posted
Bush is following the old Commie M.O. perfectly. He must have a copy of the old Russian KGB playbook... this man must be stopped!!!
Read this:
The National Security Agency has been secretly collecting the phone call records of tens of millions of Americans, using data provided by AT&T, Verizon and BellSouth, people with direct knowledge of the arrangement told USA TODAY.
The NSA program reaches into homes and businesses across the nation by amassing information about the calls of ordinary Americans - most of whom aren't suspected of any crime. This program does not involve the NSA listening to or recording conversations. But the spy agency is using the data to analyze calling patterns in an effort to detect terrorist activity, sources said in separate interviews.
"It's the largest database ever assembled in the world," said one person, who, like the others who agreed to talk about the NSA's activities, declined to be identified by name or affiliation. The agency's goal is "to create a database of every call ever made" within the nation's borders, this person added.
For the customers of these companies, it means that the government has detailed records of calls they made - across town or across the country - to family members, co-workers, business contacts and others.
The three telecommunications companies are working under contract with the NSA, which launched the program in 2001 shortly after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, the sources said. The program is aimed at identifying and tracking suspected terrorists, they said.
The sources would talk only under a guarantee of anonymity because the NSA program is secret.
Air Force Gen. Michael Hayden, nominated Monday by President Bush to become the director of the CIA, headed the NSA from March 1999 to April 2005. In that post, Hayden would have overseen the agency's domestic call-tracking program. Hayden declined to comment about the program.
-------------------- The more weedsmoke I puff the more dangerous...
IP: Logged |
posted
Every law inforcement agency has the same ability to pull these records. So if they are being pulled to make life safer, great. Every president has had the power to do this. At least this presidents got the guts to do something other than fret about things and give lip service to the problem of terrorism. Talk to the guys coming back from Iraq and aske them if they have got a problem with tracking down terrorists this way. I have and they don't. Get realist about what's happening and realize things have to be done different or extreme to stop these terrorists. Clinton did the same thing just not as deep and no one said anythng. He was questioned about the wire taps and the NSA's role but said the president has certain powers that Congress can't regulate. Most presidents agree and so do most of the lawyers and judges.
-------------------- BE HUMBLE, DON'T STUMBLE!
IP: Logged |
posted
I don't care which former presidents illegally infringed on our Constitutional rights. Bush has taken this to extremes.
For somebody who is going to such extremes because of his self-proclaimed "global war on terrorism," I think it's pretty interesting that he's turning a blind eye to things like the out-of-control border situation in Mexico. The last time I checked, Mexico was still on the globe, yet Bush lets illegals pour over the border.
So, it's OK for Bush to steal our Constitutional rights in the name of the "global war on terror," yet it's not OK to secure our border against ILLEGALS. Sure, makes perfect sense to me...
-------------------- The more weedsmoke I puff the more dangerous...
IP: Logged |
posted
Another thing... what kind of terrorist would use a line from BellSouth or a cell phone from Verizon to conduct terrorism business? Are you kidding me, this is a joke!!! The Bush administration is clueless.
-------------------- The more weedsmoke I puff the more dangerous...
IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by deepockets: Every law inforcement agency has the same ability to pull these records. So if they are being pulled to make life safer, great. Every president has had the power to do this. At least this presidents got the guts to do something other than fret about things and give lip service to the problem of terrorism. Talk to the guys coming back from Iraq and aske them if they have got a problem with tracking down terrorists this way. I have and they don't. Get realist about what's happening and realize things have to be done different or extreme to stop these terrorists. Clinton did the same thing just not as deep and no one said anythng. He was questioned about the wire taps and the NSA's role but said the president has certain powers that Congress can't regulate. Most presidents agree and so do most of the lawyers and judges.
where did you get this set of "facts" from? please show US a source...
you are the only person i have heard say the prez is not breaking the law....
these "terrorists" have beaten your azz into the ground...
don't you realise that the terrorists wanted THIS and wars?
osamabinalivetoolong isn't some demonaical idiot, he's fighting a very calcluated war, designed to destroy freedom and liberty everywhere...
anybody catch Cramer (Mad Money) equating the current "economic boom" to the one in the 1920's?
those who fail to study history are doomed to repeat it....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
Most presidents agree and so do most of the lawyers and judges.
name a few?
i can name dozens who totally disagree..
starting with Ashecroft....
he QUIT as Bush's attorney General after refusing to sign off on it... and? when it was time to appoint a new Supreme Court Judge? Alberto Gonzales was the logical first choice wasn't he?
anybody wonder if he was passed over cuz he CANNOT be replaced? i do maybe he can't be replaced because nobody else will sign off on it either?
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
deepockets: Another proud member of Idiots for Bush!
quote:Originally posted by deepockets: Every law inforcement agency has the same ability to pull these records. So if they are being pulled to make life safer, great. Every president has had the power to do this. At least this presidents got the guts to do something other than fret about things and give lip service to the problem of terrorism. Talk to the guys coming back from Iraq and aske them if they have got a problem with tracking down terrorists this way. I have and they don't. Get realist about what's happening and realize things have to be done different or extreme to stop these terrorists. Clinton did the same thing just not as deep and no one said anythng. He was questioned about the wire taps and the NSA's role but said the president has certain powers that Congress can't regulate. Most presidents agree and so do most of the lawyers and judges.
-------------------- "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."
First, the monitoring is done by computers. No one in the CIA or NSA is listening on a phone call you place to your hookup for a sac.
Second, terrorists have in the past and do use AT&T, Cingular, or whatever to place phone calls. What other choice do they have besides the internet? Carrier pigeons?
The computer monitoring looks for patterns. When we discover terrorist phone #s, we look for who called them.
Think about all the phone calls, are they going to randomly listen in on your phone call or are they going to go after likely candidates. You have nothing to worry about unless you are calling Al Quaeda.
IP: Logged |
posted
if you think they are fighting us ONLY because of iraq, you are mistaken. this is only one part of a global agenda from the "religion of peace". refer to my list of 14 conflicts for reference.
About Al Quaeda
"Current goal is to establish a pan-Islamic Caliphate throughout the world by working with allied Islamic extremist groups to overthrow regimes it deems "non-Islamic" and expelling Westerners and non-Muslims from Muslim countries. Issued statement under banner of "the World Islamic Front for Jihad Against the Jews and Crusaders" in February 1998, saying it was the duty of all Muslims to kill US citizens--civilian or military--and their allies everywhere."
"The fundamentals of the Islamic faith are examined initially, with a description of Islam as being a "religion based on work" with "entrance to paradise" having to be earned. Muslims being described as having no "assurance of salvation". The only way of guaranteeing "entrance to paradise" being to die in jihad. What the book describes as the "perfect motive for suicide bombers". Something which is describing as encouraging Muslims to even leave their own nations to fight jihad in other countries."
"This study illustrates that the focus of jihad is to "overcome" people who do not accept Islam (page 33). A quotation from Surah 4;89 of the Noble Quran stating, "Those who reject Islam must be killed. If they turn back, take them and kill them wherever you find them "."
"Many, many other quotations are taken from the Islamic holy books to substantiate this issue. Many readers may be disturbed by what they read. Indeed, the book proceeds to describe (with suitable references) that the ultimate goal of Islam is to establish Islamic authority over the entire World. The book also revealing what it describes as historical facts about the Islamic prophet Muhammad, his teachings and practices, that few Westerners have ever encountered."
"The book declares that Islam has been veiled in a vast sea of misinformation since September 11th , with many political and media elements falsely presenting Islam as a "religion of peace". Muslim spokespersons publicly proclaiming such an image are described as distorting the truth to make it palatable to Western ears and also with a view to attracting possible converts. Many Islamic leaders being cited here as each doing their part for jihad by deceiving the Western populace through the media, achieving the desired effect upon public opinion. We are also presented with Muhammad's own example of jihad and how others were encouraged to follow him. The ultimate goal of Islam is also examined. Mawlana Abul Ala Mawdudi, the founder of Pakistan's fundamentalist Islamic movement is quoted as saying that Islam is not like the other religions in the World and Muslim nations not like other nations, because Muslim nations have a command from Allah to "rule the entire World and to be over every nation in the World". (Page 81)."
"The book takes the reader on what it describes as a guided tour through 1,200 years of Islamic history where examples are illustrated that "justify" the killing of even women and children . The evolution of Islamic terrorism is also studied and how it has been brought to the West. The book describing how Islamic terrorism is no longer so intent upon targeting diplomatic figures or individuals, as random attacks upon the general public are more effective, as they terrorize the majority and spread fear in a larger way. Terrorism shown to have become a method of "political debate & dialogue". The depth of the Islamic hatred of Israel, the US, the West, Christianity and Judaism all being mentioned."
IP: Logged |
posted
Think about all the phone calls, are they going to randomly listen in on your phone call or are they going to go after likely candidates. You have nothing to worry about unless you are calling Al Quaeda.
today we have nothing to worry about....
are you a gun owner? one of the ways we historically defined ourselves as liberal or conservative was whther or not you believe in the freedom to own firearms...
use the NRA model of not letting them "chip away" at our rights? any TRUE conservative should be screaming bloody murder about the current situation... if Clinton or Gore did this? you know as well as i do that the conservatives would be calling for another impeachment.... fact is? the "conservatives" have folded under Bush... he isn't conservative any more than Clinton was.... what makes him different? he declared war? BFD..... as far as i can see? THE ONLY THING HE'S ACCOMPLISHED SO FAR IS TO SPEND MORE MONEY THAN ANYBODY ELSE IN HISTORY
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
are you a gun owner? one of the ways we historically defined ourselves as liberal or conservative was whther or not you believe in the freedom to own firearms...
use the NRA model of not letting them "chip away" at our rights? any TRUE conservative should be screaming bloody murder about the current situation... if Clinton or Gore did this? you know as well as i do that the conservatives would be calling for another impeachment.... fact is? the "conservatives" have folded under Bush... he isn't conservative any more than Clinton was.... what makes him different? he declared war? BFD..... as far as i can see? THE ONLY THING HE'S ACCOMPLISHED SO FAR IS TO SPEND MORE MONEY THAN ANYBODY ELSE IN HISTORY
lets live on earth, not in a theoretical plane of existence.
terrorists want to kill us. they need to communicate. how can we intercept their communications
its only FOOLISH to not have a COMPUTER look for patterns in phone calls to terrorists. how do you think we have stopped terrorist attacks for five years? you think they have not tried again? hit us once at 9/11 and then just sit back?
do you really care if someone checks out your phone numbers? there are no names attached, its a list of numbers. no one is listening to you have private conversations...once again it literally is a big computer program sifting through telephone numbers. look at it from a pragmatic POV.
IP: Logged |
posted
I love the heading of this thread it reminds me of all the kool aide drinkers at work. They voted Republican and always yaking about big Gov. in peoples lives now they are asking why the Gov. does not stop gas prices from going up. I tell them you want the Gov. to interfere with the MARKET!!!!!!! You sound like a bunch of commie whinners. Oh I see its only the things that are important to you that the Gov. should fix COMMIE WHINNER.
IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by crazyucihapa: lets live on earth, not in a theoretical plane of existence.
terrorists want to kill us. they need to communicate. how can we intercept their communications
its only FOOLISH to not have a COMPUTER look for patterns in phone calls to terrorists. how do you think we have stopped terrorist attacks for five years? you think they have not tried again? hit us once at 9/11 and then just sit back?
do you really care if someone checks out your phone numbers? there are no names attached, its a list of numbers. no one is listening to you have private conversations...once again it literally is a big computer program sifting through telephone numbers. look at it from a pragmatic POV. [/QB]
as i said? we are OK today.... with this program... what happens when they decide that the Minority Party (in the future that could possibly be the GOP) is the target of the next "investigation"... the "slipperry slope" has been greased now too
NO!!! i don't have anything to hide..... and i bet i'm one of the very few people in this country that can say that.....
BUT?
if you read the constittion? you'll find that the Office of the President has almost no power of it's own
UNLESS? we are at war.... maybe that's why we have been at war since the end of WW2...
i am NOT against wire taps or the phone number collections...they are legal...
WITH WARRANTS!!!
the phone number collection is not much different from keeping track of what you put in your mail box every day... go look in your neighbors mailbox everyday and see how long it takes the Postmaster Generals office to SWOOP on you
it's pretty plainly written in the Constitution....
picking an chooosing which parts of the Constittution the Prez wants to follow is pretty ridiculous... and NO! i don't want an impeachment either.. i want people to stop making excuses for not doing the right thing....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
the problem? after 911 these guys can't really think they would get away with re-using the same tactics over and over again....
the claims that you think they have not tried again? hit us once at 9/11 and then just sit back?
are unfounded... terrorists don't need to hit continuously to be effective...
also? why would they use phones when they have the internet?
i will repeat my basic premise: i'm not convinced there is any need to circumvent the constitution to win the war on terror, IMO, circumventing the constitution is ceding victory....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
for that matter--what about those "bic" phones? buy em in 7-11 or Family Dollar... If I had deal cookin' and desired a cloak? would simply buy a stockpile of those...
anyway, your premise is worth repeating: in fact, I'd alter a bit--
i'm convinced there is *no* need to circumvent the constitution to win the war on terror, in fact, circumventing the constitution is ceding victory....
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
IP: Logged |
posted
You bet home land security ports wide open and almost under control of an element that hates us a border that 12 to 15 million walked across illegaly but you better not try and use a cell phone in this country baby. Or just wait and see what happens to you we will put panty's on you and stack you like cord wood in jail until you learn your lesson .
Its time Americans wake up Home Land Security is almost name only and a way to shovel our money to another Bush lacky.
IP: Logged |
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of the price. What is his profit?
Teaching Math In 1960
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is 4/5 of the price, or $80. What is his profit?
Teaching Math In 1970 A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80. Did he make a profit?
Teaching Math In 1980
A logger sells a truckload of lumber for $100. His cost of production is $80 and his profit is $20. Your assignment: Underline the number 20.
Teaching Math In 1990
A logger cuts down a beautiful forest because he is selfish and inconsiderate and cares nothing for the habitat of animals or the preservation of our woodlands. He does this so he can make a profit of $20.
What do you think of this way of making a living?
Topic for class participation after answering the question: How did the birds and squirrels feel as the logger cut down their homes? (There are no wrong answers!)
Teaching Math In 2006
Un ranchero vende una carretera de maderapara $100. El cuesto de la produccion era $80. Cuantos tortillas se puede comprar?
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
i'm not really thrilled about this plan to send the Guard and the Military to the border...
Bush seems to think our troops have endless energy and resources.... they can't do everything at once for crying out loud... and they aren't police, they are warriors....
just a couple months ago? this was the headline:
Governors defend National Guard After all 50 protested National Guard cuts, governors won assurances from the White House and Pentagon this week. By Gail Russell Chaddock | Staff writer of The Christian Science Monitor
Governors also asked President Bush to drop plans to cut the National Guard, to review the decision to turn over management of six US ports to a company owned by the government of Dubai in the United Arab Emirates, and to pick up more of the tab for securing the nation's borders.
All 50 governors signed a letter opposing cuts in troop strength for the National Guard in the president's FY 2007 budget. With tens of thousands of National Guard members in Iraq, governors worry that they will come up short should they face hurricanes, forest fires, floods, terrorist attacks, or other domestic emergencies. They also want Washington to replace the equipment that guard units took overseas - but did not bring home.
talk about flip-floppping around the political landscape? he's acting like a fish outa water.....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
posted
earlier this year he was talking about cutting Natl Guard funds, and now he's supposedly ready to task them with more work.....
IMO? he's already asked them to do more than he should have in Iraq....
if he would just get on TV and look straight into the camera and tell EMPLOYERS they are gonna have to follow the LAW and hire only legals cuz we are gonna start enforcing the law? THE PROBLEM WILL SELF-CORRECT...
apparently the rumor of amnesty coming again has increased illegal border crossings by an embarasssing amount...
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by glassman: earlier this year he was talking about cutting Natl Guard funds, and now he's supposedly ready to task them with more work.....
IMO? he's already asked them to do more than he should have in Iraq....
if he would just get on TV and look straight into the camera and tell EMPLOYERS they are gonna have to follow the LAW and hire only legals cuz we are gonna start enforcing the law? THE PROBLEM WILL SELF-CORRECT...
apparently the rumor of amnesty coming again has increased illegal border crossings by an embarasssing amount...
Might correct one problem but it would create a slew of new ones. Lawns would go uncut, cabbage would go unharvested, apples would rot on the branch, the list goes on. There'd be anarchy.
IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by glassman: earlier this year he was talking about cutting Natl Guard funds, and now he's supposedly ready to task them with more work.....
IMO? he's already asked them to do more than he should have in Iraq....
if he would just get on TV and look straight into the camera and tell EMPLOYERS they are gonna have to follow the LAW and hire only legals cuz we are gonna start enforcing the law? THE PROBLEM WILL SELF-CORRECT...
apparently the rumor of amnesty coming again has increased illegal border crossings by an embarasssing amount...
si, es claro
repitan despues me:
Yo Quiero, Boooshh!
-------------------- Nashoba Holba Chepulechi Adventures in microcapitalism...
IP: Logged |
posted
Might correct one problem but it would create a slew of new ones. Lawns would go uncut, cabbage would go unharvested, apples would rot on the branch, the list goes on. There'd be anarchy.
i think a legal worker program should be implemented
in other words? grant limited stays to people from outside the country .....
take a far-sighted look at th eproblem... once the current crop of illegals get Legal status? they won't be doing those jobs anymore, they'll be going to nursing school etc....
and a new round of illegals will be "needed"...
human nature is what it is....
-------------------- Don't envy the happiness of those who live in a fool's paradise.
IP: Logged |
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Eek!]](eek.gif)
![[Mad]](mad.gif)
