! The third part of God, the Holy Spirit is with us, to guide us, when we accept Jesus! It is up to us, to fight the battles against evil! God didn't tell us, to not go to war! He leads us to do what is right, but he does'n't command us! You can't just sit and watch innocent people get slattered, no matter where, or how they live! Ok, I'm writing a sermon! I'll quit now!
you may not want to admit to yourself what you are supporting. i suggest you reread what the New American Century site says.....
especially the part about attacking Iraq... back in 1998.....
these people are not HONEST...they plead the case to attack on bad intel and now they are hiding behind some nice sounding rhetoric about being nice guys and doing it for the Iraqui people.....
there is some discussion about LYING in the Bible too isn't there?
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 06, 2004).]
- Kevin
this is no game. America is being led astray by some very nasty people. These people have a TV news station......
There is more disinformation being delivered as TV news in America than there is in Ragging Bullsh.
i have been doing the DD for awhile. the neo-conservative movement is a wolf in sheeps clothing. they are appealing to peoples better sides while they steal from them.
i have no doubt Kate has the very best of intentions, the problem is that she is not getting all of the DATA necessary to make an informed decision. President Bush does an excellent job of presenting himself as a SINCERE person. he may even be, but some of his ADVISORS are nothing like that......
he has been very quiet lately....
HYPOCRISY
it is also about showing them that there are people out there, that actually care about them. I believe that President Bush is trying to do this!
That statement says nothing about God saying he is supposed to head a Holy War, or that God told him to go to war! Hmmmm, I can read and write too! As for the war effort, I do support it, no matter who is in the presidency, because I don't want my sons children, to have to deal with far worse than we have to deal with someday, because the world isn't going to get better on it's own, until Jesus comes back! You know, when I was a child, I could spend the whole day outside, and my mother never had to worry about me being stolen; we never had to lock the doors! Evil has escalated to horrendous proportions in the last 30 years, and I don't believe in sitting here, in my "safer" country, and allowing more and more evil people, to gather together, to hurt others, no matter WHO or where they are! We could go round and round on this forever, so I will let it go at this! I value your opinions, and I'm glad we could talk without fighting! I hope the best for you and yours!
i don't find it hard relate to your current position on world events. i was once a conservative, i am now a moderate, without even changing my views......
the neo-conservatives are war-mongers and they are using every tool available to them to "make us safer" when in reality they are the reason we are being attacked. i am not anti-war, i am anti-stupidity. these neo-conservatives plainly state that they are out to GLOBALISE American interests....that is what is scaring the rest of the world.
we cannot win the war on terrorism alone...
moderate Islamic attitude is that we are getting what we asked for....
i am not saying they are correct..i am saying that until we acknowledge the legitimacy of other people to live their lives the way THEY choose(in their definition of freedom), we will continue to stand alone...and we will pay a much higher price-- win or lose....America won WW2 by working together internally and internationally. that is why Bush is NOT winning the war on terrorism......
we haven't been attacked again (on our soil), but we have been attacked vigorously in Iraq. we are actually breeding more terrorists than we are killing.....
in the war that is no longer a war in Iraq, we have captured 1 non-Iraqi terrorist for every 100 Iraqi insurgents....FOX news makes no distinction, but other channels do....
FOX news makes EVERY other channel liberal.., but they are the only unbiased NEWS... BIG LOL
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Glass, I'm a little fuzzy on the whole war-monger thing. Could you please explain to me the reality in which you live, surely there was no 9-11 in your reality, just wondering what other differences there are.
how many times to do i have to repeat mself....
9-11 had NOTHING TO DO WITH IRAQ...
the only people who believe that are FOX news watchers.....
Bush USED the 9-11 attack to INVADE a third world country that had no self-defense.....and NO WMD
which reality are you in?????
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Glass, perhaps you can show me in the constitution where any of that is the federal government's concern.
Am I the only one who argues politics only after reading the constitution?
where what is the Fed Govs concern???
FOX news???
do a little DD DQR..FOX news(check out the names) they ARE the neo-conservative news station..that's their right, but that doesn't make them FACTUAL....
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
Kate, i too am distressed that i have to drive my kids to school (in a small town even) instead of having them walk a very few blocks like i did. this is a good example of why we need to do more about OUR domestic problems and less about Iraq's domestic problems
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Insurgent? We don't call them terrorists when it foils your feeble arguement?
I mean how could they possibly be terrorists when Iraq had no ties to terrorism? Good rule of thumb is that if it walks talks and blows itself up like a terrorist then it just might be one.
feeble argument?? LOL DQR the facts aren't feeble...i am not defending Iraqui insurgents i am pointing out the political lying....our presence in Iraq is in fact CREATING more terrorists....
this was pointed by a large group of world leaders PRIOR to our invasion of Iraq and that is why we FAILED to acquire UN sanctions...
We are losing the war on terrorism in Iraq even Fox News admits this.....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 06, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Glass, we all know Iraq had no ties to 9-11 even though Attah met with the senior Iraqi Intell. official just days before coming to America to begin his flight training. We also know that the Boeing 747 carcus at a terrorist training camp in northern Iraq wasn't used by Attah to train for the attack.
I know you can't figure this out on your own so I will tell you that while the battle in Iraq was for mainly noble causes, the main reason was to close the backdoor of Iran.
Sure I know you will try vainly to wrap your head around this one, but the reason for going to Iraq first was to surround Iran. (we are already in Afganistan)
so you at least are willing to admit that the war in Iraq was not altruistic....
let's talk the TRUTH.... cuz guess what, the President isn't....
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Glass, I have always understood that Iraq was a strategic battle, I have left it up to you commies to misunderstand what I meant by that.
then why does the Bush/Cheney political machine present it in their speeches as altruistic?
i'll tell you why, cuz the truth won't get them ELECTED...LOL
and he is giving us tax breaks while he spends an extera 200 BILION dolars....
he also just passed the LARGEST medicaid increase ever...LOL but he is helping the seniors with their medical costs????LOL
oh yeah some lottery for getting a RX card...JOKE
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
The problem you commies have with the battle in iraq is that you cannot fathom doing something for more than one reason.
Have you ever stopped for gas not only because you needed gas but your kid had to go to the bathroom and your wife was hungry?
What happens when your wife decides she isn't hungry? Do you call the stop an injustice and raise hell over it?
We went to Iraq for many reasons. One of the reasons turned out to be invalid. So we should forget the fact that we liberated fifty-million people? We should forget the fact that we surrounded our biggest enemy in the war on terror?
Glass, I admire your spunk, but your perception of reality isn't worth admiration.
you are doing the same thing the Repubs did at the election DQR....
there aren't 50 million people in Iraq and Afgh. COMBINED.....
they LIED to get this war and YOU ADMIT it...that's a little better than at the convention...cuz they won't admit it...and we are in no postion to take Iran from there right now are we?????
it's really sad to you defending lying to the voters.......
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
how many times to do i have to repeat mself....
9-11 had NOTHING TO DO WITH IRAQ...
the only people who believe that are FOX news watchers.....
Bush USED the 9-11 attack to INVADE a third world country that had no self-defense.....and NO WMDglass, i dont recall that iraq started 9-11 argument, i heard dems on cnn trying to say bush said so. I dont want hints though, just facts, and fact is he hasnt said iraq and 9-11 were linked. He has linked al queda and iraq, much as russia has linked chechny and al-queda.
I would've supported an attack on iraq as soon as they broke the cease fire agreement. Clinton said he was number one threat to america........
i agreed, bin laden just got lucky.
keith
which reality are you in?????
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Glass, I have read your posts. As you well know I am about the only one who confronts you on these political threads. You are against the war because you don't know exactly why we went. Fortunately for you I am here to tell you why, as I have done repeatidly. If you care to listen to Bush telling you why we went to war I suggest you travel to C-SPAN.com and listen to all of his national addresses. You will find no difference in what I have told you.
i have never been against the war. i am against lying. i am against the ADMIN that went to the CIA and asked for the intel they WANTED and now the CIA is being dismantled for it.....
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
i have never been against the war. i am against lying. i am against the ADMIN that went to the CIA and asked for the intel they WANTED and now the CIA is being dismantled for it.....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 06, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by glassman:
[b] i have never been against the war. i am against lying. i am against the ADMIN that went to the CIA and asked for the intel they WANTED and now the CIA is being dismantled for it.....
[/B][/QUOTE]
i will disagree with that the opposite is true....
NO ONE will testify...that's what you really mean by no proof...
but it doesn't take much DD to come that conclusion....
it is a fact that people in the CIA who spoke up against the war got harrassed by the white house...
and it is a fact that the people in the white house were looking for the evidence to go to war in IRAQ even BEFORE 9-11....
yes, unproven speculation,
not a stretch at all....
it is also a fact that the INTEL was bought and paid for, and much more QUESTIONABLE (according to CIA documents) than BUSH was willing to admit....
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Hey glass, I just thought it would be a real kick to the groin of all those CMKX pumpers to see us argue like this. All those paid pumper theories would be blown out of the water.
i enjoy it..LOL....i doubt they are even looking up from their pile of kimberlite rubble..LOL
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
I'm still a little fuzzy on what the Bush admin. lied about. The CIA, FBI, Emgland's Mi, France, Russia, Germany, .... everyone who could know did say Iraq had WMD's.... so who lied?
Also it might behoove you to investigate resolution 1441. Saddam had to declare and show what happened to his WMD's... Did he do that?
Han's Blix says no.
i don't think there's any question that Saddam is a very bad guy...
but we can't afford to carry the weight alone...and Bush has alienated us from the rest of the world...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 06, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Carry the weight alone?
You might want to ask one of the other fourty-five countries that were in the coalition about that. (look, I'm not sure about the actual number but I think it was 45, or close to it)
Forty-five countries is unilateral?
Well I guess logic never concerned france in it's arguements before... why would it now?
we are providing something like 97% of the resources.....
Gillette has not sold one feminine razor in France for over five years.
Page Two:
French men have resorted to lawn darts as a form of foreplay.
------------------
You Must Adapt To Your Opportunities And Weaknesses. You Can Use A Variety Of Approaches And Still Have A Consistant Result. - Sun Tzu, "The Art Of War"
Do Da Due.....But Be Damn Quick About It. - Dardadog, "Da Art Of Daytrading"
DaDog
[This message has been edited by dardadog (edited September 06, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
we are providing something like 97% of the resources.....
Glass this is easy to explain...
You and I are the only ones arguing these points. Are we the only ones viewing these pages?
No, there are many lurkers watching this unwilling to confront the issues themselves.
America is no lurker.
As for the feminine razors, I don't buy them either, I use the mens, they work better! Not touching the other subject with a ten foot pole!
quote:
Originally posted by Kate:
I'm lurking, and enjoying watching you guys "discuss" this now!
my wife does too....LOL and they are ruined when i get them back...
my cacklacker don't go that high--(speaking of CMKX-LOL)
with about 200 million taxpayers (vague estimate)
that's only about 1000 per taxpayer?....
hmm not too spensive....how long are we going finace this deal for????
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
sorry Keith, i wasn't even thinking about you ....[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 06, 2004).]
LOL - glass, I'm lost, thanks for the apology though?????
yes, unproven speculation,
not a stretch at all....
it is also a fact that the INTEL was bought and paid for, and much more QUESTIONABLE (according to CIA documents) than BUSH was willing to admit....[/B][/QUOTE]
Hold on glass, whos intelligence.
Putin went out of his way at an EU convention to state that he told USA that sadam was planning attacks in the USA.
dont forget Blairs intelligence, ( you can argue your way out of israels and jordans)
All these intelligence agencies backed bush propaganda? come on............... conspiracy theories LOL. you trying to write Oliver Stones next movie?
quote:
Originally posted by keithsan:
yes, unproven speculation,
not a stretch at all....
it is also a fact that the INTEL was bought and paid for, and much more QUESTIONABLE (according to CIA documents) than BUSH was willing to admit...
Hold on glass, whos intelligence.
Putin went out of his way at an EU convention to state that he told USA that sadam was planning attacks in the USA.
dont forget Blairs intelligence, ( you can argue your way out of israels and jordans)
All these intelligence agencies backed bush propaganda? come on............... conspiracy theories LOL. you trying to write Oliver Stones next movie?
the CIA itself has made it clear they presented Bush with the evidence and said it was highly speculative....
Putin??? kind of makes me nervous what his price for that endorsement actualy was....
you know i am trying to point out the pump and dump and the spin here......
i'm sick of being lied to all the time....
it's getting worse every year...where does this all lead??????
if Kerry had anything for Bush, nobody would even bother defending him....
we ARE in a Global Economy and i have made my disdain for that clear in the past...
now we thumb our noses at the world and tell them to take it or leave it??? DUMB...
if America VOTES Bush back in
WE THE PEOPLE
are supporting his arrogant behaviour.....
that teary eyed act he put on at the convention when he talked about troops looked pretty convincing....
i don't buy it....
esp. when you look at Cheny and Bush's real military service records...
do i think Kerry will make a better president???? it wouldn't take much.....
do i like Kerry??? NO!!!!
[
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 06, 2004).]
1. 6 year terms for PREZ and VEEPS--no returning, VEEP can't run for PREZ....this would fix how much money taxpayers actually spend on the re-election campaigns...
2. NO campaign donations EXCEPT by REGISTERED VOTERS... no corps, no foreigners, no endorsements by nameless groups...i.e. Swift boat veterans would be required to post all of their names on a web site and state clearly their party affiliations and HOW MUCH MONEY THEY ARE SPENDING....kind of like a FORM 4
we don't want to stop freedom of speech,
we NEED accountability.....
quote:
Originally posted by DiQuiRiesco:
Dog, perhaps you could clarify how the problem was handed down from Bush Sr. when radical islam has been on the warpath for two-thousand years. Yeah sure Bush Sr. is old, but not sure he's that old.
I don't think dad should have stopped when he did. 50% of the male children born in Iraq since dad pulled out have been named Osama. We left the Iraqi people with a limp american flag in one hand, and a case of the ass in the other. We should not be trying to free nations in the world of tyranny. If they want freedom, let them free themselves. Its the only way they will get true freedom. If someone else free's them, they are in a sense serving a new master. Only you can free yourself. Someone yesterday slammed me for not repecting the freedoms I enjoy. Bullsh!t!!! I'm a service connected disabled veteran. I've fought for my freedom. The same individual that was assaulting me seem to think I should be thankful to George Bush for my freedom. George didn't give me any of the freedom I currently enjoy. I gave freedom to George twenty years ago. He is the one that now is taking more and more of my freedoms from me at a rapid pace. He's not even a true capitilist. Telling people they cannot go to Canada to purchase life sustaining medicine at prices they can afford. I'm sorry. I've been in business most of my adult life. A monopoly is not capitilism. It's borderline communism. The state of Arizona in which I reside just passed a law against people buying cigarettes over the border in Mexico or on the internet. They even had the audacity to state that the reason was because they were losing tax revenue. The "run by the very rich" government we have today feels that they can help thier wallet by laying off a $30,000 a year american employee and send his job to India or Mexico or China and pay someone there less than $5000 annually. Now they tell us we can't shop in those countries and have to buy only from them. Again, BULLSH!T!!!!! I don't claim that Kerry is the great american answer. I feel that 90% of the politicians are jerks. But I feel very strongly that George is a very dangerous individual. All for one, and the one is George kinda guy. Anyone that can't see his self serving agenda is a blind fool.
Dar
Fifty-one percent of Americans now say that the situation in Iraq was worth going to war over. In early May, that number was 44%.
Similarly, the two most recent Gallup Polls have shown that about 50% of Americans believe that the U.S. involvement in Iraq was not a mistake. That is up from three polls in late June and early July when only about 45% thought that sending troops to Iraq was not a mistake, and the "mistake" number was up to 54%.
Bush is now in his strongest position vis-à-vis Kerry on Iraq since March. Forty-nine percent of Americans say that Bush can do the best job of handling Iraq, compared with 43% who choose Kerry. This marks a turnaround from Gallup's July 30-Aug. 1 poll (just after the Democratic convention), when 48% chose Kerry and 47% chose Bush.
they did it by MISrepresenting their ORIGINAL Iraq mission....
and by trying to say Kerry will screw up....
they are NOW trying to paint it with an altruistic brush...and that's not TRUE....
if the President says "It was the right thing to do" enough times, people will start to believe it.....
and he is appealing to the religious as if he is doing GOD's work....
if you listen to Fox News, he got a lot better numbers...LOL
the economy is not so good for Bush......
7. The economy remains a weak spot for Bush.
Kerry continues to lead Bush -- most recently by 49% to 43% -- when the public is asked which of the two candidates would do the better job of handling the economy. Although the specific size of this gap has varied from poll to poll, Kerry has led Bush on the economy across six different Gallup Polls since early March.
Additionally, Bush has not gotten a lot of mileage out of his signature economic issue: tax cuts. Kerry has a slight lead over Bush (47% to 44%) when Gallup asks the public which candidate can better handle taxes.
The American public is no more likely to say that the tax cuts passed in 2001-2002 have helped the U.S. economy than it is to say the cuts have hurt the economy.
needless to say,Fox News disagrees ... LOL
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 06, 2004).]
it's USUALLY called sleight of hand when someone does it on stage......
And DiQuiRiesco...
"Gillette has not sold one feminine razor in France for over five years."
good old blatant yankee doodle flag waving racism
People like you are pathetic obedient little slaves to your facist king George the 2nd.
The right wing of America has gone beyond far what it means to be conservative, and is now approaching facism on the political spectrum. People like you deserve everything thats going to happen to America over the next while, assuming America doesn't change its course. I just feel bad for your children, and people like glassman and daradog, they don't deserve to suffer for your stupidity and macho arroagance.
- Kevin
Not trying to start a battle between countries, just stating my own opinion!
in case you didn't hear, Pres. Bush managed to tell us at the convention that he was helping our seniors, the very NEXT day he presented us with the LARGEST medicare increase in history....
technically, Medi-care isn't a tax..LOL it IS SOCIALIZED medicine, and IT IS the future of our medical economy if things keep going the way they are....
40 million Americans have NO health care coverage......how many in Canada have NO coverage?
20 MILLION Americans suffer from Diagnosed clincial depression, how many of those 40 million uninsured suffer from it UNDIAGNOSED?......probably a much higher percentage....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
they are CRIMINALS....
no, we reward them....
you can drive around in almost every city in America and hire dozens of illegal aliens at "tent employment agencies" it's flaunted..and every contractor KNOWS exactly where to find them... the LAW looks the other way...even tho 9-11 CHANGED THE WORLD--give me a break.....
quit being FOOLED by the white house, they AREN'T doing a good job protecting our borders, OUR BORDERS ARE seives....
send the ILLEGALS back home to stay
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
how about throwing people who HIRE illegal aliens in JAIL.......they are CRIMINALS....
no, we reward them....
you can drive around in almost every city in America and hire dozens of illegal aliens at "tent employment agencies" it's flaunted..and every contractor KNOWS exactly where to find them... the LAW looks the other way...even tho 9-11 CHANGED THE WORLD--give me a break.....
quit being FOOLED by the white house, they AREN'T doing a good job protecting our borders, OUR BORDERS ARE seives....
send the ILLEGALS back home to stay[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
I agree. This is one thing that has always concerned me. Why leave the house when your back door is unlocked (why are we atteacking countries half a world away when our bourders are not secure?). Seems you take care of the first problem before addressing the second.
As I recall 9/11 happened HERE!!! While I support Bush for being offensive in this war, I would have sought out terror cells in this country and secured the borders first. The way we did it was like buying a gun to become a vigilanty rather than for the purposes of protecting your OWN home.
by comparison our liars look like saints...
that doesn't make us good...just better...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
he does not look well in his speech right now
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
he is even mis-speaking-very uncharacterisitic ohf him...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
I DO care about what you all think, but I have enough to think about, without going in circles here! Got some of the wonderful medical bills, from my accident with the mower! Always wear gloves! I repeat, ALWAYS wear gloves!
this PR is disturbing, Rumsfeld uses WW2 as an example for attacking Iraq on one hand and turns around and says you CAN'T compare 20th cent. to 21st cent wars when asked about pulling troops from the Korean penninsula......
this isn't the worst tho.....
the worst is that this PR had no NEWS--it was a campaign speech using a military uniform trying to compare Russia's terrorism problem to ours...and there is NO comparison....
unless you want to compare the occupation of Iraq to Chechneya....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by keithsan:
glass, do you think Russi is wondering if they should have a doctrine of preemption right now? arresting those who are on a death wish doesnt really work. I am expecting a counteraction from russia and soon. If there is none, this will continue.....
who are they going to attack?????
maybe this will give more credence to what i mean about Rusia not being comparable to US in any way.....
look up them up.....
http://www.allstocks.com/markets/World_Charts/world_charts.html
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
And when he WON the last election, i was very angry with Al Gore for putting us through the recount crap. Why? because you have to count ALL the votes the same way..not special ways in one county....
sure Bush lost the popular vote, but WE ARE A REPUBLIC not a democracy, as DQR is so fond of pointing out. I FULLY supported Bush up until we made the MAD dash into Baghdad.....
War was delivered without DUE CAUTION.....
That is why i am very angry at this campaign. ONCE AGAIN they are not not using DUE CAUTION. If Bush loses and tells the world Kerry is weak--who really loses?
This scorched earth is not looking out for OUR interests--it is: i'll win or nobody will win......
He is gambling with all our futures....i would not be posting all of this negative crap if the campaign weren't going this way already.....
I will FULLY support whoever wins...i just can't stomach such deceit and outright arrogance.....
if you make a mistake you are human, if you make a mistake and you don't admit it, you are doomed to repeat....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
America's health care is disgusting compared to ours. We have to wait longer for non life threatening surgoery, but at least we get that surgeory!! In America, if you are insured, you get better non life threatening care then you do in Canada. Life threatening care is of the same quality in Canada as if you were insured in the states. But for the 40+ million Americans that aren't insured, and the 100+ million Americans without adequate inurance, your health care is BARBARIC. If someone needs surgoery to live in America, and they don't have insurance, all your doctors can do is ease the pain while they die. Then they drive their earth destroyer SUV home to their mansion and pat themselves on the back for a job well done. Sick *******s. Sick System.
- Kevin
that is UNCONSCIONABLE.....
now he is THREATENING US not to vote for his compettitor.....
wake up people.....
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
who are they going to attack?????maybe this will give more credence to what i mean about Rusia not being comparable to US in any way.....
look up them up.....
http://www.allstocks.com/markets/World_Charts/world_charts.html[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
glass, you cant compare the two, but, you can compare the problem. who wil they attack? those who fund, train, and promote terrorists. There is not a country to go to war with. People have to think out of the box. Russia will have to do something there are many al-queda supporting countries out there and they have said al-queda was a part. so SYRIA and IRAN work for me, but, i dont know what they are thinking.
maybe they'll do nothing again, that doesnt seem to work though.
. Asylum for Chechen Draws Protest From Russia
Maura Reynolds, The Los Angeles Times, August 6, 2004
"A Boston immigration court granted Akhmadov's asylum application last spring, but the Department of Homeland Security appealed the decision on June 1. It withdrew the appeal on July 13, and the grant of asylum decision became final on Monday, Akhmadov said in a telephone interview from his home in Vermont
http://www.peaceinchechnya.org/
The DHS appeal had little foundation. After hearing Mr. Akhmadov's case, the immigration judge pointed out that if he were returned to Russia, there was little doubt the Chechen leader would be "shot without being afforded the opportunity to defend himself in a trial, as has happened to other members of the Chechen government."
maybe that's why some sick people don't care if theey live or die........
Not surprisingly, the Russian government was displeased by the decision. "Such acts do not correspond to the friendly spirit of Russian-American relations, and do not help the joint fight against international terrorism," the Russian foreign ministry declared
gee, i guess our current government is really doing a great job in the war on terrorism....LOL
oh yeah, that's right Russia didn't think Saddam was a terrorist???? or did they?
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
how does it feel to you that the russians were making great money off sadam with the santions, as was france.
You mentioned we must have paid off putin for what he said to the EU.... come on oliver stone. You must have a better answer than that.
It would have been easy to match the amount of money that france and russia made Illegally from Iraq and the U.N would've been in. And then this conversation is completely different.
Iran and Iraq have given assylum to al queda and one is still around, we play political grab ass with these people all the time. The stakes are high now, Putin has put off his people badly, (not dumb protest sign angry) really angry.
side note: reading today how some of the parents shot the elite army as they raced in with guns, parents shot anyone with a weapon.....
Thats a bad situation.
keith
maybe he was trying to get us to change our support away from the chechyns.....
maybe we will flip-flop now??????
now he is THREATENING US not to vote for his compettitor....
i thought Scare Tactics was a SCI-FI channel show, not a FOX NEWS show....LOL
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
i still have a hard time with anyone who says Iraq was significantly tied to Al-queda...
that is PROPAGANDA that was DEBUNKED by the 9-11 commission.....a BI-partisan commission that the White House itself has not argued against---even Bush no longer says it...he just says the world is better/safer etc.....
i think tied to terrorists and al-queda, but not 9/11 at all!!!!!
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
[b]You mentioned we must have paid off putin for what he said to the EU.... come on oliver stone. You must have a better answer than that
maybe he was trying to get us to change our support away from the chechyns.....maybe we will flip-flop now??????[/B]
maybe he should've done it before the war...
LOL
flip flop is silly but sadly not political spin. I saw kerry come out today saying this was the wrong war. Last week with a questioner he said i would've been for the war with even knowing no WMD- what an a..
I dont buy the rhetoric of either moron but I aint no idjet eida...
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by glassman:
[B]
Dick Cheney said today that if we make the wrong decision in 8 weeks, "we will get hit again".....
in those words....now he is THREATENING US not to vote for his compettitor....
i thought Scare Tactics was a SCI-FI channel show, not a FOX NEWS show....LOL[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
I like fox news, not sci-fi though, silly statement agreed, I do praise the gods that gore wasnt our president at the time of attacks cuz i think we would've been hit again.
kerry has helped to destroy MA, hate to see him with a country - no LOL.
i don't like Kerry ..it's just that i am having a hard time watching our political process sink this low....these guys will say anything... Kerry isn't getting nearly as much time on any of the channels as the Boss, and since i am in a non-battle state i see even less....
this flip-flop thing is not just Kerry either... the only reason Bush has no flip-flop is cuz he was never a senator.. just a governor..and guess what his no child left behind law is forcing Texas Schools to lose a lot of money cuz they got caught fudging the books...... none of 'em are for US they are for the BUCKS....
just a coment tho...Governors are usually the ones that shaft the states, the senators are mostly about Federal Law...they are supposed to work to bring federal money BACK into the state...the good ones get you twice as much(or more) as you put intp the kitty...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by kevin954:And DiQuiRiesco...
"Gillette has not sold one feminine razor in France for over five years."
good old blatant yankee doodle flag waving racism
People like you are pathetic obedient little slaves to your facist king George the 2nd.
The right wing of America has gone beyond far what it means to be conservative, and is now approaching facism on the political spectrum. People like you deserve everything thats going to happen to America over the next while, assuming America doesn't change its course. I just feel bad for your children, and people like glassman and daradog, they don't deserve to suffer for your stupidity and macho arroagance.
- Kevin
Just a little inside info for you Kev. The glorious French were the ones aiding and abetting our enemy. This means they are directly responsible for American deaths.
And you defend them?
Good job, way to show off that brain.
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
Keith, i think you are watching too much EDITED TV....FOX is really bad about taking things out of context.... try switching around some...i don't like Kerry ..it's just that i am having a hard time watching our political process sink this low....these guys will say anything... Kerry isn't getting nearly as much time on any of the channels as the Boss, and since i am in a non-battle state i see even less....
this flip-flop thing is not just Kerry either... the only reason Bush has no flip-flop is cuz he was never a senator.. just a governor..and guess what his no child left behind law is forcing Texas Schools to lose a lot of money cuz they got caught fudging the books...... none of 'em are for US they are for the BUCKS....just a coment tho...Governors are usually the ones that shaft the states, the senators are mostly about Federal Law...they are supposed to work to bring federal money BACK into the state...the good ones get you twice as much(or more) as you put intp the kitty...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 07, 2004).]
Glass, are you kidding me...... I spent the last 2 months in Greece with no television. I enjoy the personality of the fox reporters and commentators better than those of cnn. (yes i know the difference) and Msnbc is just brutal.
Almost all of my news comes from reading, i read the Boston Globe, owned by the N.Y. Times, the same one voted as the most biased media outlet in the country (by the media themselves). Its a good paper but, biased and you have to read between the lines, no different than fox.
...Globe today front page was about how Bush maybe didnt show up for guard duty....LOL Even with all the swift boat news they have yet to have an article on the front page saying maybe Kerry didnt deserve medals....
My favorite news program is meet the press though, Russert is tough on all, he's no larry king. (dem though). I watched all Kerrys interviews there, I support the war, with or without WMD's, I would spend billions more in Iraq to finish this off right....
now new tone, the war is killing economy etc.....(thats why the flip flop label) I wont even get into the i voted for it before I voted against it speach...
[This message has been edited by keithsan (edited September 08, 2004).]
Ok, i don't want to defend Kerry. i just want to see a campaign based on real issues....
the flip-flop thing is a
double-sided issue....
on the issue of the budget.....
another excerpt from the White House web site....
For Immediate Release
Office of the Press Secretary
September 24, 2002
President's Remarks
President Urges Congress to Pass Iraq Resolution Promptly
Remarks by the President in Photo Opportunity with the Cabinet
The Cabinet Room
A Decade of Deception and Defiance
11:00 A.M. EDT
from the President's statement...
My message, of course, is that, to the senators up here that are more interested in special interests, you better pay attention to the overall interests of protecting the American people.
We can get budget going. I need a defense bill. The Senate needs to get, and the House needs to get, their differences reconciled and get a defense bill to my desk before they go home. That's a very important signal to send. And at the same time, since there is no budget in the Senate, they've got to be mindful of over-spending. Very important for those up there who keep talking about budget -- balanced budget, and all that, to not over-spend. If they're truly that concerned about the deficit, then one way they can help is to be fiscally sound with the people's money.
did he say "balanced budget"???????
one of the questions from th epress corps...
Dick.
Q Mr. President, we haven't asked you about the economy in quite some time. Consumer confidence numbers out today -- not real good. Later this month, lots of Americans are going to receive their 401(k) statements, many of them probably cringing about what they're going to see in there. Do you feel like the economy is on the right track, that the stock market can mount any kind of a recovery in coming months? And if you are optimistic, what are your reasons for your optimism?
THE PRESIDENT: Yes. Well, I'm optimistic because, one, I'm optimistic about America in general. I mean, the American people are resilient, they're strong, we've got the best workers in the world, inflation is down, interest rates are low. So when you combine the productivity of the American people with low interest rates and low inflation, those are the ingredients for growth.
But there's more to do. That's why we need a terrorism insurance bill. We need to get our hard-hats working again. We need to make the tax cuts permanent so that entrepreneurs and small businesses have got certainty in the tax code. We need to make sure Congress doesn't over-spend. If Congress over-spends, it will send a chilling signal to markets. And so there are things that Congress and the administration can do, working together to make sure people work.
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 08, 2004).]
this might be the tell...
Reporters who followed Russell outside to try to talk with him were ordered by Kerry campaign staffers to return inside immediately or risk not being allowed back in to hear the speech.
Kerry staffers didn't want him interviewed?
just this week- kitty kelly with cocaine abuse (from divorcing sister in law- couldnt get own book published)
top news papers running the stupid national guard story.....
(thats just this week,-LOL i think its just crazy)
i find it hard to have pride in the processes we have been seeing, Clinton/cigars etc., not much in the way STATESMANSHIP anymore.....
Russia attack who? i really was working toward a point there....
Which country were most of the 9-11 hi-jackers from?
which country does MOST of the terrorism money seem to come from????
if they attack THAT country, what will we DO???????????
that's one of the things that has been bugging me since we attacked Iraq.....
Ossama bin alive too long isn't an Iraqi is he?????????
noooooo.............
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 08, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
OK keith i was startng a new thread, but this one has a life of it's own.....Russia attack who? i really was working toward a point there....
Which country were most of the 9-11 hi-jackers from?
which country does MOST of the terrorism money seem to come from????if they attack THAT country, what will we DO???????????
that's one of the things that has been bugging me since we attacked Iraq.....
Ossama bin alive too long isn't an Iraqi is he?????????
noooooo.............[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 08, 2004).]
Saudi Arabia- I agree, i'd like to create a parking lot there(with oil wells).
i will work on some DD....
Who are the current coalition members?
President Bush is assembling a Coalition that has already begun military operations to disarm Iraq of its weapons of mass destruction, and enforce 17 UNSC resolutions.
The Coalition will also liberate the Iraqi people from one of the worst tyrants and most brutal regimes on earth.
Contributions from Coalition member nations range from: direct military participation, logistical and intelligence support, specialized chemical/biological response teams, over-flight rights, humanitarian and reconstruction aid, to political support.
Forty-nine countries are publicly committed to the Coalition, including:
Afghanistan
Albania
Angola
Australia
Azerbaijan
Bulgaria
Colombia
Costa Rica
Czech Republic
Denmark
Dominican Republic
El Salvador
Eritrea
Estonia
Ethiopia
Georgia
Honduras
Hungary
Iceland
Italy
Japan
Kuwait
Latvia
Lithuania
Macedonia
Marshall Islands
Micronesia
Mongolia
Netherlands
Nicaragua
Palau
Panama
Philippines
Poland
Portugal
Romania
Rwanda
Singapore
Slovakia
Solomon Islands
South Korea
Spain
Tonga
Turkey
Uganda
Ukraine
United Kingdom
United States
Uzbekistan
This number is still growing, and it is no accident that many member nations of the Coalition recently escaped from the boot of a tyrant or have felt the scourge of terrorism. All Coalition member nations understand the threat Saddam Hussein's weapons pose to the world and the devastation his regime has wreaked on the Iraqi people.
The population of Coalition countries is approximately 1.23 billion people.
Coalition countries have a combined GDP of approximately $22 trillion.
Every major race, religion, ethnicity in the world is represented.
The Coalition includes nations from every continent on the globe.
i think a few of these are off the CURRENT list now...
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 08, 2004).]
For Immediate Release
Office of the Press Secretary
April 25, 2002
President Bush Meets with Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia
Remarks by the President After Meeting With Crown Prince of Saudi Arabia
Bush Ranch
Crawford, Texas
President's Remarks
view
listen
4:06 P.M. CDT
THE PRESIDENT: Good afternoon. I was honored to welcome Crown Prince Abdallah to my ranch, a place that is very special for me, and a place where I welcome special guests to our country. The Crown Prince and I had a very cordial meeting that confirmed the strong relationship between Saudi Arabia and the United States of America.
yep. this might make things alittle sticky....
THE PRESIDENT: Well, first of all, one of the really positive things out of this meeting was the fact that the Crown Prince and I established a strong personal bond. We spent a lot of time alone, discussing our respective visions, talking about our families. I was most interested in learning about how he thought about things. I'm convinced that the stronger our personal bond is, the more likely it is relations between our country will be strong.
NOTE the DATES how is it they were so sure Osama wasn't associated with them so SOOOOON after 9-11????
i hope it wasn't the SAME intel source that they had on the WMD in Iraq........
want a link????????????
i din't get this from Mike the butthead MOORE
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 08, 2004).]
the Saudi's insist is the best answer i can find....
Bush Donor Profile
printer friendly
Robert W. Jordan
Occupation: Attorney
Employer: Baker Botts
Home: Dallas, TX
Corporate lawyer Robert Jordan specializes in dispute resolution and international business at Baker Botts, the Bush family’s insider law firm (see William Barnett). Jordan was George W. Bush’s personal attorney during an early scandal. While sitting on Harken Oil’s audit committee in 1990, director George W. Bush sold $848,560 in Harken stock (60 percent of his holdings)--just two months before the stock price tanked after Harken disclosed a $23 million loss to its shareholders. The Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) investigated this suspicious stock sale after Bush reported it eight months late. Heading the SEC at the time was Richard Breeden, who was appointed by Bush’s father (Breeden and then-SEC General Counsel James Doty came from Baker Botts). On August 21, 1991 the SEC concluded that there was insufficient evidence to charge Bush with insider trading because Harken’s internal and outside counsel reportedly approved the sale. The day after the SEC reached this conclusion, however, Robert Jordan belatedly provided the SEC with contradictory evidence. Namely, Harken’s external counsel at Haynes & Boone (see Michael Boone) sent Bush and other Harken directors a cautionary 1990 letter warning them not to sell Harken stock if they were aware of significant problems with the company. The date of that letter was one week before Bush unloaded his 212,140 Harken shares for $848,560. Bush used the Harken stock money to repay a loan he had taken out to invest in the Texas Rangers, an investment that made him a millionaire 15 times over in 1999 (see Tom Hicks). On September 12, 2001—the day after 11 suicidal Saudi terrorists attacked the United States, President Bush nominated Jordan to be Saudi ambassador. Ambassador Jordan generally kept a low public profile as the U.S. sought to keep Saudi oil flowing while distancing itself from a corrupt monarchy with financial ties to the terrorists. Ambassador Jordan praised Saudi cooperation with U.S. terrorism investigators in late 2001, when those same U.S. officials said Saudi cooperation was virtually nonexistent. Ambassador Jordan resigned in 2003, shortly after an Arabic newspaper reported that Jordan privately cited two princes whom the U.S. would prefer as the next Saudi king and crown prince. Jordan’s claim that he was misquoted failed to soothe the seething jealousies harbored by the Royal Family’s prodigious pool of spoiled offspring. Several weeks after Jordan’s allegedly undiplomatic comments, President Bush refused to declassify the section of a congressional report that discusses Saudi financing of the September 2001 attacks. At the time, the FBI was probing why tens of thousands of dollars from the Riggs bank account (see Jonathan Bush) of Saudi Princess Haifa flowed to the families of two Saudi students who subsidized two Saudi terrorists. Princess Haifa, daughter of the late King Faisal, is married to Saudi Arabia’s U.S. ambassador, Prince Bandar bin Sultan. Bush nominated James Oberwetter, a Hunt Oil executive (see Ray Hunt), to replace Jordan.
http://www.tpj.org/docs/pioneers/pioneers_view.jsp?id=628
i don't know anything about these people other than what you see on the site....these are the funding vehicles...
Texans for Public Justice is able to continue its work thanks to generous support from the following foundations:
The Alliance For Better Campaigns, Washington, DC (The Alliance is supported by grants from the Pew Charitable Trusts.)
The Arca Foundation, Washington, DC
The Deer Creek Foundation, St. Louis, MO
The Magnolia Charitable Trust, Houston, TX
The National Association for Public Interest Law (NAPIL), Washington, DC
The Ottinger Foundation, New York, NY
The Proteus Fund, Amherst, MA
The Public Interest Research Group Education Fund, Los Angeles, CA
The Margaret Cullinan Wray Charitable Trust, Houston, TX
The Solidago Foundation, Northampton, MA
The Stern Family Fund, Washington, DC
The Rockefeller Familly Fund, New York, NY
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 08, 2004).]
quote:
Originally posted by glassman:
the other question i have been pondering is WHY are we soft on the Palestinians???the Saudi's insist is the best answer i can find....
This is a tough call, Europe is also highly anti-israel/jewish and most countries back the palestinians there....
cooler heads ALWAYS prevail
[This message has been edited by glassman (edited September 09, 2004).]
i wonder if the Swift Boat people have William Calley in their group???
the President accused Kerry of hurting our troops today by speaking negtively about the war in Iraq...
i say the Swift Boat people are doing WORSE by trying to discredit a CONFIRMED war hero.....
they should be ashamed---
everyone knew rich kids got breaks.....
even back then.
Kerry screwed this one up too, hes backpeddling. LOOK if this (man) wants to be president. Stand UP and Say. The WAR SUCKED! I MET with enemy to help STOP it. Here are my facts.
its his fault his response is so weak. the charges are worthless.
When Rather brought Docu-drama, Bush response was......
There was none! good play! hand goes to bush.
Ante up.
the swift boat guys are also connected to the Bush campaign or were until the two guys quit....
these swifty guys forgot that we lost Nam...
they act like it was a good war, they are hurting out troops, if Kerry wins the election then these guys start to look like traitors don't they????
what was kerry 20. I dont care.
Bush snorted coke instead of flying his plane......hell i was snortin and never learned to fly...
quote:
Originally posted by glassman posted August 20, 2004 20:10 :
if president Bush doesn't renounce the swift boat adds, he risks losing a significant numbers of veteran/military supporters.
the ads are of the same ilk as Moore's "documentary" only worse cuz they aren't even done under the "guise" of commerce or "art"--they are one of the most repulsive campaign tactics in US history....