The VIX is at an all time high. I think we open much lower, but actually bottom today. I'm back in, fully invested.
Posted by invester on :
WHEN I'M RIGHT, I'M REALLY RIGHT!!!!!!!!!!! Down 700 at the open, now positive.
Posted by invester on :
Lehman CDS at 9.75%. Not to good. This is a text book bottom though. I love the signs here.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Now down 240 again. When everyone is looking for it then I say watch out!
Posted by invester on :
Warren Buffet just became the richest American. He added $8 Billion to his already $50 Billion in 33 days to overtake Bill Gates who held the title for 15 years. Nice.
Posted by glassman on :
i am looking for a double bottom invester.
and that may (should) be tested a third time.
i am also looking for oil to drop more.
oil is 80-81 right now. that IMO is the high end of the trading range it needs to be in for the markets to stabilise.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Down 350 now. If this stays low everybody better watch after 3pm. Could be another selloff! Why hold stocks thru the weekend when no rally was seen? Not me talking just what I think people will start thinking as we near the close. Of course the opposite would be true if we can start climbing!! But the closer we get to the close the more concern I would have.
Posted by BooDog on :
I picked support at 7,500. Either way i would like to see at least a decent double bottom as Glass suggested.
Posted by invester on :
I have put protection on some. Earnings are now at 10% on S&P. We have the bailout, global interest rate cut, and plummeting commodities. Couple all of that with the over 40% drop in the Industrial average, and the sharp sell off yesterday, as well as the open. I like double and triple bottoms as well as the rest, but the down side risk is anemic compared to the massive upturn we are going to have shortly.
Posted by invester on :
I have put protection on everything. Earnings are now at 10% on S&P. We have the bailout, global interest rate cut, and plummeting commodities. Couple all of that with the over 40% drop in the Industrial average, and the sharp sell off yesterday, as well as the open. I like double and triple bottoms as well as the rest, but the down side risk is anemic compared to the massive upturn we are going to have shortly.
Posted by invester on :
We are always the contrarians, and never forward looking until it’s too late. I've been bearish for more than a year, and know a good thing when I see it.
Posted by BooDog on :
No risk no reward. So far so good. And there is certainly plenty of room for going up. I won't mind missing bottom to wait till next week for putting back in some of my TSP (govt 401k). Good luck invester!
Posted by invester on :
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Rally into the weekend?
Posted by Gary59 on :
Also a long weekend no market on monday.... Posted by invester on :
Up triple digits.
Posted by PCola77 on :
Markets are not closed on Monday
quote:Originally posted by Gary59: Also a long weekend no market on monday....
Posted by Gary59 on :
Sorry , I thought the market was closed but its just the banks and options market closes at 2..
Posted by Ace of Spades on :
I wouldn't be so sure this is the Real Bottom! This was the worst one week decline in the history of the DOW for a reason....things are worse than most know...and the media has be reporting doom & Gloom for weeks now...so what does that say??? The market is damned!!!
If anyone does decide to go bottom fishing, average in over several days....as you should always do any way...but especialy with this market!
Posted by invester on :
Called it.
Posted by invester on :
Posted by Peaser on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: This is a text book bottom though. I love the signs here.
LOL
Dead Cat Bounce IMO. Financial Markets around the world are not out of the sh-tter. I believe that there is more downside coming.
Average folks can not get credit.
Day-swing trade only here, IMO.
A 5000 DJI would not surprise me in another month.
Posted by Peaser on :
Those "invester"s that lost a bunch in the past few months that get back in the market now are only going to lose more, IMO.
If I am wrong. Well, I'll bet my posting life at Allstocks on it.
Good luck...
It might be about time to grab my gun, and cling to religion in the up and coming year.
Posted by invester on :
That’s what makes a market. 5000 DJIA, LoL.
Posted by BooDog on :
Bush speaking again... Look out below
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: Bush speaking again... Look out below
I wish there was a way to sell him short. LoL.
Posted by BooDog on :
McCain and Palin here in Va Beach - DOW up! lol
"My friends"
Posted by invester on :
Called it, up 600 now
Posted by invester on :
700 now. Here are a few of my performers today.
CHK up 21% RRI up 81% PAL is up 35% MS up 86% NYX up 23% NCC up 12%
Posted by invester on :
Dead cat bounce? LoL. I called it at 7900 at the open Friday. We are now at 9175.
Posted by Gary59 on :
Invester, i picked up some NCC as well to hold a few days , is your T&S screen or L2s showing almost all mirror trades on this the last 30 minutes or so?I am not sure if its scottrade or MMs are playing games this afternoon before closing..
Posted by invester on :
810 and going!!!!!
Posted by invester on :
It looks like mirrors up until 10 min. ago. The NCC buyout should be out any day this week.
Posted by invester on :
I love being right
Posted by invester on :
Sold half of MS. Misubishi's Coversion is at $21
Posted by Peaser on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: Dead cat bounce? LoL. I called it at 7900 at the open Friday. We are now at 9175.
Sorry, I thought the market ended in the red on Friday, thus the dead cat bounce didn't begin on Friday.
Just puzzled on your way of thinkin' is all...
"Market Bottom Hits Today" and "Dead Cat Bounce" are two opposite statements.
Thus, I am puzzled to your way of thinking again.
Posted by invester on :
Called it, Up 950 That’s some dead cat. 7900 to 9400
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser:
quote:Originally posted by invester: Dead cat bounce? LoL. I called it at 7900 at the open Friday. We are now at 9175.
Sorry, I thought the market ended in the red on Friday, thus the dead cat bounce didn't begin on Friday.
Just puzzled on your way of thinkin' is all...
"Market Bottom Hits Today" and "Dead Cat Bounce" are two opposite statements.
Thus, I am puzzled to your way of thinking again.
My way of thinking? You have a huge sell off on Thursday, then a 700 point down open on Friday only to recover all of that and gain 300. It then only ended down 128. The VIX was at an all time high. This was a classic bottom a mile a way.
Posted by Peaser on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: I love being right
About market bottom or a dead cat bounce?
Which is it?
Posted by glassman on :
short covering
Posted by Peaser on :
We've got a ways to go before we see a bottom to this market IMO.
Still waiting for a confirmation of a bottom. Haven't seen one yet.
As g mentioned before, a double or triple bottom needs to be seen before anoyne can claim "being right."
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: We've got a ways to go before we see a bottom to this market IMO.
Still waiting for a confirmation of a bottom. Haven't seen one yet.
As g mentioned before, a double or triple bottom needs to be seen before anoyne can claim "being right."
The definition of a dead cat bounce is a precipitous decline followed by a bounce in the market. I'm saying that this was not just a dead cat bounce. I called the bottom at 7900. Are you saying it's going to break 7900?
Posted by Peaser on :
yup.
"dead-cat" bounce - is a "fake" bounce.
Posted by invester on :
There are always the contrarians. I'll say again, that’s what makes a market.
Posted by invester on :
I will say this; I've never seen a continuation the next day after the biggest point day ever in the market. Should see a little selling tomorrow but a continuation the following days.
Posted by invester on :
Credit markets were closed today IE: the real problem. If you look at the futures, it looks as if credit is going to ease. I look for LIBOR to come down over the next week. If so, we fly!!!!!
Posted by jon clogger on :
Nice call, but I'd be careful and watch the currency markets tonight folks. They moved with equities today, but not with the same conviction or momentum.
I don't think the rest of the world is buying the turnaround just yet...at least not from an increased "risk appetite" perspective.
Posted by invester on :
Cramer just did a whole piece on a stock I'm in, and was talking about earlier today in this thread. CHK Chesapeake Energy. Nice!!!
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: We've got a ways to go before we see a bottom to this market IMO.
Still waiting for a confirmation of a bottom. Haven't seen one yet.
As g mentioned before, a double or triple bottom needs to be seen before anoyne can claim "being right."
He got it right in my book. Doesn't mean it won't dip again - and I think along the same lines as you that it will. wtg invester
Posted by glassman on :
i need to hear more about how this bailout is being structured.
it APPEARS to me that the good traders are buying in with the understanding that the US Govt is going to buy TOO...
after they buy? the market will turn back down...
this has to be one of the boldest moves ever by any economist. i'm very skeptical that it will be a good long term fix.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: We've got a ways to go before we see a bottom to this market IMO.
Still waiting for a confirmation of a bottom. Haven't seen one yet.
As g mentioned before, a double or triple bottom needs to be seen before anoyne can claim "being right."
He got it right in my book. Doesn't mean it won't dip again - and I think along the same lines as you that it will. wtg invester
Posted by invester on :
2 YEAR SWAP AT 1.24!!! Lowest level in 4 weeks. Still coming down. LIBOR O/N at 2.15. Credit markets are finally easing.
Posted by glassman on :
this stock buy-back plan is pure socialism. the government is now in full control of anybody they buy into. this is a deal with the devil himself IMO.
i liked the plan to buy bad debt much better. it would have taken longer for the market to recover, but it would have been a healthy recovery..
Posted by invester on :
NCC up 50% and going
Posted by invester on :
I'm amazed that we haven't seen at least a small dip after the biggest point day ever.
Posted by glassman on :
OK, we are about "halfway" backway to the last low from the retrace to 9800....
i am tempted to buy back in with half my long-term investments at 8000.
here's where it gets nervewracking. wait for the bottom and buy on the way up and maybe miss it? or buy on the way down and watch the bottom be 7000 or even 6500?
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: OK, we are about "halfway" backway to the last low from the retrace to 9800....
i am tempted to buy back in with half my long-term investments at 8000.
here's where it gets nervewracking. wait for the bottom and buy on the way up and maybe miss it? or buy on the way down and watch the bottom be 7000 or even 6500?
I don't think so. We may retest the 7900 level, but credit seems to be easing slowly but finally happening. Government backstops etc.... I would wait until tomorrow as we could have one more day. Maybe 25%-30% here, then the rest tomorrow through Friday.
Posted by BooDog on :
tough choice. I'm in the same boat with my TSP. I'm waiting though. We very easily could see Investers low again. And if we don't, I don't mind missing bottom.
Posted by Ace of Spades on :
Have you been listening to Bloomberg or CNBC????
The credit problem is shifting from morgages...to credit cards now....they say that the credit cards are now just starting to see record write-offs/charge-offs on credit cards now....the problem will just get worse..
Posted by BooDog on :
.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by Ace of Spades: Have you been listening to Bloomberg or CNBC????
The credit problem is shifting from morgages...to credit cards now....they say that the credit cards are now just starting to see record write-offs/charge-offs on credit cards now....the problem will just get worse..
Although credit cards are a problem, the main problem at hand is the mortgage market and getting the banks to loan again. If people default on there credit cards that is a much smaller problem Than the CDO, and CDS problem. I'm not saying we are out of the woods by any stretch of the imagination; I'm merely speaking from the standpoint of the banks, and lending. Credit cards are a MUCH smaller issue. I know that with impending debt and burden on households, it will lead to less spending and no consumer driven release from the resection. I feel we may touch the lows but never break.
Posted by invester on :
It's also the Medias JOB to play situations up for ratings. You have to know that. DOOM AND GLOOM!!!!!! I'm not saying it’s not a tough market, but we as a society and out government have taken the necessary steps to relive the situation i.e.: bailout, interest rate cut, government backstops, socialism for the banking industry, etc........
Posted by Ace of Spades on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by Ace of Spades: Have you been listening to Bloomberg or CNBC????
The credit problem is shifting from morgages...to credit cards now....they say that the credit cards are now just starting to see record write-offs/charge-offs on credit cards now....the problem will just get worse..
Although credit cards are a problem, the main problem at hand is the mortgage market and getting the banks to loan again. If people default on there credit cards that is a much smaller problem Than the CDO, and CDS problem. I'm not saying we are out of the woods by any stretch of the imagination; I'm merely speaking from the standpoint of the banks, and lending. Credit cards are a MUCH smaller issue. I know that with impending debt and burden on households, it will lead to less spending and no consumer driven release from the resection. I feel we may touch the lows but never break.
Bro...you could not be more wrong!!!
The problem isn't credit from credit cards or credit from mortagages....it's just credit period.
And all the major banks are just now starting to see huge amounts of charge offs/writeoffs from credit cards now
And some of the banks like captiol one....who were already exposed to subprime mess...are now just starting to get in more trouble with credit cards....
Thus creating the perfect storm for disaster...You will here alot more about this in the comming days/weeks Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by Ace of Spades:
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by Ace of Spades: Have you been listening to Bloomberg or CNBC????
The credit problem is shifting from morgages...to credit cards now....they say that the credit cards are now just starting to see record write-offs/charge-offs on credit cards now....the problem will just get worse..
Although credit cards are a problem, the main problem at hand is the mortgage market and getting the banks to loan again. If people default on there credit cards that is a much smaller problem Than the CDO, and CDS problem. I'm not saying we are out of the woods by any stretch of the imagination; I'm merely speaking from the standpoint of the banks, and lending. Credit cards are a MUCH smaller issue. I know that with impending debt and burden on households, it will lead to less spending and no consumer driven release from the resection. I feel we may touch the lows but never break.
Bro...you could not be more wrong!!!
The problem isn't credit from credit cards or credit from mortagages....it's just credit period.
And all the major banks are just now starting to see huge amounts of charge offs/writeoffs from credit cards now
And some of the banks like captiol one....who were already exposed to subprime mess...are now just starting to get in more trouble with credit cards....
Thus creating the perfect storm for disaster...You will here alot more about this in the comming days/weeks
The coming days? I've heard about the credit card problems for weeks now. I'm not as worried about this issue as you are
Posted by invester on :
I just re-read your statement when you said “ I couldn't be more wrong”. I was merely combining two thoughts when I said credit and the lending aspect of mortgages. I know that it’s all credit environments. People can’t get loans for cars, and even Caterpillar was having trouble getting a short term loan for machinery. If CAT is having a problem obviously everyone is. I follow LIBOR and SWAPS every day. I’m very familiar..
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: tough choice. I'm in the same boat with my TSP. I'm waiting though. We very easily could see Investers low again. And if we don't, I don't mind missing bottom.
i think we'll make new lows. i'm going to wait to pull the trigger...
BTW? on the TSP? remember it takes 2-3 days after you place your "orders" i know that sounds like a short amount of time, but with all the programmed trading going on? it's likely to be a 1000 point difference...
Posted by Peaser on :
Might need to change the title of this thread in the next day or two...
Just so it's not a blatant lie 'n all.
Posted by jon clogger on :
We won't hit bottom until this thread and discussion are forgotten, and replaced with other concerns.
Posted by Peaser on :
My guess is 5000 on the Dow. Wait and see.
Posted by thadchr on :
So am I interpreting all this wisely... wait a couple days to get in? There might be bleaker times yet to come?
It's like glassman said, there has to be an absolute low and there has to be an hour/day/week where the conservative investor is one step behind the inevitable surge in the market.
Personally, I want to be the guy that jumps in right before that surge. Let's pool some knowledge Posted by Peaser on :
Who knows, we may see the lows for months, or even years. That is, once we get there...
Just remember all those that lost money in the market. That cash is now gone... So who will be investing. There needs to be a lot of new cash coming into the market to get us back anywhere's close to where we were a year ago on the DOW. We might get back there in say 10 years+.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: Might need to change the title of this thread in the next day or two...
Just so it's not a blatant lie 'n all.
Has it fallen to 7900 again?. Blatant lie? We all new there would be a dip after the massive run. Talk to me when it gets 7900 again.
Posted by glassman on :
7900? i have one scenario on my chart that takes us to 6000, look at the low on 9-18 and the low on 10-10...
draw a line under them
it's just too frothy to pick the trayend line for me right now....
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: My guess is 5000 on the Dow. Wait and see.
Yikes. Having trouble with stockcharts. Trying to get a chart from 1996 to present. I'm leaning towards my pick of 7,500. Break 7k? wow. I like seeing consolidation, kinda hard to see that with 1k swings.
I did have this one right. Just can't get stockcharts to cooperate with me.
Posted by Peaser on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: Has it fallen to 7900 again?. Blatant lie? We all new there would be a dip after the massive run. Talk to me when it gets 7900 again.
This is like a reverse Q & A session
I provided the answers, prior to your asking of the questions. lol
Posted by BooDog on :
This is Ciao's chart from Top Gun.
my chart from stockcharts
I drew a few what I figure to be pretty solid support lines. I missed one at the 6500 mark. I couldn't get the chart to extend to March/Sept '09 to try and figure out a potential trend reversal. IMO there is still some decent support in the 7Ks. I have about 0 trust in the bailout plan. Consider this a work in progress.
I couldn't slobber on it but here's a pic anyway... Posted by glassman on :
i don't like this chart, but i can't find anyting wrong with it
i do think the time frames projecting *2012,16,16 are to far out...
computerised trading is making everything happen faster. thats going to "scrunch" everything together...
there's just too much cash out there that people will put to work for the bottom to take years to show up...
i do think we'll find bottom this calendar year.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: i don't like this chart, but i can't find anyting wrong with it
Does have a settling effect doesn't it? Like why are we worried about the small ****? Market will correct itself.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by glassman: i don't like this chart, but i can't find anyting wrong with it
Does have a settling effect doesn't it? Like why are we worried about the small ****? Market will correct itself.
Oops, I forgot - a lot of you guys are OLD and can't wait so long for this to recover. I do wish all the best. I know plenty around me that woke up one day and just said "crap". Best of luck to all of us but especially those that were caught off guard and were relying on a better market now or in the very near future.
Posted by Peaser on :
We've never seen anything like this. I am hoping for a recovery as well.
A break in the trend line would suck...
Posted by jon clogger on :
Today may have some positive momentum based on a rumor of another round of coordinated rate cuts overseas, but the rally will fade, and come Friday or Monday, look out below.
Posted by BooDog on :
Morning BooDog,, are you still just in cash or are you holding anything.. Interesting read you posted in the last post.. Makes me want to be back to an ALL CASH POSITION now. But If it swings up some today I am going to take some pofits out today (hopefully) then keep watching for more bottom buy opps...
Posted by BooDog on :
Thanks Gary, I like to share what I can.
Still all cash here cept for a few flip ops. I'm chillin but I do have my TSP making deposits again that I can afford to go either way. Holding back on the main $$ for now though.
Posted by BooDog on :
My charts above are just me putting a piece of toilet papper on the wall and throwing darts. Like to see a few others offer their guesses.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: My charts above are just me putting a piece of toilet papper on the wall and throwing darts. Like to see a few others offer their guesses.
quote:Originally posted by glassman: 7900? i have one scenario on my chart that takes us to 6000, look at the low on 9-18 and the low on 10-10...
draw a line under them
it's just too frothy to pick the trayend line for me right now....
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: My guess is 5000 on the Dow. Wait and see.
I like support between 7,200 (for now) and resistance of 9,800. The media has been trying to control when to buy and sell imo, but they are losing the control. I LIKE MY CHARTS BUT!!! We can't ignore those that have been here before.
Posted by Gary59 on :
I dont even try to make guesses on the future of the market, the last month of highs and lows has me scratching my head wondering when will it slow down a little , and try to play a few momentum plays a week and thats still a big gamble..Everything on my watch list and holdings down yesterday except NCC but was not able to get back in the other day. I was flipping NCC back at $1.50 and did not think that it would be this high until next month after the FART plan was more in effect but has been on the rise even in a bad market..Just wonder what each day brings now...
Posted by a surfer on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: My charts above are just me putting a piece of toilet papper on the wall and throwing darts. Like to see a few others offer their guesses.
quote:Originally posted by glassman: 7900? i have one scenario on my chart that takes us to 6000, look at the low on 9-18 and the low on 10-10...
draw a line under them
it's just too frothy to pick the trayend line for me right now....
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: My guess is 5000 on the Dow. Wait and see.
I like support between 7,200 (for now) and resistance of 9,800. The media has been trying to control when to buy and sell imo, but they are losing the control. I LIKE MY CHARTS BUT!!! We can't ignore those that have been here before.
10-23 will be the day we drop to 7000 or under.
Posted by PCola77 on :
VIX just hit another all-time high. Broke 80 a few minutes ago.
Posted by jon clogger on :
The charts are ugly, fresh lows tomorrow or Monday.
Posted by Rockster on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: VIX just hit another all-time high. Broke 80 a few minutes ago.
ya and I have a call option at 85 from a week ago and now etrade says they don't trade it anymore. IT"S IN MY ACCOUNT!!
went from .60 to 3.40, trying to sell and they aren't. NEver seen something like that. I put an order in and it says invalid symbol. called in, no go. now I'm sending messages. WHAT!!!
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by Rockster:
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: VIX just hit another all-time high. Broke 80 a few minutes ago.
ya and I have a call option at 85 from a week ago and now etrade says they don't trade it anymore. IT"S IN MY ACCOUNT!!
went from .60 to 3.40, trying to sell and they aren't. NEver seen something like that. I put an order in and it says invalid symbol. called in, no go. now I'm sending messages. WHAT!!!
please keep us informed about this...
if they are "breaking trades" we are in for a real sh!tstorm...
i've been stuck in an "DTC global lock" on a pennystock for three years that the DTC won't honor, and i suspect we have some problems in the market that are even worse than the credit market....
look up "global lock" stock... it's doesn't exist, but we've had one for three years.. it's something they made up on the spot to cover up a serious flaw in the settlement system...
Posted by invester on :
How are you trading the VIX, its just an indicator. Are you saying you have options on the indicator itself? I haven't seen this, nor do any of my accounts offer such a trade. Please inform.
Posted by PCola77 on :
yeah, you can trade options on the VIX
Posted by PCola77 on :
BCIT, I presume? I wasn't around yet for that one (or I was around but missed it) but I've heard tons about it. I'm in a similar boat with BHUB, but "only" ~18 months on that one...
quote:Originally posted by glassman:
quote:Originally posted by Rockster:
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: VIX just hit another all-time high. Broke 80 a few minutes ago.
ya and I have a call option at 85 from a week ago and now etrade says they don't trade it anymore. IT"S IN MY ACCOUNT!!
went from .60 to 3.40, trying to sell and they aren't. NEver seen something like that. I put an order in and it says invalid symbol. called in, no go. now I'm sending messages. WHAT!!!
please keep us informed about this...
if they are "breaking trades" we are in for a real sh!tstorm...
i've been stuck in an "DTC global lock" on a pennystock for three years that the DTC won't honor, and i suspect we have some problems in the market that are even worse than the credit market....
look up "global lock" stock... it's doesn't exist, but we've had one for three years.. it's something they made up on the spot to cover up a serious flaw in the settlement system...
Posted by glassman on :
that's the one.. some idiot broker allowed a couple hundred million counterfeit certs into the market, the DTC didn't do their DD on the fake TA and now they don't seem to fell obligated to buy the shares back Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: yeah, you can trade options on the VIX
What is the symbol? I click "VIX" then options, and it states "not available" ??????
Posted by glassman on :
VIX Options Index Surges to Record as Stocks Rout Intensifies
By Jeff Kearns
Oct. 16 (Bloomberg) -- The benchmark index for U.S. stock options reached 80 for the first time in its 18-year history, driven higher by equities extending the biggest slide since 1987 on concern the economy will continue deteriorating.
The VIX, as the Chicago Board Options Exchange Volatility Index is known, increased 17 percent to 81.13 at 11:14 a.m. in New York after earlier rising to 81.17. The index measures the cost of using options as insurance against declines in the Standard & Poor's 500 Index, which lost 4.5 percent. The S&P 500 tumbled 9 percent yesterday. Today's VIX record eclipsed the peak of 76.94 on Oct. 10, when U.S. stocks completed their worst week since the 1930s.
``It's absolutely uncharted territory,'' Matt Shapiro, a VIX options trader at Stutland Equities LLC, said in an interview from the CBOE floor. ``It's very frightening and there's a huge explosion to buy any options on the VIX, especially 70 and 90.''
The VXO Volatility Index, a predecessor to the VIX that reflects the price of options on the S&P 100, climbed 23 percent to 84.30. It jumped to 103.41 on Oct. 10. The ``old VIX'' set an intraday record of 172.79 a day after the October 1987 stock- market crash.
To contact the reporter on this story: Jeff Kearns in New York at jkearns3*bloomberg.net. Last Updated: October 16, 2008 11:16 EDT
no news abouthem being canceled.. Posted by glassman on :
etrade says they don't trade it anymore.
this is the EXACT same thing they pulled on BCIT.
too many contracts on the wrong side?
the brokers desked it and didn't find a counterparty to teh contract? so now they won't pay it?
Posted by PCola77 on :
Works for me on ThinkOrSwim. Sorry
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: yeah, you can trade options on the VIX
What is the symbol? I click "VIX" then options, and it states "not available" ??????
Posted by Gary59 on :
WATCH OUT BELOW:::::PRES GIVING ANOTHER TALK TODAY::::
AP Bush to give pep talk to anxious country Friday Friday October 17, 6:46 am ET By Jeannine Aversa, AP Economics Writer Bush to give pep talk Friday to country racked by economic, financial problems
WASHINGTON (AP) -- Wild gyrations on Wall Street, a loss of confidence in the U.S. banking system and worries the economy will be weak for some time are raising Americans' anxiety level. Against this backdrop, President Bush on Friday was to give the nation a more detailed explanation of what the government is doing to battle the worst financial crisis in more than a half-century.
Posted by BooDog on :
Just plan opposite on whatever your thinking. LOL (just kidding) Futures are only a little red this morning so we may get a small gap down with some decent action. I was surprised to only see the nikkei only recover less than 3%. I'm thinking more sideways so we could get another 1k swing. NIKKEI8693.82235.37+2.78%
Posted by BooDog on :
Hey PCOLA, what do you think of sinkorswim? You like it?
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: Just plan opposite on whatever your thinking. LOL (just kidding) Futures are only a little red this morning so we may get a small gap down with some decent action. I was surprised to only see the nikkei only recover less than 3%. I'm thinking more sideways so we could get another 1k swing. NIKKEI8693.82235.37+2.78%
So much for just a little red.
Posted by Gary59 on :
CIT is running pretty good this morning afer a baad day yesterday,, I have a buy in thinking it would dip on open but up .46 already %15....
Posted by PCola77 on :
Love it. far and away my favrotie of the 9 or so that I have/had
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: Hey PCOLA, what do you think of sinkorswim? You like it?
Posted by invester on :
Warren Buffet just came out today and said America's on sale. He's buying stock for his personal account. He called the bottom in the 60's, the 70's, and said that we were too high in 1999. He has been right 100% of the time. Dow 5000 here we come. LoL
Posted by invester on :
Be fearful when everyone is greedy; be greedy when everyone is fearful
Posted by osubucks30 on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: Warren Buffet just came out today and said America's on sale. He's buying stock for his personal account. He called the bottom in the 60's, the 70's, and said that we were too high in 1999. He has been right 100% of the time. Dow 5000 here we come. LoL
He has to be wrong one time! Plus he says he was buying when the market was down 300 yesterday and stopped when the market turned positive. So if you consider that then he thinks the value is below 9000! I would sell into any rally this news produces. Good stocks are out there but can't buy the market at the current prices IMO.
Posted by jon clogger on :
All sunshine and rainbows from here on?
You guys are so predictable. When the market hits new lows you'll hide under a rock and pretend you never said anything.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
quote:Originally posted by jon clogger: All sunshine and rainbows from here on?
You guys are so predictable. When the market hits new lows you'll hide under a rock and pretend you never said anything.
You didn't hear?? The whole crisis is over. In less then a month all the problems have been solved! Its all up from here!! Posted by osubucks30 on :
Posted by jon clogger on :
I think you're right osubucks, mortgage smortgage, credit schmedit, derivatives shmerivatives....
I wonder what portfolio percentage Mr. Buffet is actually risking to BUY back into America? Less than 3%?
If it was half a percent the media will hype it.
Posted by Rockster on :
VQXJQ was the symbol for the vxi option I was in. its pulling up under etrade.
Posted by Peaser on :
Buffet made a boo boo IMO. We'll find out soon enough.
Nobody on earth today is perfect.
Posted by invester on :
As I have been originally saying, and called that the bottom is in. I called the very day it hit 7900. Your saying you’re not going to get back in until next summer? You will be getting in only to loose money on the down side. As I said before, when everyone is greedy be fearful, when everyone is fearful be greedy. Allot of these armature traders on this site are constantly contrarians, and pessimistic. I'll ask all of you, have you made any money this year? Are you down for the year? I'm up several hundred percent with shorting Financials, then getting long at the right time. Up or down for the year??????
Posted by BooDog on :
You did great catching this bottom V. But to think the worse is over? ehhhhhh not so sure. Just my opinion but 250b dollars to bail out about a trillion dollars? Still a lot of rough waves ahead. I took the same opportunity you did though by re-investing my retirement payday deposits 100% but still holding back the main capital. Mine is with Barclays and I think there are still some major ripples to go. I did hear a report that October has been the "bounce" month for most of our deep economic dips so that was encouraging. And I do agree with warren's saying about "when everyone is greedy be fearful, when everyone is fearful be greedy." Will it hold? Only time will tell. What am I waiting for? I would like to see more disclosure on our banks with a full report on their credit card debt and toxic waste. Another round of write-down’s? Maybe. Govt giving top banks equal $$ to attempt to "hide" the bad apple is pretty foolish don't you think? Gonna be a tight Christmas imo. You've got the business education not me but in a soft market I'm looking for the fundamentals to firm up a bit, but my money is going in at the same time - and yep - up so far.. Otherwise it's swing trading and trying to win more than I lose.
Posted by invester on :
Doom and Gloom AAPL knocked the cover off the ball. Analyst’s estimates around 8b, actual 11b. We may see that consumer driven recovery after all. This is very surprising news. Dow 5000 here we come. LoL
Posted by invester on :
One other opinion, YHOO will be bought for $21 by Microsoft. The offer will be within 2-3 weeks. Dec. at the money Calls will PAY off.
Posted by invester on :
Peaser:
You’re literally the village idiot. Don't you feel that way? You’re clearly always wrong. Don’t you think its enough out of you?
Posted by osubucks30 on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: As I have been originally saying, and called that the bottom is in. I called the very day it hit 7900. Your saying you’re not going to get back in until next summer? You will be getting in only to loose money on the down side. As I said before, when everyone is greedy be fearful, when everyone is fearful be greedy. Allot of these armature traders on this site are constantly contrarians, and pessimistic. I'll ask all of you, have you made any money this year? Are you down for the year? I'm up several hundred percent with shorting Financials, then getting long at the right time. Up or down for the year??????
You along with everyone at CNBC called the bottom. I was watching that day and after the selloff at the open just about every single person was saying its the bottom. When the masses think one way go the other! Everything right now in the market is non sense. Day to day moves are not important. Worst is yet to come IMO. Obviously there are stocks out there to buy but the market as a whole looks no good.
Posted by Peaser on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: One other opinion, YHOO will be bought for $21 by Microsoft. The offer will be within 2-3 weeks. Dec. at the money Calls will PAY off.
That's funny, I remember MSFT mentioning that they would not make another offer for yahoo.
Are you calling Gates a liar now too?
Did you used to live in a glass house?
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: Doom and Gloom AAPL knocked the cover off the ball. Analyst’s estimates around 8b, actual 11b. We may see that consumer driven recovery after all. This is very surprising news. Dow 5000 here we come. LoL
It's one thing to call bottom a few months in advance, it's another to call it the day that it happens. Now stop putting fear in the neighbors! Japan Nikkei 225 -631.56 -6.79% 8,674.69 10/22 4:30pm
Economic gloom hits global stocks Japan's Nikkei index dives nearly 7%. European shares drop as euro and British pound fall sharply against the dollar.
feed://rss.cnn.com/rss/money_markets.rss Paste this link into your favorite RSS desktop reader
Last Updated: October 22, 2008: 4:41 AM ET
AMERICA'S MONEY CRISIS Economic gloom hits global stocks Paulson: Global cooperation is crucial to end crisis Analysts cautious on AmEx GM-Chrysler: Stuck in neutral Monthly job losses cut across 41 states Is capitalism deteriorating?
More VideosLONDON (CNNMoney.com) -- Stocks around the world fell Wednesday, tracking Wall Street's selloff overnight, amid deepening worries about the economy and corporate earnings.
European shares opened lower, with major markets in London, Paris and Frankfurt all down about 2% in the early going.
Asian markets dived, with Japan's Nikkei closing down 6.8%. The Hang Seng index in Hong Kong was off nearly 6% and South Korea's KOSPI finished the day down 5.1%.
U.S. futures, which give an indication of how Wall Street will perform when trading begins, were mixed.
Stocks on Wall Street tumbled Tuesday as investors expressed disappointment with a slew of earnings reports.
The Dow Jones industrial average lost 2.5%. The Standard & Poor's 500 index shed 3.1% and the Nasdaq composite sank 4.1%.
With 21% of S&P 500 companies already having reported results, third-quarter profits are currently on track to have fallen almost 10% from a year ago, according to the latest estimates from Thomson Reuters.
In Tokyo, major exporters such as Sony and Toyota Motor slumped amid concerns about the weakening global economy.
Meanwhile, economic fears deepened in the U.K. after Bank of England Governor Mervyn King said Tuesday it is likely that Britain is entering a recession.
The euro and the pound fell sharply against the dollar. The euro tumbled as low as $1.2736 in morning trading, down from $1.3003 late Tuesday.
The British pound touched a five-year low against the dollar. It bought $1.6326 Wednesday, versus $1.6560 the day before.
CNN Wires and The Associated Press contributed to this report.
First Published: October 22, 2008: 4:04 AM ET
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser:
quote:Originally posted by invester: One other opinion, YHOO will be bought for $21 by Microsoft. The offer will be within 2-3 weeks. Dec. at the money Calls will PAY off.
That's funny, I remember MSFT mentioning that they would not make another offer for yahoo.
Are you calling Gates a liar now too?
Did you used to live in a glass house?
Guy, the CEO of Microsoft "Steve Ballmer" came out last week and said a deal with YHOO would still be viable. You need to be current to be a good trader. You REALLY bring nothing to the table on this site.
Posted by jon clogger on :
We're hovering 800 points above the "BIG BOTTOM" of 7900. Normally I would say that's a safe margin, but what used to take weeks now takes hours.
Take a look at the relationship between S & P and the EUR/USD. They were married up until 2 days ago. Big time divergence building, and I don't think the Euro is gonna magically snap back up, which means something else needs to come down...(overly dramatic music here)
Posted by invester on :
...(overly dramatic music here)
LoL
Posted by BooDog on :
Classy invester.
Posted by a surfer on :
quote:Originally posted by a surfer:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: My charts above are just me putting a piece of toilet papper on the wall and throwing darts. Like to see a few others offer their guesses.
quote:Originally posted by glassman: 7900? i have one scenario on my chart that takes us to 6000, look at the low on 9-18 and the low on 10-10...
draw a line under them
it's just too frothy to pick the trayend line for me right now....
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: My guess is 5000 on the Dow. Wait and see.
I like support between 7,200 (for now) and resistance of 9,800. The media has been trying to control when to buy and sell imo, but they are losing the control. I LIKE MY CHARTS BUT!!! We can't ignore those that have been here before.
10-23 will be the day we drop to 7000 or under.
D-Day is here.
Posted by jon clogger on :
Wow, we were a cozy 800 points off the bottom a couple of hours ago, now less than 500.
Into the Abyss we go... stale bread anyone? I think it was a luxury during the depression.
Posted by Peaser on :
You REALLY bring nothing to the table on this site.
Just as the market bottom is in...
Nice insight ya got there kidd-o.
Posted by BooDog on :
You still holding your line invester?
Posted by invester on :
Yep. I have put protection that I'm making money with. I cover every 100 shares that I own with a put. Every time we fall I sell the puts for profit still holding the shares. I realize it seems crazy to call a bottom, but I am. We aren't out of the woods, but the stocks I'm in are WAY up. I don't play indexes. If you’re not DCA at these levels your crazy. Even with downward revised earnings, stocks are historically cheap. I’m not saying we won’t test the lows, but I don’t feel we will break them. That said, if something egregious happens “war with Iran, Oil embargo, etc…” happens I will change my view. The game always changes.
Posted by BooDog on :
Makes sense. Too bad my retirement account doesn't allow me the fluid ability to transfer funds around more than just twice a month. Their control has keept me from jumping in and jumping out. When I get a handle on things more i'll be making more elswhere though.
Posted by BooDog on :
From what things look like right now? Look out below, History to repeat? Ascending triangle on the VIX putting us right on the edge.
Here is America's chance to shine!
Posted by a surfer on :
Dow fut. 550 down. The most it can begin the day....
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by a surfer: Dow fut. 550 down. The most it can begin the day....
So does the 1000 pt to suspend trading go from the mark of the open? Or from yesterdays close?
Posted by osubucks30 on :
All these experts looking at charts are crazy!! You can't compare this to anything else in history. People saying they know where the market is going is full of it. They just need to fill up air time on TV! lol
Posted by BooDog on :
would be nice to see more views from those here. Things stay on a decent keel invester could end up being right. How many can live with that!!!??
j/k invester LOL
Posted by osubucks30 on :
New closing low!
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: would be nice to see more views from those here. Things stay on a decent keel invester could end up being right. How many can live with that!!!??
j/k invester LOL
Posted by jon clogger on :
When oil broke support at $75.00 bbl that left the next support around $53-55.00 bbl. Right now we are in the mid $60's, so when oil drops another $10.00 bbl and maintains support, I'll feel a little better about calling a bottom.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by jon clogger: When oil broke support at $75.00 bbl that left the next support around $53-55.00 bbl. Right now we are in the mid $60's, so when oil drops another $10.00 bbl and maintains support, I'll feel a little better about calling a bottom.
That's why they're cutting production.
some of the oils on my list have taken 3 - 18% + losses since just the 14th, they can't handle it and will cut the output as much as they can. While this could be one measuring stick it still has a lot of influence that will "distract" an actual market bottom in my opinion. I was looking for gold to present signs of a bottom along the same lines you may have been thinking oil. Once gold peaked poof, there would be a sign we were close, so much for that theory. Still need to look at more charts and do some more research. I think we are in more of an over correction trend (panic mode) where we will continue to see 500 - 1000 point swings. I think it will settle as more companies fess up where they stand, especially with the financials. Getting the toxic waste and the foreclosures under control as well as identifying credit defaults that are out there will help also. Just rambling.
Posted by BooDog on :
Australia ASX 100 -45.00 -1.41% 3,137.60 10/27 4:47pm Australia ASX All Ords -63.30 -1.65% 3,768.30 10/27 4:47pm Australia ASX Mid-cap 50 -56.00 -1.57% 3,507.50 10/27 4:47pm Hong Kong Hang Seng -1,602.54 -12.70% 11,015.84 10/27 5:59pm Hong Kong HSCC Red Chip -225.18 -8.88% 2,311.45 10/27 4:35pm Japan Nikkei 225 -486.18 -6.36% 7,162.90 10/27 4:30pm
Posted by BooDog on :
"The market is doing a terrific job of pricing in Armageddon, but that scenario is off the table because of the bold and creative steps that the Fed and Treasury Department have taken," he said. "That leaves us not with Armageddon but a recession. And recessions end. At some point, investors have to realize that and prepare for an upturn."
Posted by Peaser on :
Just hope this recession we're in don't turn into another depression...
Posted by invester on :
up 700
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: up 700
DJIA 9,065.12 889.35
NASDAQ 1,649.47 143.57
S&P 500 940.50 91.58
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Time to start unloading again!
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: Time to start unloading again!
yep. futures will put the fear back out there. Can't have a fluke run without a pull back. Dow aint nuttin but a glorified pinky right now imo. lol
Posted by invester on :
Thought we would have sold off today. Couple that with a 50 bp cut and we may have a winner here. It also looks as if banks are starting to lend. Posted by Rockster on :
Hope things turn around.. I'm long... very long
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by Rockster: Hope things turn around.. I'm long... very long
Let's see,
yep I'm long too. Posted by Rockster on :
When you think the market will turn... buy some SPY call options. (with money you don't mind going down)
Jermyn
made 259% yesterday when market turned (risky)
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by Rockster: When you think the market will turn... buy some SPY call options. (with money you don't mind going down)
Jermyn
made 259% yesterday when market turned (risky)
Very nice. Just small time here. A swing here and there.
Posted by invester on :
Jeff Immelt killed the rally.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by Rockster: Hope things turn around.. I'm long... very long
Let's see,
yep I'm long too.
Stop bragging. LoL
Posted by invester on :
Posted by Peaser on :
Looking like another big red day on Monday due to another bank going under yesterday. That makes only 17, for now...
Funny thing is, I have only seen coverage on it once on TV since yesterday.
10/31:
"Of the roughly 8,500 FDIC-insured banks, 117 were considered to be in trouble in the second quarter — the highest level in about five years and up from 90 in the first quarter. The agency doesn't disclose the banks' names."
"It's expected that many more banks won't survive the next year of economic tumult."
"In addition, the FDIC may guarantee nearly $2 trillion in U.S. banks' debt and deposit accounts in an effort to break the crippling logjam in bank-to-bank lending.
Well over half of the roughly 8,500 federally-insured banks and savings and loans are expected to tap the FDIC's temporary guarantees. The agency will provide as much as $1.4 trillion in insurance for more than three years for loans between banks, guaranteeing the new debt in the event the issuing bank failed or its holding company filed for bankruptcy."
So what happens if the FDIC runs out of bailout funds in the next three years?
Posted by invester on :
Freedom Bank? Only $32 billion in assets. Shouldn’t even make a dent in Monday's trading.
Posted by jon clogger on :
I'm willing to give invester the call on a fundamental bottom, but I think we have yet to see a psychological bottom.
It's not the news, it's the reaction to the news. People are waiting for the other shoe to drop, and it will, even if they have it make it drop.
Posted by invester on :
Posted by Peaser on :
More folks lose jobs as CC to close 150 stores.
Consumer spending in a downward spiral.
Mark these words - It's gonna be worse 4 years from now, no matter who gets elected Pres.
More banks doomed to fail as some of those that are losing jobs will run up credit card bills, and not be able to pay.
Posted by invester on :
More doom and gloom huh Peaser. Dow 5000, LoL.
Posted by invester on :
quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by Peaser: SVNT - only if they can get a partner, or get bought. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Long term hold????? Long term? Wow. I can’t hold my tongue any more. With our entire market being down, and some of the greatest companies out there trading at a P/E of 4 or lower, you choose SVNT. I suppose that's why I have been right 100% of every call I have made and you have been wrong 100% of the time. Literally, 100% of the time guy. You have an obligation when posting, to at the bear minimum know what you’re doing. I'm not attacking you but you’re awful. I have the posts to back up my record. Under ALLSTOCKS .Hot stocks forum "buyout candidates”. You even bashed CC when I was making my call. "Who wants them you say, what about K-Mart” If you know how to read a balance sheet they have well over 1 billion in real estate. Stock trades at $30 million. I'm now up well over 100% as your still waiting for your call of DOW 5000. LoL. Get educated before you influence others to spend there hard earned money on your ridiculous calls.
Posted by invester on :
PEASER>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Look, I don't mean to me mean, but you say you've been right 100% of the time. Your Kool-Aid man is so ridiculous. I'll ask you, please back that up on this thread. I, as well as others have read your inaccurate rants. I'm not attacking you but real people read these threads, invest money, and you obviously have no comprehension on a good recommendation let alone a good "long term investment". Guy, you once asked me "how old are you". I'll answer you, I'm old enough to have been a stock broker out of College, then an Investment Banker. I now trade Energy and Stock, along with options on stock for a living and make more in a day than you will EVER make in a year. I guarantee that I am the most educated and experienced trader on this site, let alone the whole industry. I also see you work at USANA, So sad.
Posted by invester on :
USANA United States 3838 West Parkway Boulevard Salt Lake City, UT 84120
I suppose a dry county let alone the state. Have two wives do you? Mormon? Are you friends with Elizabeth Smart? She’s from your town.
Posted by BooDog on :
WEDNESDAY, Nov. 5
NEW YORK -- The Institute for Supply Management releases its non-manufacturing index for October, 10 a.m.
SAN JOSE, Calif. -- Cisco Systems Inc. releases first-quarter financial results.
CHARLOTTE, N.C. -- Duke Energy Corp. releases third-quarter financial results.
NEW YORK -- IAC/InterActiveCorp releases third-quarter financial results.
NEW YORK -- Marsh & McLennan Cos. releases third-quarter financial results.
FRANKLIN LAKES, N.J. -- Medco Health Solutions Inc. releases third-quarter financial results.
NEW YORK -- Retailers report October sales results.
WASHINGTON -- Labor Department releases weekly jobless claims, 8:30 a.m.; Labor Department releases productivity for the third quarter, 8:30 a.m.; Freddie Mac, the mortgage company, releases weekly mortgage rates.
ST. LOUIS -- Anheuser-Busch Cos. releases third-quarter financial results.
FORT LAUDERDALE, Fla. -- AutoNation Inc. releases third-quarter financial results.
NEW YORK -- Blackstone Group LP releases third-quarter financial results.
DALLAS -- Blockbuster Inc. releases third-quarter financial results.
BETHPAGE, N.Y. -- Cablevision Systems Corp. releases third-quarter financial results.
EL SEGUNDO, Calif. -- DirecTV Group Inc. releases third-quarter financial results.
HOUSTON -- Dynegy Inc. releases third-quarter financial results.
NEW YORK -- Nasdaq OMX Group Inc. releases third-quarter financial results.
SAN DIEGO -- Qualcomm Inc. releases fourth-quarter financial results.
BURBANK, Calif. -- Walt Disney Co. releases fourth-quarter financial results.
MANILA, Philippines -- Release of Philippines inflation data for October.
FRIDAY, Nov. 7
WASHINGTON -- Labor Department releases unemployment data for October, 8:30 a.m.; Federal Reserve releases consumer credit data for September, 3 p.m.
BRUSSELS, Belgium -- European Union leaders hold special meeting to discuss reforms of international financial system ahead of economic summit in Washington on Nov. 14.
DETROIT -- Ford Motor Co. releases third-quarter financial results.
quote:Originally posted by invester: PEASER>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Look, I don't mean to me mean, but you say you've been right 100% of the time. Your Kool-Aid man is so ridiculous. I'll ask you, please back that up on this thread. I, as well as others have read your inaccurate rants. I'm not attacking you but real people read these threads, invest money, and you obviously have no comprehension on a good recommendation let alone a good "long term investment". Guy, you once asked me "how old are you". I'll answer you, I'm old enough to have been a stock broker out of College, then an Investment Banker. I now trade Energy and Stock, along with options on stock for a living and make more in a day than you will EVER make in a year. I guarantee that I am the most educated and experienced trader on this site, let alone the whole industry. I also see you work at USANA, So sad.
Geez, can't you get your blatant lies straightened out and quit double posting your ignorance on two separate threads, wasting folks' time?
quote:Originally posted by invester: More doom and gloom huh Peaser. Dow 5000, LoL.
Lookout below. Let's get ready for some SEC reform in the upcoming years...
Posted by osubucks30 on :
It was all just a bear market rally. This recesion is going to be long and deep. If you are long you better buy and not pay attention for a couple of years. Decent trading environment but what if you would of bought Monday? Alot of risk in this market. Even tho people act like the bottom is in we can go alot lower.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: It was all just a bear market rally. This recession is going to be long and deep. If you are long you better buy and not pay attention for a couple of years. Decent trading environment but what if you would of bought Monday? Alot of risk in this market. Even tho people act like the bottom is in we can go alot lower.
Posted by Peaser on :
Yup
Posted by Peaser on :
invester rants -I'll answer you, I'm old enough to have been a stock broker out of College, then an Investment Banker. I now trade Energy and Stock, along with options on stock for a living and make more in a day than you will EVER make in a year. I guarantee that I am the most educated and experienced trader on this site, let alone the whole industry.
Well, you can lose more in a year than I can I suppose, along with anyone else foolish enough to take your "advise" on options, energy and stocks.
By the way, you didn't by chance lock any suckers into fixed energy rates in the past year did ya?
You mentioned previously that I have a responsibility to people that read these boards...
Sounds to me like you have a fiduciary reponsibility to anyone that listens to your suggestions, that is, if ya is whats ya says you is.
My thoughts on Obama, and other ridiculous threads.
Like him or hate him he is our president for the next 4 years. I believe that Barrack has the ability and without question the brains to get us out of the egregious turmoil that this country is suffering from. I'm curious, was it the 8 years of prosperity or growth that you hated through the Clinton administration? He now has Paul Volker and some of the same administration from Clinton on his cabinet. I'm a pre-Bush Fiscal Republican, but I have seen the last 8 years go to absolute hell for America. Not to mention the potential for Sarah Plain "John McCain being 72 tears old" being our commander and chief. Terrifying!!!!!!!! Also, if I have to pay 5 percent more in capital gains tax to bring our troops home, so be it. I am a little tired of hering about how much more we are going to pay in taxes with Obama. I know that with McCain the Iraq war will go on “Indefinitely”. I for one will be OK sacrificing a few dollars out of my pocket for the lives that have been lost, and that will be lost in this god awful war. It seems so glib.
Posted by IMAKEMONEY on :
TAKE THERE OIL, THATS HOW YOU PAY THE TAB, NEXT I WANT SOMEONE WHO SAYS WERE AT WAR TO BE AT WAR, PULL THE TROOPS TURN THEM TO GLASS!!!!! BOOMMMM! WARS OVER, F-UM,JMO
Posted by invester on :
"I must say" Was it not “a surfer” that grabbed this ridiculous materialabout Obama and brought it to this thread? I think it’s funny how the feeble minded human is so easily swayed by the human physique. I was taught at a very young age to never argue a point in life unless I knew it to be absolutely factually true. My father said that you never want to be proven wrong, so make sure YOU ARE RIGHT!!! I live by those words.
Posted by a surfer on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: "I must say" Was it not “a surfer” that grabbed this ridiculous materialabout Obama and brought it to this thread? I think it’s funny how the feeble minded human is so easily swayed by the human physique. I was taught at a very young age to never argue a point in life unless I knew it to be absolutely factually true. My father said that you never want to be proven wrong, so make sure YOU ARE RIGHT!!! I live by those words.
Are you 18 yet?? You have got to be kidding me.....
I have written several times that I post some things just to get a reaction.
Guess it works.
Market headed below 8000. Oil to 48.
Hope you're not upsetting anyone.
Posted by T e x on :
Hey, fellas...
Sure, this is the freewheelin' Hot Stocks forum...
BUT,
let's rein in the combative remarks and keep it to stock talk. Take your off-topic remarks to an appropriate off-topic thread, please.
Thanks, Tex
Posted by invester on :
I’m changing my outlook based on the Paulson plan being revoked. We may break the lows now. It depends on what the new plan entails.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
If the lows are broken I don't think you want to be in the market at all!
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: If the lows are broken I don't think you want to be in the market at all!
I'm out. I'm short VNO, and a few others. The game is changing everyday. I think LIBOR will start to creep back up without buying all of the bad assets. Who knows, there may be another plan on the horizon in which I may change my view. For now, this could get even worse.
Posted by invester on :
Cisco last week, Intel and Best Buy today. Couple all of these bellwethers bad news with the TARP not buying bad assets and we have a systemic problem. The only thing that kept the market from freefall was the thought that the bad assets would be bought and lending would resume. Look out below. Hold me I'm scared. LoL
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Dow under 7000?
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: Dow under 7000?
It's rapidly changing. First off, all confidence was lost today in our government. Not that we had any to begin with, but Paulson flip flopping on the TARP was a sure sign of bad times to come. "We need the 700 billion to buy the bad assets". Now that they moved that to credit cards and consumer loans, we still have the problem that has plagued this market to begin with, the CDO’s. Well, the real problem was the consumer taking out loans that they knew they couldn't afford ultimately resulting in default. That or they thought that housing prices would continue to escalate thus selling for a profit. Not sure what to think about this. I'm perplexed to say the least, and I feel that this is REALLY going to get bad now. Happy Thanksgiving everyone!!!! LoL
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Its over!!! S&P breaches lows!! Watch out below.
Posted by invester on :
I can't believe it bounced. Bad news everywhere. I had to cover my shorts. Hedge fund redemptions will still occur through Jan.1st. though. TOUGH market.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
It is a thin market. Can easily be driven up by one hedge fund. (Thats what Cramer is saying) He says this is nothing to get excited about.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
We will see what happens the last half hour. It is impossible to make anything out of these moves with low volume.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
I'm not disagreeing with you, but you can't fight the tape. Range bound.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Definetly a good traders market! All you will hear now is we tested the bottom again and we are off!! How many times are we going to bounce and come back. I think this will be the last bounce and we will trend back to below 8000. The test today was on light volume so it can't be trusted. At the current price of the market Dow 8750 I would be short before long. Currently I stay on the sidelines tho.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: Definetly a good traders market! All you will hear now is we tested the bottom again and we are off!! How many times are we going to bounce and come back. I think this will be the last bounce and we will trend back to below 8000. The test today was on light volume so it can't be trusted. At the current price of the market Dow 8750 I would be short before long. Currently I stay on the sidelines tho.
I use straddles "put and call" in this situation.
Posted by glassman on :
i kinda like this new ETF. its it been out for less than two weeks, but if you want to forget doing so much DD and play the sentiment? this is the best game i've seen so far:
be sure to look at the "related co's" section for the other symbols to the 3X fund.
Posted by PCola77 on :
BGU and BGZ are the large cap versions. I have a standing order to put most of my IRA into BGU at 28.50. that corresopnds approximately with a 7600 Dow, which I thought we'd get before the long term rebound. Got to the low $30s, and then bounced like 30% without me...
i don't think that order will fill Posted by PCola77 on :
Well, I got within $2 today I think. I don't think we've seen the bottom either. My guess is that this is a temporary bounce, but I can't say I would have been upset to have moved my buy to $31 instead of 28.50 Posted by glassman on :
maybe i'm too much of an optimist...
i think we tested the low twice now...
we may test it again a couple more times...
the market is always ahead of news, and the worst news is just now coming in.
Posted by Peaser on :
maybe i'm too much of an optimist...
Gotta love the sarcasm...
Posted by Ace of Spades on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: BGU and BGZ are the large cap versions. I have a standing order to put most of my IRA into BGU at 28.50. that corresopnds approximately with a 7600 Dow, which I thought we'd get before the long term rebound. Got to the low $30s, and then bounced like 30% without me...
Thanks for the link....it's a great board! Im gonna be swing trading these bad boys very often!!!
Posted by Rockster on :
6,300
Financial is still going lower and the real estate market is starting to pick up but that is mostly the abundance of forclosures that are a great deal being partially bought by previous stock market dollars. The economy will get worse if the bailout dollars are not enough or the big three collapse in the next 6 months to year.
I hope for the best.
When the market recovers money will flow back and it will be a great 6 year run and I will make money
Posted by osubucks30 on :
People who bought the last hour yesterday are getting crushed!! Another false reversal! Will we give it all back and more??
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: i kinda like this new ETF. its it been out for less than two weeks, but if you want to forget doing so much DD and play the sentiment? this is the best game i've seen so far:
be sure to look at the "related co's" section for the other symbols to the 3X fund.
I love any aymbol thats T & A, I mean TNA. LoL This one looks good Glass.
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by glassman: i kinda like this new ETF. its it been out for less than two weeks, but if you want to forget doing so much DD and play the sentiment? this is the best game i've seen so far:
be sure to look at the "related co's" section for the other symbols to the 3X fund.
I love any aymbol thats T & A, I mean TNA. LoL This one looks good Glass.
actually i am playing BGU just as pcola suggested, but i was checking TNA too when i linked it... i feel so lazy playing these that it must be wrong on some level Posted by PCola77 on :
Nice clsoe for the Dow today.... Yuck.
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by PCola77: Nice close for the Dow today.... Yuck.
nobody wants to hold over the weekend...
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: I’m changing my outlook based on the Paulson plan being revoked. We may break the lows now. It depends on what the new plan entails.
No way! No backing out dude! TA or fundamentals!!!! make up your mind!
Although, everytime Paulson's face even shows up on TV the dow dumps points like crazy. lmao
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by invester: I’m changing my outlook based on the Paulson plan being revoked. We may break the lows now. It depends on what the new plan entails.
No way! No backing out dude! TA or fundamentals!!!! make up your mind!
Although, everytime Paulson's face even shows up on TV the dow dumps points like crazy. lmao
The fundamentals will now change now that were not buying the banks bad assets. Credit should still remain frozen, and it will defiantly get worse. To make up your mind and stick to your guns after such a monumental change is absurd. The game changes everyday in this environment.
Posted by glassman on :
so you think Paulson screwed up?
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: so you think Paulson screwed up?
Who doesn't, is that even a question????? The CEO of Goldman Sachs at the time was Hank Paulson, our current T. Secretary. He went to Congress to ask them to reduce the constrains on leverage which was 15-1 at the time. They reviewed it then passed law at 40-1. Hank Paulson along with every other Wall Street firm makes money off leverage. Everyone makes money off leverage. That’s how they were able to lend, and do deals of that magnitude. You will NEVER see that type of growth again. Is Paulson responsible for not buying the $700 billion in bad Wall Street assets, I say yes. But I go one step further; he is also DIRECTLRY responsible for the law that re-wrote the leverage on Wall Street, which crippled our economy.
Posted by T e x on :
But I go one step further; he is also DIRECTLRY responsible for the law that re-wrote the leverage on Wall Street, which crippled our economy.
Invester, please document that law. Interested minds want to know... Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by invester: I’m changing my outlook based on the Paulson plan being revoked. We may break the lows now. It depends on what the new plan entails.
No way! No backing out dude! TA or fundamentals!!!! make up your mind!
Although, everytime Paulson's face even shows up on TV the dow dumps points like crazy. lmao
The fundamentals will now change now that were not buying the banks bad assets. Credit should still remain frozen, and it will defiantly get worse. To make up your mind and stick to your guns after such a monumental change is absurd. The game changes everyday in this environment.
I'll stick to my TA These are just a little out of date.
quote:
[quote name='BooDog' post='16577' date='Oct 22 2008, 07:54 PM']The bottom isn't "in" imo. I wouldn't mind seeing some of the experts post their views
HERE YOU ARE TEX. So ridiculous that he is our current T. Secretary!!!!!!!!!!!
TradingMarkets.com Hank Paulson-Savior Monday October 20, 9:05 am ET By Gary Kaltbaum
In 2000 SEC Testimony, Paulson Recommended "Self-Regulation" For Wall Street, Plus A Rule Change Now Blamed For Collapse Back in 2000, when Hank Paulson was CEO of Goldman Sachs, he testified in front of the Security and Exchange Commission. Among other things, he lobbied the SEC to enact a "change to self-regulation" for Wall Street. He also urged them to change the "net capital rule" which governed the amount of leverage investment banks could use. The net capital rule was indeed changed in 2004, and is now blamed for the investment banks' collapse.
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PAULSON: The Challenge of Technology and Change to Self-Regulation in the United States: "The third area for re-examination and reform is the structure of broker/dealer regulation, a function now shared by the SEC and the self regulatory organizations ("SROs"), principally the New York Stock Exchange and NASD Regulation Inc."
"{W}e and other global firms have, for many years, urged the SEC to reform its net capital rule to allow for more efficient use of capital. This is the single most important factor in driving significant parts of our business offshore, so that our firms can remain competitive with our foreign competitors risk-based capital standards must become the norm. The SEC has made it clear that risk-based capital rules can be implemented only when the Commission is confident that firms employing value-at-risk models have robust credit and risk management policies in place."
"For these reasons we think it is time to seriously consider the creation of a single, independent SRO to adopt, examine and enforce a core body of financial responsibility, customer protection and margin rules. We hope and expect that there would be savings generated by economies of scale."
How did Paulson's recommendation to let investment banks borrow much, much more work out?
The Securities and Exchange Commission can blame itself for the current crisis. That is the allegation being made by a former SEC official, Lee Pickard, who says "a rule change in 2004 led to the failure of Lehman Brothers (NYSE:LEH - News), Bear Stearns, and Merrill Lynch (NYSE:MER - News)." The SEC allowed five firms - the three that have collapsed plus Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley - to more than double the leverage they were allowed to keep on their balance sheets and remove discounts that had been applied to the assets they had been required to keep to protect them from defaults.
The so-called net capital rule was created in 1975 to allow the SEC to oversee broker-dealers...The net capital rule also requires that broker dealers limit their debt-to-net capital ratio to 12-to-1. In 2004, the European Union passed a rule allowing the SEC's European counterpart to manage the risk both of broker dealers and their investment banking holding companies. In response, the SEC instituted a similar, voluntary program for broker dealers with capital of at least $5 billion, enabling the agency to oversee both the broker dealers and the holding companies.
This alternative approach, which all five broker-dealers that qualified - Bear Stearns, Lehman Brothers, Merrill Lynch, Goldman Sachs (NYSE:GS - News), and Morgan Stanley (NYSE:MS - News) - voluntarily joined, altered the way the SEC measured their capital. Using computerized models, the SEC, under its new Consolidated Supervised Entities program, allowed the broker dealers to increase their debt-to-net-capital ratios, sometimes, as in the case of Merrill Lynch, to as high as 40-to-1. It also removed the method for applying haircuts, relying instead on another math-based model for calculating risk that led to a much smaller discount.
So when you hear Paulson and Bush (AKA THE BOLSHEVIKS) tell you that the reason for the problem we are in is HOUSING, please realize they are lying to you. They are not just mistaken. They are lying to you. They know better. Any investment can drop 20, 30, 40% without causing catastrophe. It is the leveraging up of these declining assets that cause the problem. "Hank Paulson was the pointman in creating this leverage...and no one seems to care. And no one seems to care that he is now in charge of fixing this problem by creating the largest hedge fund in history...managed by who? Yup...Goldman Sachs!"
While I am no fan of the NY Times, I urge you to read yesterday's article about how Goldman Sachs is now taking everything over...all brought to you by Hank Paulson. I still don't get how this guy, who came from leverage land, could persuade so many to vote for a bill so quickly. All I keep hearing is that the markets would have been much worse without the passing of the bill. "Who is convincing these people of this? Yup...Hank Paulson." I guess we will never know what would have happened without such a bill.
I wanted to give you a little history lesson as there remains so much misinformation and so much dart throwing by pundits who have been bullish all the way down and magically converted into bears out of nowhere in recent weeks. On top of that, those same people who have been calling bottoms all the way down, continue with their nonsensical stance of the market being cheap...the market is a value...the economy is soft but will be ok...and if you sell now, you are going to miss the buy of a lifetime...and lots more of the blah blah blah. The latest excuse to buy is that Warren Buffett bought stock. Even though he said his timing could be off by a year and even though this man is worth $50 billion, just follow Warren and dive right in. Here are the facts.
The market has been bearish for many areas starting back in early '07, with other areas topping in July...with major indices topping in October...with NDX-types topping in January...with flopping and chopping most of '08 before commodities topped July 2 and have crashed along with the rest of the market recently. But again, that does not stop the pundits.
My first problem: I am hearing this will be a small recession. HMMM! If it is going to be small, why did the market drop almost 50%?
My second problem: I am hearing all kinds of calls of bottom...still...as well as the worst is over. The question I have been asked several hundred times this week has been: is the worst over? My answer...MAYBE! COULD BE! I WILL LET YOU KNOW!
Those calling the worst over have not studied history. Bear markets do not just bottom...especially bad bear markets. Going all the way back to the bear that ended in '32, there was a double bottom formed with the first low in June of '32 and the second in February of '33. In 1956, the first low was in May with the second low in November. During '62, the first low occurred in June with the second low in October. There was also a double bottom in the nightmarish '73-'74 bear market (which in my opinion, has now been passed by this one) where the first low came in October with the second low in December. Fast forward to 1982 where that bear ended with a double bottom with the first low occurring in March and the second low coming in August.
In 1987, the first low occurred in October with the second low in December. The market then sat around for a good year before moving up. Even the quick bear market in 1998 traced out a double bottom. Lastly, in the last bear of 2000-03, the first low was put in October of '02 before the final low in March of '03. We know anything can happen...but we have our studies of history on our side. Remember, fear and greed are emotions for the ages. They do not change, regardless of the decade. They just have different degrees to how far they go. So while most continue to just yap, we have some forensic evidence of what odds favor will occur.
There is simply no leadership. Most stocks remain way below longer term moving averages. There are zero bases. There are no sectors in an uptrend...though one sector, the AIRLINES is trying to emerge. WORLD MARKETS have been leading down...and I can go on and on. Shorter term, anything can happen. Last week's action is indicative of a market that is stretched to the norm, thus the ridiculous intraday swings. I have the sneaking suspicion we may now be tracing out a range between recent lows and recent highs...with the market making it tough for both short and long. I am taking my time. During Thursday's follow through day, I took a long proxy for the first time in months. I felt terrible on Friday's poor open...felt better midday, felt real good when market was up 300 and felt like a few shots of tequila were necessary by 4 p.m. EST...and that's just being a wee bit invested. To show you what I mean by this ridiculous intraday action, check these numbers out:
Posted by T e x on :
HERE YOU ARE TEX. So ridiculous that he is our current T. Secretary!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks!
Posted by invester on :
Posted by jon clogger on :
Not looking good...tick..tick...tick
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Dow 6400?? Actually she says it will go lower then that.
Her is a prediction from Nicole Elliott, technical analyst at Mizuho Corporate Bank told CNBC.
I was trying to look up her record to see if she has ever been right before. I wonder just how many analysts are trying to show their feathers now when a few of us even like me have seen where we would be for so long already.
Posted by invester on :
The DOW has tested the bottom twice since I changed my view to negative. Tomorrow will be very telling. I think we may break it after the Paulson blunder. What a boob. I would be interested to see if he has contacts with known short sellers.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: The DOW has tested the bottom twice since I changed my view to negative. Tomorrow will be very telling. I think we may break it after the Paulson blunder. What a boob. I would be interested to see if he has contacts with known short sellers.
No more than Greenspan that's for sure. Good luck to us all.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by invester: The DOW has tested the bottom twice since I changed my view to negative. Tomorrow will be very telling. I think we may break it after the Paulson blunder. What a boob. I would be interested to see if he has contacts with known short sellers.
No more than Greenspan that's for sure. Good luck to us all.
This began with Greenspan as interest rates were low entirely to long. It ended with the ridiculous Hank Paulson asking congress to lift the rule on leverage from 15-1 to 40-1. I can't believe these are the people running our country. My closest friends are MUCH smarter than any of these individuals. Greenspan" I didn't know that leaving interest rates these u unseen levels would have these consequences". You’re the fed chief, unintended consequences should be you forte. bernanke, paulsen, and the whole bunch are the most educated but inactive individuals. I left there names non-capitalized because I don’t feel they deserved my accreditation. I have seen in recent memory. May god have mercy on there ridicules souls.
Posted by invester on :
Rather, ridiculous. LoL
Posted by BooDog on :
I'll be trying to make up a new chart this weekend. See if I can take it through 1st Q next year.
Posted by invester on :
I wonder if Citi "C" will get bought. I never thought I would say a once $300 billion market cap company would potentially be a buyout candidate.
Posted by invester on :
Dow intraday low just broke.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
All of this wealth deteration is quick and painful!
Posted by osubucks30 on :
They tried to rally off the bottom but got sold back quick! Worrisome sign?
Posted by invester on :
It should be down more. With any clarity about the TARP we could fly though.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: They tried to rally off the bottom but got sold back quick! Worrisome sign?
certainly doesn't take much. NO patience and 0 tolerance
Posted by a surfer on :
Let the bodies hit the floor......
Blood bath.
Posted by invester on :
Terrifying!!!!
Posted by glassman on :
what'd you expect? paulson got on TV again..
i'm pretty sure i'll be going long BGU before 2PM tomorrow for a big runup....
d'oh, i forgot tomorrow is Friday... i'll prolly wait to go long...
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: what'd you expect? paulson got on TV again..
WAAAAAHAHAHAHAHA!!! NO DOUBT!!!
GOTTA HOLD ABOVE MY 7300 LINE AT LEAST UNTILL I GET NEW CHARTS OUT THIS WEEKEND!!!
Japan down almost 7% this morning, wonder what they're thinking now!
Posted by glassman on :
i'm beginning to think Paulson is intentionally trying to drive this thing into the ground...
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: i'm beginning to think Paulson is intentionally trying to drive this thing into the ground...
As I said before, I would like to know if he has contacts with known short sellers.
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by glassman: i'm beginning to think Paulson is intentionally trying to drive this thing into the ground...
As I said before, I would like to know if he has contacts with known short sellers.
remember how they banned shorting in "selected" finacial co's whne the shorts began going after them (Goldman in particular)
Posted by BooDog on :
wow. I brought my fin list back this morning. Check out MBI and a couple others and see how MBI dipped BELOW july's low. Dat aint a good sign imo, as if we needed another bit of bad news. We're headed lower (duh) and quite possibly looking to shed another 100 pts on the S&P, just a quick glance and you can see the next support level sticking out like a sore thumb. I feel only one slight drift of warm breeze blowing in from the right, dems knew they weren't going to get their gazillions for the auto so they all grouped together demanding they come up with some sort of "plan" so they can weasel their deal through in December. Total hogwash if anyone believes even one word of what they have to say other than "we need help or we're goin under". Even Ford's new 2009 Flex is under 25 MPG ( http://www.billsmithford.com/car.aspx?Car=http://cpanel.tkcarsites.com/DigitalBr ochures/Digi.aspx?year=2009&make=Ford&model=Flex&bodystyle=OD&sstyle=all&identif ier=1&smode=1&sid=258&pid=&did=140 ). Sick, just sick. At least they might have a ghost of a chance of avoiding bk if the package is denied and gm goes bk to cut off the auto workers union. imo their arrogance needs to be checked, not the UAWU but the directors of the big 3. Their studios just need to have better products, isn't that what the first 25B was for? to stimulate new tech? Look at what quantum fuels has and a few others, problem is, cut off GM's funding for these new VC's and they go down with the ship. So what to do... the warm fuzzy i got a drift of was the sense that gov't might actually show some constraint and demand a little validity - if even for show.
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: Might need to change the title of this thread in the next day or two...
Just so it's not a blatant lie 'n all.
Has it fallen to 7900 again?. Blatant lie? We all new there would be a dip after the massive run. Talk to me when it gets 7900 again.
Yes...
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser:
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: Might need to change the title of this thread in the next day or two...
Just so it's not a blatant lie 'n all.
Has it fallen to 7900 again?. Blatant lie? We all new there would be a dip after the massive run. Talk to me when it gets 7900 again.
Yes...
I have said many times that I changed my view to negative after Paulson said he would not use the TARP to buy the banks bad assets. As I see it, I was right both times, as usual.
Posted by BooDog on :
I CAN KEEP BEING RIGHT iF I KEEP CHANGING MY MIND TOO. THE FUNDAMENTALS OF OUR ECONOMY ARE STRONG MY FRIENDS!
It's the media and the whole insolvent banking system that's taking us down. do you think those bonds have any value left? Do we REALLY want to know?
how much should that hammer cost? get that bubble under control and then we'll see bottom imo.
Posted by glassman on :
nobody is right all the time.
Posted by glassman on :
futures look good this AM, i don't trust 'em.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: futures look good this AM, i don't trust 'em.
I bought S FNM AIG C
right at the close yesterday as I thought we would see at least a short term bounce after the breach.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: nobody is right all the time.
no doubt. And I'm pretty sure we didn't have a whole lotta faith that he was right when he called bottom. And in my charts I'm not calling bottom either, only decent support levels that we can use to try and set triggers for if they hit. imo there isn't much sanity in todays market. Sad part is, it seems more and more people are taking their money out of their 401k and trying the market for themselves without learning what they are doing. i know i lost my first batch from my ignorance. I'm still making picks and sticking my neck out there though. trying to win more than i lose - that's the name of the game.
Posted by invester on :
Oh, and GNW
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog:
quote:Originally posted by glassman: nobody is right all the time.
no doubt. And I'm pretty sure we didn't have a whole lotta faith that he was right when he called bottom. And in my charts I'm not calling bottom either, only decent support levels that we can use to try and set triggers for if they hit. imo there isn't much sanity in todays market. Sad part is, it seems more and more people are taking their money out of their 401k and trying the market for themselves without learning what they are doing. i know i lost my first batch from my ignorance. I'm still making picks and sticking my neck out there though. trying to win more than i lose - that's the name of the game.
You people keep saying that I wasn't right, but I was. Don't you see, the whole reason why we stopped the freefall and had a sustained market was the thought that the original cause "CDO's" would just be wiped out. He then backtracked and changed the game. I was RIGHT on both accounts.
Posted by glassman on :
funny thing is? i KNEW Paulson wasn't buying the CDO's a full month before he got on TV and made that announcement. why was it suddenly news?
the Treasury PR'ed when they began buying the prefereds and nobody got upset then. there was no way they could do both with only 700 billion
IMO? this market is being manipualted to the hilt, and Paulson is right at the center of it.
what made you suddnely change your mind on that press conference?
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by glassman: funny thing is? i KNEW Paulson wasn't buying the CDO's a full month before he got on TV and made that announcement. why was it suddenly news?
the Treasury PR'ed when they began buying the prefereds and nobody got upset then. there was no way they could do both with only 700 billion
IMO? this market is being manipualted to the hilt, and Paulson is right at he center of it.
I agree, I think Paulson should be at the very least questioned about his lack of transparency about the TARP and the waiting game.
Posted by glassman on :
look, we knew 700 billion would only begin to cover the CDO problem before the TARP was aproved.
Treasury announced a full month and half ago they were buying prefereds.
Paulson's press conference was not news.
why did you change your mind?
i have a theory.
i cannot prove it yet, but mark this. the market is FLOODED with non-existant stock.
call it whatever you want. NS, counterfeitts i don't care, but there's people that have raised CASH by shorting, and they can't buy it back because the cash went out the door.
the market will have to go down and they have to raise cash to fix it. how is that going to happen?
Posted by BooDog on :
I give you credit for an EXCELLENT technical bounce call invester. There is still too much volatility and fear out there imo to call a solid bottom, I hope you can do it again, and then we can mark our confirmation on the way up.
Posted by invester on :
C is getting crushed.
Posted by Rockster on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: C is getting crushed.
Wow... i bought and sold around 15, they are...
Paying a small dividend to instill hope when they have:
EPS (Trailing 12 mo.) -4.3021
Posted by Rockster on :
When i posted 6400 it was my now opinion, hope it stays higher. Not in reference to anyone.
Retail is taking a hit... (making money with my puts)
Good luck to all
Posted by osubucks30 on :
Market is crazy. Probably will follow thru on Monday but I would be selling into the strength. Government can do all they want!! THEY NEED TO LET EVERYTHING SELF CORRECT!
Posted by glassman on :
darnit, this is the first afternoon runup i've missed in awhile...
i really didn't think friday would be buyday
Posted by jon clogger on :
When the bottom was called, we all had the same information, whether technical or fundamental. And still I knew it wasn't over. I think we will see 4-5 more "false" bottoms.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by jon clogger: When the bottom was called, we all had the same information, whether technical or fundamental. And still I knew it wasn't over. I think we will see 4-5 more "false" bottoms.
I knew, i KNEW, You didn’t know crap, as you never do. I post my thoughts before any information comes out. I ALWAYS ONLY SEE MONDAY MORNING QUARTERBACKS!!!!!!!!!!! Stop saying, I knew this would happen, or I knew there wouldn’t be enough money in the TARP, or I saw this coming.. Every one of you is full of SHI#. I speak ALL of my views before anything comes out and I am always right. I am SO tired of Glass, Peaser AND THE REST OF YOU saying you could analyze the situation before hand. THEN POST IT BEFORE HAND DIP SHI^^^^^^^^^^^^^^!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am so good at what I do, and will never post a thread on this site again until the idiots contain themselves. I can’t stand ignorance, or VEY DUMB PEOPLE.
Posted by jon clogger on :
Relax Spongebob investerpants,
Next time you make a call, add this disclaimer -
"This is only a bottom if no more negative news comes out, like changes to the bailout, etc..."
Then we'll know ahead of time it was a chicken sh!t call.
To call the bottom in the middle of bad news rolling every day is balsy for that very reason.
Posted by glassman on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by jon clogger: When the bottom was called, we all had the same information, whether technical or fundamental. And still I knew it wasn't over. I think we will see 4-5 more "false" bottoms.
I knew, i KNEW, You didn’t know crap, as you never do. I post my thoughts before any information comes out. I ALWAYS ONLY SEE MONDAY MORNING QUARTERBACKS!!!!!!!!!!! Stop saying, I knew this would happen, or I knew there wouldn’t be enough money in the TARP, or I saw this coming.. Every one of you is full of SHI#. I speak ALL of my views before anything comes out and I am always right. I am SO tired of Glass, Peaser AND THE REST OF YOU saying you could analyze the situation before hand. THEN POST IT BEFORE HAND DIP SHI^^^^^^^^^^^^^^!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am so good at what I do, and will never post a thread on this site again until the idiots contain themselves. I can’t stand ignorance, or VEY DUMB PEOPLE.
LOL
Posted by a surfer on :
You are seriously that angry.....? Wow.
You have more issues than Playboy.
To post that you are always right is pathetically ridiculous.
God luck with that.....
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by jon clogger: When the bottom was called, we all had the same information, whether technical or fundamental. And still I knew it wasn't over. I think we will see 4-5 more "false" bottoms.
I knew, i KNEW, You didn’t know crap, as you never do. I post my thoughts before any information comes out. I ALWAYS ONLY SEE MONDAY MORNING QUARTERBACKS!!!!!!!!!!! Stop saying, I knew this would happen, or I knew there wouldn’t be enough money in the TARP, or I saw this coming.. Every one of you is full of SHI#. I speak ALL of my views before anything comes out and I am always right. I am SO tired of Glass, Peaser AND THE REST OF YOU saying you could analyze the situation before hand. THEN POST IT BEFORE HAND DIP SHI^^^^^^^^^^^^^^!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I am so good at what I do, and will never post a thread on this site again until the idiots contain themselves. I can’t stand ignorance, or VEY DUMB PEOPLE.
yer just too much, relax dude. We are on your side, no one likes watching their life savings go down the tubes. my posts
quote:Originally Posted by BooDog on October 10, 2008 11:34: [QUOTE]Posted by BooDog on October 10, 2008 11:34:
I picked support at 7,500. Either way i would like to see at least a decent double bottom as Glass suggested.
quote:
Posted by BooDog on October 10, 2008 12:51:
No risk no reward. So far so good. And there is certainly plenty of room for going up. I won't mind missing bottom to wait till next week for putting back in some of my TSP (govt 401k). Good luck invester!
Now think about this, and then think about todays bull/bear trap. A lower low is still a lower low.
Dow Jones Industrial Average(DJI: ^DJI) Index Value: 8,046.42 Trade Time: 4:07PM ET Change: 494.13 (6.54%) Prev Close: 7,552.29 Open: 7,552.37 Day's Range: 7449.38 - 8071.75 52wk Range: 7,392.27 - 13,850.90
quote: Posted by BooDog on October 15, 2008 17:24:
quote: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Originally posted by Peaser: My guess is 5000 on the Dow. Wait and see. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yikes. Having trouble with stockcharts. Trying to get a chart from 1996 to present. I'm leaning towards my pick of 7,500. Break 7k? wow. I like seeing consolidation, kinda hard to see that with 1k swings.
Then I worked some of my chart magic and changed my outlook slightly. Trace back a few pages and see the charts I posted.
quote:
Posted by BooDog on October 22, 2008 20:42: I still like my support line at 7300.
Is anything in stone? hell no. I do plan on working up some more charts and see what I can analyze. I'm no better than anyone else looking at a chart, but what to do with it? My retirement fund only allows 2 trades a month. Investers trigger when he called bottom presented a great op to put a little back in for the ride, i also had my resistance levels which put me back under cover. And now? 40% back in for the next ride. imo there is so much volatility it's nuts. is it new money coming in from people runing from their brokers and trying to do it on their own? Just nuts out there. Invester, don't forget yourself. Everyone has a view. Each view can be used to help make another view. Good luck and I hope you stick around.
Posted by Peaser on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: I give you credit for an EXCELLENT technical bounce call invester. There is still too much volatility and fear out there imo to call a solid bottom, I hope you can do it again, and then we can mark our confirmation on the way up.
Wow, "do it again" WTF.
I'm still waiting for the first...
Oh wait, there wasn't one. It was a dead cat bounce.
Posted by Peaser on :
I am SO tired of Glass, Peaser AND THE REST OF YOU saying you could analyze the situation before hand.
Again, this statement brings me back to questioning your age, or better said, experience in the market.
Posted by Peaser on :
I ALWAYS ONLY SEE MONDAY MORNING QUARTERBACKS!!!!!!!!!!!
Me too. One in particular, wishy-washy at best.
(Oh wait, Paulson just changed his mind, I think I will follow suit on the market due to what the media just released on the bailout)
If it feels good, do it?
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: I give you credit for an EXCELLENT technical bounce call invester. There is still too much volatility and fear out there imo to call a solid bottom, I hope you can do it again, and then we can mark our confirmation on the way up.
Wow, "do it again" WTF.
I'm still waiting for the first...
Oh wait, there wasn't one. It was a dead cat bounce.
However he called it - it lasted longer than a dead cat bounce imo. And he put his name on it. Now take NNBR for example, i've been playing that dead cat lately, put it on watch here ~played it like a big dog 1.63 to 2.07 and now it's on its way to ANOTHER dead cat bounce "my friends" (lmao - just can't get enough of that line) anyway, that is a dead cat bounce imo. But NO, we knew it wasn't bottom. Just as we with some pretty good certainty say that today wasn't bottom. Post your analysis EVERYONE and lets compare some notes. btw, my nnbr play was on top gun in chat. oh yeah, I did mark NNBR at 1.60 for the bounce... http://topgun***********/forums/index.php?s=&showtopic=1502&view=findpost&p=1750 9 that's trading . net in place of the stars
oh, and no comments that my dow pick was 7300 - 7500 and it was right in there today.
not even a pat on the back Posted by a surfer on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: oh, and no comments that my dow pick was 7300 - 7500 and it was right in there today.
not even a pat on the back
Way to go Boo!! Posted by Peaser on :
However he called it - it lasted longer than a dead cat bounce
It was not a bottom; therefore, your friend called nothing.
Charting long-term says it is a dead cat bounce.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by a surfer:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: oh, and no comments that my dow pick was 7300 - 7500 and it was right in there today.
not even a pat on the back
Way to go Boo!!
Thanks Surf! Posted by glassman on :
here's the part i don't get investor.
i wasn't agreeing or disagreeing with anybody, especially you.
my problem is that i do not understand what happened to people (you included) after paulsons infamous TARP announcement.
i asked you why you changed your mind in earnest.
whatever it was called? i saw stability at your "bottom" and i saw it erode on EMOTIONS. nothing more nothing less.
i played BGU off that "bottom" several times.
i saw you change your mind whch is absolutely fine, but it would help me be a better analyst if i knew why.
i could see everybody on the TV change their minds too. but i still have no idea why they did.
if you think i was jerking your chain? you've never had your chain jerked.
these are ruff times. you know what they say when the going gets gets tuff? the tuff get some.
Posted by BooDog on :
Posted by osubucks30 on :
I am starting to look for an entry to short the market.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: I am starting to look for an entry to short the market.
I'm waiting for invester to pick a new bottom.
Posted by invester on :
How are you all doing in the CNBC.com portfolio challenge I'd like to know?
Posted by jon clogger on :
I made the top 25 leader board for a couple of days but couldn't hold on.
Majority of earnings coming from the currencies: GBP/JPY pair.
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by jon clogger: I made the top 25 leader board for a couple of days but couldn't hold on.
Majority of earnings coming from the currencies: GBP/JPY pair.
I trade USD/JPY. Top 25 trading? Come on guy. I'm willing to post my #56 ranking if I can copy and paste.
Posted by Peaser on :
On second thought. I don't have time to waste with that garbage. I checked it out, yet they limit you on what you can/can not trade. Not my style, and a complete waste of time, like these boards...
JC is the man, you didn't know that invertorina?
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by Peaser: On second thought. I don't have time to waste with that garbage. I checked it out, yet they limit you on what you can/can not trade. Not my style, and a complete waste of time, like these boards...
JC is the man, you didn't know that invertorina?
I agree, too restrictive. Have you tried Umoo? http://umoo.com/ Posted by invester on :
Went long last Wednesday. The new tarp plan, along with the others is exactly what I've been looking for. Largest holdings.
LVS MTW DRYS FNM S FCX
Posted by invester on :
Oh, and Citi "C"
Posted by BooDog on :
so you think we've hit our bottom? no more 7's?
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: so you think we've hit our bottom? no more 7's?
That’s Right.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: so you think we've hit our bottom? no more 7's?
That’s Right.
I tend to agree. Still a lot of volatility but finding support. One day at a time now. I'm still playing by the charts and playing short swings.
Posted by a surfer on :
quote:Originally posted by invester:
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: so you think we've hit our bottom? no more 7's?
That’s Right.
I disagree. I think we retest the lows before December is over.
Shorting this week wins.....IMO
We'll see.
Posted by $tock Weazel on :
Volume has been WAY to low to have any convictions of upward movement.
Reminds me of the few days before elections. Low volume suckers rally.
Good time to short!
Posted by PCola77 on :
Kind of rings hollow now that futures are down a bunch, but I am of the opposite opinion. I planned to sell my FAS and BGU to go into the short ones (FAZ and BGZ) today. Looks like I should have done it on Friday. I think we'll give back half or more of the gains from the last 5 days over the next few.
quote:Originally posted by invester: Went long last Wednesday. The new tarp plan, along with the others is exactly what I've been looking for. Largest holdings.
LVS MTW DRYS FNM S FCX
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by $tock Weazel: Volume has been WAY to low to have any convictions of upward movement.
Reminds me of the few days before elections. Low volume suckers rally.
Good time to short!
Hey Weazel!
man, after today? I don't see how we can stay out of the 7's. freekin nuts!
some nice bounces goin on though! I'm stickin to short swing plays. Cheers!
Posted by osubucks30 on :
quote:Originally posted by BooDog: Hey Weazel!
man, after today? I don't see how we can stay out of the 7's. freekin nuts!
some nice bounces goin on though! I'm stickin to short swing plays. Cheers! [/qb]
We will break below 7000. Its only a matter of time!
Posted by invester on :
Sheldon Adelson bought over 91million shares of Las Vegas Sands. LVS
14-Nov-08 ADELSON SHELDON G Officer 91,613,636 Indirect Acquisition (Non Open Market) N/
Posted by invester on :
Cramer just did a whole piece on MTW. I've been preaching about that company since $5. Here’s the video.
"At the close of the show, Melissa Lee was asked to comment on the volatile impact hedge-fund redemptions are having on the market. She noted an estimated $200 billion worth of redemptions still have to be made between now and the end of this year.
She noted hedge funds are hurting badly to the point where they have "gated" investors from making withdrawals. According to Bloomberg, over 80 hedge fund managers have limited withdrawals in the past two months.
She said the hedge fund selling is not limited to equities, but is across the board, including commodities, where "they are big players."
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by Ace of Spades: Hedge funds still have Hundreds of billions left to sell off still...no bottom yet!!!
"At the close of the show, Melissa Lee was asked to comment on the volatile impact hedge-fund redemptions are having on the market. She noted an estimated $200 billion worth of redemptions still have to be made between now and the end of this year.
She noted hedge funds are hurting badly to the point where they have "gated" investors from making withdrawals. According to Bloomberg, over 80 hedge fund managers have limited withdrawals in the past two months.
She said the hedge fund selling is not limited to equities, but is across the board, including commodities, where "they are big players."
All those analysts have been brainwashed by Cramer. Stlii plenty of volatility. We could see another black Monday very easily. Invester, I think we go lower and back in the 7's this week.
Posted by Ace of Spades on :
Here's a great article from the Wall Street Journal.....
Down in the morning, up in the afternoon. Or is it the other way around? The topsy-turvy stock market is tough to read.
In the last year, the Dow Jones Industrial Average has briefly been over 13,000 and below 8,000. The past month has felt like the Cyclone roller coaster on Brooklyn's Coney Island -- lots of ups and downs, the whole rickety thing feeling like it's going to crash at any minute.
Great investors are taught to listen to the market. Each tick of the tape has something to say about expectations for growth, inflation, policy changes and looming recessions. The stock market is like a giant mass of pulsing plasma doing price discovery and a game of hot potato, getting stocks into the correct hands with the right risk profile. It's way too big for any one person to manipulate, let alone touch directly. Instead, millions of us provide input with our buying and selling decisions.
When it's at its most efficient, with buyers and sellers neatly matched up at the right price, it's a pretty good predictor. The Crash of 1929 announced a recession, and the wake-up call unheeded might have caused many of the bad policies leading to the Great Depression. The Crash of 1987? Not so much.
You see, the market is a great manipulator. In September, the Dow dropped 700 points intraday after the House of Representatives voted down the Treasury's TARP bank-rescue bill. Spooked, the House passed the bill the next week. Or how about this? The Dow was up 300 points on Election Day applauding an Obama victory and then down 1,600 points since.
The market can also be a bold-faced liar. On Jan. 22, the Fed announced an emergency 75-basis-point rate cut in response to huge drops in European markets. A few days later, it came out that a rogue trader at Société Générale lost them $7 billion and the bank was unwinding his positions. Oops.
So which is it now: an efficient mechanism or a manipulating liar? Should you listen to it warning of doom or anticipating renewal? I'd say stick wax in your ears and don't listen to the market until February.
Don't get me wrong. The freezing of the credit markets is wreaking havoc on the world economy. Corporate profits are dropping. Central banks are fighting off deflation and may not turn off the spigots fast enough -- which could ignite runaway inflation. But because of the credit mess, I am convinced the stock market is at its least efficient today. Don't read too much into any move. Here are the five biggest dislocations taking place:
- Tax-loss selling: Whenever you have a loss in a stock -- and who doesn't -- it's always tax smart to sell it, take a tax loss and either buy something similar or wait 30 days and buy the original one back. December can be an ugly month of indiscriminate selling. The December effect will be huge this year.
- Mutual-fund redemptions: Mutual funds are also dumped for tax losses. When the stock market is down in the morning, it's usually because of mutual-fund redemptions.
Fidelity's giant Magellan fund, down 56%, is one of many in the $6 trillion stock-fund business having an awful year. As investors call or click to get out of these funds, Fidelity and the others have to unload shares the next morning to raise cash. This forced-selling overwhelms the system. New York Stock Exchange specialists, who are supposed to maintain an orderly market, stop buying and back away. You get huge drops, which can unnerve even more investors and cause them to redeem.
- Mutual fund cap-gain distributions: To make matters worse, in December mutual funds do capital-gains distributions. In a down year like 2008, you would think there are no taxes to pay. Think again. Legg Mason's Value Trust, run by Bill Miller, outperformed the market for 15 years by buying many "unvalue" names like Amazon. As investors redeem, he is forced to sell many of these stocks originally purchased at very low prices, triggering huge capital gains in a year his fund is down 62%. You can almost guarantee investors also will sell more of these funds to pay their unexpected tax bill.
- Hedge-fund redemptions: Instead of overnight selling like mutual funds, hedge funds typically require 45 days' notice for investors to get out of a fund. They've been furiously selling since September to raise cash to pay investors. This usually shows up as a set of stocks that just go down and down and down with no obvious explanation.
Rubbing salt in hedge-fund wounds is the fact that Lehman Brothers was a prime broker to many hedge funds, holding their shares. While Lehman's bankruptcy was not a problem in the U.S., in England the policy is to freeze accounts until the mess can be sorted out. There are billions in assets locked in this bankruptcy, and hedge funds are forced to sell positions in the U.S. and elsewhere to raise cash, exacerbating the downside here.
By the way, when hedge funds are down for the year, they work practically for free until they make up the loss. We'll see hedge funds close and stocks liquidated as -- no surprise -- hedge-fund managers like to get paid.
- Margin calls: Whenever stocks go down sharply, you quickly find who owns them with debt. We have seen spectacular margin calls, a requirement for more capital to cover share losses. Chesapeake Energy CEO Aubrey McClendon unloaded 33 million shares to cover losses. Viacom CEO Sumner Redstone had a forced sale of $400 million in Viacom and CBS shares because of a margin call on other stocks. You can bet many not-so-public margin calls are behind many huge price drops. These usually take place in the last 30 minutes of trading.
So won't January be alright once these dislocations weighing on the market are lifted? The January effect is supposed to be positive.
Well, often money managers are fired at the end of disastrous years. A new manager comes in, looks at the existing positions and dumps them all and remakes the portfolio with new stocks that he likes, thus generating more selling. My favorite Wall Street adage suggests that the stock market trades to inflict the maximum amount of pain. Remember, you can only ignore the stock market for so long. Once everyone thinks it can only go down . . . it might go up.
Mr. Kessler, a former hedge-fund manager, is the author of "How We Got Here" (Collins, 2005).
Posted by BooDog on :
talk about "hope"
World markets surge on global stimulus hopes
LONDON – European and Asian stock markets surged Monday after Wall Street's rebound on Friday as investors took heart from new plans to bolster growth around the world.
The FTSE 100 index of leading British shares was up 168.70 points, or 4.2 percent, at 4,218.07, while Germany's DAX was 242.97 points, or 5.6 percent, higher at 4,624.44. The CAC-40 in France rose 174.33 points, or 5.8 percent, to 3,162.34.
Earlier, Hong Kong's Hang Seng index jumped 1,198.78 points, or 8.7 percent, to 15,044.87 — its highest close in seven weeks — while Japan's Nikkei 225 average jumped 411.54 points, or 5.2 percent, to 8,329.05.
The gains came despite Friday's news that American employers cut 533,000 jobs in November — the most in 34 years — as investors appeared to signal their support for growth-promoting measures around the world.
On Friday, the Dow Jones industrials rose 3.1 percent to 8,635.42, and the broader Standard & Poor's 500 index gained 3.7 percent to 876.07.
Futures pointed to further gains on Wall Street, with Dow futures up 181 points, or 2.1 percent, at 8,793 and S&P futures up 22.40 points, or 2.6 percent, at 894.80.
"The hour is darkest before the dawn and while the economic backdrop is absolutely dire, policy makers have now moved to an aggressively accommodative stance," said Jeremy Batstone-Carr, head of research at Charles Stanley in London.
Chinese officials were reportedly meeting this week to discuss possible new steps to expand the $586 billion of stimulus already planned, while in Washington, a bailout of ailing U.S. automakers appeared to be falling into place.
House and Senate aides were hammering out legislation that would dole out billions to Detroit's Big Three automakers within a week — but yank back the money if a government-run board and overseer decided the companies weren't taking steps to overhaul themselves and become viable.
Investors also cheered President-elect Barack Obama's plans, announced over the weekend, for the largest U.S. public works spending program since the creation of the interstate highway system a half-century ago.
India's government also said Sunday it plans to spend an additional $4 billion and cut some taxes to boost the nation's slowing economy, an announcement that came on the heels of the central bank slashing key interest rates by 1 percentage point.
"Weaker economic data have increased the pace at which monetary and fiscal authorities are putting support packages together," said Hans Redeker, an analyst at BNP Paribas.
Oil stocks were doing particularly well Monday as expectations of a big production cut from the OPEC oil cartel helped crude bounce back from four-year lows.
Light, sweet crude for January delivery was up $2.51 to $43.32 a barrel in electronic trading on the New York Mercantile Exchange. The contract fell Friday nearly $3 to settle at $40.81. Prices fell as low as $40.50, levels last seen in December 2004.
Chakib Khelil, OPEC's president, said Saturday the oil cartel could announce a "severe" reduction of output quotas at its next meeting on Dec. 17 in Algeria.
Elsewhere in Asia, Mumbai's Sensex index was up 4.6 percent, while in mainland China, the Shanghai Composite index rose 3.6 percent.
Australia's benchmark index shot up more than 4 percent, led by banks and the nation's biggest retailers, as 8.7 billion Australian dollars of government handouts began to flow into the bank accounts of pensioners and low-income families.
Thailand's key index advanced 2.8 percent, taking a cue from gains around the region and also lifted by signs the business-friendly opposition Democrat Party will have the numbers to form a coalition government in the aftermath of Thailand's ruling party being dissolved for vote buying.
Markets in Singapore, Malaysia and Indonesia were closed for public holidays.
__
Associated Press business writer Stephen Wright in Bangkok contributed to this report.
Posted by invester on :
My MTW and DRYS are on fire!!!!
Posted by BooDog on :
Dow 8,918.80 +283.38 +3.28% WAIT FOR IT. What's here today may be gone tomorrow. Boodogs Bull/Bear trap warning.
what's this bull full of? lol
Posted by invester on :
DRYS up 50% today. Market cap a messily $250 million. They own a fleet of 38 vessels. Extremely undervalued. Check out the spot price for drybulk. It bounced and is now soaring.
Sold DRYS for a 98% gain. Sold DRYS options for a 300% gain. Posted by invester on :
LVS HOD Up 13%
Posted by PCola77 on :
Very nice!
quote:Originally posted by invester: Sold DRYS for a 98% gain. Sold DRYS options for a 300% gain.
Posted by invester on :
Thanks P
Posted by BooDog on :
WTG Invester, closed my PMI at 1.74 (in at 1.3). that ones getting hit by analysts but it'll be back. good flipper.
Posted by osubucks30 on :
At what level do you think the market is over bought? I am looking to start a new short position at 9500 (if we can get there).
Posted by invester on :
quote:Originally posted by osubucks30: At what level do you think the market is over bought? I am looking to start a new short position at 9500 (if we can get there).
I actually said the same thing "9500" on Pcola's thread. I think with Obamas new plan its risky to take a full on short position. The game has completely changed. I would defiantly hedge. I am, and have been for a while long all infrastructure i.e. MTW. I've got two new AMAZING picks for tomorrow. I can't say now because I haven't purchased yet. I did DD all day on them.
Posted by invester on :
I forgot about SLW. Owned the option since $3
2 really good picks to come tomorrow.
Posted by invester on :
NM $2.40
Navios has revenues of over $300 million and the stock trades at a mere $250 million market cap. Not just that, but they are actually the largest Drybulk shipper with over 70 vessels to date. The Baltic index bounced and is now soaring. This may be the cheapest stock, in one of the best sectors I've seen in a while.
Posted by invester on :
Re-bought some DRYS Leaps. I sold to early.
Posted by invester on :
NM now $2.58. This will double in a couple of weeks if not sooner.
Posted by invester on :
NM $2.89 up 25% today
Posted by BooDog on :
nice going Invester. Cruisin!
Posted by BooDog on :
[url= http://"http://imageshack.us"] [/url]
Tell me what you think. (anyone) Three strikes (circled) showing some great consolidation and then the inverted head and shoulders pinning a decent bottom support. Notice also I projected a gentle slope up instead of a sharper up trend for my reversal. And a few lines showing resistance and support.
Posted by invester on :
NM Gapping to $3.10!!!! The Baltic Dry Index is soaring.
Posted by invester on :
Absolutely crushing it!!!!!!!!!!! I don't have one option that’s not up 150% or more.
Posted by invester on :
Sold my DRYS Leaps for another 200% gain. Stock looks heavy. I could be wrong but that one has run allot. I like NM and EXM
Posted by invester on :
MAN, I called that one. DRYS and NM are coming down. I'll pick it up tomorrow on the cheap. Posted by invester on :
The founder of Stockpickr.com just came on CNBC to say that MTW “Manitowoc” is his favorite company. Nice.
Posted by BooDog on :
quote:Originally posted by invester: MAN, I called that one. DRYS and NM are coming down. I'll pick it up tomorrow on the cheap.
Saw the indicators turning right around lunch time yesterday, Cramer pump job? Well, at least the street pump job anyway.
Posted by invester on :
DRYS owns $6 billion in ships. Not to mention the business itself.
P/E of under 1 forward P/E a little over 1. Unbelievable.
Posted by invester on :
Market goes higher after the Fed meting. This is the beginning of the end of the bear movement. Everyone is affraid to short stocks now. I’m in, and have been in 100% or more move ago,
X FWLT DRYS CX YRCW MTW WXM NM
Posted by invester on :
I meant EXM, not WXM
Posted by Peaser on :
Have we seen the market bottom yet?
I'm not so sure that we have. With the talking heads speaking of inflation, I am worried more of the opposite. Deflation. Bernanke has flirted with the idea lately.
If we see a long-term deflation period, look-out below for an extended period of time.
Housing prices have not yet stabilized in most areas. Commercial real estate is being affected by sub-prime as well. Has anyone seen any new businesses moving into older properties that have been recently vacated?
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plan was more in effect but has been on the rise even in a bad market..Just wonder what each day brings now...
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I still like my support line at 7300
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